This is supposed to be very educative thread but it's now wwf. That was why I made that first lengthy post thinking we can expatriate it to educate ourselves. Phew.

pmoye:
What exactly is the reason why Nigerian women are so much in love with abortion? It is so rampant that you get tempted to categorize abortion as another method of contraception. The funny thing is that most of these ladies involved are religious individuals... What exactly is going on?

And they always claim it is a mistake. There is no accident in having sex. You don't walk on the streets and suddenly slip and fall on a ready-to-fire di.ck. There's always a process involved in sex.

Make no mistake, this is 100% about women, in case some start feeling the need to balance the gender here.

If you're a single mother because of this-kind of mistake, then what a shame. Abortion and single-motherhood should never be a replacement for good sense.

Says the Oracle.

Unless abstinence is insisted, pregnancy cannot be totally avoided even with contraceptive pills and condoms in tow. In that scenario, would you blame the woman still?

pmoye:
Thanks a lot for your insightful contribution. I believe it would be helpful if you start a discussion on various options available to women on this platform. Will you consider doing it please?

Me, on nairaland?

Pls, let's leave it as it is.
Anybody that has interest should use Google.

Thank you

bukatyne:


Because we are the same as men and everyone MUST be FORCED to bear the choices of their actions.

liberalchick:

You told no lies, I don’t know why some people are having trouble comprehending.

We need to stop our society’s narrative of “women only suffer the fallout of irresponsible sexual behavior” because 1. It’s not true. 2. Imagine if we maintain the same energy on men, the importance of safe sex and taking financial responsibility for any child borne out of such behaviors, we would have twice the intended effect.

It's simple math. Teaching 100% of the population responsibility will lead to better results than teaching 50%. Not everyone will be responsible but more people will. I also find this argument 'as long as I don't suffer the consequences, wetin concern me?' very troubling. It sums up all that is wrong with this country.

Instead of raising responsible boys and future gentlemen who take responsibility for themselves and their partners, they will argue that it is ok to be a fvckboy as long as someone else suffers greater consequences.

It is also the same reasoning that justifies infidelity on the husband's side. He doesn't suffer greater consequences so it's ok.

Morally bankrupt people.

Abortions as a means of birth control in Nigeria (and places like it) stems from the shaming and demonization of premarital sex and single parenthood among women (And women only).

How can a girl who’s not married have sex or get pregnant? It’s the unspoken abomination that everyone is doing but no one wants to talk about unless it’s time to act holier than others.

It contributes to a phenomenon where many girls do not have access to effective and consistent birth control. Because providing birth control means you’re telling them to have sex and oh my what a scandal.

Solution?
Just a tip of the iceberg
*More education is definitely needed.
*Safe sex should be taught more.
*Social support for young women should be invested in so that girls can learn in a judgement free zone how best to take care of themselves as they grow.
*Realistic options should be provided (abstinence is realistic only to a certain point and then it falls apart).
*education for boys is important too because they contribute to the pregnancy. It might seem sensible to focus on the girls alone because they are the ones who get pregnant but that will never and has never worked by itself.

It’s even more complex than that. But I personally believe that abortions done because the mom mistakenly got pregnant can be reduced to the barest possible minimum if things are done right.

Sixfeetbelle:


Unless abstinence is insisted, pregnancy cannot be totally avoided even with contraceptive pills and condoms in tow. In that scenario, would you blame the woman still?

Hmmm, how do married people avoid unwanted pregnancies while having regular sex?

missjo:

I never said they can't, I implied it's harder. This is why I used the word 'embarrassed'.

Culturally, premarital sex still has taboo status. It's mostly forgivable for males but all hush hush when it comes to females. This is one reason why sexually-active single women may find it embarrassing walking into a pharmacy to get birth control patches, pills, or condoms.

But obviously.
Dunno why this is being debated or argued

Sterope:
FIRST OF ALL, we are saying men cannot be forced to take responsibilities so women should make better choices. How many responsible guys are out there? Are they going to experience significant changes to their body? Is their job/school going to suffer as much? Is finance everything there is to child-rearing?

