₦airaland Forum

bykebyke:
His motivational acts are being used as a reason why He is better than Messi..As a Barcelona and MessiFc supporter why should I let that stand?

I should leave their individual capabilities and face motivational speeches?

When they both enter a pitch,is it to motivate the ball or to play it?

I don't care who's better between them, all I know is leadership qualities are needed on and off the pitch. If it wasn't Maradona and others wouldn't be bytching about it.

When they are on the pitch, they motivate thier team-mates while playing the ball.

bykebyke:
I don't understand..Higuain went up and took his pen after seeing his captain go up and take his,He didn't cower.

Same way i don't understand how someone low morale is inspired by CR7 but your hating won't let you see that.

bykebyke:
Note:I asked Nihilist what can he use to backup the Cristina would have scored a Hat Trick against France talk because there was nothing to suggest that as the score was still at 0-0 when He left.

I can back up my Argentina are more efficient with Messi because they have a higher win percentage in qualifiers since 2014-2016 with Messi than without Messi.

You can't use yesterday's match as the crux of your point because it was Messi's first loss in 90minutes with Argentina in 17games.

And yesterday was the worse Argentina have played,they literally wanted Messi to do it all,from attack to midfield,hence Messi not seeing a lot of the ball.


What's this one supposed to mean?
Moutinho was being a püssy,Cristina told to stop being a püssy and go play the Penalty...Motivation?

Messi has stepped up first to go play a penalty for Argentina in a final as the captain and not wait for the last one to suck up all glory...nobody else..Messi.

Yes He missed one,that act is enough to get you motivated.
If your captain can go up first to take his pk..who the fück are you?

There's nothing to suggest that Messi would have won the matches for Argentina if he was on the pitch too if you want to look at it that way. Wasn't he on the pitch when they lost yesterday? He'd have won since once he's on the pitch Argentina must win.


Story for the gods. Against Poland CR7 also stepped up first to take the PK for Portugal, so this your "sucking up the glory" excuse doesn't hold water.

[quote author=bykebyke post=50964893][/quote]Maybe if Messi had helped Higuain to stop being a půssy in the grand stage, maybe, just maybe he wouldnt have lost 3 finals.

TRendlona:
A footballer is one who plays football on the pitch. We are arguing on who is a greater footballer between Messi and Ronaldo. Their primary duty is to lead their team to victory while playing on the pitch. If you wanna argue on who is a better motivator (off the pitch), then I think it's Ronaldo. One isn't a good footballer because he motivates his team of the pitch. It's what you play and how you influence your team positively on the pitch that matters.

I'm not arguing who's a better player between them, I thought I made that clear? My grouse is downplaying motivational acts. Whether you like it or not, CR7 motivated his team-mates to victory, and the likes of Maradona and others have chastised Messi for not being a LEADER enough to motivate his team to an international title. Just few days ago, an ex-footballer complained about it too and ask Bauza to strip Messi of his captain role and give it to Everton's Funes Mori. My own is, teams are not only motivated by playing but also by words and acts.

elrony:
Sinizia , how Cayman Islands be na?... you abandon us for here go flex with bae!... more grease to ya loins

You sure say na Cayman Island I go abi the heavy defeat by Shekpe was too hard and shameful to stomach so I had to run way?

Laveda:
sinizia right now.

kokaneprodigy:
Them just dey open yansh like Tiwa, corporate olosho of a club, meanwhile where is sinizia?

Pataki:
You no see how one of them don dey curse Moaninghoe for here?

Reminds me of Sinizia last season, who woke up as early as 6am Sunday morning, logged on NL and started cussing Van Gaal heavily for no reason.

Pataki:
Upon all the senseless argument here, your useless coach will still turn-up with his park the bus tactics.

Anyways, seems another ariya is loading in some hours time on this thread. We go kuku turn-up as usual.

I hope Sinizia never pokunso oh!

