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AntiChristian:


Matthew was a Jew. Jesus was a Jew! But you are Christians right? You sabi give excuse o hypocrite!

Muhammad too was from Ishmael from Abraham.
Did Abraham rape Hagar in the Bible?

Lukuluku69:


According to the Bible:

1. Abraham prayed for a son/an heir.
2. God told him he shall have one.
3. Abraham had a son when he was 86 years (Ishmael)
4. Abraham was circumscised when he was 99 years (why?)
5. Issac was born when Abraham was 100yrs.
6. God instruction/command was: Offer THINE ONLY SON!
7. When Issac came, Abraham had 2 (TWO) SONS and not an ONLY SON.
8. The Circumscision (every male: Abraham, his son Ishmael and all servant were circumscised that day at 99yrs. And in line with the Covenant Issac was circumscised when he was 8 Days old (as Muslims do till date)

The name Ishmael was replaced with Issac in all of Genesis 17 and replaced with Issac. This was the reason the Jews wanted Jesus dead! He told them their age-long LIES to their Faces!

All these have not given any Qur’anic evidence being undiluted Allah’s word but mere conjecture and evil intrapolation. The Bible is more direct about its own records and reasons. I doubt if any Hadith talks about it, so the inferences are unrealistic and unreliable.

MightySparrow:


All these have not given any Qur’anic evidence being undiluted Allah’s word but mere conjecture and evil intrapolation. The Bible is more direct about its own records and reasons. I doubt if any Hadith talks about it, so the inferences are unrealistic and unreliable.

You are still taking a peek from a Keyhole. Come out in the open to enjoy the splendour of the horizon.

Lukuluku69:


You are still taking a peek from a Keyhole. Come out in the open to enjoy the splendour of the horizon.

You are Muslim and you know quran and other books of islam. I am not a muslim and do not know Quran, but in the name of truth, qoute your references!

AntiChristian:


You guys are absurd! You Claim Muhammad was being possessed but Paul saw a bright light and that is not possession since it favours Christianity!
It's hypocrisy when you do like that.

Which of my statement is unclear here? God Created everything with the word "be" and they become.

Jesus, Adam and Everything was created in this way.

Dude your hadith say Muhammad was bewitched by a sorcerer, its not christians who gave that story please. In other places it says he could have sex with all his wives in one night by some special powers beyond man, was it a christian who wrote the hadith? The difference between a real man of God and a fake is based on the kind of things he says, while your Muhammad claims to be a prophet of God, the last one who was sent to the entire mankind, he fails to meet the the prophecy concerning The Messiah which he claims to be, so how do you expect us to accept what he says? Besides there is no where from The Scriptures were an Angel of God chokes or tortures anyone to accept his message.

Again his message seeks to exalt his person above everyone else, that is so what some oluba olumba or any other typical bipolar maniac prophet would say, they claim to be some divine personality or God Himself, they usually have multiple sexual partners of increasingly complex relationships, they usually have unique weird messages, they also have some episodes of hallucinations which their followers may think they communicating with some divine spirits, and they operate in an occultic manner. Muhammad had all these characteristics from the hadith and quran. imagine someone like that existing at a time ignorance was bliss?

St Paul was a regular person against the Church who changed his ways after discovering the truth.

You are the ones who claim God is One and Indivisible, yet you say a portion of God exists in men? Thats speaking fron two sides of your mouth bro.

Jesus Christ is A Spirit, A Spirit can inhabit a mortal body right?

veeshock:

Dude your hadith say Muhammad was bewitched by a sorcerer, its not christians who gave that story please. In other places it says he could have sex with all his wives in one night by some special powers beyond man, was it a christian who wrote the hadith? The difference between a real man of God and a fake is based on the kind of things he says, while your Muhammad claims to be a prophet of God, the last one who was sent to the entire mankind, he fails to meet the the prophecy concerning The Messiah which he claims to be, so how do you expect us to accept what he says? Besides there is no where from The Scriptures were an Angel of God chokes or tortures anyone to accept his message.

Being bewitched by a sorcerer doesn't diminish his Prophethood in anyway. In your book, many Prophets suffered different ordeals. From Moses, Abraham, Daniel, Samson, Jesus, John, Job, Jonah, etc. They were all tested! Don't be ignorant.

Having sex with one's wife is now a sin in the Bible right? Can you mention how many wives Solomon has? Mention how many concubines? How do you thing he satisfy them? Does all this diminish them being men of God? What was Job's sin before his affliction? Why did God allow John to be beheaded? I know you won't answer these and shame to you!

veeshock:

Again his message seeks to exalt his person above everyone else, that is so what some oluba olumba or any other typical bipolar maniac prophet would say, they claim to be some divine personality or God Himself, they usually have multiple sexual partners of increasingly complex relationships, they usually have unique weird messages, they also have some episodes of hallucinations which their followers may think they communicating with some divine spirits, and they operate in an occultic manner. Muhammad had all these characteristics from the hadith and quran. imagine someone like that existing at a time ignorance was bliss?

