waternogetenemy:



My friend, their is no pride in denying the history of our people.

It is a well documented fact that the Benin Empire invaded and carried away Igbo slaves down to the coast of warri.

Likewise the Efik alongside the Arochukwu.

The Ogoni were brought from Ghana for the purpose of slave raids by the British.

The Ijaws were neck deep involved in the slave raids of surrounding communities along the coast as well as holding them along the port of Bonny.

I have to go soon so I will say this very plainly.

The majority of slaves in Benin were urhobo, the same as with the itshekiri. The itshekiri were not even a slave raiding tribe for goodness sakes!

Any Igbo in edo land was more than likely a blacksmith, travelling merchant or priest. As attested by the Europeans who actually met them and the fact that an old study of the influence of Igbo smiths in southern Edo showed that a large percentage of the iron artifacts discovered there seemed to be of Igbo make. Igbos were literally one of the most prolific and recognisable travelling traders in the entire country.

What Aniomas had with Bini was at times a cordial relationship and sometimes a warring relationship, as can be expected of neighbours, not a raiding parasitic one.

Tribes such as Ijaws, ogonis were directly subservient politically, socially and economically to Igbo Oracle's and political systems. While tribes like Efiks were more indirectly dominated economically and politically to the point where the Efiks themselves told the colonists that they were descendants of Aro.

History is important to learn, hence the reason why it is good to accurately recount it and not rely on made-up assumptions.

X

waternogetenemy:


Yeah? Did the Oba of Benin enter Anioma?

Did the Efik enter Arochukwu?


Did ijaws and Ogoni enter Abia?

There is a difference between 'entering' and raiding for slaves like you mentioned previously which was incorrect. You will need to define what you mean.

waternogetenemy:



Dude, u did not answer my question.


How can we learn, when we cannot even answer question.


It is not about writing long epistol, answer the very clear and short question that I asked you.

What was your question?

waternogetenemy:


U are not serious.

Ok then. I don't know where you were going with that.

But I will recommend you read the notes of impartial Europeans that witnessed the precolonial relationships and social dynamics between Igbos and all those tribes you mentioned there.

Thousands of Hausas and Nupes were enslaved in Igboland. Igbos did not raid any of these areas , they were bought through civil wars in those respective places.

The 'Igbo slave trade' was largely conducted by Igbos themselves seeing as they were the ones that controlled the slave routes. Trying to say that these minorities were successfully raiding Igbo towns for slaves is blatant rewriting of history.

waternogetenemy:


Yeah? Did the Oba of Benin enter Anioma?

Did the Efik enter Arochukwu?


Did ijaws and Ogoni enter Abia?

Before I respond, please clarify what you are trying to say.

waternogetenemy:



The funny thing about Igbo slave trade is, the minority tribes that surround us were used against us, not so much Igbo selling but rather Igbo kidnap.

The Oba of Benin showed up in the area from ile ife around the sametime dealing in Human Cargo.

Oba with the itsekiri conducted raids into Anioma.

On the otherside, we had the Obong of Calabar and Efik slave raiders that joined with Arochukwu to raid Igboland for slaves.

The Aro are mixed with Ibibio and they were the only igbo group involved in slave raids.

Then the British brought Ogoni's from Ghana to aid their access into Igbo hinterland and slave raid.

The Ijaws were kidnaping and active at slave ports, used for holding the slaves.


This is what happened in our region.

That is not what happened in our region. Minority tribes couldn't even enter Igbo towns without permission.

The economic epicentre of Southern Nigeria have always been largely centred in Eastern Nigeria, and if fairness,is allowed to reign devoid of the artificial meddling of the Nigerian government, it will continue to do so.

Also, it is pretty dumb to think that Igbos were afraid of water just because they didn't move to the coasts en masse. They live on both sides of one of the largest water bodies on the African continent, and they have their numerous water deities.

Hence the reason they lived near large water bodies such as lakes and rivers; in areas that could support farming and expanding towns.
If the eastern Nigerian coasts were similar to that of countries like Australia and hospitable to human life, then by today, the area would have been closer to homogenously Igbo.

This is the strangest question. That's like asking why most people preferred to settle in the grassland than in deserts.

Have you even bothered to travel to coasts of Nigeria bordering the Igbo hinterland? It is made up of swamps and marshes and was considered extremely undesirable real estate. Literally when European ethnographers travelled up the Niger, they knew they were entering Igbo territories when the mangroves and swamps started to give way to green dry land.

The people that made a living there lived hard lives and were prone to much higher frequencies of diseases than the hinterland, due to airborne diseases, mosquitoes that were prevalent, poor sanitation, poor access to drinkable water...

As such, with few exceptions, the Igbos of old perceived the coasts much like how the Europeans of old perceived Australia, a backwards wilderness.

The actual question to be asked is why Ancient Igbos would want to settle there en masse?

AmotekunSW:


Igbo men? Spits.
Why will Yoruba women look at Igbo men when even Igbo women are dying over Yoruba men.