I will repeat: I HAVE NOT ARGUED THAT THE IMPACT OF UNPROTECTED SEX IS NOT GREATER ON THE FEMALE.
If you don't have anything new to contribute to the discussion, don't quote me please.

Obviously wasn’t a thread created to help or educate any woman.

kneehighbootz:
Please, dear women. Let's learn to quickly perceive misogynistic and women shaming topics and not give them the attention they desperately seek.

If the op can hold one gender accountable while exonerating the other (a toddler knows it takes two people to make a baby), just know that he's not actually looking for a balanced discussion but an excuse to abuse and vilify women.

Pay him no mind. Have a good day, ladies

sassysure:

This is supposed to be very educative thread but it's now wwf. That was why I made that first lengthy post thinking we can expatriate it to educate ourselves. Phew.

My dear, those that will learn will learn.

Shebi we are still begging the 29yr old OP with N40k salary to marry the 22 year old abortion specialist on the other thread.

You know what I like about this life, we will postulate theories online and still logoff to the reality offline.

bukatyne:


My dear, those that will learn will learn.

Shebi we are still begging the 29yr old OP with N40k salary to marry the 22 year old abortion specialist on the other thread.

You know what I like about this life, we will postulate theories online and still logoff to the reality offline.

Or will talk about the individual responsibility for the collective good but exempt 50% of the population from this responsibility and think we are righteous when we justify immoral behavior in the name of 'someone else will suffer greater consequences".

Pmoye what was the intention of this thread?

Unnerve:

Hmmm, how do married people avoid unwanted pregnancies while having regular sex?

They don't have regular sex and in the case they do get pregnant, they either keep it or abort it.

Safe sex isn't 100% effective and pregnancy must always result for the unlucky ones. Responsibility for such actions must be taught on the parties involved.

bukatyne:


My dear, those that will learn will learn.

Shebi we are still begging the 29yr old OP with N40k salary to marry the 22 year old abortion specialist on the other thread.

You know what I like about this life, we will postulate theories online and still logoff to the reality offline.

I don’t think anyone here says women shouldn’t be responsible or careful. Quote the post that says women should leave the responsibility to men alone and I’ll educate the person. I have a few words for them.

Now my question to you is this? Should men also be careful about this issue? A simple yes or no would suffice.

No need to to use many words when maybe everyone’s points summarized might actually come to be the same or similar.

Hathor5:

It's simple math. Teaching 100% of the population responsibility will lead to better results than teaching 50%. Not everyone will be responsible but more people will. I also find this argument 'as long as I don't suffer the consequences, wetin concern me?' very troubling. It sums up all that is wrong with this country.

Instead of raising responsible boys and future gentlemen who take responsibility for themselves and their partners, they will argue that it is ok to be a fvckboy as long as someone else suffers greater consequences.

It is also the same reasoning that justifies infidelity on the husband's side. He doesn't suffer greater consequences so it's ok.

Morally bankrupt people.

But is it perculiar with Nigeria? It's quite the same mentality with men in most places. If a woman does not insist on protection, most men regardless of race are okay with having regular unprotected sex.

The difference in societies only comes to play when laws are enforced which force men to be financially responsible for their children. This still did not stop the number of baby mums from increasing each year.

I am sure you would agree that contraception reduces the risk of unwanted pregnancies.

And no one has the right or power to insist on how a woman's sexuality. Sexual expression will always remain the right of every woman (or man) and it is really scary when we start speaking of insisting on another person's right, even if you're the person's pastor/imam. Only the woman involved should have that right to so insist.

Lastly, we cannot say that since contraception doesn't completely remove the risk of unwanted pregnancy that we should avoid it in favor of unprotected sex.

Sixfeetbelle:


Unless abstinence is insisted, pregnancy cannot be totally avoided even with contraceptive pills and condoms in tow. In that scenario, would you blame the woman still?

Unnerve:

But is it perculiar with Nigeria? It's quite the same mentality with men in most places. If a woman does not insist on protection, most men regardless of race are okay with having regular unprotected sex.

