budaatum:

And what religion, pray thee, do you pressume to attach buda to? Did buda mention religion in what buda wrote that you read?

Who, in their right mind, religion or not, would stand by and watch their daughter being raped? Who, in fact, in their right mind, would stand by and watch anyone being raped?

I wonder, do you also pressume that buda would stand by and not fight to death anyone who attempts to rape buda too, because, in your own opinion, some God is more important to buda than buda and buda deserves it because buda's skirt is short?

Perhaps pressume less and seek understanding instead. You are more than capable, Great Odin's Son.

Thread carefully Mortal! For I am Thor the Mighty son of Odin,Prince of Asgard

Well I thought you were a Christian so I made the assumption

From your Above comment,you are more merciful and Compassionate Than the God you were trying to defend in your First post

HellVictorinho:

Those are some of the reasons why I said life is an absurdity.
Although I can't kill myself,I will express my views.

By all means, express your views. I have nothing against such expression.

As far as your reasons go, I'm afraid I see no justification for them. That life is hard and often tragic does not prove that it is an absurdity. It may make your own experience of it an absurdity, but your experience is not the definition of life for everyone.

odinson1:


Thread carefully Mortal! For I am Thor the Mighty son of Odin,Prince of Asgard

Well I thought you were a Christian so I made the assumption

From your Above comment,you are more merciful and Compassionate Than the God you were trying to defend in your First post

Oh you amuse me, Thor the Mighty Son of Odin, Prince of Asgard, for asking buda, the Questioner of all the Gods, to thread carefully, I am mortal.

Who in their right mind needs to defend the Gods? Has Thor the Mighty Son of Odin and Prince of Asgard lost his hammer and need a mortal's defence? Does Thor fear the death it is foretold, will occur at the war at Ragnarök? For even though the snake you kill, 9 steps and succumb to the venom of the beast do you, for indeed even the Gods are subject to the Fates.

But if Thor would need defence, I offer the Word, the mightiest of all defences. Those who seek for Wisdom will favour the Word of the God. Especially one that is so not jealous, he says, "Do not live by the bread of One God alone but eat the food of them All".

Yeah indeed is buda taught to seek not vengeance but mercifully turn the cheek. And compassion too according to the Parable of the Orangutan, which I share with you O Thor the Mighty Son of Odin, Prince of Asgard.

budaatum:
In reply Jesus said: “A man was stuck in a river".

"A photographer stood there taking photos while an orangutan saved the man".

“Which of these do you think was a neighbor to the man stuck in a river?”

The expert in the law replied, “The one who had mercy on him.”

Jesus told him, “[url=https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Luke+10%3A25-37&version=NIV]Go and do likewise[/url].”

www.nairaland.com/attachments/11026430_244049467975207imagem181581013078995_jpeg36831a722ecdff67f0e5698629a2a90c

Ihedinobi3:


By all means, express your views. I have nothing against such expression.

As far as your reasons go, I'm afraid I see no justification for them. That life is hard and often tragic does not prove that it is an absurdity. It may make your own experience of it an absurdity, but your experience is not the definition of life for everyone.

An absurdity makes no sense.
In other words, it shows no balance.
Since life(the event that involves all living things on Earth at once) happens randomly,I don't have to determine its pattern.
Ultimately, life is an absurdity because it doesn't show a specific pattern.

HellVictorinho:

An absurdity makes no sense.
In other words, it shows no balance.
Since life(the event that involves all living things on Earth at once) happens randomly,I don't have to determine its pattern.
Ultimately, life is an absurdity because it doesn't show a specific pattern.

I'm not sure how "makes no sense" is the same as "shows no balance," but that really doesn't matter at this point. I'm just noting it for your own benefit.

As for life happening randomly, can you prove that it does? That is just a claim that you're making and you offer me no reasons to believe that it is actually the case.

As I said before, if your life shows no specific pattern, that is your own experience, and it is on you, because you're making your choices; nobody else is. That your life shows no specific pattern is no reason to believe either that nobody else's life shows no specific pattern or that life in general shows no specific pattern. You don't get to define life for everybody, friend.

