₦airaland Forum

gregyboy:
This was one of The rascist from the white downplaying benin after the war.......


Nonsense man

Ooh she-male you thought we havnt seeing this quote lol

Maybe we have to post when they compared benin with lesbon

davidmarker2:
The jealous will be jealous, i have learnt to ignore them. They have nothing of their own so they must talk of others who have something worth talking about. They must spit on your orange because they have no orange. they must claim your water because they have no water. They are an organism which depends on you to exist, an unwelcomed organism for that matter. By defintion, they are parasits.

TAO11:
So far in the course of this thread, the following retar.ded claims have been devastatingly debunked:

(1) The retar.ded claim (by disgruntled Binis) that Yorubas began using the word “Oba” in the post-1930s.

This has been debunked with written evidence of Yoruba usage from 1899, from 1897, from c.1867, from 1845, et al.

(2) The retar.ded claim (by @samuk) that there exists some “600 years” old written evidence of Benin usage of the word “Oba”.

This retar.ded claim is yet to be substantiated (even with an atom of evidence) despite more than 10 days (and still counting) of their torturous search.

Instead, these disgruntled Binis were at best only able to demonstrate (from their own warped logic) that the Yorubas have an earlier written evidence — 1845 (Yoruba) Vs. 1867 (Bini).

——————————————————
But what does it really mean that I was able to produce an 1845 written evidence and the Binis weren’t able to come even close to that ??

Well, it just simply means that the Binis weren’t able to come close to the Yorubas, despite their own bogus claim of wRiTteN eViDeNcE. Nothing more, nothing less! [I know I’m being too nice now].

To put the same question in other words:
Does the comparative written evidence already provided really mean that the Binis began using this word only in the year 1867 — because that’s all they could provide ??

Funny enough, this line of warped reasoning is what the disgruntled Binis have been trailing. Should I play their game along with them? No, I’m Yoruba!

To every sound and logically mind, such conclusion (based on available writing) is too obvious as a flawed reasoning and logical fallacy — even though I could have forced their own flawed reasoning down their throats.

Such particular logical fallacy is know in analytical logic specifically by the name: argumentum ex silentio.

————————————————————
Having debunked their deluded claim of 1930s [see (1)]; having exposed @samuk’s fraud of “600 years” old writing [see (2)]; having exposed their inability to produce anything close to (let alone earlier than) the Yorubas’ [see (2)]; having debunked their warped logic of arguing from earlier written usage (despite the fact that it favours me); I now turn, at this point, to discussing the actual objective evidence for determining the indigenous ownership of a word — that is, the linguistic evidence.

——————————————————————
The Argument:
(I) If a word is in use in a particular language, but its literal meaning can not be meaningfully analyzed within that language; then such word does not originally belong to that language. Gbam!

(II) The word “Ọba” (as used by the Binis for their monarch) does not have any literal meaning in the language of the Binis.

(III) In conclusion, the word “Ọba” (as used by the Binis for their monarch) does not belong originally to the Bini language — In other words, it is a loanword.

————————————————————
The Evidence:
An objective source of evidence for the meanings of Bini words is obviously and undoubtedly an authoritative dictionary of the Bini language itself.

[This is not to be confused with a dictionary of the English language which simply features a paltry number of non-English words of widespread, global, popular usage — such as: “fufu”, “agbada”, “oba”, et al.]

As such, recourse will now be made to a Bini-English Lexicon. This is so that the English readers here can access the written meanings which are attributed to the actual Bini words.

One such example of an authoritative material for this purpose is the work entitled: “A Concise Dictionary of The Bini Language of Southern Nigeria” compiled by the professor of African Phonetics and Linguistics, Hans Melzian.

———————————————————
Under the entry “Ọba” (for which Professor Melzian used “ɔ” to represent “ọ“, in order to distinguish /o/ as in odd from /o/ as in old ); the following are some interesting observations from this Bini dictionary.

(A) Unlike what the author did with virtually all other Bini words within the same dictionary, he did not give a literal meaning to this word — as I have expected.