Moses too had most of this. Anyone seeing him going up the mountain could say all this against him. He had multiple wives just as Abraham had.
Many people had dreams in the Bible which can be similar to hallucinations as you said! All your claims are still baseless! bring the evidence and I will put similar ones to show your hypocrisy!

veeshock:
St Paul was a regular person against the Church who changed his ways after discovering the truth.

You are the ones who claim God is One and Indivisible, yet you say a portion of God exists in men? Thats speaking fron two sides of your mouth bro.

Jesus Christ is A Spirit, A Spirit can inhabit a mortal body right?

Where did I say a portion of God exist in men?

Your Jesus is a Spirit! Ours is human!
Angels are spirits!
Your Satan too is a Spirit! Satan is a Jinn!
Your God too is a Spirit But Allah is not comparable to any of His creations!

ContractKiller:

You are not to be blamed actually. It was Yahweh who first started the discrimination of the two sons of Abraham!
I don't blame you much!

sagenaija:
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Who told you Mohamed was from Ishmael?
Can you substantiate this your claim?
Islam just wants to be relevant by attempting a link to Abraham.
Even the Koran has no such linkage of Mohamed to Ishmael. Where did you get yours from?

Your Christian brother just posted the image above there! Go and fight the evidence.

Sahih al-Bukhari 3364

AntiChristian:


Your Christian brother just posted the image above there! Go and fight the evidence.

Sahih al-Bukhari 3364

Are you so dumb?
Who's talking about Ishmael?
Did you even bother to read what was posted? Obviously not.

I guess in your haste to answer back you end up making a fool of yourself.

This is what I wrote:
Who told you Mohamed was from Ishmael?
Can you substantiate this your claim?
Islam just wants to be relevant by attempting a link to Abraham.
Even the Koran has no such linkage of Mohamed to Ishmael. Where did you get yours from?

AntiChristian:



Being bewitched by a sorcerer doesn't diminish his Prophethood in anyway. In your book, many Prophets suffered different ordeals. From Moses, Abraham, Daniel, Samson, Jesus, John, Job, Jonah, etc. They were all tested! Don't be ignorant.

Do you know hallucination is a symptom of mania? Do you know having an abnormally high sex drive(your hadith says muhammad had the sex drive of 30men) is also a symtom of mania? Do you also know claiming to be a "special" prophet with no agreeable evidence is also a symptom of mania? What about the numerous confabulations in the quran and hadiths?
Which prophet did you see in the Bible was under the spell of an evil spirit sent by a sorcerer?

AntiChristian:

Having sex with one's wife is now a sin in the Bible right? Can you mention how many wives Solomon has? Mention how many concubines? How do you thing he satisfy them? Does all this diminish them being men of God? What was Job's sin before his affliction? Why did God allow John to be beheaded? I know you won't answer these and shame to you!

Moses too had most of this. Anyone seeing him going up the mountain could say all this against him. He had multiple wives just as Abraham had.
Many people had dreams in the Bible which can be similar to hallucinations as you said! All your claims are still baseless! bring the evidence and I will put similar ones to show your hypocrisy!

How many wives did muhammad have? He claimed a muslim should have only four but how many did he have and why? besides slaves he also had sex with...smh.

What are the names of Solomons wives? Did any one tell you he slept with all of them every night? And who said the story of Job was a real event and not just a lesson on morality? Concerning John, when Jesus was about to be crucified and He said "not my will but Thine will be done" what do you think He meant?

Unfortunately for you not only Moses heard the Voice of God, all the isrealites saw the Works of God before their eyes, but as for Muhammad...even those who saw him "split the moon" said it was fake, no one ever saw or heard the angel speaking to him in all his 23 years or so, his quran which he claims was dictated from The Creator has too many fallacies.
Hallucinations are clearly differebt from dreams mr.

AntiChristian:

Where did I say a portion of God exist in men?

Perhaps you dont understand what you say....

"Then He (Allah) fashioned him (Adam) and blew in him from His
spirit."
Soorah as-Sajdah 32:9, and 38:72
And, "When I fashioned him and blew into him of My Spirit..."
Soorah al-Hijr 15:29 and Soorah Saad 38:72
…have been used as evidence for the belief that every human being
contains within his body a part of God. The portion of Allah's "spirit"
which Allah breathed into Adam has supposedly been inherited by all of
his descendants...

AntiChristian:

Your Jesus is a Spirit! Ours is human!
Angels are spirits!
Your Satan too is a Spirit! Satan is a Jinn!
Your God too is a Spirit But Allah is not comparable to any of His creations!

Offcourse anyone verse with the Bible would agree muhammad had a poor understanding of christianity and only gave you what he understood based on his own thinking of what should be right, but unfortunately for you, he isnt the first or last to make such claims, and they almost always have those clear symptoms of mania above. He just came at a time knowledge wasnt available.

