Skimanski's Posts

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Properties › Re: Finishing Our Building In Benin (a New Dimension To Nigerian Architecture) by skimanski(op): 7:20am On May 18, 2017

PRE-PLASTERING WORKS: Extension of door height from Normal 7 Feet to 8 feet. for Aesthetic Purposes

Properties › Re: Finishing Our Building In Benin (a New Dimension To Nigerian Architecture) by skimanski(op): 7:18am On May 18, 2017

ROOFING WORKS: Installation of wooden frame to carry roof sheet.

Properties › Re: Finishing Our Building In Benin (a New Dimension To Nigerian Architecture) by skimanski(op): 7:12am On May 18, 2017

Properties › Re: Our Renovation Diary-lekki Scheme I (a New Dimension To Nigerian Architecture) by skimanski(op): 7:03am On May 17, 2017

EXTERNAL WORKS: External tiles on body of Building

Properties › Re: Our Renovation Diary-lekki Scheme I (a New Dimension To Nigerian Architecture) by skimanski(op): 7:00am On May 17, 2017

MASTER'S W.C: Rounding Up tiling works

Properties › Re: Our Renovation Diary-lekki Scheme I (a New Dimension To Nigerian Architecture) by skimanski(op): 6:59am On May 17, 2017

KIDS ROOM: Finishing Wardrobe

Properties › Re: Our Renovation Diary-lekki Scheme I (a New Dimension To Nigerian Architecture) by skimanski(op): 6:57am On May 17, 2017

CLOSET: 70% Done

Properties › Re: Our Renovation Diary-lekki Scheme I (a New Dimension To Nigerian Architecture) by skimanski(op): 6:55am On May 17, 2017

INTERNAL DOORS: Ongoing installation

Properties › Re: Finishing Our Building In Benin (a New Dimension To Nigerian Architecture) by skimanski(op): 6:54am On May 17, 2017

DOORS: Ongoing installation

Properties › Re: Finishing Our Building In Benin (a New Dimension To Nigerian Architecture) by skimanski(op): 6:16am On May 16, 2017

StainlessH:
Nice job sir. You are Good!

Thanks Boss

Properties › Re: General Topic Thread-To Discuss Anything And Everything in Building Construction by skimanski(m): 8:05pm On May 14, 2017

I am going to paste My first comment on this topic below so that we read it again.

"Why is it so surprising that he paid N1.2m to plaster a four unit of 3 bedroom flat? Don't you think he should bother more about his Job been worth the figure than the figure been that high. Una no want make the guys Chop?"

Note The contractor is not my concern. the client is my concern. i want him to bother more on the quality. If he feels he can get thesame quality for 600k No wahala. But like I always Operate. Quality is number 1. before price. If i can get a good deal for quality, who doesn't want that? But first on my scale is Quality, then secondly price.

I no wan talk again, Dem beat Man u. so make I go sleep.

Properties › Re: General Topic Thread-To Discuss Anything And Everything in Building Construction by skimanski(m): 6:29pm On May 14, 2017

Excuzeme:
\

Can ANYONE on this forum, tell us if they have paid over #1,200,000, to plaster a 3-bed, FOUR FLATS building?
I am sure no-one has done so, except maybe a Contractor like Skimanski --- It is not his money!

Ofcourse, @Skimanski can say: because l am good at plastering, l think l would charge #6Million for the same job, that shows how good l am!
Then @Aventures will say, "for me, it is #12Million for the same job, because l think l am better
@Spyder can even up the ante by saying okay, its either #18Million or nothing for me....... or dont you know the quality of my work?

Question is: Where does it stop and where is the FAIRNESS to the Customer here?

@Skimanski: QUALITY is 'given'.
it is expected of any Artisan/Contractor who is worth his salt, anything other than that makes the Artisan/Contractor a QUACK.