Your illustration is not fitting Sir!
This case is like condemned criminals who have all been sentenced to death {Romans 3:23} what they does to one another is nobody's business!
The only hope is if the King decides to grant any of them amnesty based on remorseful attitude towards the offence for which they're been condemned. That's when the King will now set a date for the release of those who were pardoned.

So whatever anyone does to anyone now is of no weight before God because all humans are like condemned criminals already, the only hope for mankind is gaining the real life when all evildoers are destroyed for good until then let anyone manage whatever comes to him or her, it's your own type (humans) that's bringing you harm not aliens from outer space {Psalms 37:7-11} God will not step in until his own time to stop all badness once and for all time.

You can come up with your insults now but take note how my illustration fittingly describe what the Bible says, even Jesus God's own son was accused, arrested, battered, charged, convicted, sentenced and executed by own kind (humans) all based on false accusations.

So don't expect God to come and save anyone from ourselves, what he is doing now is sending Jesus' trained followers to come and give hope to those who want it, if you're feeling he's too slow you're free to solve mankind's problem your own way, God's time is the best!

Ihedinobi3:


I'm not sure how "makes no sense" is the same as "shows no balance," but that really doesn't matter at this point. I'm just noting it for your own benefit.

As for life happening randomly, can you prove that it does? That is just a claim that you're making and you offer me no reasons to believe that it is actually the case.

As I said before, if your life shows no specific pattern, that is your own experience, and it is on you, because you're making your choices; nobody else is. That your life shows no specific pattern is no reason to believe either that nobody else's life shows no specific pattern or that life in general shows no specific pattern. You don't get to define life for everybody, friend.

You don't get it.
I never said anybody's life shows no pattern.
Besides,I don't have to prove that life happens randomly and I don't care about your disbelief in my statements.
You have also chosen to say things that are not related to what I am saying.
I actually think you reason less deeply because you keep talking about my life despite my ability to create a picture of something bigger or/and twisted.
Yeah,life is twisted because people like you exist alongside people like me.

budaatum:

Who is this Uwa you keep mentioning?

Uwa was the lady raped and killed in a church in Benin City.

LordReed:


Uwa was the lady raped and killed in a church in Benin City.

Yeah, I figured. Was she wearing a mini skirt?

Not that that's an excuse for raping her. Just that the person who introduced her to the thread implied the mininess of her skirt had to do with the subject of the thread.

budaatum:

Yeah, I figured. Was she wearing a mini skirt?

Not that that's an excuse for raping her. Just that the person who introduced her to the thread implied the mininess of her skirt had to do with the subject of the thread.

IRC no she wasn't. She was in the church studying, a known habit of hers.

LordReed:


IRC no she wasn't. She was in the church studying, a known habit of hers.

That's what I thought, and is why I considered the connection absurd and stupid.

sinkhole:

So, Uwa deserved to die, as she did not prepare well for God to defend her?

budaatum:

Oh you amuse me, Thor the Mighty Son of Odin, Prince of Asgard, for asking buda, the Questioner of all the Gods, to thread carefully, I am mortal.

Who in their right mind needs to defend the Gods? Has Thor the Mighty Son of Odin and Prince of Asgard lost his hammer and need a mortal's defence? Does Thor fear the death it is foretold, will occur at the war at Ragnarök? For even though the snake you kill, 9 steps and succumb to the venom of the beast do you, for indeed even the Gods are subject to the Fates.

But if Thor would need defence, I offer the Word, the mightiest of all defences. Those who seek for Wisdom will favour the Word of the God. Especially one that is so not jealous, he says, "Do not live by the bread of One God alone but eat the food of them All".

Yeah indeed is buda taught to seek not vengeance but mercifully turn the cheek. And compassion too according to the Parable of the Orangutan, which I share with you O Thor the Mighty Son of Odin, Prince of Asgard.

why do you quote the Bible?

HellVictorinho:

why do you quote the Bible?

Same reason I'd quote the Quran, or Plato, or Chinua Achebe's Things Fall Apart or Homer. Because I read them and learn.

As is understood, "Humans shall not live by the bread in only one book or they will be malnourished". [url=https://classic.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Matthew+4%3A4&version=KJV]Matthew 4:4[/url]

budaatum:

Same reason I'd quote the Quran, or Plato, or Chinua Achebe's Things Fall Apart or Homer. Because I read them and learn.

