Matthew 16:27 (KJV)

27 For the Son of man shall come in the glory of his Father with his angels; and then he shall reward every man according to his works.

So there are the Words Of Jesus Himself saying that He was going to reward every one according to the works of the person, not His own finished works.

He that has ears let him hear.

Not, according to your "belief" or "God's Grace", as some claim.

Do not be deceived by man-made doctrines which tell you the otherwise.

These Words came out of the mouth of Jesus Himself!

Works! Works!! Works!!!

budaatum:
Not, according to your "belief" or "God's Grace", as some claim.

jesusjnr:
Matthew 16:27 (KJV)

27 For the Son of man shall come in the glory of his Father with his angels; and then he shall reward every man according to his works.

So there are the Words Of Jesus Himself saying that He was going to reward every one according to the works of the person, not His own finished works.

He that has ears let him hear.

Sorry guys, your lack of the Holy Spirit has prevented you from understanding the verse you quoted.

Jesus was not talking about salvation in that verse. He didn't say he was going to save people according to their work. He simply meant he would reward them according to their work.

If you are saved by Grace through faith, he would ensure you enter heaven. After that, he will now reward you for the good works you did on Earth e.g soulwinning, obedience etc.

If you rejected him, you will be condemned to hell fire. You will now be rewarded for the evil works you did.

So clearly, works is not what saves but faith. Even the passage below clearly rules out works as part of the basis for salvation. Just take a look at the bold parts.


Ephesians 2:8-9(KJV)
For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:
Not of works, lest any man should boast.


So guys, you lack the Holy Spirit that's why you couldn't understand that simple verse even in it's plain and simple English.

jesusjnr:
Works! Works!! Works!!!

Sorry, to show you that work plays no role in salvation but faith only, the below verse says someone who does NO WORK but has faith is counted as righteous.

Romans 4:5 (KJV)
But to him that worketh not, but believeth on him that justifieth the ungodly, his faith is counted for righteousness.

newsynews:


Sorry guys, your lack of the Holy Spirit has prevented you from understanding the verse you quoted.

Jesus was not talking about salvation in that verse. He didn't say he was going to save people according to their work. He simply meant he would reward them according to their work.

If you are saved by Grace through faith, he would ensure you enter heaven. After that, he will now reward you for the good works you did on Earth e.g soulwinning, obedience etc.

If you rejected him, you will be condemned to hell fire. You will now be rewarded for the evil works you did.

So clearly, works is not what saves but faith. Even the passage below clearly rules out works as part of the basis for salvation. Just take a look at the bold parts.


Ephesians 2:8-9(KJV)
For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:
Not of works, lest any man should boast.


So guys, you lack the Holy Spirit that's why you couldn't understand that simple verse even in it's plain and simple English.

In otherwords your "holy spirit" is Paul, for he was the one you quoted to debunk the self-explanatory Words of Jesus the Master?

Also use that saying of Paul your "holy spirit" to debunk these other self-explanatory sayings of Jesus that you need works (good deed) to be saved for:

John 5:29 (KJV)

And shall come forth; they that have done good, unto the resurrection of life; and they that have done evil, unto the resurrection of damnation.

Matthew 13:41-43 (KJV)

41 The Son of man shall send forth his angels, and they shall gather out of his kingdom all things that offend, and them which do iniquity;
42 And shall cast them into a furnace of fire: there shall be wailing and gnashing of teeth.
43 Then shall the righteous shine forth as the sun in the kingdom of their Father. Who hath ears to hear, let him hear.

So that if you would find you find yourself in hell because you lack good works which is a requirement for salvation, you'd say that's it's Paul your "holy spirit" that told you, you didn't need works which Jesus clearly stated on several occasions that He required from every man to grant them entry into His Kingdom.

We lack the Holy Spirit and yet it's Paul you're quoting to prove you have Him.

Well enjoy yourself believing such misleading teaching of Paul, your "holy spirit" who himself needed works to be granted entry into God's Kingdom by Jesus.

I wonder if people who see error in Apostle Paul's epistles are doers of iniquity also.
Just thinking aloud.

The fact that most people screaming works! works!! Know for sure that works doesn't save a man from damnation. Now i want you to read
Revelation 20:12 carefully
And I saw the dead, small and great, stand before God; and the books were opened: and another book was opened, which is the book of life: and the dead were judged out of those things which were written in the books, according to their works.
[color=#990000][/color]. Note revelation never said the dead were judged according to those things written in the book, but in the books(plural). The book of life is all about salvation and the faith of those in Christ, not their works, which is written en in another books. So my friend, Just know works doesn't save but gives you reward that can either be good or bad.