The difference in societies only comes to play when laws are enforced which force men to be financially responsible for their children. This still did not stop the number of baby mums from increasing each year.

I don't know about most men, do you?

Sixfeetbelle:

They don't have regular sex and in the case they do get pregnant, they either keep it or abort it.

Safe sex isn't 100% effective and pregnancy must always result for the unlucky ones. Responsibility for such actions must be taught on the parties involved.

My apologies then, I thought I was asking a married woman.

Hathor5:

I don't know about most men, do you?

You could confirm starting with your husband or boyfriend, then brothers and cousins. Close friends whom you can have that type of conversation with as well.

Depending on where you live, mix it up by including men from other races

pmoye:
I am sure you would agree that contraception reduces the risk of unwanted pregnancies.

And no one has the right or power to insist on how a woman's sexuality. Sexual expression will always remain the right of every woman (or man) and it is really scary when we start speaking of insisting on another person's right, even if you're the person's pastor/imam. Only the woman involved should have that right to so insist.

Lastly, we cannot say that since contraception doesn't completely remove the risk of unwanted pregnancy that we should avoid it in favor of unprotected sex.

@ the bold, I would push for abstinence since responsibility for actions is being thrown out of the window here but we can't always get what we want, can we?

Point is, sex would always have complications like pregnancy no matter how safe you are so what to do when such occurs should be the issue here. The responsibility for such actions shouldn't be looked down on like the society is doing or abandoned like the male folks are known to do.

Unnerve:

My apologies then, I thought I was asking a married woman.

Married women also have high rates of abortions. Maybe not as high as single women but high enough it would surprise you.

The difference if they feel sanctioned while doing it.
At least they weren’t caught having sex while unmarried like those sinful ladies

cococandy:


I don’t think anyone here says women shouldn’t be responsible or careful. Quote the post that says women should leave the responsibility to men alone and I’ll educate the person. I have a few words for them.

Now my question to you is this? Should men also be careful about this issue? A simple yes or no would suffice.

No need to to use many words when maybe everyone’s points summarized might actually come to be the same or similar.

Should men be careful about pregnancies and abortions and other pregnancy management risks?

Yes.

cococandy:


Married women also have high rates of abortions. Maybe not as high as single women but high enough it would surprise you.

The difference if they feel sanctioned while doing it.
At least they weren’t caught having sex the while unmarried

I'm not following you.

Is abortion legal for married women but illegal for unmarried women in Nigeria?

Unnerve:

My apologies then, I thought I was asking a married woman.

What are you insinuating with this response? Or haven't you seen couples mention about having an extra kid that wasn't planned for?

missjo:

This is kind of the point tho.
I can't comprehend any way I could possibly get pregnant against my own wishes. I mean, it's my uterus right?

That's an odd thing to type.

Lol. It's your uterus.

Well, I hope your perceived self-efficacy to avoid unwanted pregnancy and to use contraceptives doesn't come back to bite you. Have a nice day.

Ningen:


Lol. It's your uterus.

Well, I hope your perceived self-efficacy to avoid unwanted pregnancy and to use contraceptives doesn't come back to bite you. Have a nice day.

And that's the issue, isn't it?

How safe is prolonged use of contraceptives for a woman who plans to have kids in the future?

Unnerve:

You could confirm starting with your husband or boyfriend, then brothers and cousins. Close friends whom you can have that type of conversation with as well.

Depending on where you live, mix it up by including men from other races

I am not going to discuss the sex lives of my family members here, not that I know enough about it anyway.
And whether men of other races are quick to sleep with women without protection or not is irrelevant because it is not a common attitude to justify it with 'she is the only one to suffer the consequences'.

Like you said, their laws will have them take responsibility one way or another and their collective mentality is such that their absence in the child's life will be strongly condemned. Rightly so. It's the peak of immorality not to look after your own.

Now to those preachers and moralists on this forum who always repeat how important it is for a child to have a mother and a father, they should be the first to teach everyone to take responsibility.

bukatyne:


Should men be careful about pregnancies and abortions and other pregnancy management risks?