As is understood, "Humans shall not live by the bread in only one book or they will be malnourished". [url=https://classic.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Matthew+4%3A4&version=KJV]Matthew 4:4[/url]

Don't you think the Bible is not indispensable?
I think it's not indispensable because it doesn't contain information that is indispensable.
I don't need the Bible to tell me that I have to do anything.
There are other documentations..
My brain is also there.

HellVictorinho:

You don't get it.
I never said anybody's life shows no pattern.
Besides,I don't have to prove that life happens randomly and I don't care about your disbelief in my statements.
You have also chosen to say things that are not related to what I am saying.
I actually think you reason less deeply because you keep talking about my life despite my ability to create a picture of something bigger or/and twisted.
Yeah,life is twisted because people like you exist alongside people like me.

I think you're the one who doesn't get it.

You said that life is random and absurd. I told you that you can't say that. It is a blanket statement. If you say that life is random and absurd without any qualification, then the only way to understand it is that everyone is living a random and absurd life. But you cannot make that kind of claim without proof. That was why I pointed out that it may only apply to you. And yes you do have to prove claims that you make when you challenge someone with them.

As for saying things that are unrelated to what you were saying, you seem to have forgotten that you were responding to me. Do you think that you can challenge someone's arguments and then turn around and say that they are saying things that are not related to what you are saying? What do you even think that you are doing speaking to me?

No, you have not demonstrated any ability at all to create a picture of anything bigger or twisted? You have only named obvious examples of the human condition and claimed that they are proof of the absurdity and randomness of life. That is a useless thing to do in this discussion. Your life keeps coming up because you keep making an absurd blanket claim with no proof. Since you do, it is only logical to assume that you are making that claim because of your own personal experiences. How many people in your examples agree that life is absurd or random? And even if they do, is it impossible that you are all wrong? If one of the Awa in Brazil were to walk into an engineering shop, would it be reasonable for him or her to insist that everything in it is absurd and random? Would it not be right to say to them then that they are being absurd? The right response to ignorance is to ask questions, not make hasty assumptions that may only prove one the fool.

I still don't agree with you. I think that life makes perfect sense even with people like you existing alongside people like me. That contrast demonstrates that we all have a free will and are using it in order to steadily move history toward a pre-planned conclusion. But it is still telling how you subtly wish that there is only one of us existing without the other. Whenever Christians remind atheists of the genocides of atheistic governments against Christians and religious people, your kind begins to foam at the mouth and insist that the governments were not atheistic at all, but your sentiment here is not very different from the motivation that drives such persecutions and, ultimately, murders.

HellVictorinho:

Don't you think the Bible is not indispensable?
I think it's not indispensable because it doesn't contain information that is indispensable.
I don't need the Bible to tell me that I have to do anything.
There are other documentations..
My brain is also there.

As In, Don't you think the Bible is not absolutely necessary?

No. I think the opposite. That the Bible is absolutely necessary.

I am Nigerian, a country where half the population take the Bible as close to being a God. If I think it unnecessary then I am very unlikely to understand what influences those who think it is necessary, and my lack of understanding will make me sound like a fool.

It is for this reason we learn in Buddhism to understand the religion of the people we dwell amongst, so that we can understand them when they speak and so we can speak their language.

HellVictorinho:


I don't need the Bible to tell me that I have to do anything.
There are other documentations..
My brain is also there.

Neither do most people need the Bible to tell them what to do. And the Bible does not tell anyone what to do, though it is full of advice about what should be done.

The Bible has it written in it for instance, that thou shalt not kill and thou shalt not lie, yet some Bible readers kill and lie.

It is those who use their brains that tend to know why they should neither kill nor lie.

Ihedinobi3:

Whenever Christians remind atheists of the genocides of atheistic governments against Christians and religious people, your kind begins to foam at the mouth and insist that the governments were not atheistic at all, but your sentiment here is not very different from the motivation that drives such persecutions and, ultimately, murders.

Can you show me an example of an atheist foaming in the mouth and denying that those governments were atheistic?

Ihedinobi3:


I think you're the one who doesn't get it.