Any teaching on Salvation and grace that downplays on repentance is fraud!

1) Jesus said, “REPENT! for the kingdom of God is at hand”.

2) Paul wrote, “Shall we continue in sin that grace may abound? God forbid!”


Anyone who thinks God’s grace is a liberty to commit sin and justify a sinful lifestyle, you are on a long thing.

newsynews:


So clearly, works is not what saves but faith.

Salvation = Faith + Works

"What doth it profit, my brethren, though a man say he hath faith, and have not works? Can faith save him?

For as the body without the spirit is dead, so faith without works is dead also"
[url=https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=James+2%3A14-26&version=KJV]James 2:14-26 King James Version (KJV)[/url]

The "dead" are all those who have not received the only reward that Jesus promises which is Eternal Life.

Adeling:


The book of life is all about salvation and the faith of those in Christ, not their works, which is written en in another books.

Haba! And you were doing ever so well up to there!

Why is there a book of works if works do not count?

From my own reading of Rev20, they will first check your name is in the Book of Works and if found there, check that it is also in the Book of Life, and "Anyone whose name was not found written in the book of life was thrown into the lake of fire".

budaatum:
Haba! And you were doing ever so well up to there!
Why is there a book of works if works do not count?

"And behold, I am coming quickly, and My reward is with Me,
to give to every one according to his work."
- Revelation 22:12

"For the Son of man shall come in the glory of his Father with His angels;
and then He shall reward every man according to his works."
- Matthew 16:27

You get rewarded for your good works

budaatum:
From my own reading of Rev20, they will first check your name is in the Book of Works and if found there, check that it is also in the Book of Life, and "Anyone whose name was not found written in the book of life was thrown into the lake of fire".

"If the work that anyone has built on the foundation survives, he will receive a reward."
- 1 Corinthians 3:14

Well, no works, then no reward

MuttleyLaff:
"And behold, I am coming quickly, and My reward is with Me, to give to every one according to his work."
- Revelation 22:12

"For the Son of man shall come in the glory of his Father with His angels;
and then He shall reward every man according to his works."
- Matthew 16:27
You get rewarded for your good works

"If the work that anyone has built on the foundation survives, he will receive a reward."
- 1 Corinthians 3:14

Well, no works, then no reward

Be short and to the point like you've worked to be here when you disagree with me please.

budaatum:
Be short and to the point like you've worked to be here when you disagree with me please.

budaatum, this was easy to do, but when it comes to certain other subject matter(s) shrouded in elaborate lies, then it becomes a case of elaborate explanation is required. The case of angels banging female human beings or confusing Nephilims for something else is a classic example. Smh.

Dont worry budaatum, I understand the challenges, your occasional low temperance and patience thresholds, but just that sometimes you need having a kick up the jacksy whenever you go on your bad-tempered, irritable and dishing out insults spree episodes. I, today checked, and couldnt believe my eyes, seeing how far back you started doing it

MuttleyLaff:

I, today checked, and couldnt believe my eyes, seeing how far back you started doing it

Don't you make out I spreed everyone muttley.
You deserve it when you refuse to use your brain.

budaatum:
Don't you make out I spreed everyone muttley.
You deserve it when you refuse to use your brain.

Face palm. Shm. Here we go again

It's really strange that some are yet trying to debate the importance of works in one's salvation.

jesusjnr:
Works! Works!! Works!!!

Bros are you hearing from that guy who became depressed after seeing things in the sun?

OnPointMan:


Bros are you hearing from that guy who became depressed after seeing things in the sun?

Not really but it appears he's been delivered.

https://www.nairaland.com/5390672/testimonies-enthronedbygod-when-he-nairaland/1#81904076

I've not heard from him of late but recently he shared a post of mine which suggests he's okay.

Thanks.

budaatum:

Salvation = Faith + Works

"What doth it profit, my brethren, though a man say he hath faith, and have not works? Can faith save him?

For as the body without the spirit is dead, so faith without works is dead also"
[url=https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=James+2%3A14-26&version=KJV]James 2:14-26 King James Version (KJV)[/url]

The "dead" are all those who have not received the only reward that Jesus promises which is Eternal Life.