Rather, he simply describes the person whom the Binis refer to by this word. Interesting, isn’t it?! See embedded image below:

www.nairaland.com/attachments/12754901_bb7fcaad09fc479498aedbb24cb57370_jpeg_jpeg80dbd02cb7ce1db81e998db7e161c38e

(B) But more than that, the author (in fact) let the cat out of the bag. He revealed why this word could not have had a literal meaning in a dictionary of Bini language.

Before I reveal his reason, it is important that one is acquainted with a few notations and abbreviations which he define in his work.

Two examples of these are relevant to my discourse here, and they are: “Yor.” and “cf.” which he defines as: “Yoruba” and “etymological reference” respectively.

See embedded image below:

www.nairaland.com/attachments/12754902_541f22648c37485488282bea682c0e27_jpeg_jpegf272ec9b7e8de333789df15c524980aa

In the light of this background, let’s then see what reason the author indicates as to why this word could have appeared without a literal meaning in the Bini dictionary.

See embedded image below as highlighted on the top-right corner in continuation of the bottom-left corner.

www.nairaland.com/attachments/12754903_7e31a3d03b7c407ab60e863fbf8fb4c2_jpeg_jpegfba5de93eebde69a9ef00beabf7a605c

In the light of his foregoing definition of abbreviations, what we have here in the phrase “cf. Yor. ɔba” then becomes extremely clear and straightforward.

In other words, the word “Ọba” [ɔba] (used by the Binis for their monarch) has its ”etymology” [cf.] (aka. ”origin”) in the Yoruba language [Yor.].

Quod Erat Demonstrandum!

davidmarker2:
So what did we learn today:

1) who was the first ooni of ife to copy the word Oba into his title: adesoji aderemi.
He also created a beaded crown as a way to copy the Benin crown. (the fake crown in the picture below)

2) there is no such thing as Edo, igbo or yoruba etymology. Anybody using such as argument is either intellectually bankrupt either morally bankrupt, anyways his argument is trash.

3) the yoruba have a habbit of copying other people's cultures:

a) they first copied the word "sir" which is a mark of british nobility: ooni of ife, sir adesoji.
b) after some time they changed that borrowed word for an other borrowed word "Oba" the title of the King of Benin: it then became "ooni of ife, oba adesoji"
c) adesoji also imitated the Benin crown
d) the current crown worn by the ooni of ife is an imitation of a statue which was found in ife
e) the current dress of the ooni of ife is an imitation of the royal uniform of the king of the ashanti.

davidmarker2:
So what did we learn today:

who was the first ooni of ife to copy the word Oba into his title: adesoji aderemi.

He also created a beaded crown as a way to copy the Benin crown. (the fake crown in the picture below)

there is no such thing as Edo, igbo or yoruba etymology. Anybody using such as argument is either intellectually bankrupt either morally bankrupt, anyways his argument is trash

the yoruba have a habbit of copying other people's cultures:

a) they first copied the word "sir" which is a mark of british nobility: ooni of ife, sir adesoji.

b) after some time they changed that borrowed word for an other borrowed word "Oba" the title of the King of Benin: it then became "ooni of ife, oba adesoji"

c) adesoji also imitated the Benin crown

d) the current crown worn by the ooni of ife is an imitation of a statue which was found in ife

e) the current dress of the ooni of ife is an imitation of the royal uniform of the king of the Ashanti

TAO11:
Well, we learnt that SUICIDE is loading in Benin Kingdom today — because I simply won’t let you peddle lies freely.

The days of unchecked Benin lies on Nairaland are gone, hence enjoy the refutation again as follows:


Well, on this same thread we’ve already seen written evidence of “Oba” usage among the Yorubas — some going back to the year 1845.

The closest the Benin usage came so far is 1863.

Moreover, linguistics evidence have already been adduced on this same thread to establish that the Binis borrowed “Oba” from the Yorubas.



Well I understand your desperation, but guess what: No Benin crown comes close in any way shape or form to any Ife crown.

The closest which one of the Benin crowns came (the tall one) was that it looked like the signature tall crown of other Yoruba kingdoms (excluding Ife) called Ade-Nla.

Moreover, if your claim was that the Ife kingdom had more than one type of crown, that’s factual.

