₦airaland Forum

Pray onto (Pray descending down from above.) Bless onto (Bless descending down from above). Sent down from the Creator as all invoked the pray and blessings with Allahumma (O Allah).

So when servants of God (angels,mankind) say Pray onto Muhammad , Pray onto Ibrahim, Bless onto Muhammad, Bless onto Ibrahim.
Allah sent down Pray and Bless to believers by 10xfold as reward in return.

Before the Jew - Roman war roughly in 66AD, we knew that Nasoreans Jew sect opposed the new doctrine invented by Paul that Jewish rites should be abolished and it is only enough to just have faith in heart and be saved.

Certainly these Nasoreans do not use Greek gospels that supported Paul. Now the question is, where is the texts used by Nasorean? Or famously termed as Logia of Jesus / Q doc (in Aramaic/Hebrew). Why was it lost after the Jew-Roman war 66AD? What was the purpose of Pauline influenced Romans destroying it?

chuose: There is nothing in common with the bible & the quoran.

Nothing in common between God & Allah.

As Allah IS NOT THE NAME OF GOD!
God cannot not Lie While Allah is the Greatest Deceiver


Titus 1:2
which God, that cannot lie

Qur'an 3:54
and Allah (is) the best (of) the cheaters/deceivers

So you can see God & Allah are NOT the same.

Read more here

http://www.letusreason.org/islam6.htm

Well if Allah is not Almighty God, then why prior to the arrival of Islam, the Ishmaelites and Jews in Arabia use the name Allah to refer to Almighty God?

Care to explain why would Jews refer to 'a deceiver' as their Almighty God? lol

https://frontpagemag.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/05/here.jpg.jpg

Rabbi Abraham Ibn Ezra the great Jewish sage identifies the well mentioned by Hagar in Genesis 16:14 with Zimum (or in other versions, Zimzum), "where the Arabs hold an annual festival. This is Zamzam near Mecca.

Genesis 16:14 "She called the well Be'er Lachai Roi It is between Kadesh and Bered."

This Well located approximately 20m east of the Kaaba (from todays measurement) was the source of life for both Ishmael and Hagar before.

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There is also ancient Samaritan Jews book (Asatir) in 3rd century having the tradition that Ishmael and his son built Mecca several years after the death of Abraham.

alexis: submitter

Do you know how to debate at all? Refute the claim the OP made without justifying idol worship in Islam. Can't you refute the claim without involving another religion. Let us say Christianity didn't exist, what then? Idolatry is permitted in Islam? You should learn to refute others claim independently. All you have done is confirm that muslims worship the Kabbah.

Going to Mecca is one of the 5 pillars of Islam. A tradition that was practiced before Mohammed was born and before Islam as a religion was formed. It is my understanding that Allah is almighty and can't be described. Yet, millions of muslims go to Mecca every year to have their hair shaved and kiss the Kabba that contained the idols of Arabia. Why do they do these things? Why are they worshiping a stone, what is inside the Kabbah?

Muslims claim to be monotheist yet they are kissing the Kabba and praying to it. Muslims are to pray to Allah only and no one else? Is Allah in the Kabbah?

Kaaba which consist of several structures; is a House (of prayer) built by Abraham (pbuh) and Ishmael (pbuh). So what does that mean? Its a blessed place for one to offer prayer.

Prior to bowing and prostrating in the the direction of Kaaba. They did so onto the direction of Al-Aqsa (House of Prayer in Jerusalem). So by your logic, Muslims worship Al-Aqsa previously and now worshipping Kaaba?

Why would Muslims worship objects that cant even shelter themselves from rain, lol.

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Your bolded queries will be answered below.

Behold! We gave the site, to Abraham, of the (Sacred) House, (saying): "Associate not anything (in worship) with Me; and sanctify My House for those who compass it round, or stand up, or bow, or prostrate themselves (therein in prayer)." And proclaim the Pilgrimage among men: they will come to thee on foot and (mounted) on every kind of camel, lean on account of journeys through deep and distant mountain highways; (The Noble Quran, 22:26-27)"


We see the turning of thy face (for guidance to the heavens: now Shall We turn thee to a Qibla that shall please thee. Turn then Thy face in the direction of the sacred Mosque: Wherever ye are, turn your faces in that direction. The people of the Book know well that that is the truth from their Lord. Nor is Allah unmindful of what they do.
(The Noble Quran, 2:144)