You said that life is random and absurd. I told you that you can't say that. It is a blanket statement. If you say that life is random and absurd without any qualification, then the only way to understand it is that everyone is living a random and absurd life. But you cannot make that kind of claim without proof. That was why I pointed out that it may only apply to you. And yes you do have to prove claims that you make when you challenge someone with them.

As for saying things that are unrelated to what you were saying, you seem to have forgotten that you were responding to me. Do you think that you can challenge someone's arguments and then turn around and say that they are saying things that are not related to what you are saying? What do you even think that you are doing speaking to me?

No, you have not demonstrated any ability at all to create a picture of anything bigger or twisted? You have only named obvious examples of the human condition and claimed that they are proof of the absurdity and randomness of life. That is a useless thing to do in this discussion. Your life keeps coming up because you keep making an absurd blanket claim with no proof. Since you do, it is only logical to assume that you are making that claim because of your own personal experiences. How many people in your examples agree that life is absurd or random? And even if they do, is it impossible that you are all wrong? If one of the Awa in Brazil were to walk into an engineering shop, would it be reasonable for him or her to insist that everything in it is absurd and random? Would it not be right to say to them then that they are being absurd? The right response to ignorance is to ask questions, not make hasty assumptions that may only prove one the fool.

I still don't agree with you. I think that life makes perfect sense even with people like you existing alongside people like me. That contrast demonstrates that we all have a free will and are using it in order to steadily move history toward a pre-planned conclusion. But it is still telling how you subtly wish that there is only one of us existing without the other. Whenever Christians remind atheists of the genocides of atheistic governments against Christians and religious people, your kind begins to foam at the mouth and insist that the governments were not atheistic at all, but your sentiment here is not very different from the motivation that drives such persecutions and, ultimately, murders.

I never said everyone's life is absurd.
Besides, you shouldn't ask me to prove what I didn't state.
I only said the events that involve living things can't determine a specific pattern because they also happen by chance.
The so-called plan you have also happens by chance.
The choices you make happen by chance.
The thoughts you have happen by chance.
But I'm not saying that everything you have done makes no sense.
I am not saying that everything you possess makes no sense.
You should rather understand that the manner in which all living things exist simultaneously doesn't determine what is meaningful.
if you can tell me what it means, your reply will be more relevant.
Furthermore,I'm not saying there is a manner in which they can exist simultaneously towards a meaning.
But I've heard enough of "prove this","prove that'.
It's your turn to define what has no meaning to me.
Yeah,teach me what has no meaning to me without leaving any word that's necessary for your teaching to be effective.

budaatum:


As In, Don't you think the Bible is not absolutely necessary?

No. I think the opposite. That the Bible is absolutely necessary.

I am Nigerian, a country where half the population take the Bible as close to being a God. If I think it unnecessary then I am very unlikely to understand what influences those who think it is necessary, and my lack of understanding will make me sound like a fool.

It is for this reason we learn in Buddhism to understand the religion of the people we dwell amongst, so that we can understand them when they speak and so we can speak their language.

So,the Bible is necessary because religion is compulsory.
That's true.
If you are not religious in Nigeria, then you are less likely to survive.

Ihedinobi3:


I think you're the one who doesn't get it.

You said that life is random and absurd. I told you that you can't say that. It is a blanket statement. If you say that life is random and absurd without any qualification, then the only way to understand it is that everyone is living a random and absurd life. But you cannot make that kind of claim without proof. That was why I pointed out that it may only apply to you. And yes you do have to prove claims that you make when you challenge someone with them.

As for saying things that are unrelated to what you were saying, you seem to have forgotten that you were responding to me. Do you think that you can challenge someone's arguments and then turn around and say that they are saying things that are not related to what you are saying? What do you even think that you are doing speaking to me?

No, you have not demonstrated any ability at all to create a picture of anything bigger or twisted? You have only named obvious examples of the human condition and claimed that they are proof of the absurdity and randomness of life. That is a useless thing to do in this discussion. Your life keeps coming up because you keep making an absurd blanket claim with no proof. Since you do, it is only logical to assume that you are making that claim because of your own personal experiences. How many people in your examples agree that life is absurd or random? And even if they do, is it impossible that you are all wrong? If one of the Awa in Brazil were to walk into an engineering shop, would it be reasonable for him or her to insist that everything in it is absurd and random? Would it not be right to say to them then that they are being absurd? The right response to ignorance is to ask questions, not make hasty assumptions that may only prove one the fool.

