₦airaland Forum

Henry240:
Let me ask you these first.

Why does the Colombian and Mexican army use pick-ups then?

Before you go further, outside Afghanistan and Iraq, Colombia has the record for the conflict with the highest number of mine related KIA and WIA.

Let me also state, there is no APC in existence that can protect soldiers from 23mm rounds.

Even the Russians deploy motorised infantry in Pick-up trucks in combat operations in Syria.

You are welcome to believe what you like. I am not hear to prove any points or prove anything. The issues at stake are too serious for that. It's not a PS4 game. That's why I really don't come here often.

The term APC has evolved towards AMV in more recent times.

And my reference was towards IFV.

But for the record there are a number of APC 's using the term generically that can withstand 30mm projectiles. For instance the upgraded Canadian LAV6.

With regards to Colombia and Mexico, I don't know and I am not particularly interested.

In the UK the Land-rover snatch and other armoured vehicles were withdrawn from Afghanistan in favour of the MRAP. This also followed a parliamentary enquiry after multiple casualties in the early days of deployment to Afghanistan.

allexpensive:
Been in service for a long time sha but this COIN has helped fast track promotion. Benefit of this CAS. He's making sure our contributions here end up being rewarded.

Do you sometimes fear for continuity of a good CAS after the incumbent one

Odunayaw:
Toh
This post is quite a swing but I understand in all.

However,AFSF do ride in MRAPs as the mission dictates, there's no hard & fast rule.

Let's get perspective.

How many serviceable MRAPS do we have in total and how many combatants do we have in the NE.

Do the ratio and it's obvious that they are totally inadequate. Serious countries talk about armoured vehicle procurement in terms of thousands of units, not in units of 20 or 30 or 40.

That's why we have our highly trained combatants in a kill zone in the backs of pick ups and highly exposed light trucks. In today's environment that's near suicidal.

Why do you think our casualty rate is so high.

komekn:
You are welcome to believe what you like. I am not hear to prove any points or prove anything. The issues at stake are too serious for that. It's not a PS4 game. That's why I really don't come here often.

The term APC has evolved towards AMV in more recent times.

And my reference was towards IFV.

But for the record there are a number of APC 's using the term generically that can withstand 30mm projectiles. For instance the upgraded Canadian LAV6.

With regards to Colombia and Mexico, I don't know and I am not particularly interested.

In the UK the Land-rover snatch and other armoured vehicles were withdrawn from Afghanistan in favour of the MRAP. This also followed a parliamentary enquiry after multiple casualties in the early days of deployment to Afghanistan.

Amvs don't offer 360 protection against 23-30mm. You can't also deployed AMV in large numbers too. Some of these are just manufacturers specification with what I have noticed here. Wait till some shilka guns start piercing through.

komekn:
Let's get perspective.

How many serviceable MRAPS do we have in total and how many combatants do we have in the NE.

Do the ratio and it's obvious that they are totally inadequate. Serious countries talk about armoured vehicle procurement in terms of thousands of units, not in units of 20 or 30 or 40.

That's why we have our highly trained combatants in a kill zone in the backs of pick ups and highly exposed light trucks. In today's environment that's near suicidal.

Why do you think our casualty rate is so high.

what do the SAS,German KSK,USASF ride in ?There has been arguments on this before. Special teams aren't the regular army. Their trade tools depends on the mission & they seem to have it

Nonetheless, the ratio of MRAPs to troops in theatre is sadly low, one would think our indigenous MRAP would be chased enthusiastically at least for the economics of scale,but alas!

Reality Check;
We are not rich enough to buy & maintain MRAPs in thousands ,these are not Sienna SUVs.

komekn:
You are welcome to believe what you like. I am not hear to prove any points or prove anything. The issues at stake are too serious for that. It's not a PS4 game. That's why I really don't come here often.

The term APC has evolved towards AMV in more recent times.

And my reference was towards IFV.

But for the record there are a number of APC 's using the term generically that can withstand 30mm projectiles. For instance the upgraded Canadian LAV6.

Sorry Sir, AMVs only can offer 30mm protection at the front & not all round

But still, most ambushes on our patrols are with rounds in the 14.5mm & below ranges

Odunayaw:
Do you sometimes fear for continuity of a good CAS after the incumbent one

The current hierarchy has officers who seems passionate about the development of the airforce. Of course, this might have been influenced by the actions of the current CAS.

So if the current CAS retires and Mr President picks from those at the top again then it's still good.

My fear is after a new regime something like 2023 a new government will retire others at the top and some will come to hold that post. Will they do well?

allexpensive:
The current hierarchy has officers who seems passionate about the development of the airforce. Of course, this might have been influenced by the actions of the current CAS.

So if the current CAS retires and Mr President picks from those at the top again then it's still good.