Yes.

I’m QUITE SURE you understand I meant pregnancy prevention. Not pregnancy itself and abortions.

But I’ll accept your response as non-facetious.

Now that it’s been established that both sides would benefit from being careful about preventing unwanted pregnancies (ergo reducing abortions), why are the posts encouraging the OP to broaden his Teachings judgement, not acceptable here?

Again, before the argument of “women suffer more” arises, let me state that I recognize that.

However, how would it hurt anyone if both men and women take actions to prevent such pregnancies?

Again, not saying women should leave it to men. Y’all know I dislike being deliberately misinterpreted hence the repetitions. Why does the statement that men need to be included in this conversation create controversy?

cococandy:


I’m QUITE SURE you understand I meant pregnancy prevention. Not pregnancy itself and abortions.

But I’ll accept your response as non-facetious.

Now that it’s been established that both sides would benefit from being careful about preventing unwanted pregnancies (ergo reducing abortions), why are the posts encouraging the OP to broaden his Teachings judgement, not acceptable here?

Again, before the argument of “women suffer more” arises, let me state that I recognize that.

However, how would it hurt anyone if both men and women take actions to prevent such pregnancies?

Again, not saying women should leave it to men. Y’all know I dislike being deliberately misinterpreted hence the repetitions. Why does the statement that men need to be included in this conversation create controversy?

But cococandy you know that woman can never criticize men naa, na wa for you sef.
See question wey you dey ask

You would be surprised how many married men and women procure abortions every year in the country. That some men and women are married doesn't automatically mean they have special access to good sense with respect to unplanned pregnancies. And it is always the same story of the man not wanting to use condom while at the same time not discussing contraceptive options with the wife.

For those that are interested in blaming men, yes such men though married are irresponsible and I offer no apologies for saying that.

What amazes me every single time is meeting individuals engaging in unprotected sex and claiming the ensuing pregnancy to be an accident, a mistake. For those interested in interpreting the initial post beyond the intention to draw out a debate that emphasizes the fact that the woman is 100% the owner of her body and should determine whether and when she gets pregnant, I have no need to sate your desire to turn this into a men-vs-women thing. You can continue, which is the beauty of this forum.

Yes, married men and women are highly involved in unwanted pregnancies and both the pregnancies and/or the abortion directly affects the woman more than the man. It is simple biology.


I am going to quote a research publication by the Guttmacher Institute that touches the matter here:

"An estimated 1.25 million induced abortions occurred in Nigeria in 2012, equivalent to a rate of 33 abortions per 1,000 women aged 15–49. The estimated unintended pregnancy rate was 59 per 1,000 women aged 15–49. Fifty-six percent of unintended pregnancies were resolved by abortion. About 212,000 women were treated for complications of unsafe abortion, representing a treatment rate of 5.6 per 1,000 women of reproductive age, and an additional 285,000 experienced serious health consequences but did not receive the treatment they needed.
Levels of unintended pregnancy and unsafe abortion continue to be high in Nigeria. Improvements in access to contraceptive services and in the provision of safe abortion and postabortion care services (as permitted by law) may help reduce maternal morbidity and mortality."

Reference: International Perspectives on Sexual and Reproductive Health, 2015, 41(4):170–181, doi:10.1363/4117015

Notice that it says maternal morbidity and mortality. Not paternal. Neither does it talk about who is to blame. The morbidity burden and the mortality burden of unplanned pregnancies are qualified with a gender-specific adjective maternal. I am not sure that the right approach to discuss this matter is by inviting men to share the blame (yes, they have a large portion of that already), but by recognizing that the woman suffers those two burdens exclusively and to recognize that they should own their bodies 100%. Even in marriage.

Unnerve:

Hmmm, how do married people avoid unwanted pregnancies while having regular sex?

Sixfeetbelle:


And that's the issue, isn't it?

How safe is prolonged use of contraceptives for a woman who plans to have kids in the future?

How safe? Not encouraging.

Especially for hormonal contraceptives which is by far the commonest used by most women.