The only thing left to haggle about is the PRICE to be paid for the 'expected' quality job.
If l call you for a job, it is because l 'believe' you are professional, know what you are doing, you are well-trained and competent thus, QUALITY is expected and should be taken for granted!
It is because we have too many, poorly educated, incompetent and unprofessional QUACKS masquerading as Professional "Big Guns" in the industry, that we then have to worry about 'quality' or bad jobs.

All of us know that GREED is inbred in our DNA, hence we look for ways to justify it.

An average Oyinbo is always upfront about his charges, .......that he will do a Good/Quality job, is GIVEN.
If he does not, his license can be withdrawn, he can be prosecuted and even banned from practising for life but all those who did a shoddy job at Lekki Gardens collapsed building are already out, ...doing more shoddy jobs!
Its not about how much you are asked to pay (even if you double the price they charged), it is no guarantee they wont do a shoddy job.

Its like in the "Legal" industry.
Lawyers are free to charge whatever they deem fit, claiming its about 'how good a service they can render".
But the Courts (made up of qualified former, senior Lawyers as well) has come out to say "There should be a FAIR PRICE for your Services" and have disciplined some Lawyers for excessive charges and deducted the excess back to the Client.
What we should all understand is that "Where one of the parties is at a disadvantage in a negotiation and has no option than to pay (because he can do the job and he needs the job), the party rendering the service has a temptation to ABUSE AND TAKE ADVANTAGE of his Position.
Even when some Lawyers bungle a case that a well-informed 'lay-man' could have won, they still want to charge an arm and leg!
Just tell them to do the case "prono bono" (No win, No fee) then you will see how they quickly develop cold feet because they know their own limitations.

What l am saying is that it is WRONG to say that there is always a DIRECT and PROPORTIONAL relationship between EXCESSIVE CHARGE and quality of Job, in Nigeria.
Let us call a spade, a spade.

@twinskenny: I knew you back then in the FTA section on Nairaland when you knew nothing about wiring or electrical installation!
I remember the kind of questions you used to ask ..which shows your level of 'knowledge and competency', and the FREE answers you were given.
A few years later now, you think you have joined the "Elite Club" who can charge whatever they like or the customer can go to blazes or imply that your outrageous prices are reflection of your level of competency, professionalism or qualification?
Please, take it easy o.
The fact that there are thieves and 419ers trying to get jobs, stealing materials and running away with Customer funds, does not mean we should be at the mercy of those who dont do so!

Finally and this is BTW: I have finished exactly a building of this same size as the original person who posed this question, early this year and it cost 600K (in and out), the Bricklayer did a marvellous job that l was so happy with, l gave him an extra 50K as promised, since he was insisting on 640K and l said l will add the 40K + 10K Beer money for his boys, if l am impressed by his work, on completion (though he needs to be properly 'supervised' because some of his boys do develop 'light fingers' for things not their own, left hanging around and he takes his time to do his job.... you cant hurry him one bit! he even has a 'roster' of clients queuing and waiting for him to come and do their job).
I have seen a lot of jobs and l can tell you his compares favourably.
He the Contractor was happy, Me, the Client was happy and we both agreed it was a FAIR PRICE.
If he insisted on #1,200,000 based on the kind of job he wanted to do (and which he did), l am sure some people here will tell me it is justified since he is competent and has quality work to show for it.
But it wont be fair to me, the Client, despite him the Contractor, smiling t o the bank.

This where FAIRNESS comes-in.

I am very sorry we have all been speaking from a very sentimental point of view. I have been speaking from a Contractor who hopes to be paid well's point of view, and may be (just maybe) you have been speaking from a client who hopes to get the best deal for his money's Point of view. Let me see if I can go neutral,which I'm not sure you might agree on.

We all know we are in the business of competition. Competition for price and quality. Apparently Nigeria has more competition in the price region than in the quality region, but nevertheless there is still competition in Both. I would be stupid to bill you N1.2m for plastering I know you can get for N600k and hope you will give to me. You will be stupid to give me N1.2m when you know you can pay 600k for Plastering. If i decide to be greedy let that be my cup of tea. My own is do your check and pay what you think your request is worth. Clients should also be fair too.