My fear is after a new regime something like 2023 a new government will retire others at the top and some will come to hold that post. Will they do well?

by 2023 you could be in a top post too who knows

It brings me to the question, what actually happens to good junior officers that when they become rednecks they get "turned"

Can an officer entering NAF by DSSC apply to join NAF Regt?

bidexiii:
#AFSF GUYS

I think its time the AFSF adopts the Mini-Beryl carbine. In my opinion it suits Special Forces operators better. The present Beryl rifle should be moved to standard infantry units.

Odunayaw:
by 2023 you could be in a top post too who knows

It brings me to the question, what actually happens to good junior officers that when they become rednecks they get "turned"

Can an officer entering NAF by DSSC apply to join NAF Regt?

Appointment of Chiefs at that level is highly political, if you like conquer America and Russia in warfare nobody go look ur side except you lobby or the hand of God de ur matter, unfortunately it all boils down to the C-in-C. About 27 Senior police offrs where retired to accommodate the current IG, "This is Nigeria".

PS: The last recruitment(DSSC) Air force accepted guys for special forces. You must be tall atleast(1.9m) have big chest, well built and have a Degree in Physical education.

Odunayaw:
by 2023 you could be in a top post too who knows

It brings me to the question, what actually happens to good junior officers that when they become rednecks they get "turned"

Can an officer entering NAF by DSSC apply to join NAF Regt?

It is possible. There are DSSC officers from sections like intelligence in the regiment.

allexpensive:
It is possible. There are DSSC officers from sections like intelligence in the regiment.

Good here is my favorite section.

Pls is it possible to be posted to DIA immediately after Air force's DSSC or Army's SSC training ?

abiodunalasa:
Bro apart from cost what else is the benefit of the pick-up trucks ?

Speed,
Carry between 10 -12 troops,
Low maintenance,
Cheaper to procure,
Have some level of off road capability,
More quite than most military vehicles.
Etc.

There is nothing with advantage without disadvantage.

I've actually seen many military with pickup vehicles just that ours is too much.

iblawi:
Speed,
Carry between to 10 -12 troops,
Low maintenance,
Cheaper to procure,
Have some level of off road capability,
More quite than most military vehicles.
Etc.

There is nothing with advantage without disadvantage.

I've actually seen many military with pickup vehicles just that ours is too much.

In other words... the only disadvantage(s) is its soft skin ?

giles14:
for me apart from cost.

it high mobility and low maintenance

What if we find a way to produce Armored Pick ups...

Or must our IFVs be the conventional ones ?

abiodunalasa:
In other words... the only disadvantage(s) is its soft skin ?

We have armoured pickups in the North East too.

Every vehicle have their role and they fall under different category. When you start using a vehicle for a role it wasn't designed for then you have to be extra careful.

We've used the pickups for too long in this war and surely the wrong way.

abiodunalasa:
What if we find a way to produce Armored Pick ups...

Or must our IFVs be the conventional ones ?

We already produce armored pickups. Ask proforce na.

iblawi:
We already produce armored pickups. Ask proforce na.

Yeah I know the Air force contingents in the NorthEast are using it.

Just talking about a wide spread usage.

iblawi:
We have armoured pickups in the North East too.

Every vehicle have their role and they fall under different category. When you start using a vehicle for a role it wasn't designed for then you have to be extra careful.

We've used the pickups for too long in this war and surely the wrong way.

But ur earlier post you made the pick up look like one multipurpose ATV

ugo4u:
Appointment of Chiefs at that level is highly political, if you like conquer America and Russia in warfare nobody go look ur side except you lobby or the hand of God de ur matter, unfortunately it all boils down to the C-in-C. About 27 Senior police offrs where retired to accommodate the current IG, "This is Nigeria".

PS: The last recruitment(DSSC) Air force accepted guys for special forces. You must be tall atleast(1.9m) have big chest, well built and have a Degree in Physical education.

Really...why are those requirements compulsory nah

abiodunalasa:
But ur earlier post you made the pick up look like one multipurpose ATV

Because some people here believe pickups shouldn't be in the north east at all.

I was only trying say the vehicle have it role to play too and cannot be pulled out completely. Some unit would still prefer the hilux/land cruiser over APCs.

Remember bullet proof vest too were meant to protect troops but some prefer mobility to safety. It all depends on the role we play.

allexpensive:
It is possible. There are DSSC officers from sections like intelligence in the regiment.

Please what's the age requirement for the Dssc in the Air Force and it possible, other arms.. basically Airforce and Navy....plus what is the highest obtainable level for a Dssc officer?

iblawi:
Because some people here believe pickups shouldn't be in the north east at all.

I was only trying say the vehicle have it role to play too and cannot be pulled out completely. Some unit would still prefer the hilux/land cruiser to some APCs.