I still don't agree with you. I think that life makes perfect sense even with people like you existing alongside people like me. That contrast demonstrates that we all have a free will and are using it in order to steadily move history toward a pre-planned conclusion. But it is still telling how you subtly wish that there is only one of us existing without the other. Whenever Christians remind atheists of the genocides of atheistic governments against Christians and religious people, your kind begins to foam at the mouth and insist that the governments were not atheistic at all, but your sentiment here is not very different from the motivation that drives such persecutions and, ultimately, murders.

The possession of freewill doesn't really mean you can do anything you want and get away with it.
Besides,I'm not talking about your ability to choose.
I'm talking about the things that happen in the presence/absence of choices.
You never chose to be born,anyway.

HellVictorinho:

So,the Bible is necessary because religion is compulsory.

What!? Is that what I said? Where please?!

I do not agree that the Bible must have anything to do with religion. After all, I did say, "the Quran, or Plato, or Chinua Achebe's Things Fall Apart or Homer". Is religion compulsory for Things fall Apart?

HellVictorinho:
If you are not religious in Nigeria, then you are less likely to survive.

I disagree. I was an atheist throughout my growing up in Nigeria and I survived very well, thank you very much, and I am still not religious now and still survive very well.

Perhaps step back a bit and let us first define "religion" because despite two years after attempting to take up religion, I am finding it to mean groupthink, or rather, groupbelieve, which I am finding to be contrary to what I have rediscovered in the Bible.

Do you know Jesus was crucified because he did not believe what the group claimed should be believed? Do you realise that Eve refused to believe and remain a slave in the Garden of Eden?

Perhaps we should wait till you have finished your conversation with Ihe and can devote your attention to our conversation or you might mix us up.

HellVictorinho:

I never said everyone's life is absurd.
Besides, you shouldn't ask me to prove what I didn't state.
I only said the events that involve living things can't determine a specific pattern because they also happen by chance.
The so-called plan you have also happens by chance.
The choices you make happen by chance.
The thoughts you have happen by chance.
But I'm not saying that everything you have done makes no sense.
I am not saying that everything you possess makes no sense.
You should rather understand that the manner in which all living things exist simultaneously doesn't determine what is meaningful.
if you can tell me what it means, your reply will be more relevant.
Furthermore,I'm not saying there is a manner in which they can exist simultaneously towards a meaning.
But I've heard enough of "prove this","prove that'.
It's your turn to define what has no meaning to me.
Yeah,teach me what has no meaning to me without leaving any word that's necessary for your teaching to be effective.

HellVictorinho:

The possession of freewill doesn't really mean you can do anything you want and get away with it.
Besides,I'm not talking about your ability to choose.
I'm talking about the things that happen in the presence/absence of choices.
You never chose to be born,anyway.

There he goes making even more claims. If I ask you to prove them now, won't you say that you didn't make them, just like you have said now about the claim you made previously? I believe we're done with this conversation.

As for free will, I certainly don't believe that anyone can choose anything they want and get away with it. That is not the meaning of free will. Free will is merely the ability to intelligently choose between available options. We don't get to decide anything about the consequences of our choices. We can only choose each option as presented. In choosing any option, we also choose the consequences attached to it.

Free will entered our conversation in my response to your claim that life is absurd. If you make absurd choices, then your life and life around you will look absurd to you. If you make wise choices, then your life and life around you will look different.

LordReed:


Can you show me an example of an atheist foaming in the mouth and denying that those governments were atheistic?

Why? Do you doubt that atheists have denied that the governments of China and the USSR were atheistic?

Ihedinobi3:


Why? Do you doubt that atheists have denied that the governments of China and the USSR were atheistic?

Yes, especially the foaming in the mouth part.

LordReed:


Yes, especially the foaming in the mouth part.

You are foaming in the mouth just now. It's not literal, what did you score in common entrance English?