You see that 4 flat building, if Julius Berger were to plaster that for you, they will charge to maybe 2million. Not because they are greedy, but because they know they can get the Job done and they know getting the Job done comes with a cost of Attention to details that will take men power, Machinery, attention to details and Other exercises that its only fair the client pays for and not the contractor.

Now I agree Nigerian's always look for a way to reap you off, but that doesn't takeaway from the fact that you want a good job and should look for a way to strike a balance in Payment for what you want and what is given around. This N1.2m is equal to 3k dollars. i'm sure if Oyinbo man talk say make you give am 4k dollars to plaster that four flat, you will pay because na Oyinbo.

Anyway, we are all entitled to our opinion. and That is mine, based on my experience is this my very few years of existence in this life.

Properties › Re: General Topic Thread-To Discuss Anything And Everything in Building Construction by skimanski(m): 12:44pm On May 14, 2017

Marilo:
Skimanski, I don't think the question is about "chopping",it should be about fairness. If it's about chopping everybody and anybody can charge anything and that will be taken hook, line and sinker. How does the owner "chop" if it's about "chopping"?.

Again,why isn't there some sort of standard as to pricing. To tell you my experience,I have seen some kind of ridiculous quote that can only make me think/ask "does this guy think I am a fool?". Irrespective of professionalism involved, except there are some differences in materials to be bought, there should be some yardstick to standardise charges so that all parties are fair to one another.

Anyway I stick to my comment. @rabcnesbit should stick to the quality the guy can give than the figure. He should only be concerned about the quality.

Let me use one example. I'm sure you own a Car, and that car cost Money. Base on the way I take dey look you, maybe you car cost up to N10m. Lets even say you drive a Toyota car that was sold by toyota for N2m. do you know the cost of producing that toyota is probably as low 500k. But the reason why the cost of the Production and the cost of sale which is alarmingly different isn't a problem for you is that toyota has already produced the car, and it's serving its purpose to you. you have everything properly done. its working very fine. you would even rather the Toyota car of N2m than the Kia of N1.2m, even though they both have 4 legs and both will get you to your location. That aside,its not your business what it cost these guys to make the car, what is your concern is how it serves your purpose.

Bottom line, @Excuzeme shouldn't advise that guy to put cost first before requirement. requirement first, then he should know what he's requirement will cost because like Oga spyder880 can relate, you can get someone to do it for any figure you want, but is what you want that matters.

Properties › Re: Our Renovation Diary-lekki Scheme I (a New Dimension To Nigerian Architecture) by skimanski(op): 8:32am On May 14, 2017

INTERNAL DOORS: Installing doors Architrave

Properties › Re: Our Renovation Diary-lekki Scheme I (a New Dimension To Nigerian Architecture) by skimanski(op): 8:25am On May 14, 2017

Other Ongoing wooden Designs

Properties › Re: General Topic Thread-To Discuss Anything And Everything in Building Construction by skimanski(m): 8:22am On May 14, 2017

Excuzeme:
So, in total, he quoted 180 + 900 + 150 = #1,230,000 (One Million, Two hundred and thirty thousand Niara... to plaster a Standard Dour Flats!
The Lord is good, all the time.
Anyway, its all good.

But going forward, what you should have done is bargain on ALL PLASTERING WORK for the whole building first,
After the price is agreed, you then break the toatl cost down by allocating "cost" to each of the above areas (Decking, Inside, Outside), from the total cost.

That Bricklayer don hammer!

NB: Inside Plastering, to outside plastering is mostly, usually about ration 3:1.
That is, 65% - 75% Cost for Inside and 25% - 35% Cost for outside plastering.

Scaffold: You will but the Bamboo yourself (it cost roughly #150 - #200 each), You will buy Binding Wire of about 2-3 Bundles
Construction/Erection should be between 30K - 45k, depending on your negotiating power

Why is it so surprising that he paid N1.2m to plaster a four unit of 3 bedroom flat? Don't you think he should bother more about his Job been worth the figure than the figure been that high. Una no want make the guys Chop?