At least light amoured pick up trucks...if they can add amour to innoson vehicles, it would be good

joshingjosh:
At least light amoured pick up trucks...if they can add amour to innoson vehicles, it would be good

Remember bullet proof vest too were meant to protect troops but some prefer mobility to safety. It all depends on the role we play.

komekn:
You are welcome to believe what you like. I am not hear to prove any points or prove anything. The issues at stake are too serious for that. It's not a PS4 game. That's why I really don't come here often.

The term APC has evolved towards AMV in more recent times.

And my reference was towards IFV.

But for the record there are a number of APC 's using the term generically that can withstand 30mm projectiles. For instance the upgraded Canadian LAV6.

With regards to Colombia and Mexico, I don't know and I am not particularly interested.

In the UK the Land-rover snatch and other armoured vehicles were withdrawn from Afghanistan in favour of the MRAP. This also followed a parliamentary enquiry after multiple casualties in the early days of deployment to Afghanistan.

I have actively followed, reported, researched and contributed to military topics for the last 10 years. This is an area i'm well versed in.

Your claim was on APC, now you have moved to AMVs. Do you know how much a standard AMV like the Patria or Boxer costs?

Let us be very realistic, i brought up the Colombian and Mexican militaries because they also heavily use Pick-up trucks. It is a matter of necessity, cost and logistic support.

The Patria or Boxer standard AMV will not go lower than 1.5 - 3 million dollars a unit. Do we have that kind of money or the defence budget to support that?

Yes, MRAPs are very important, and we need lots of them, however we cannot afford to move all the soldiers deployed in the northeast in MRAPs, only few countries in the world can deploy all armoured infantry.

Insurgents develop IEDs that can rip apart 19 ton MRAPs, we've seen multiple videos which proof this. No MRAP will protect Nigerian troops against 23mm rounds.

The best method of defeating an IED is detection and demolition.

What we should instead be focusing on is a good mix of MRAPs and Soft-skins. 6 MRAPs to 4 Hilux vehicles. We would have the right amount of protection and mobility with this.

We desperately need IFVs, that's what we are lacking. However even these like i earlier stated are not cheap, the Republic of South Africa has the struggling to procure 200+ IFVs for a good number of years now.

What we really need is not to replace the Toyota Hilux with MRAPs, what we require is a very good mix of MRAPs, Toyota Hilux armed with 14.5mm HMG or 23mm and IFVs.

As the Russians saw in Syria, pick-up trucks can be very effective in combat. Even the Turks deploy 23mm HMGs on pick-up trucks.

A standard SOP can be developed to guide the deployment of these vehicles in the Nigerian military.

joshingjosh:
At least light amoured pick up trucks...if they can add amour to innoson vehicles, it would be good

Light armoured pick-up trucks are not good enough. They don't protect against anything.

If you allow the enemy get in to the close range of 300 meters where his AK is in effective firing range, then your entire defence tactics has failed.

A pick up truck like the Proforce ICV should only be used as a survelliance vehicle for Intel gathering.

For an IFV option, Proforce can also develop a 6x6 version of the ARA MRAP, then we mount a 25mm RWCS on top of it.

allexpensive:
Amvs don't offer 360 protection against 23-30mm. You can't also deployed AMV in large numbers too. Some of these are just manufacturers specification with what I have noticed here. Wait till some shilka guns start piercing through.

What we need is a good ratio of Tanks, IFVs, MRAPs and heavily armed pick-up trucks.

Henry240:
For an IFV option, Proforce can also develop a 6x6 version of the ARA MRAP, then we mount a 25mm RWCS on top of it.

the center of gravity will be way too high. The Ara is very tall.

Not only will it be unstable, depression of the RWCS for short range engagement will be tricky.

lionel4power:
the center of gravity will be way too high. The Ara is very tall.

Not only will it be unstable, depression of the RWCS for short range engagement will be tricky.

That's not correct. The ARA was designed to accommodate both an RWCS and a manned station.

ugo4u:
Appointment of Chiefs at that level is highly political, if you like conquer America and Russia in warfare nobody go look ur side except you lobby or the hand of God de ur matter, unfortunately it all boils down to the C-in-C. About 27 Senior police offrs where retired to accommodate the current IG, "This is Nigeria".

PS: The last recruitment(DSSC) Air force accepted guys for special forces. You must be tall atleast(1.9m) have big chest, well built and have a Degree in Physical education.

It was funny reading this

I am 1.9m tall fortunately but WTF! BEd in Physical Education?
I will take it as a joke

Odunayaw:
It was funny reading this

I am 1.9m tall fortunately but WTF! BEd in Physical Education?
I will take it as a joke

na the requirement air force need that year, the thing ma tire guys and u mustn't exceed 30 yrs sef.