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AntiChristian:


You are not to be blamed actually. It was Yahweh who first started the discrimination of the two sons of Abraham!
I don't blame you much!

MightySparrow:
You are Muslim and you know quran and other books of islam. I am not a muslim and do not know Quran, but in the name of truth, qoute your references!

You can't handle your own references and you want me to quote from the one you don't believe in?

So long. It is better to lay off what you don't have knowledge about because A Day is coming we will ALL be called to give ACCOUNTS for ALL that transpired here. Even the idle words will count against us.

Lukuluku69:


You can't handle your own references and you want me to quote from the one you don't believe in?

So long. It is better to lay off what you don't have knowledge about because A Day is coming we will ALL be called to give ACCOUNTS for ALL that transpired here. Even the idle words will count against us.

Islam is falsehood in the absolule. You people condemn bible you can't understand or refuse to acknowledge. Go through wikipaedia and bronwse Saudi Arabia, long before mohammed was born the place was dominated by christianity. He was born into it. the lie told by muslims now is that he was a complete illiterate, no schooling, no knowledge. the man just sat somewhere, copied what suited his 'ministry' from the Bible and condemn the source protected the 'new revelation' with violence. The same is in force today! What we are discussing here could attract fatwa if not because of identity - saving internet. I could imagine the rage going on within you even now.

I see you're too cowardly to face me by responding promptly and in a timely fashion to my posts.

It is clear that Ishmael was only a refugee who lived amongst the Arabs and was taught the Arabic language. He was NEVER their father!

So in essence, MuhaMAD turned his own people into fatherless bastards who don't even know their own history just because he was fascinated with the God of Christians and Jews and he desperately wanted them to accept him!

That level of stupidity deserves its own classification!!



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AntiChristian:


Your Christian brother just posted the image above there! Go and fight the evidence.

Sahih al-Bukhari 3364

MightySparrow:
Islam is falsehood in the absolule. You people condemn bible you can't understand or refuse to acknowledge. Go through wikipaedia and bronwse Saudi Arabia, long before mohammed was born the place was dominated by christianity. He was born into it. the lie told by muslims now is that he was a complete illiterate, no schooling, no knowledge. the man just sat somewhere, copied what suited his 'ministry' from the Bible and condemn the source protected the 'new revelation' with violence. The same is in force today! What we are discussing here could attract fatwa if not because of identity - saving internet. I could imagine the rage going on within you even now.

Ok.

K

Lukuluku69:


Ok.

K

:

MightySparrow:
Islam is falsehood in the absolule. You people condemn bible you can't understand or refuse to acknowledge. Go through wikipaedia and bronwse Saudi Arabia, long before mohammed was born the place was dominated by christianity. He was born into it. the lie told by muslims now is that he was a complete illiterate, no schooling, no knowledge. the man just sat somewhere, copied what suited his 'ministry' from the Bible and condemn the source protected the 'new revelation' with violence. The same is in force today! What we are discussing here could attract fatwa if not because of identity - saving internet. I could imagine the rage going on within you even now.

Same way Christianity is falsehood to the Jew. The Jews didn't accept Jesus as messiah or God sent. To them also Jesus also copied from their history. The same way you Christains view the Jew is the same way we view you. We can say the same thing you accuse Muhammad of also applies to Jesus. We can say Jesus copied from the Torah and Jewish history that is the Jews view of Jesus. You can believe whatever you want to believe. You believe Apostle Paul don't you who saw a bright light that blinded him with no witness and you believe Jesus/holyspirit can be that violent. To you is your religion to me is mine.

To me one thing is certain there is only one God not trinity. Jesus was only a servant.

Isaiah 42 Vs 1 & 8

1 BEHOLD MY [a]Servant, Whom I uphold, My elect in Whom My soul delights! I have put My Spirit upon Him; He will bring forth justice and right and reveal truth to the nations.

5 Thus says God the Lord--He Who created the heavens and stretched them forth, He Who spread abroad the earth and that which comes out of it, He Who gives breath to the people on it and spirit to those who walk in it:

6 I the Lord have called You [the Messiah] for a righteous purpose and in righteousness; I will take You by the hand and will keep You; I will give You for a covenant to the people [Israel], for a light to the nations [Gentiles],

7 To open the eyes of the blind, to bring out prisoners from the dungeon, and those who sit in darkness from the prison

8 I am the Lord; that is My name! And My glory I will not give to another, nor My praise to graven images.

From this verse it shows Jesus didn't create heaven and earth yet you claim he is the word of God through which all things are created. The difference is clear for you to see but you allowed the deceiver to deceive you. Same Jesus that can't do anything without the support of God(Allah). Here God called him servant who is Jesus serving tell me (Allah).
God said he would give no one his glory but Christians gave it to Jesus.