Pataki:
GBAM! Have you noticed that even the regular scummies have abandoned their own thread? For example, where is Sinizia these days?

kokaneprodigy:
U want that dude to go commit suicide? Na sinizia I and pataki still dey find upandan, abeg cool down dey troll these scummies.

www.nairaland.com/attachments/4392944_jog_jpeg16b24daf2116b1422fb0dd0f4d82f6b8


Na wa o. Someone cannot play with you? Ezz dat how you use to do?

Bykebyke, while I wouldn't engage in this Messi-CR7 debate as I find it extremely tedious and unenjoyable, I've to say your hypocrisy is so thick I can slice a knife through it.

I remember when some weeks back, different sites pointed out how Argentina were less efficient without Messi and more efficient with Messi on the team, you and your fellow Barca fans lapped it up and supported it. None of you disagreed that Argentina were more deadly with Messi playing, but now that Nihilist said if Ororo was on that pitch he'd have scored a hat-trick [I believe Nihilist exaggerated here though], a way of saying with Ororo on the pitch Portugal is more deadly, you guys are trying to shoot down the notion. Why the hypocrisy? If what's good for the goose is also good for the gander, why are you all of sudden trying to deny Ororo of his importance to Portugal? If you can believe that Argentina would have had better results if Messi didn't miss those matches, then Ororo would have likely score or pose more danger if Portugal had him on the pitch in that finals. If you disagree then it applies to Messi too after all he's on the pitch yesterday and Argentina still got rąped.


Now unto my second issue with you, you're once again downplaying Ororo's motivational speeches to his team-mates or his leadership qualities. It's glaring even to blind men that motivational speeches and acts inspired/inspires various sport teams over the years and will continue to do so. After every example Nihilist pointed to you, you still had to hate on Ororo. If that ain't enough, what about how he motivated Moutinho to take that PK when Moutinho had made up his mind to stop taking PKs because of his earlier failure? Abi na you talk to Moutinho?

It's on YouTube too, below is the news and the video is in the link in case you've suddenly forgotten.
http://m.sportskeeda.com/football/euro-2016-cristiano-ronaldo-convinced-joao-moutinho-take-penalty-shootout-portugal-poland-win


Blowing off another man's candle won't make yours light, just saying though.

Also here are different sport personalities inspiring thier teams to victory by thier speeches and acts.
http://talksport.com/magazine/features/130523/greatest-ever-inspirational-sporting-speeches-198226

An0nimus:
Joke is on you brah...you're the bigger team here

We the apex predator weren't the ones complaining.

An0nimus:
See as ManUtd fans dey party on top our draw...how times change

Yes o, same way Gayners fans left this dry thread and made United thread their first home, and partied non-stop when we drew Stoke and Loserfool. Times has really changed.

PietroRico:
I wonder how he still manages to rile so many people up.

You guys a giving him exactly what he needs, attention

Exactly my thought. If na only my type full Nairaland, that thing won't get a jot of attention from me, not even a minuscule of it. The joy of being quoted or snidely referred to gives it its earth-shattering orgasm that it craves.

raumdeuter:
Everyone loves an underdog thats why Simeone is popular.

Atletico is only sexy because most of their top opponents are significantly richer have more talents and they arent even close, Check Deloitte money league and see where Atletico is, Thats why people think Simeone is doing wonders with a relatively small budget/team

if Simeone is given Barca/Madrid type money and he plays that type of football see what will happen. I think he is being startegic by staying in Atletico for now

Let Simeone go to a big club and the onus is on him to win and win attacking then lets see how he copes

Are you wondering why top clubs even the type of Tottenham or Everton are not hiring Tony Pulis rather going for attacking coaches like Pochetinno Koeman AVB and Roberto Martinez

You've a point. I support Atletico as the underdog to break Barca and Madrid dominance. If they were in the same rich league as Madrid and Co, I probably would've wanted another underdog to spring up. I used to support Dani Alvez and Kanoute's Sevilla back then too before Alvez left and they became weak. But Atletico are a good side irrespective of the underdog tag. Having less money and staying competitive yet deserves commendation.

Night bros. Make man crash small. Time don pass.

donjazet:
That's highly debatable! Considering the way he left. He left on acrimonious terms!
The last few months were very hectic for him with the press constantly bombarding him with questions about his future. The focus left the field of play, he walked out a few times from press conferences. There is no doubt that pep is a coach in demand but many people believe he hasn't been adequately tested.