In fact, the crowns are almost innumerable, just as the Binis have more than one as well — two examples (of the Binis’) of which may be seen at this link:

https://www.nairaland.com/6234931/why-ikwerres-not-igbo-logic/20#96543761

This is a false statement which you’ve made here without a shred of evidence.

You have simply peddled this falsehood in the hope that people will swallow it without asking for evidence.

Interesting! Let’s hear it.

Haha!

Insecure Bini Liar: Look, the Ooni of Ife uses “Sir” instead of “Oba”

Sane Person: In what capacity did he use the designation “Sir”? Is it with respect to his traditional stool?

Insecure Bini Liar: [scratches his bald head and goes] Well, that was in his capacity as a politician and governor of Western Nigeria

Sane Person: Why then did you post this when you already know it is nonsense?
——-—

Moreover, I would have thought you should know that Nigeria was a British colony.

And that certain British titles were conferred on certain distinguished public office holders.

One of such distinguished individuals was the then Ooni of Ife. At the time, he was the Governor of the Nigerian Western Nigeria.

Other Nigerians who have been conferred similar the honor are:
Sir Ahmadi Bello; Sir Herbert Macaulay; Alhaji Sir Abubakr’s Tafawa Balewa to name a few.

Well, as the written evidence have shown so far on this thread; your base level of reasoning should have permitted you to conclude that:

The Yorubas have been using the word “Oba” decades before the Binis would first use it — 1845 (Yoruba) Vs. 1863 (Benin).

This has already been demonstrated in this same comment to be a deluded falsehood.

Interesting! An ancient Ife crown is modeled after a more ancient Ife sculpture. So? Hehehe!

Oh, I have an idea!

What about ‘the current dress of the Ashanti king is an imitation of the Ife king’s’?

In fact, this is more tenable since a Ghanaian subgroup claimed to have originated from Ife considering the testimony of the then Supreme King of the Ga people — The Ga Matse, King Ni Adama Latse.

davidmarker2:
[s]Yoruba is a brand new tribe of people from other tribes and origins who separated from their main tribes to create a political alliance called Yoruba.
Some Yoruba are actually dahomians, some are oyo people, some are ijebu, some are Egba and some are Edo, some are even Haussa. But a lot are descendents from slaves captured all around Africa and dumped into the region.[/s]

TAO11:
Well, we learnt that SUICIDE is loading in Benin Kingdom today — because I simply won’t let you peddle lies freely.

The days of unchecked Benin lies on Nairaland are gone, hence enjoy the refutation again as follows:


Well, on this same thread we’ve already seen written evidence of “Oba” usage among the Yorubas — some going back to the year 1845.

The closest the Benin usage came so far is 1863.

Moreover, linguistics evidence have already been adduced on this same thread to establish that the Binis borrowed “Oba” from the Yorubas.



Well I understand your desperation, but guess what: No Benin crown comes close in any way shape or form to any Ife crown.

The closest which one of the Benin crowns came (the tall one) was that it looked like the signature tall crown of other Yoruba kingdoms (excluding Ife) called Ade-Nla.

Moreover, if your claim was that the Ife kingdom had more than one type of crown, that’s factual.

In fact, the crowns are almost innumerable, just as the Binis have more than one as well — two examples (of the Binis’) of which may be seen at this link:

https://www.nairaland.com/6234931/why-ikwerres-not-igbo-logic/20#96543761

This is a false statement which you’ve made here without a shred of evidence.

You have simply peddled this falsehood in the hope that people will swallow it without asking for evidence.

Interesting! Let’s hear it.

Haha!

Insecure Bini Liar: Look, the Ooni of Ife uses “Sir” instead of “Oba”

Sane Person: In what capacity did he use the designation “Sir”? Is it with respect to his traditional stool?

Insecure Bini Liar: [scratches his bald head and goes] Well, that was in his capacity as a politician and governor of Western Nigeria

Sane Person: Why then did you post this when you already know it is nonsense?
——-—

Moreover, I would have thought you should know that Nigeria was a British colony.

And that certain British titles were conferred on certain distinguished public office holders.