"O mankind, fear your Lord and fear a Day when no father will avail his son, nor will a son avail his father at all. Indeed, the promise of Allah is truth, so let not the worldly life delude you and be not deceived about Allah by the Deceiver."
(QS. Luqman 31: Verse 33)


"They have certainly disbelieved who say that Allah is Christ, the son of Mary. Say, Then who could prevent Allah at all if He had intended to destroy Christ, the son of Mary, or his mother or everyone on the earth? And to Allah belongs the dominion of the heavens and the earth and whatever is between them. He creates what He wills, and Allah is over all things competent."
(QS. Al-Maaida 5: Verse 17)


* Via Qur'an English http://quran-en.com


For me I will serve the creator and not the creation.

MightySparrow:
Islam is falsehood in the absolule. You people condemn bible you can't understand or refuse to acknowledge. Go through wikipaedia and bronwse Saudi Arabia, long before mohammed was born the place was dominated by christianity. He was born into it. the lie told by muslims now is that he was a complete illiterate, no schooling, no knowledge. the man just sat somewhere, copied what suited his 'ministry' from the Bible and condemn the source protected the 'new revelation' with violence. The same is in force today! What we are discussing here could attract fatwa if not because of identity - saving internet. I could imagine the rage going on within you even now.

You're on point!!

The illiterate, no knowledge man was trading for his first wife according to the same Islam. How did he keep records? How did he negotiate trade? Or was he simply a 'security guard' for the wife's caravans?

This is one of the bare-faced lies Islam wants it's unthinking adherents to believe. All in a bid to elevate a less-than-a-Robbin-Hood to prophethood.

ContractKiller:
I see you're too cowardly to face me by responding promptly and in a timely fashion to my posts.

It is clear that Ishmael was only a refugee who lived amongst the Arabs and was taught the Arabic language. He was NEVER their father!

So in essence, MuhaMAD turned his own people into fatherless bastards who don't even know their own history just because he was fascinated with the God of Christians and Jews and he desperately wanted them to accept him!

That level of stupidity deserves its own classification!!

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Islam should ordinarily crumble under the weight of of its false and contradictory writings but for bolded.

haekymbahd:
Same way Christianity is falsehood to the Jew. The Jews didn't accept Jesus as messiah

For me I will serve the creator and not the creation.

You can't defend your religion and now run to attack Christianity.

You're not serving the Creator. You are serving the one amongst other creators - Allah. That is what he said he is - the best among other creators. Prove me wrong

sagenaija:

You're on point!!

The illiterate, no knowledge man was trading for his first wife according to the same Islam. How did he keep records? How did he negotiate trade? Or was he simply a 'security guard' for the wife's caravans?

This is one of the bare-faced lies Islam wants it's unthinking adherents to believe. All in a bid to elevate a less-than-a-Robbin-Hood to prophethood.

Thanks, tell them the truth, they will asking for one's head.

Agree 100%!!! It is idiots who are living in self denial and the spirit of Antichristian who are keeping the I-SLIMEIC lie alive. They are too cowardly to admit that they are wrong, so rather than do that, they start looking for imaginary flaws in Christianity and Judaism to make themselves feel good.

sagenaija:

Islam should ordinarily crumble under the weight of of its false and contradictory writings but for bolded.

haekymbahd:
Bro I understand you religion is about faith. Personally this is my view on that I will go with the Islamic view because Islamically when Abraham was to sacrificed Ishmael and at the time Isaac has not yet been born making Ishmael the only son then.

From the Christian perspective Isaac was to be sacrificed but he wasn't Abraham's only son.

Genesis 22:12
12 And He said, Do not lay your hand on the lad or do anything to him; for now I know that you fear and revere God, since you have not held back from Me or begrudged giving Me your son, your only son.

I believe the mistake came from the Bible.

It couldn't have come from the bible. the story of the bible is complete and straight forward. bible story is mainly about the house of israel and how jesus was linked with adam. also, god promised abraham a son through sarah but impatience ishmael came to the scene but promise from god has not changed. if i

MightySparrow pobyst=92641392:
It couldn't have come from the bible. the story of the bible is complete and straight forward. bible story is mainly about the house of israel and how jesus was linked with adam. also, god promised abraham a son through sarah but impatience ishmael came to the scene but promise from god has not changed. if i

I know the bible especially book of genesis is not reliable due to so many errors and contradictions even about the order creations. so to me it is not worthy of a standard there could be some conspiracy theory behind it.