No o. It's not debatable. Bayern never wanted to let Pep go. They fought hard to keep him.

raumdeuter:
Attacking football and possesion football is more desirable to people than defensive football. Its why every club and team wanted to play like Pep's Barcelona even CHelsea owner wants an attacking team.

Benitez one advocate of defensive football is in division 2, DiMatteo another one has been sacked in division 2, Mourinho was sacked last season

While all the coaches people are hailing now are attacking coaches even the younger ones Pochettino, Tuchel etc look up to Peps style, Pray tell how many coaches come out to say they want to play bunker ball get 40% possession like Mourinho, Benitez Pulis have patented

Mourinho won his treble after Pep yet people are still making reference to Peps team. Bayern City every top club want Pep. Wenger said once Pep declares he is available, every coaches job became uncertain, whereas the bunker coach is being asked to write an affidavit to get a job

I think everyone can choose which tactics best suit him. As for me, I fell in love with United seeing their breath-taking football attack, so I choose attack over defense. The only team that makes defence look sexy to me is Atletico. Attack wins you more titles and accolades than defense after all attack they say, is the best way to defend.

I think my only major problem with Pep is not knowing when to defend. A bit defending when a man down is not bad at all.

donjazet:
He hasn't been adequately tested. That's a fact.

Let's wait till his tenure is over to judge him. I feel it's too early to call him a fraud. He's not doing bad at all, we all knew he won't win last night.

donjazet:
Lots of credits still go to jupp henykens(spell check) and van gasp for the modern Bayern success. Pep is not really rated in Germany, many fans still feel he underachieved there. There simply wasn't any higher difference from what was earlier done there.
Records weren't really set.
He doesn't have the highest goal scored/least goal conceded or consecutive league wins. Stuff like that! He couldn't even go unbeaten at home for even a season. What jose did for nine years. Pep might be good but he hasn't really been tested.
Now is the time!! We would know his full abilities. Today, he has just failed his first big test. If care is not taken in that group., borussia moncheglabach might even come 2nd.

I hope you know Jupp didn't revolutionize Bayern alone? It's a gradual process, even Van Gaal played a part, ask Raumdeuter. That's what I'm trying to say, that attacking system has been embedded in Bayern's DNA by years of attacking tactics. That's what Pep is trying to bring to City. Yes, he hasn't been really tested that much, but let's see what he does in his tenure at City. He might put it off.


I hope he fails though, coz I'm scared of what he might do to my team if he succeeds.

weedtaker:
oga sinizia how is pep a great tactician?

e be lyk say some people don forget say tactics and identity no mean de same thing.

His titles, his brand of football makes him a great tactician. If he's a poor tactician, most clubs won't be scrambling for his signature. United, Chelsea, PSG, etc were all chasing him. A poor tactician cannot command such respect

I understand why you guys are hard on Pep. His lack of defensive acumen in some certain aspect of football. I agree that he'd work on that, but I feel Pep is a great tactician coz he's someone thats not in for a short term success but a long term one. He's not about just winning for the moment, he's about laying a solid foundation for future success.

He brings his own ideologies, tactics and plans aimed at changing the entire thought and playing process of a club. If such tactics succeed, he ends up revolutionizing the club's style of football. He wants to leave his mark on a club even while he's long gone. That's why he's wanted so much. The three most successful club in recent times, Barca, Madrid and Bayern are well rooted in attacking football. It's not a coincidence, and that's what he wants to impact on City. He might pull it off.

chic2pimp:
That's the point I have been making all day. Doesn't necessarily has to be 'park the bus'. Pep is a genius as far as the beautiful game is concerned. He just needs to add that to his repertoire.

I feel he's rigid though. Like he feels locking up shop in some scenarios or using a closely knitted formation at some stages in a match is a curse. He'd know that defensive football is also a tactic. A bit of it is not bad especially against tactically superior opponents.

bigkesh:
City's previous meetings against Barca 2-0,2-1,2-1,1-0

If those are hammer,this is Chain saw

Lwkmd.