One of such distinguished individuals was the then Ooni of Ife. At the time, he was the Governor of the Nigerian Western Nigeria.

Other Nigerians who have been conferred similar the honor are:
Sir Ahmadi Bello; Sir Herbert Macaulay; Alhaji Sir Abubakr’s Tafawa Balewa to name a few.

Well, as the written evidence have shown so far on this thread; your base level of reasoning should have permitted you to conclude that:

The Yorubas have been using the word “Oba” decades before the Binis would first use it — 1845 (Yoruba) Vs. 1863 (Benin).

This has already been demonstrated in this same comment to be a deluded falsehood.

Interesting! An ancient Ife crown is modeled after a more ancient Ife sculpture. So? Hehehe!

Oh, I have an idea!

What about ‘the current dress of the Ashanti king is an imitation of the Ife king’s’?

In fact, this is more tenable since a Ghanaian subgroup claimed to have originated from Ife considering the testimony of the then Supreme King of the Ga people — The Ga Matse, King Ni Adama Latse.

gregyboy:
The question is why didnt he put it like thiz
Sir oba ooni of ife ademumu ogunwusmi if really
The sir eas acting as is political role

Answer he never had thought at that time adding oba to his stool would boom is prestige if not he would have added it

davidmarker2:
The early colonial format of the name of the ooni of ife is the same as that of the Ezama:

1)Ezama of Benin, sir Igbinedion
2)ooni of ife, sir aderemi

the only difference is that the ezama never changed the word "sir" into the word "Oba".

TAO11:
Waiting on you all on the next page.

You must make that my post popular on the internet as a top search result.

davidmarker2:
[s]So what did we learn today:

who was the first ooni of ife to copy the word Oba into his title: adesoji aderemi.

He also created a beaded crown as a way to copy the Benin crown. (the fake crown in the picture below)

there is no such thing as Edo, igbo or yoruba etymology. Anybody using such as argument is either intellectually bankrupt either morally bankrupt, anyways his argument is trash

the yoruba have a habbit of copying other people's cultures:

a) they first copied the word "sir" which is a mark of british nobility: ooni of ife, sir adesoji.

b) after some time they changed that borrowed word for an other borrowed word "Oba" the title of the King of Benin: it then became "ooni of ife, oba adesoji"

c) adesoji also imitated the Benin crown

d) the current crown worn by the ooni of ife is an imitation of a statue which was found in ife

e) the current dress of the ooni of ife is an imitation of the royal uniform of the king of the Ashanti

4) Benin has a true history, ife has fairytales.
5) benin has architecture, ...

6) Benin actually fought a war against britain, ife once again has fairytales of great warriors

7) Benin city got burnt into ashes, ife didn't yet no architecture, nothing to show in ife.
8 ) at this point it feels like a big insult to even dare pronounce benin and ife in the same sentence in anybody's dream.
indeed, ife remains a village, a make-belief rubbish elevated by the invaders becuase the ooni of ife was a backstabbing traitor to the cause the black race. The ooni of ife served the british instead of fighting the british, coward if you ask me.Sayonara

ife has fairytales of rambo/oduduwa dropping from the sky in egypt strait into ife with a golden parachute/chain.

davidmarker2:
So what did we learn today:

1) who was the first ooni of ife to copy the word Oba into his title: adesoji aderemi.
He also created a beaded crown as a way to copy the benin crown. (the fake crown in the picture below)

2) there is no such thing as Edo, igbo or yoruba etymology. Anybody using such as argument is either intellectually bankrupt either morally bankrupt, anyways his argument is trash.

3) the yoruba have a habbit of copying other people's cultures:

a) they first copied the word "sir" which is a mark of british nobility: ooni of ife, sir adesoji.
b) after some time they changed that borrowed word for an other borrowed word "Oba" the title of the King of benin: it then became "ooni of ife, oba adesoji"
c) adesoji also imitated the benin crown
d) the current crown worn by the ooni of ife is an imitation of a statue which was found in ife
e) the current dress of the ooni of ife is an imitation of the royal uniform of the king of the ashanti.