Abraham had only one son.
When God told Abraham to kill his son Isaac, God referred to Isaac as Abrahams's "only son."
Take now thy son, thine only son Isaac ... and offer him there for a burnt offering. Genesis 22:2

1600 or so years after Abraham supposedly lived, the author of Hebrews repeated God's reference to Isaac as Abraham's "only son."
By faith Abraham when he was tried, offered up Isaac ... his only begotten son. Hebrews 11:17

Abraham had two sons.
Abraham was 86 years old when his son Ishmael was born.
And Hagar bare Abraham a son: and Abram called his son's name, which Hagar bare, Ishmael. And Abram was fourscore and six years old, when Hagar bare Ishmael to Abram. Genesis 16:15-16

Sixteen years later, when Abraham was 100 years old, Isaac was born.
For Sarah conceived, and bare Abraham a son is his old age .... And Abraham called him Isaac. ... And Abraham was an hundred years old, when his son Isaac was born. Genesis 21:2-5
Abraham had two sons; the one [Ishmael] by a bond-woman [Hagar], and the other [Isaac] by a free woman [Sarah]. Galatians 4:22

Abraham had seven or eight sons
(Depending on whether or not Ishmael is Abraham's son.)
Many years later, Abraham "took" another wife (or concubine) and had six more sons.
Then again Abraham took a wife, and her name was Keturah. And she bare him Zimran, and Jokshan, and Medan, and Midian, and Ishbak, and Shuah. Genesis 25:1-2
Now the sons of Keturah, Abraham's concubine: she bare Zimran, and Jokshan, and Medan, and Midian, and Ishbak, and Shuah. 1 Chronicles 1:32



If Abraham had an only son and only begotten son at any point in history it was Ishmael because he was his first.
And the fact is God made a promise to Ishmael too even though Isaac might have been the promise son. Yeah the promise of God has not changed God made lot of promise not only to Isaac but also too Ishmael.

Also

It is clear the Jew are expecting Elijah, the messiah and also a prophet. Jesus said John the Baptist was Elijah.
So I ask you who is the prophet and who fulfilled the prophecy because it is clear the prophet can't be Jesus?

John 1

19 And this is the testimony of John when the Jews sent priests and Levites to him from Jerusalem to ask him, Who are you?

20 He confessed (admitted the truth) and did not try to conceal it, but acknowledged, I am not the Christ!

21 They asked him, What then? Are you Elijah? And he said, I am not! Are you the Prophet? And he answered, No!(H)

22 Then they said to him, Who are you? Tell us, so that we may give an answer to those who sent us. What do you say about yourself?

23 He said, I am the voice of one crying aloud in the wilderness [the voice of one shouting in the desert], Prepare the way of the Lord [level, straighten out, the path of the Lord], as the prophet Isaiah said.(I)

24 The messengers had been sent from the Pharisees.

25 And they asked him, Why then are you baptizing if you are not the Christ, nor Elijah, nor the Prophet?



Who is the prophet being talked about which the Jew are expecting?

A clue

Deuteronomy 18 Vs 18

I will raise up for them a prophet like you from among their brothers. And I will put my words in his mouth, and he shall speak to them all that I command him.

Who fulfilled that prophecy?

haekymbahd:
I know the bible especially book of genesis is not reliable due

Isaac was the only PROMISED child of Abraham, a fact which the Koran agrees with (cf. Genesis 17:15-21; Koran 11:69-73, 37:112-113, 51:24-30). Ishmael was never a promised child.

Isaac was conceived miraculously to a barren mother and a very aged father, with the Koran likewise agreeing (cf. Genesis 17:15-17, 18:9-15, 21:1-7; Galatians 4:28-29; Koran 11:69-73, 51:24-30). Ishmael was conceived normally without the need of any miraculous intervention.

God promised that it would be Isaac's descendants who would inherit the land given to Abraham. (Genesis 13:14-18, 15:18-21, 28:13-14). Ishmael had no part in the inheritance and promise given to Isaac through Abraham.

It is for these reasons that Isaac is called Abraham's only son since God himself reckoned him as the child of promise and blessings, an honor never bestowed upon Ishmael.

Islamic scholars strongly disagree and much confusion still exists over the identity of the son, with some arguing for Isaac and others for Ishmael.

The Koran does not give a clear position on it. So, Moslems hold differing opinions on it. The Biblical narrative is clear, making it vastly superior and more trustworthy.

The confusion is in the Koran and Islam. Your religion speaks from both sides of the mouth. The Koran claims to make things clear. But in reality the opposite is the case. It therefore ends up confusing you guys. You then have to run to the hadiths or the traditions. There is no such contradiction in the Bible.

Also, the Koran gives no clear reason why God would test Abraham in this fashion, and yet the Bible does. Abraham and Isaac were shadows of what was to eventually come nearly two thousand years later on the same mountain site where Isaac was offered.

Just as Abraham displayed unconditional love for God in his willingness to sacrifice his one and only son, God also gave up his only beloved Son on the cross of Calvary to prove to the world that He is the true source of unconditional, infinite love. Whereas God withheld the hand of Abraham from completing the sacrifice, He did not withhold his own hand from sacrificing his only Son, going to the extremes in displaying his love for mankind, an extreme that even Abraham did not cross.

PS
Let's finish with this issue first then we can go to John and the promised prophet. Again, did you note the word 'promised'?