I don die. Guy, take it easy on me, it's almost midnight here.

bigkesh:
And when you are a man down against Barca at camp nou every normal being who isn't an extremist like Pep would close the shop and hope to hit on the counter....
That he even came out and allowed Barca a lot of space with a numerical disadvantage shows he is a dunce...

I agree with this. This to me, is Pep's greatest undoing. He made this mistake against Barca with Bayern. At one man down, he refused to lock up. He'd learn how to defend in such occasions though. There's no need to attack Barca when numerically disadvantaged.

SailorXY:
Before I address this, the City game was not won in the first half. Zlatan could have leveled it in the dying minutes, Rashford had his effort ruled out & there were @ least 2 more clean headers the Zlatan I know would have buried without fuss.

This you paragraph is like saying water is wet. If Jose succeed in molding the team he want with United, they will dominate EPL. So?
In the end, dominating here points to trophies earned, not ball playing goalkeepers showboating!!

In the second-half didn't City miss chances as well. If they convert all the chances for both teams, City would have still won. I still remember City's numerous counter on us that they wasted.

True, if Mourinho molds his team well, they'd be a force; but I see Pep's molding as a long term source of success than Mourinho's. Pep's plan for a club is to change their entire style of play which sets the tone for a period of domination. He's not just about winning for a short time but rather laying the foundation of sustained success.

SIRcumalot:
Almost everybody is,
And you still need to score goals to win,but no when to focus on which side of football
Pep never wavering on his style of play don probably cost am another UCL medal.

Ancleotti's Milan is a great defensive side they won two UCL medal.
And the only team and manager to win the UCL back to back did it with their defence.

Ancellotti with his defensive side was poor on the league scene, he's just a man good at UCL. Why wasn't his Madrid that defensive as well? AC Milan had good attacking outlets as well. Kaka and Shevy in their prime were devastating. You can only be defensive depending on the team you have. Even United is not as defensive as Mourinho's great defensive sides. Also when was the last time a team won UCL back to back? Before it's renamed. E don tey, bros.


But I get what you're saying. A little caution won't hurt especially when playing your superiors.

bigkesh:
If they play that game 100 times its still gonna go like that....
Even Arsenal did the same at Emirates


You gain soo much confidence with the possession that you leave spaces at the back

And you believe if City had parked the bus, they would've won? I don't believe so. Yes, they got rąped tonight, but i can see a bright future ahead if Pep gets it right. Too much respect given to Barca will earn the opposing team a rout by Barcelona.

Diademk07:
There's no reason why he shouldn't have gone with a striker to give them a focal point in attack though. Debruyne was never a forward to begin with, even Sterling/Nolito woulda been a better choice as the false 9 than De bryune.

A double pivot of Fernandinho and Gundogan in midfield wouldn't have hurt either, considering the fact that Dinho is not your typical DM, he's a converted no 8.

I agree, seeing Aguero on the bench made me angry. I don't know what Pep was thinking mehn and Debruyne as a false 9 would have been more devastating if Nolito or Sterling played there. It cost them that point man to convert those chances or run off the shoulders of Umtiti or Mathieu.

tess1:
Pep going to play tikitaka with Barca at Camp Nou is always a suicude. No matter how good played today, they'll always make errors. Barca's kind of tikitaka always thrive on these little little errors and they have a front-three that'll always punish teams for such errors. Can you compare that to Man City's? It's not as if Barca also won't make errors as well but who are those strikers that'll punish such when he played without Aguero/Nacho who can punish them for theirs most especially after their two of their back four was out.

Pep's biggest mistake was not having Aguero on that pitch, he'd have scored Barca in that first-half. Barca had errors too but no-one to convert them. At the end, City attack didn't step up. But still, as a fan of attacking football, City made me happy up until Bravo moment of stupidity. Thunder fire Pep on that one. His quest for passing football is too extreme.

SailorXY:
what was he doing in the second half @ Old Trafford?
What was his plan hoofing long balls against Spurs when him eye don clear?