Paul was not making a clear statement when he said "can faith save him?". He was simply asking a question. The answer to the question of if faith can save a man. is seen in his epistle to the Ephesians. He simply stated that faith saves through grace without works.

Ephesians 2:8-9 King James Version (KJV)
For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:
Not of works, lest any man should boast.

Can you see that he made a plain and clear statement t above saying works doesn't play any role in salvation, only faith?

But you wrongly took his question to mean a plain statement.

Works are what we do to show our faith to the world to know we have faith.

James 2:18
Yea, a man may say, Thou hast faith, and I have works: shew me thy faith without thy works, and I will shew thee my faith by my works.

Nowhere did Paul ever say works plays a role in salvation. That's why you should never mistake his word that "faith without works is dead" to mean works is important for salvation.

Everyone can claim to have faith, but your works is how I will know. But God doesn't need to see your works to know you have faith. That's because he see where humans can't. And that's why Paul said that someone who has faith alone without works is counted as. righteous before God Almighty.

Romans 4:5 (KJV)
But to him that worketh not, but believeth on him that justifieth the ungodly, his faith is counted for righteousness.

Can you see how works has been rendered useless by Paul when it comes to salvation? Did you see how faith alone is what makes a man righteous before God?

jesusjnr:
Not really but it appears he's been delivered.

https://www.nairaland.com/5390672/testimonies-enthronedbygod-when-he-nairaland/1#81904076

I've not heard from him of late but recently he shared a post of mine which suggests he's okay.

Thanks.

Glory be to the Almighty

newsynews:


Paul was not making a clear statement when he said "can faith save him?". He was simply asking a question. The answer to the question of if faith can save a man. is seen in his epistle to the Ephesians. He simply stated that faith saves through grace without works.

Ephesians 2:8-9 King James Version (KJV)
For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:
Not of works, lest any man should boast.

First let me state that "one does not live by one verse alone least one becomes malnourished".

We had a thread on something similar some time ago when some were justifying themselves by their faith and God's Grace. I'll post links to said threads at the end, but meanwhile, note that last paragraph. "Not of works, lest any man should boast". Its from Paul the works boaster (c.f. https://bible.knowing-jesus.com/topics/Paul~s-Boasting)

And he's not saying works do not matter, since you must deny yourself (work!) and take up your cross (work!) and follow Christ (work!). But lets look around us and at our own selves a minute. Can I be saved if I do no work, the least of which is "believe"? Or is believing itself not work?

Christians like to say Christianity is a way of life, and not a religion. Scripture itself is a lot of doing with so much work and few labourers. The Laws of God boil down to loving my neighbours, which is work, and loving my enemies even moreso which is more work, and if I do not do these works, am I not only a resounding gong and a clanging cymbal, a nothing who gains nothing?

The fact is that works do matter. Scripture itself is a "Works Manual" and specific works are the evidence of salvation, the fruits one sows, and anyone who sows not shall reap not, not even salvation. Such need Christ in their life or they will surely die of nothing else but starvation brought on by being lazy.

Please consider that Paul means "don't boast" , and not "works don't matter", because if he had not done the immense work he did, being responsible for over about ⅔ of the New Testament, and if Christ had not done the work he did dying for me, and if God too had not worked and created me in the first place, Christianity itself would be but a shadow of what it is today and I would not exist not to talk of be saved.

Below are some links to my view on the subject:

https://www.nairaland.com/5211669/saved-grace-alone-filthy-doctrine/2#80303593

https://www.nairaland.com/5211669/saved-grace-alone-filthy-doctrine/3#80323778

https://www.nairaland.com/5315834/saved-faith-alone-need-works#80558671

newsynews:


Paul was not making a clear statement when he said "can faith save him?".

P.s. And a correction.

It was James the Works Guru who asked if faith can save, and not Paul in James 2:14-26 King James Version (KJV). But my "Paul the Works Boaster" still stands.

OnPointMan:


Glory be to the Almighty

Yes oh bro.

Nothing pass God.

budaatum:

First let me state that "one does not live by one verse alone least one becomes malnourished".

We had a thread on something similar some time ago when some were justifying themselves by their faith and God's Grace. I'll post links to said threads at the end, but meanwhile, note that last paragraph. "Not of works, lest any man should boast". Its from Paul the works boaster (c.f. https://bible.knowing-jesus.com/topics/Paul~s-Boasting)

And he's not saying works do not matter, since you must deny yourself (work!) and take up your cross (work!) and follow Christ (work!). But lets look around us and at our own selves a minute. Can I be saved if I do no work, the least of which is "believe"? Or is believing itself not work?