Your

haekymbahd:
I know the bible especially book of genesis is not reliable due to so many errors and contradictions even about the order creations. so to me it is not worthy of a standard there could be some conspiracy theory behind it.

Abraham had only one son.
When God told Abraham to kill his son Isaac, God referred to Isaac as Abrahams's "only son."
Take now thy son, thine only son Isaac ... and offer him there for a burnt offering. Genesis 22:2

1600 or so years after Abraham supposedly lived, the author of Hebrews repeated God's reference to Isaac as Abraham's "only son."
By faith Abraham when he was tried, offered up Isaac ... his only begotten son. Hebrews 11:17

Abraham had two sons.
Abraham was 86 years old when his son Ishmael was born.
And Hagar bare Abraham a son: and Abram called his son's name, which Hagar bare, Ishmael. And Abram was fourscore and six years old, when Hagar bare Ishmael to Abram. Genesis 16:15-16

Sixteen years later, when Abraham was 100 years old, Isaac was born.
For Sarah conceived, and bare Abraham a son is his old age .... And Abraham called him Isaac. ... And Abraham was an hundred years old, when his son Isaac was born. Genesis 21:2-5
Abraham had two sons; the one [Ishmael] by a bond-woman [Hagar], and the other [Isaac] by a free woman [Sarah]. Galatians 4:22

Abraham had seven or eight sons
(Depending on whether or not Ishmael is Abraham's son.)
Many years later, Abraham "took" another wife (or concubine) and had six more sons.
Then again Abraham took a wife, and her name was Keturah. And she bare him Zimran, and Jokshan, and Medan, and Midian, and Ishbak, and Shuah. Genesis 25:1-2
Now the sons of Keturah, Abraham's concubine: she bare Zimran, and Jokshan, and Medan, and Midian, and Ishbak, and Shuah. 1 Chronicles 1:32



If Abraham had an only son and only begotten son at any point in history it was Ishmael because he was his first.
And the fact is God made a promise to Ishmael too even though Isaac might have been the promise son. Yeah the promise of God has not changed God made lot of promise not only to Isaac but also too Ishmael.

Also

It is clear the Jew are expecting Elijah, the messiah and also a prophet. Jesus said John the Baptist was Elijah.
So I ask you who is the prophet and who fulfilled the prophecy because it is clear the prophet can't be Jesus?

John 1

19 And this is the testimony of John when the Jews sent priests and Levites to him from Jerusalem to ask him, Who are you?

20 He confessed (admitted the truth) and did not try to conceal it, but acknowledged, I am not the Christ!

21 They asked him, What then? Are you Elijah? And he said, I am not! Are you the Prophet? And he answered, No!(H)

22 Then they said to him, Who are you? Tell us, so that we may give an answer to those who sent us. What do you say about yourself?

23 He said, I am the voice of one crying aloud in the wilderness [the voice of one shouting in the desert], Prepare the way of the Lord [level, straighten out, the path of the Lord], as the prophet Isaiah said.(I)

24 The messengers had been sent from the Pharisees.

25 And they asked him, Why then are you baptizing if you are not the Christ, nor Elijah, nor the Prophet?



Who is the prophet being talked about which the Jew are expecting?

A clue

Deuteronomy 18 Vs 18

I will raise up for them a prophet like you from among their brothers. And I will put my words in his mouth, and he shall speak to them all that I command him.

Who fulfilled that prophecy?

Your argument is logical but still haven’t answered the question raised. Your analysis still subject to so many factors. 1. Who, when , how were the records of Genesis altered?. 2. Who has the original writ? 3. Why didn’t Ishmaelites tell their own history before Mohammed? Why did God neglect the children of Ketursh as did Ishmael? 4. How reliable is Mohammed’s revelation that came 3000+ later.
5. The claim that Mohammed was the awaited prophet, did he actually claim that or inferred by a devotee of Islam like you after his death.
Ishmael himself was not an Arab - see one of the posts above as reported by an authentic Hadith.

sagenaija:

You can't defend your religion and now run to attack Christianity.

You're not serving the Creator. You are serving the one amongst other creators - Allah. That is what he said he is - the best among other creators. Prove me wrong

Dundee, how far with Hagia Sophia? Or have you stopped crying on behalf of the Orthodox?

haekymbahd:
I know the bible especially book of genesis is not reliable due to so many errors and contradictions even about the order creations. so to me it is not worthy of a standard there could be some conspiracy theory behind it.