Photos

https://www.ahlanpk.org/352k6eh.jpg

https://file1.hpage.com/000738/78/bilder/securedownload_1.jpg

https://uwpics.urduwire.com/images_photos/photos/37589324_2012102511636.jpg

https://www.shafaqna.com/english/media/k2/galleries/2491/islamic-images-0175.jpg

Christian kissing walls, pillars ? so why do they kiss them?

https://cdn.c.photoshelter.com/img-get/I0000b81XTaPSZZY/s/750/600/090326JM1219-Via-Dolorosa-Jerusalem.jpg
https://www.custodia.org/img/news/3502.jpg
https://thecatholicspirit.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/09/pilgrimage.jpg


Why do Christians gather around a weird looking cube shape structure?

https://www.jimandnancyforest.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/04/Holy-Fire.jpg

The question that most of us ask now had also arose before during the time of Muhammad s.a.w; preaching the words of God onto Arabia. Was Muhammad mentioned? This was the question by inhabitants of Arabia towards Jews that embraced Islam. And if we refer to the claim by past Jewish converts, they had quote verses from Isaiah 42.

And if we look at the passages in Isaiah. God address His chosen servants with their names, and so in the prophesied verse we see God mention clearly the prophet's name. Some examples of God mentioning His servant by name.
(My Servant Isaiah, My Servant Eliakim, David My Servant, Jacob My Servant, ;My Servant Israel, and so in Isaiah 42:1 , God specifically mention My Servant Ahmad)

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The prophecy tells about Ahmad; 'Servant of God' whom will war to correct the wrongs and bringing judgement based on the law of God. He will liberate act of worshiping molten images and thus Arabia (wilderness desert, villages and cities) will glorify God since then. As can be seen today, inhabitants of Arabia are worshiping,praising God and singing words of God daily.

And we continue reading Isaiah 42:18 - 25; God remind the 'blind and deaf' about the wrath of God towards Children of Israel, who neglect the message brought by past Servant of God.

And not to repeat; the same mistake upon the coming of the new Servant of God,

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In Isaiah 42:1, it is deemed not a coincidence upon seeing the writing of both אתמך (Atmc) אחמד (Ahmd). And the word before אתמך (Atmc), is עבדי (Abedi~My Servant). For indeed, it is indicating Ahmad; Abedallah (Ahmad; Servant of God).

Not to mention אתמך (Atmc) is a special term foretelling the coming of a righteous man and is used only ONCE throughout the entire Book. [could this be a copying error or an intended error?]

Children of Israel have been foretold upon the coming of Ahmad but sadly, only a few accepts.

if we can get a hold of original Aramaic sentence preached by Jesus. and not the Greek text. We will get to read the prophecized name

Christians always say that the name of Father is YHWH and thus render it as Yahweh. But who tells them its Yahweh; even the Jews themselves have lost the pronunciation.

To make things worst, never can we found the pronunciation of YHWH , or Jesus using the so called name of God as YHWH in New Testament .

If we look at one of oldest Hebrew source, the verse in Dead Sea Scroll that is Isaiah 42:8

I YHWH and ‘my name’ and my glory..

it shows God’s name was no longer mentioned, YHWH means “I am what I am” “He who is” “The Eternal” based on several translation by Jews or Christian.

worship means praying in hoping it grants a reward or something in return. So how can a black stone grants anything?

The best example for all mankind to follow is none other than Prophet Muhammad s.a.w.
There has certainly been for you in the Messenger of Allah an excellent pattern for anyone whose hope is in Allah and the Last Day and [who] remembers Allah often. (Quran 33:21)

Logical reason why muslims kiss the stone? Here's one example why..
(1) Narrated 'Abis bin Rabia: 'Umar came near the black stone and kissed it and said "No doubt, I know thatyou are a stone and can neither benefit anyone nor harm anyone. Had I not seen Allah's Apostle kissing you I would not have kissed you." (Book #26, Hadith #667)

Do not put too much hope on Greek texts as word of God. Where is Logia of Jesus in Aramaic. Where is Matthew’s Aramaic gospel?

P46 (175CE) is Greek manuscript with the largest percentage of difference on record. This just proved that Church have been changing words since early 2nd century at will.