Stop lying to yourselves. With all this obsession you guys have over Igbo women, they still don't claim you. You are the only ones dying over Igbo women in real life and on the internet while their male counterparts just see you as an increasingly weird nuisance.

Omoawoke:


Them no get shame before na. Just have money, you will shag all the Igbo girls in the whole wide world .
If you come be Yoruba man, they fit die on top your matter

You guys aren't even ashamed, my goodness. Igbo men aren't even interested in yoruba women while your creepy obsession with Igbo women has led you to this ridiculous fantasies.

KingOfAllIgbos:


Stop crying. You're a grown man.

Many of your ladies desperately chase Yoruba guys.

Away " my name is Femi and I am taking you to Lagos" and a Yamlegger will rape you.

An ibo friend of mine lies this way.

Accept reality. Your ladies complain they prefer Yoruba Demons cos they are Alphas.

Don't cry and prove me right...again

I'm sorry, but if only know what Igbo women think about you guys...You wouldn't have the guts to say this.

Just a hint. Next time you hear someone parroting what you just said, look closely and you will find that it is one of your kind.

Enough already. You guys are so pathetic. Has it ever occurred to you that Igbo women never say this, it's only you guys?

No way...Please don't tell me that there are actually yoruba people here trying to attach themselves to Igbo history?

Goodness, this is so embarassing. Please be proud of yourself and stop insert yourselves in other people's history, I'm begging you.

Alfo65:
The guy went around predominantly the western part of Nigeria and parts of the North.
He went to the biggest cities there, the ones that were no doubt constantly hyped to him prior to visiting as some of the most 'developed' areas in Nigeria.

Only to actually arrive there and see not even cities but 'slums that seemed to sprawl eternally in every direction'.

You can imagine.

If only Nigerians are honest with themselves then a serious revolution would be staged so that the nation would finally start to progress.
If not then they would continue to boast with substandard cities while the rest of the world develops at frightening speeds.

They will continue to watch from the sidelines until China eventually invades the nation and the entire country re-purposed into a poultry farm.

A closer view.

Nigeria is the true poverty capital of the world. The only reason the public keeps dragging India like that is because the spotlight hasn't been put on Nigeria yet.

Even the Lagos that some people are shouting over is considered a mere culmination of slums. So poorly planned that it's traffic and transportation is far worse than cities several times it's size.

...h

The cold truth devoid of Nigerian propaganda.

Some Key points to ruminate over:

Source l url: https://biafraspot.com/threads/american-traveler-exposes-nigerias-embarrassing-condition.127/

American tourist spends 12 days travelling around Northern and Western Nigeria and reports the cold truth.

ChebeNdigboCalm:
From the mid 19th to the early 20th centuries, native states were defeated one after the other and bound together as "Nigeria".

When 'studying' the history of that area, the standard narrative that appears in surface level descriptions is as follows:

1. Hausa kingdoms were great but became corrupt and Usman dan fodio took over creating Sokoto caliphate which prompted the intensification of jihadists (also slave) raids into the south.
2. Kingdom of Benin were dominating all their neighbours, made great earthworks, made cool art, had an enviable capital city and once had control of lagos + western igbos.
3. Oyo empire had a calvary. Subjugated dahomey but lost to them later. Had very powerful armies that started fighting each other.
4. Igbos had no king and were poorer than their neighbours. Often dominated by neighbours. They lived in villages but did have a state called arochukwu and a religious state called nri. No armies, not very powerful.

But one has to examine things carefully. What actually happened when the British came to subjugate.

1. Hausas, Fulanis and Nupe trooped out in their thousands to fight, fielding armies of 10000, 15000 and sometimes 20000. They were defeated in short encounters with the british.
In Bida, the Bida army was nowhere to be seen when the British came.
In Kano the Kano emirate boasted thousands of infantry with a massive calvary of 3000 at kwatarkwashi. The British suffered only 44 casualties. Generally British army was around 600 to 1000 men in these conflicts.

2. The Benin kingdom destroyed 250 British infiltrators before they got the chance to be armed. When the actual army came a year later with 1200 men, they destroyed the city and the benin army only losing 8 men.

3. The Yoruba practically put up no resistance. The only notable war was the admirable effort of the Ijebus. In which there were about 500 british soldiers who suffered 56 dead and around 30 wounded. There were maybe 2 or 3 days of battle. Whilst the Ijebu had 8000 warriors and suffered 1000 dead.

4. The Igbo fought the British at every significant Igbo settlement. The Aro alone fought them for months in the Anglo Aro war which had 1600 british troops and 7500 Aro soildiers. In that one war the british losses were 700-800 killed or wounded (half the invading force as casualties). The Aro had heavy but unknown casualties, they pulled dead and wounded away from the trenches so the British did not discover the bodies. Is there something missing? Why did people supposedly in a much poorer and unsophisticated condition than the rest put up an exponentially better fight against the largest british force mustered in pre-colonial Nigeria?