Christians like to say Christianity is a way of life, and not a religion. Scripture itself is a lot of doing with so much work and few labourers. The Laws of God boil down to loving my neighbours, which is work, and loving my enemies even moreso which is more work, and if I do not do these works, am I not only a resounding gong and a clanging cymbal, a nothing who gains nothing?

The fact is that works do matter. Scripture itself is a "Works Manual" and specific works are the evidence of salvation, the fruits one sows, and anyone who sows not shall reap not, not even salvation. Such need Christ in their life or they will surely die of nothing else but starvation brought on by being lazy.

Please consider that Paul means "don't boast" , and not "works don't matter", because if he had not done the immense work he did, being responsible for over about ⅔ of the New Testament, and if Christ had not done the work he did dying for me, and if God too had not worked and created me in the first place, Christianity itself would be but a shadow of what it is today and I would not exist not to talk of be saved.

Below are some links to my view on the subject:

https://www.nairaland.com/5211669/saved-grace-alone-filthy-doctrine/2#80303593

https://www.nairaland.com/5211669/saved-grace-alone-filthy-doctrine/3#80323778

https://www.nairaland.com/5315834/saved-faith-alone-need-works#80558671

Why are you confusing yourself? You are even saying one can't live by one verse alone. Yes, one can do such especially when it's not misconstrued or quoted out of context. Moreover, the verse below has lots of other verses that supports it to show that works play no role on salvation.

Ephesians 2:8-9 (KJV)
For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:
Not of works, lest any man should boast.

As seen above, Paul listed the requirements for salvation. See how he carefully ruled out works as part of it. He stated that salvation is a gift from God, it is not something we work for. Or do you call something you worked for a gift?

Romans 4:5 King James Version (KJV)
But to him that worketh not, but believeth on him that justifieth the ungodly, his faith is counted for righteousness.

The above verse also rules out works as part of salvation or what makes man righteous before God. Paul said a man who does no work but believes in Jesus Christ is counted as righteous before God.

Even John 3:16 didn't include works as needed for salvation. It clearly stated that believe in Jesus Christ is all that is needed. Jesus has done the work on the cross. It's now left for us to do the easy part.

John 3:16 (KJV)
For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.

As seen above, God gave Jesus as a gift for us to accept through believe or faith. That is all that is needed for salvation, no works is involved.

There are still lots of verses I can quote to support this. You have no verse to support your stance but your own ideas.

I am absolutely certain you are saved, as in, you are in receipt of salvation. And see below how you've quoted scripture from a book of over a thousand pages which you seem to have read in order to understand. And I bet your reading and understanding had something to do with your salvation, reading that if you had not done might reduce your current understanding and salvation.

So, questions.

Would you be saved if you had not read that huge book that likely saved you?

Were you not working when you were reading the huge book that saved you?

Did you do no work in order to understand what you read?

Is 'believing' and 'having faith' itself not work?

Does your own salvation not include a very detailed worksheet with words like "love", which is work?

And are the fruitless in receipt of salvation?

Do note that I am assuming you did read your Bible, as in proper read, starting at [url=https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Gen+1%3A1&version=KJV]In the beginning[/url] and working your way word by word, verse by verse, chapter by chapter, one page at a time and book by book till you got to [url=https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Revelation+22%3A21&version=KJV]The grace of our Lord Jesus Christ be with you all. Amen[/url]. And not Church reading where you live by verse alone. One is immense work that leads through narrow gates, while the other is the lazy reliance on others bearing ones cross for one.

newsynews:


Why are you confusing yourself? You are even saying one can't live by one verse alone. Yes, one can do such especially when it's not misconstrued or quoted out of context. Moreover, the verse below has lots of other verses that supports it to show that works play no role on salvation.

Ephesians 2:8-9 (KJV)
For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:
Not of works, lest any man should boast.

As seen above, Paul listed the requirements for salvation. See how he carefully ruled out works as part of it. He stated that salvation is a gift from God, it is not something we work for. Or do you call something you worked for a gift?

Romans 4:5 King James Version (KJV)
But to him that worketh not, but believeth on him that justifieth the ungodly, his faith is counted for righteousness.

The above verse also rules out works as part of salvation or what makes man righteous before God. Paul said a man who does no work but believes in Jesus Christ is counted as righteous before God.