4) Benin has a true history, ife has fairytales.
5) benin has architecture, ife has fairytales of rambo/oduduwa dropping from the sky in egypt strait into ife with a golden parachute/chain.
6) Benin actually fought a war against britain, ife once again has fairytales of great warriors
7) Benin city got burnt into ashes, ife didn't yet no architecture, nothing to show in ife.
8 ) at this point it feels like a big insult to even dare pronounce benin and ife in the same sentence in anybody's dream.
indeed, ife remains a village, a make-belief rubbish elevated by the invaders becuase the ooni of ife was a backstabbing traitor to the cause the black race. The ooni of ife served the british instead of fighting the british, coward if you ask me.

Sayonara

davidmarker2:
[s]Nothing original in ife, just copying of other people's culture. Plain and simple. The only originality is the fairytales[/s].

davidmarker2:
So what did we learn today:

who was the first ooni of ife to copy the word Oba into his title: adesoji aderemi.

He also created a beaded crown as a way to copy the Benin crown. (the fake crown in the picture below)

there is no such thing as Edo, igbo or yoruba etymology. Anybody using such as argument is either intellectually bankrupt either morally bankrupt, anyways his argument is trash

the yoruba have a habbit of copying other people's cultures:

a) they first copied the word "sir" which is a mark of british nobility: ooni of ife, sir adesoji.

b) after some time they changed that borrowed word for an other borrowed word "Oba" the title of the King of Benin: it then became "ooni of ife, oba adesoji"

c) adesoji also imitated the Benin crown

d) the current crown worn by the ooni of ife is an imitation of a statue which was found in ife

e) the current dress of the ooni of ife is an imitation of the royal uniform of the king of the Ashanti

4) Benin has a true history, ife has fairytales.
5) benin has architecture, ...

6) Benin actually fought a war against britain, ife once again has fairytales of great warriors

7) Benin city got burnt into ashes, ife didn't yet no architecture, nothing to show in ife.
8 ) at this point it feels like a big insult to even dare pronounce benin and ife in the same sentence in anybody's dream.
indeed, ife remains a village, a make-belief rubbish elevated by the invaders becuase the ooni of ife was a backstabbing traitor to the cause the black race. The ooni of ife served the british instead of fighting the british, coward if you ask me.Sayonara

ife has fairytales of rambo/oduduwa dropping from the sky in egypt strait into ife with a golden parachute/chain.

davidmarker2:
The early colonial format of the name of the ooni of ife is the same as that of the Ezama:

1)Ezama of Benin, sir Igbinedion
2)ooni of ife, sir aderemi

the only difference is that the ezama never changed the word "sir" into the word "Oba".

davidmarker2:
So what did we learn today:

1) who was the first ooni of ife to copy the word Oba into his title: adesoji aderemi.
He also created a beaded crown as a way to copy the benin crown. (the fake crown in the picture below)

2) there is no such thing as Edo, igbo or yoruba etymology. Anybody using such as argument is either intellectually bankrupt either morally bankrupt, anyways his argument is trash.

3) the yoruba have a habbit of copying other people's cultures:

a) they first copied the word "sir" which is a mark of british nobility: ooni of ife, sir adesoji.
b) after some time they changed that borrowed word for an other borrowed word "Oba" the title of the King of benin: it then became "ooni of ife, oba adesoji"
c) adesoji also imitated the benin crown
d) the current crown worn by the ooni of ife is an imitation of a statue which was found in ife
e) the current dress of the ooni of ife is an imitation of the royal uniform of the king of the ashanti.

4) Benin has a true history, ife has fairytales.
5) benin has architecture, ife has fairytales of rambo/oduduwa dropping from the sky in egypt strait into ife with a golden parachute/chain.
6) Benin actually fought a war against britain, ife once again has fairytales of great warriors
7) Benin city got burnt into ashes, ife didn't yet no architecture, nothing to show in ife.
8 ) at this point it feels like a big insult to even dare pronounce benin and ife in the same sentence in anybody's dream.
indeed, ife remains a village, a make-belief rubbish elevated by the invaders becuase the ooni of ife was a backstabbing traitor to the cause the black race. The ooni of ife served the british instead of fighting the british, coward if you ask me.

Sayonara