Now the igbo anioma people (boasted to be igbo "slaves" of benin when suited and non igbo people when trying to diminish the size of igboland), have always been claimed to be under benin empire by surface level sources. I agree that the ika may have been but I strongly oppose that the rest may have followed suit. How is it that the anioma fought the british for 30 years whilst the bini lost in a few days?

Other very notable group resistance are the Olokoro, ezza and afikpo.

My theory is this. If you read the accounts (in london gazette archives) admitted by the leaders of the expeditions into igboland, you would see that countless towns were razed to the ground(without exaggeration) and that is only what was admitted.

I suspect that actually, the anthropologists that came into Igboland, saw an Igboland which was recovering from the ravages of war as the only major ethnicity to resist strongly in all corners. Igboland was vastly undocumented until about 1910 when most of these conflicts were concluded or drawing to a close.

I am asking that the comments in response are not drawn from tribal affiliation or hatred. I like truthful history and though I am Igbo, I genuinely objectively thought this through.

1) The myth of western Igbo domination by Benin is a power fantasy that only flourished after the war. If it were in any way true, then the European colonialists that travelled there during that period would have noted it. Unfortunately, a cursory read of historical documentation points to the fact that what many Nigerians tout as 'history' are often merely beer parlor fantasies sometimes not up to 30 years old.

2) Independence does not mean isolation. The fact that Igbo communities and towns exercised their autonomy doesn't mean they were not connected with each other. They had well developed internal and external trade networks in which weapons, food and communication could travel relatively quickly from one area to another.
Just look at how quickly Igbo social movements such as the Aba women's protest spread from one Igbo town to the entire eastern region. One of the major ways that the British forces were able to get the Aro, were by strangulating their local trade networks, stopping them from communicating information and goods with other Igbo groups.

Rostikol:
The biggest LIE ever told about Nigerian or African culture is that physical discipline of children or anyone at all, is ''part of our culture''.

IT IS NOT.

It was a practice that was introduced by British colonialists.

The saying ''spare the rod and spoil the child'' is an ENGLISH bible proverb with NO African equivalent.

If you know one, I DARE YOU to tell us.

In pre-colonial Nigeria and Africa, children were seen as SACRED.

As the ANCESTORS RETURNED.

How could a sane person be beating up the ancestors?

It was unheard of.

Children were pampered.

They were 'disciplined' through communication.

TALK. Story telling. Preaching. Proverbs. Begging. (You'll be shocked at how well begging a child to behave well actually WORKS if you tried it.)

BUT THEY WERE NOT BEATEN.

It was the European colonialists who introduced corporal punishment (again, no African equivalent of the term) in their missionary schools - flogging and caning was what they did to 'discipline' African children.

THE SAME REASON YOUR PARENTS USED THE SAME CANE AND FLOGGING AGAINST YOU.

It's no coincidence.

It was the ENGLISH that taught them that.

Because the ENGLISH were racist sadists hellbent on creating a society built on hierarchy, fear and intimidation, for their own selfish ends.

THEY HAVE GONE NOW, SO UNLEARN WHAT THEY TAUGHT YOU, AND STOP BEATING YOUR CHILDREN AND HOUSE HELPS.

It is UNAFRICAN.

Meanwhile the British who taught you to beat your kids do not beat their own kids in Britain.

A kid born there can stand up and say what he feels anywhere anytime without fear.

That is how we were before they invaded.

It was THEM who taught us to replace reason and proverbs with fear, beating, and intimidation.

You are completely correct Op, and I have been meaning to begin a thread about this.

Colonists even noted the first Igbo children forced into early missionary schools found it difficult to adjust because of the physical brutality they passed as discipline then. Nigeria's culture of 'discipline' has been largely shaped by poverty, insecurity and decades of living in a callous or unempathetic culture.

But you have to be careful because there are many cultures in this country, particularly Islamic, that historically used these methods to discipline the child.

What was the point of even doing this?

Increased chance that Nigeria will dissolve peacefully.

An interesting post from the thread.

KwaraRat:


Story.

Igbo land was known as the land of Satan and cannibalism.

Widespread indiscriminate slave raiding , human sacrifices and cannibalism where the hallmark so much so that it was dubbed the land of Satan.

It's like they haven't sniped you yet.

In the past Colonialists often remarked on how clean, well-planned and picturesque igbo villages were, it's no surprise this mentality had carried over to the modern age.


It's also no surprise that Igbos are fiercely proud of their villages, (There are multiple threads on Nairaland showcasing the nooks and crannies of various villages across Igboland) and endeavour to go there at least annually no matter where they are.

Because Igbos rejected a monarchical structure, this vested power in the community itself. Along with power came a strong sense of responsibility for the common igbo when it came to political affairs.

Instead of relying on the goodwill of an elusive higher power to build their environment, they simply gathered themselves and their collective resources together and got things done.

As a result there is no section of Nigeria that can boast of the standard of living that rural Igboland has today.


Random pictures of some villages in Igboland below.