Even John 3:16 didn't include works as needed for salvation. It clearly stated that believe in Jesus Christ is all that is needed. Jesus has done the work on the cross. It's now left for us to do the easy part.

John 3:16 (KJV)
For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.

As seen above, God gave Jesus as a gift for us to accept through believe or faith. That is all that is needed for salvation, no works is involved.

There are still lots of verses I can quote to support this. You have no verse to support your stance but your own ideas.

budaatum:
I am absolutely certain you are saved, as in, you are in receipt of salvation. And see below how you've quoted scripture from a book of over a thousand pages which you seem to have read in order to understand. And I bet your reading and understanding had something to do with your salvation, reading that if you had not done might reduce your current understanding and salvation.

So, questions.

Would you be saved if you had not read that huge book that likely saved you?

Were you not working when you were reading the huge book that saved you?

Did you do no work in order to understand what you read?

Is 'believing' and 'having faith' itself not work?

Does your own salvation not include a very detailed worksheet with words like "love", which is work?

And are the fruitless in receipt of salvation?

Do note that I am assuming you did read your Bible, as in proper read, starting at [url=https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Gen+1%3A1&version=KJV]In the beginning[/url] and working your way word by word, verse by verse, chapter by chapter, one page at a time and book by book till you got to [url=https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Revelation+22%3A21&version=KJV]The grace of our Lord Jesus Christ be with you all. Amen[/url]. And not Church reading where you live by verse alone. One is immense work that leads through narrow gates, while the other is the lazy reliance on others bearing ones cross for one.

You can't get saved by reading the Bible on your own. I didn't get saved that way. I was saved when someone read the Bible to me and made me understand why I needed to be saved.

Before then, I never understood all what I was reading in the Bible. It was just like a story book because I couldn't come to terms with the Spiritual aspect of it.

But once I got saved, I received the Holy Spirit which enabled me have understanding of the word of God which is spirit. This means I stopped being a natural man and became a spiritual man.

I couldn't understand the Bible as a natural man because...


1 Corinthians 2:14 (KJV)
But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned.


The Bible is the word of God which is spirit and only meant for the spiritual children of God. That's why the Ethiopian Eunuch couldn't understand the scriptures he was reading until a spirit-filled Philip explained it to him and got him saved.

Jesus Christ even stated that his word which is the word of God is spirit. That's why natural men can't understand it until a spirit-filled person preaches it to them to get them saved. That's when it starts to make sense to them.

John 6:63
It is the spirit that quickeneth; the flesh profiteth nothing: the words that I speak unto you, they are spirit, and they are life.

You've been speaking with your own words with no verse to back them up

newsynews:


You can't get saved by reading the Bible on your own. I didn't get saved that way. I was saved when someone read the Bible to me and made me understand why I needed to be saved.

That explains a lot. Someone did the work of salvation on your behalf but you do not see it as work. And I think you think your experience is everybody's experience, and your understanding is the only one.

All the same, I insist that you must have read the Bible or you can't exactly qualify to quote it to me unless you are just parroting what you've been told. And if that's the case then you have not done the work that you should have done and can't fully understand the Bible. But do note that even listening too is work. And getting understanding is more work. And once you understand, it is work, for it is written (bible quote alert in case you miss it) The work is plenty but the labourers are few.

My advice is do some more reading work and you'd find that you can't fully derive biblical benefits unless you do the work of reading the Bible. The Bible itself promotes work. And being a disciple of Jesus is work. And you can't claim to be saved and not be a worker. For if you don't love your neighbours and your enemies moreso, both of which involves work, your salvation is as Paul said, a resounding gong and a clanging cymbal, a nothing who gains nothing, especially not salvation, the greatest gift of all.

P.s. You keep insisting that I do not quote the Bible. I am however certain that anyone who has read my posts would not agree with you. Not only have I quoted the Bible, as anyone who is not lazy would see, I've linked to the specific bits I've quoted too as you'd find if you did the work to click on links I have shared. As to "speaking with my own words", I am guilty as charged, since I am stating my own understanding of what I have read as you too are, even though I feel you'd claim your own understanding is God's, though you have admitted that your understanding comes from "someone who read the Bible to you and made you understand". Jesus too was accused of the same crime and even that the devil was inside of him. And now He is the Lord, and the Saviour of the World.

Jesus doesn't know any worker of iniquity.

https://www.nairaland.com/5462721/depart-me-workers-iniquity-never

What is your work?

Jesus is coming soon