Here is the words of the early church father, Origen (3rd century CE):
“The differences among the manuscripts have become great, either through the negligence of some copyists or through the perverse audacity of others; they either neglect to check over what they have transcribed, or, in the process of checking, they make additions or deletions as they please.” Origen, early church father in “Commentary on Matthew.”

Regarding the oldest surviving fragment, Colin Roberts compared P52 writings using ONLY 5 samples from the early 2nd century CE back in 1935 and concluded based on those 5 samples; P52 was from the early 2nd century.

(Brent Nongbri’s 2005. The Use and Abuse of P52: Papyrological Pitfalls in the Dating of the Fourth Gospel)
What I have done is to show that any serious consideration of the window of possible dates for P52 must include dates in the later second and early third centuries. – Brent

Compare with 4th and 5th century codex-es. You will be surprise how Holy Spirit inside the scribes fail to prevent them from changing words of God.

@desika, you state

the good thing about this whoe thing is tht Muhammad clearly says that all he heard was from an 'angel' and not from God directly. hmmm.

If you read in Isaiah 42, God mention 'I will put my Spirit on him'. As Christians claim Holy Spirit is God Himself due to it being spirit of God.

In Quran God's spirit does not mean 'God's soul Himself' but rather a creation of God sent to the selected ones.

So she took a veil (to screen herself) from them; then We sent to her Our spirit, and there appeared to her a well-made man. (Quran 19:17)

Say: The Holy spirit has revealed it from your Lord with the truth, that it may establish those who believe and as a guidance and good news for those who submit. (Quran 16:102)

The prophecy said Servant of God will war in bringing judgement, to correct the wrongs. He will also liberate Arabia from worshiping molten images. Wilderness (desert), villages and cities will glorify God. This is what happen today. Whole of Arabia worshiping God daily.

And we continue reading verses 18-25; Children of Israel will still be deaf and blind as they neglect the message brought by the 'Servant of God'.
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This cannot be a coincidence. If we look at the writing of אתמך (Atmc) אחמד (Ahmad). Not to mentioned אתמך (Atmc) is used only once. Scribes copying error or indeed an intended error? And the word before אתמך (Atmc), is עבדי (Abedi~My Servant). It is indeed indicating Ahmad Abedallah (Ahmad 'Servant of God').

Children of Israel had been foretold by the coming of Ahmad.

17- They shall be turned back, they shall be greatly ashamed, that trust in graven images, that they say to the molten images, Ye are our gods.

Next read the verse 17, it mentioned clearly about inhabitants in Arabaia worshiping molten images. And indeed, Ahmad, Servant of God liberated this belief from whole Arabia.

Did people as mentioned in verse 11 & 12 worship and Glorify God. Yes the whole Arabia are doing this till today.

11- Let the wilderness and the cities thereof lift up their voice, the villages that Kedar doth inhabit: let the inhabitants of Sela sing, let them shout from the top of the mountains.

12- Let them give glory unto the Lord, and declare his praise in the islands.

Did people of Arabia abandon the belief of paganism as mentioned in verses 17. Yes indeed, the prophecised 'Servant of God' had bring judgement , to correct the wrongs.

Praise Almighty Allah as priests and bible scholars around the world are embracing Islam. They are aiding in helping to spread the message on real purpose of life. To worship Almighty God prior to the coming Judgement Day.

This is not deceiving one selves at all. It is proved by reading ongoing verses in chapter 42 foretelling about this man, servant of God.

have the events mention in passage 42 happened?

verse 11 & 12 mention specifically about arabia (desert), place inhabit by Kedar, inhabitants in areas of Sela. As of today indeed you can see, the inhabitants of arabia glorify and praise God.

You see inhabitants in these lands reciting Allahu Akbar (God is Greatest) , Alhamdulillah (Praise Almighty God) hundreds of times daily.

Prophecy Servant of God
` ` ` ` ` ` ` `
word Atmak not necessarily means ‘whom I uphold’ but is infact a name

the writing of Atmak is אתמך
the writing of Ahmad is אחמד

Isaiah 42:1
God says
“Behold, 'My Servant' (pronounced as Abd-ee), ‘whom I uphold’ (pronounced as Atmak);

God mentioning about the coming of His servant
Behold My Servant Ahmad (Isaiah 42:1) - so who is this Ahmad as in God'servant?

He is none other than
Abd-Allah Ahmad (Servant of God, Ahmad) - Prophet Muhammad s.a.w