Not every predator will confront a prey head on, there is smartness & there is overconfidence. Pep kind of overconfidence is misplaced, he doesn't have the quality he thinks is in his squad; & that will be his Achilles.

During our more dominant second-half display vs City, did it pay off? City had us where it would hurt us and it didn't matter what we did, the game was over in the first-half. Plus we were attacking with nothing left to lose, so City had to play with a bit caution. City no be Barca, they're still a team in progress.

Against Spurs City came out to attack but were outmuscled and overpowered. But at least Pep never started the match with an intent of defending. City were forced into such scenarios coz of Tottenham's excessive pressing.

As for your last paragraph, you're right that its not every time one attacks especially considering the quality of City team is not better than Barca's, but even if City parked the bus, Barca would carve them wide open still. E for worse sef. Ultra-defending is not Pep's style, everyone knows this, he said it also before the match. So it's either you employ him for attack or you leave him. This Barca first-half display is the closest I've seen a team in recent times neutralize them attacking-wise. Even MSN were invisible. Barca fans were even asking for where Messi was in that first-half.


Take it from me, if Pep succeed with City and mold them to the team he wants, they'll dominate EPL.

SIRcumalot:
Defensive football na still football,
And if done properly isn't a total borefest
Watching barca try to break down a spirited defence is ten times more thrilling than what you saw tonight.
As for Pep to Utd
I surprise say na only one arm you go sacrifice for the cause.
Plenty go give more.

Defensive football is a tactic in football and it wins matches and even titles. If you doubt me, ask Atletico. Even Mourinho's defensive sides like the Chelsea of his first stint had a knack of scoring a goal or two and locking up shop. I criticized him back then but deep down I didn't mind United utilizing it to win matches coz result matters the most.


But I've been a fan of ATTACK over DEFENCE. No matter how good defense looks, the best sides in football have had a good mixture of both or more of attack than defence. How many defensive minded teams have won more titles than attack minded teams?


I love United under Alex coz we played brilliant attacking football. That's the United I fell in love with, so I'll always lean towards more attack than defense or a good mixture of both but never more of defense.

I just don't understand. Before Bravo's mistake, Barca were outplayed by City. Messi, Suarez and Co were made to look ordinary. Why are people not giving Guardiola his due respect for outplaying and rendering Barca useless till Bravo's moment of madness? Even at Nou Camp, Barca had only one shot on target in the first-half. Only Atletico's ultra-defensive style can limit Barca to such shocking stat. Even Barca fans in the bar with me were shocked and could hardly make noise the entire first-half.

SIRcumalot:
His a forking idiot.
You play to your opponent strength for their house
For what? Vanity

He's not an ediot to me. Save for individual errors, City played well. They made Barca look ordinary. Pep doesn't like defensive football, he attacks and he doesn't change his belief. City should've known that before hiring him. I'm a fan of attacking football and I'd give an arm to have Pep at United.

SailorXY:
Bros trust me, all this is nothing if you don't get nothing from the game itself.
2005 FA Cup final United vs Arsenal - I have never seen a one-sided football in all my life like that, before or after; 180 minutes of hard ANALysis. In the end Arsenal won PK shoot out. I can bet that many fans who saw that game don't even remember much from it but when we refer to FA website - the winner on the day is written in block letters.

For Pep, Jose, Conte, Pochettino, Wenger, the Liverpool guy: in the end we will all rate them by what they were able to achieve in the EPL. This is what we will all remember.

Results are the most important thing in football no doubt, and titles are the ultimate deciders at the end of one's coaching or playing career; but I'm someone that praises a player or coach when he's doing something right irrespective of what transpires at the end.


I've watched the previous 4 meetings of Barca-City, and before Bravo's madness, this has been City's best display for me. I expected the usual annihilation of City but they proved me wrong. It's not surprising that Guardiola refused to renege on his principle of attacking football. Individual errors might have spoiled their plans this night, and I don't know if City will become great under Pep or not; but one thing I know is that Pep is coach with a vision and tactics like no other presently. And if he happens to get things right at City, I'm afraid of what United vs City's encounters will be.