Abraham had only one son.
When God told Abraham to kill his son Isaac, God referred to Isaac as Abrahams's "only son."
Take now thy son, thine only son Isaac ... and offer him there for a burnt offering. Genesis 22:2

1600 or so years after Abraham supposedly lived, the author of Hebrews repeated God's reference to Isaac as Abraham's "only son."
By faith Abraham when he was tried, offered up Isaac ... his only begotten son. Hebrews 11:17

Abraham had two sons.
Abraham was 86 years old when his son Ishmael was born.
And Hagar bare Abraham a son: and Abram called his son's name, which Hagar bare, Ishmael. And Abram was fourscore and six years old, when Hagar bare Ishmael to Abram. Genesis 16:15-16

Sixteen years later, when Abraham was 100 years old, Isaac was born.
For Sarah conceived, and bare Abraham a son is his old age .... And Abraham called him Isaac. ... And Abraham was an hundred years old, when his son Isaac was born. Genesis 21:2-5
Abraham had two sons; the one [Ishmael] by a bond-woman [Hagar], and the other [Isaac] by a free woman [Sarah]. Galatians 4:22

Abraham had seven or eight sons
(Depending on whether or not Ishmael is Abraham's son.)
Many years later, Abraham "took" another wife (or concubine) and had six more sons.
Then again Abraham took a wife, and her name was Keturah. And she bare him Zimran, and Jokshan, and Medan, and Midian, and Ishbak, and Shuah. Genesis 25:1-2
Now the sons of Keturah, Abraham's concubine: she bare Zimran, and Jokshan, and Medan, and Midian, and Ishbak, and Shuah. 1 Chronicles 1:32



If Abraham had an only son and only begotten son at any point in history it was Ishmael because he was his first.
And the fact is God made a promise to Ishmael too even though Isaac might have been the promise son. Yeah the promise of God has not changed God made lot of promise not only to Isaac but also too Ishmael.

Also

It is clear the Jew are expecting Elijah, the messiah and also a prophet. Jesus said John the Baptist was Elijah.
So I ask you who is the prophet and who fulfilled the prophecy because it is clear the prophet can't be Jesus?

John 1

19 And this is the testimony of John when the Jews sent priests and Levites to him from Jerusalem to ask him, Who are you?

20 He confessed (admitted the truth) and did not try to conceal it, but acknowledged, I am not the Christ!

21 They asked him, What then? Are you Elijah? And he said, I am not! Are you the Prophet? And he answered, No!(H)

22 Then they said to him, Who are you? Tell us, so that we may give an answer to those who sent us. What do you say about yourself?

23 He said, I am the voice of one crying aloud in the wilderness [the voice of one shouting in the desert], Prepare the way of the Lord [level, straighten out, the path of the Lord], as the prophet Isaiah said.(I)

24 The messengers had been sent from the Pharisees.

25 And they asked him, Why then are you baptizing if you are not the Christ, nor Elijah, nor the Prophet?



Who is the prophet being talked about which the Jew are expecting?

A clue

Deuteronomy 18 Vs 18

I will raise up for them a prophet like you from among their brothers. And I will put my words in his mouth, and he shall speak to them all that I command him.

Who fulfilled that prophecy?

Deaf, dumb and blind they will not return.

Keep up the good work brother perchance they reflect.

MightySparrow:
Your Your argument is logical but still haven’t answered the question raised. Your analysis still subject to so many factors. 1. Who, when , how were the records of Genesis altered?

These are few errors in Genesis alone what is the probability that the Bible didn't make an error in who Abrahams sacrcrificial son was.

GE 1:20-21, 26-27 Birds were created before man was created.

GE 2:7, 19 Man was created before birds were created.


GE 1:24-27 Animals were created before man was created.

GE 2:7, 19 Man was created before animals were created.


GE 1:26-27 Man and woman were created at the same time.

GE 2:7, 21-22 Man was created first, woman sometime later.


GE 2:4, 4:26, 12:8, 22:14-16, 26:25 God was already known as "the Lord" (Jahveh or Jehovah) much earlier than the time of Moses.
GE 21:14-16 Hagar casts Ishmael under a bush

GE 17:23-26, 21:5 Hagar was already fourteen years old


GE 22:1-12, DT 8:2 God tempts (tests) Abraham and Moses.

GE 6:4 There were Nephilim (giants) before the Flood.

GE 7:21 All creatures other than Noah and his clan were annihilated by the Flood.
GE 7:24 The flood lasts 150 days

GE 7:17 40 days

GE 8:5 Ten Months


[b]GE 11:7-9 God sows discord.

PR 6:16-19 God hates anyone who sows discord.

GE 11:12 Arpachshad [Arphaxad] was the father of Shelah.

LK 3:35-36 Cainan was the father of Shelah. Arpachshad was the grandfather of Shelah.


GE 11:26 Terah was 70 years old when his son Abram was born.

GE 11:32 Terah was 205 years old when he died (making Abram 135 at the time).

GE 12:4, AC 7:4 Abram was 75 when he left Haran. This was after Terah died. Thus, Terah could have been no more than 145 when he died; or Abram was only 75 years old after he had lived 135 years.


GE 12:7, 17:1, 18:1, 26:2, 32:30, EX 3:16, 6:2-3, 24:9-11, 33:11, NU 12:7-8, 14:14, JB 42:5, AM 7:7-8, 9:1 God is seen.