Image123:


You are foaming in the mouth just now. It's not literal, what did you score in common entrance English?

A nuisance and a troll.

Y'all still all over this thread making excuses for your deity

Ihedinobi3:



There he goes making even more claims. If I ask you to prove them now, won't you say that you didn't make them, just like you have said now about the claim you made previously? I believe we're done with this conversation.

As for free will, I certainly don't believe that anyone can choose anything they want and get away with it. That is not the meaning of free will. Free will is merely the ability to intelligently choose between available options. We don't get to decide anything about the consequences of our choices. We can only choose each option as presented. In choosing any option, we also choose the consequences attached to it.

Free will entered our conversation in my response to your claim that life is absurd. If you make absurd choices, then your life and life around you will look absurd to you. If you make wise choices, then your life and life around you will look different.

You misinterpreted what I said because you didn't agree.
You said I said bla bla bla simply because you can't see beyond what you see.
But why should I give a damn?
Furthermore, there are factors that affect the choices you make.
It's also impossible for you to determine the options available.
Those options are determined by chance.

budaatum:

What!? Is that what I said? Where please?!

I do not agree that the Bible must have anything to do with religion. After all, I did say, "the Quran, or Plato, or Chinua Achebe's Things Fall Apart or Homer". Is religion compulsory for Things fall Apart?


I disagree. I was an atheist throughout my growing up in Nigeria and I survived very well, thank you very much, and I am still not religious now and still survive very well.

Perhaps step back a bit and let us first define "religion" because despite two years after attempting to take up religion, I am finding it to mean groupthink, or rather, groupbelieve, which I am finding to be contrary to what I have rediscovered in the Bible.

Do you know Jesus was crucified because he did not believe what the group claimed should be believed? Do you realise that Eve refused to believe and remain a slave in the Garden of Eden?

Perhaps we should wait till you have finished your conversation with Ihe and can devote your attention to our conversation or you might mix us up.

You didn't say it.
But the religious people think religion is compulsory.
Furthermore,"less likely" is different from "impossible".
If almost everyone in a religious country like Nigeria knows you are an atheist,you will get what I'm saying very well.
But I''m not saying you will suffer
The issue is that many religious people see atheists as lunatics.

Ihedinobi3:



There he goes making even more claims. If I ask you to prove them now, won't you say that you didn't make them, just like you have said now about the claim you made previously? I believe we're done with this conversation.

As for free will, I certainly don't believe that anyone can choose anything they want and get away with it. That is not the meaning of free will. Free will is merely the ability to intelligently choose between available options. We don't get to decide anything about the consequences of our choices. We can only choose each option as presented. In choosing any option, we also choose the consequences attached to it.

Free will entered our conversation in my response to your claim that life is absurd. If you make absurd choices, then your life and life around you will look absurd to you. If you make wise choices, then your life and life around you will look different.

It's obvious you can't teach me what I asked you to teach me!!!!
But I will teach you the factors that affect the choices you make!!!
Those factors are what you see, what you hear and what you feel!!!
Furthermore, you don't determine any of those things !!!!
They are determined by chance!!!!!!

HellVictorinho:

You didn't say it. But the religious people think religion is compulsory.

There are also some who think Trump will be sworn in as the President of the USA on 20 January 2021. Thankfully, only buda thinks for buda.

HellVictorinho:
The issue is that many religious people see atheists as lunatics.

Then those religious people need Jesus Christ to spit on the ground and make some mud to rub in their eyes so that their blindness be cured and they see. Unless of course the atheist is behaving like a lunatic. In which case, it is the atheist who needs Christ to chase the demons out of him or her into pigs.

Religion is like school. You congregate before the altar to learn how to read from the pastor teaching in a class. Unfortunately, there is no graduation date so most sit there repeating the class until they are brainwashed and unable to think and reason for themselves. If they read the book they'd see Jesus never enslaved his students to the pew.

C.f. [url=https://classic.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Luke+9%3A1-6&version=GW]Luke 9:1-6[/url], [url=https://classic.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Luke+10%3A1-10&version=GW]Luke 10:1-10[/url], [url=https://classic.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Acts+1%3A3-10&version=KJV]Acts 1:3-10[/url]