EX 33:20, JN 1:18, 1JN 4:12 God is not seen. No one can see God's face and live. No one has ever seen him.


GE 10:5, 20, 31 There were many languages before the Tower of Babel.

GE 11:1 There was only one language before the Tower of Babel.


GE 15:9, EX 20:24, 29:10-42, LE 1:1-7:38, NU 28:1-29:40, God details sacrificial offerings.

JE 7:21-22 God says he did no such thing.


GE 15:13, ACT 7:6 The sojourn in Egypt lasted 400 years

EX 12:40 430 years

GE 16:15, 21:1-3, GA 4:22 Abraham had two sons, Ishmael and Isaac.

HE 11:17 Abraham had only one son.


GE 17:1, 35:11, 1CH 29:11-12, LK 1:37 God is omnipotent. Nothing is impossible with (or for) God.[/b]

[b]JG 1:19 Although God was with Judah, together they could not defeat the plainsmen because the latter had iron chariots.


GE 21:14-16 Hagar casts Ishmael under a bush

GE 17:23-26, 21:5 Ishmael was already fourteen years old


GE 22:1-12, DT 8:2 God tempts (tests) Abraham and Moses.

JG 2:22 God himself says that he does test (tempt).
GE 26:35 Esau's wife Bashemath was the daughter of Elon the Hittite

GE 36:2-3 Bashemath was the daughter of Ishmael and sister of Nabajoth his wife Adah is the daughter of Elon the Hittite

GE 28:9 Esau's wife Mahalath is the daughter of Ishmael and sister of Nabajoth
GE 32:28-30 God changed Jacobs name at Peniel crossing the Jabbok

GE 35:9-10 He changed it at padanaram


GE 35:10 God says Jacob is to be called Jacob no longer; henceforth his name is Israel.

GE 46:2 At a later time, God himself uses the name Jacob.
GE 36:11 The sons of Eliphaz were Teman, Omar, Zepho, Gatam, and Kenaz.

GE 36:15-16 Teman, Omar, Zepho, Kenaz.

1CH 1:35-36 Teman, Omar, Zephi, Gatam, Kenaz, Timna, and Amalek.
GE 37:36 The Midianites of northern arabia sold Jospeh into slavery

GE 37:28, 39:1 It was the Ishmaelites of the syrian desert

GE 45:4 It was his brothers
[/b]
e. t. c[/b]

MightySparrow:

2. Who has the original writ?

Ask Where the author of Genesis got this information from because I know our God and holyspirit is not a God and spirit of confusion. Lol

MightySparrow:

3. Why didn’t Ishmaelites tell their own history before Mohammed? Why did God neglect the children of Ketursh as did Ishmael?

Because after his death they reverted back to idol worshipping just like what happened during the time of Moses when they worshipped the Golden calf while Moses was still alive o. And for prophets were not sent to them at intervals unlike Israel.

Hmmmn ask yourself did God ever at any point said he was going to neglect ishmail God said he will make a great nation out of him.

MightySparrow:

4. How reliable is Mohammed’s revelation that came 3000+ later

There was a prophecy of him which God revealed to Moses and the Jew were certainly expecting a prophet he fulfilled it and also he fulfilled the promise God made to ishmael

Genesis 16
10Also the Angel of the Lord said to her, I will multiply your descendants exceedingly, so that they shall not be numbered for multitude.

11And the Angel of the Lord continued, See now, you are with child and shall bear a son, and shall call his name Ishmael [God hears], because the Lord has heard and paid attention to your affliction.

12And he [Ishmael] will be as a [b]wild ass among men; his hand will be against every man and every man's hand against him, and he will live to the east and on the borders of all his kinsmen.

13So she called the name of the Lord Who spoke to her, You are a God of seeing, for she said, Have I [not] even here [in the wilderness] looked upon Him Who sees me [and lived]? Or have I here also seen [the future purposes or designs of] Him Who sees me?

MightySparrow:
5. The claim that Mohammed was the awaited prophet, did he actually claim that or inferred by a devotee of Islam like you after his death.
Ishmael himself was not an Arab - see one of the posts above as reported by an authentic Hadith.

"And when a messenger from Allah came to them confirming that which was with them, a party of those who had been given the Scripture threw the Scripture of Allah behind their backs as if they did not know [what it contained]."
(QS. Al-Baqara 2: Verse 101)



* Via Qur'an English http://quran-en.com

Lukuluku69:

Dundee, how far with Hagia Sophia? Or have you stopped crying on behalf of the Orthodox?

See who is crying O!
Simply because I showed you which of the creators you're serving.

Thank you for proving me right again.

sagenaija:
[size=6pt][/size]
See who is crying O!
Simply because I showed you which of the creators you're serving.

Thank you for proving me right again.

Dumbo, you were the one crying nah. An event in far away Turkey yet you put up post about it here in 9ja.

I guess you are drunk on your murdered god blood that's why you can't think properly and confused.

Cry on....