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Yap!! Very interesting DNA results, esp that of Ramesses III being E1b1a.

It is remarkable that all the published aDNA (ancient DNA) done on ancient Egyptian mummies that I know of all indicate genetic profiles that are 'southern'. They are however still small though (just 4) and the field relatively young; really very interesting results are in the offing henceforth.

Oh! by the way @OP, it was important that you emphasized that these results do not necessarily mean that West AFricans were descendants of Ancient Egyptians, but just that there are some general and ancient relationship.

The Ancient Egyptians were in the main most probably a mix of Nilosaharans and Afrosans 'Black' Africans who migrated from a drying Sahara, wh absorbed some smaller groups of New Easterners over time. Their culture is however COMPLETELY African ('southern' African).

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Nice thread.
It has already been established that the original Egyptians were black prior to mixing.
And yes it's true that there was west african connection to Egypt.

but my issue is why aren't west africans trying to promote their history?
people always wonder why western blacks are fixated on egypt. the answer is not only
because whites only talk about egypt in school books, but that w. africans don't seem
to big up their local history much less talk to western blacks about it.

i wonder..why??

*Kails*:
Nice thread.
It has already been established that the original Egyptians were black prior to mixing.
And yes it's true that there was west african connection to Egypt.

but my issue is why aren't west africans trying to promote their history?
people always wonder why western blacks are fixated on egypt. the answer is not only
because whites only talk about egypt in school books, but that w. africans don't seem
to big up their local history much less talk to western blacks about it.

i wonder..why??

Glad you like it.

But Africans DO promote their history. Its AA's who don't.

i would love to live to see the day where there is a textbook about prehistoric african history pre-islam/christianity/slave trade.

that would be awesome.

_

so when are you going to write it?
lolz.

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KingMichael777: But Africans DO promote their history. Its AA's who don't.

I agree with that There is a guy named goop who posts here and I've learned a lot from him. His insight on Afro-Texan culture is intriguing... Its a lot of history there no one talks about, heck my dad was born in Texas but his family is spread all over louisiana. AAs should promote their/our history more!

btw, cool thread Mike

I also don't think West Africans are direct descendants of the Ancient Egyptians. But I think West Africans are descendants of an ancestral Saharan civilization living in the Sahara before the desertification. If you study the issue you see there's a cultural unity across the Saharan-Sahel-Nile belt for the period of the Green Sahara. During the dessication of the Sahara, population probably migrated in many directions including West Africa and the Nile in search of greener pastures.

Here's an interesting video about the black mummy found in the Sahara.

Mystery of the Black Mummy:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4mON0HWla5o

This gets even more interesting when you explore if there's any linkage between those black African populations in the Sahara and Ancient Egyptians.

The video brings up interesting aspects related to this.

Similarity between the Ancient Saharan culture and Ancient Egypt (according to video ):

1 - Deliberate mummification: The mummification of the black mummy in the Sahara predates the earliest example in the Nile Valley.

2 - Similar cattle ritual sacrifice

3 - Presence in cave art of animal headed figures (predating the Nile valley).

4 - Relatively small geographic distance between the Saharan civilization and Ancient Egypt.

5 - Excavation shows an abrupt influx of highly decorated Saharan pottery 6000 years ago in the Nile valley. This pottery had a definitive Saharan style and was not previously found in the Nile Valley.

^^^^

I concur that there were obvious movements in several directions as the the sahara expanded, pushing populations west, south and East before a complete barrier from the Nothern most points of Africa. After this period would most likely be when ancient African populations around the sahel region would have encountered back migrant populations from West Asia across the sahara. This would be the case in Ancient egypt which obviously absorbed populations around the nile river

Any additional info on population movements as desertificaiton occured would be greatly appreciated.

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morpheus24: ^^^^

I concur that there were obvious movements in several directions as the the sahara expanded, pushing populations west, south and East before a complete barrier from the Nothern most points of Africa. After this period would most likely be when ancient African populations around the sahel region would have encountered back migrant populations from West Asia across the sahara. This would be the case in Ancient egypt which obviously absorbed populations around the nile river

Any additional info on population movements as desertificaiton occured would be greatly appreciated.

I could find some quotes from books and studies but I think population movements during the desertification of the Sahara is pretty mainstream archeology. What is less mainstream is connecting it with the Ancient Egyptians for example.

nie

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nnw

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noine

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Ancient humans 'followed rains'
By Helen Briggs
Science reporter, BBC News

Prehistoric humans roamed the world's largest desert for some 5,000 years, archaeologists have revealed.

The Eastern Sahara of Egypt, Sudan, Libya and Chad was home to nomadic people who followed rains that turned the desert into grassland.

When the landscape dried up about 7,000 years ago, there was a mass exodus to the Nile and other parts of Africa.

The close link between human settlement and climate has lessons for today, researchers report in Science.

"Even modern day conflicts such as Dafur are caused by environmental degradation as it has been in the past," Dr Stefan Kropelin of the University of Cologne, Germany, told the BBC News website.

"The basic struggle for food, water and pasture is still a big problem in the Sahara zone. This process started thousands of years ago and has a long tradition."

Jigsaw puzzle

The Eastern Sahara, which covers more than 2 million sq km, an area the size of Western Europe, is now almost uninhabited by people or animals, providing a unique window into the past.

Dr Kropelin and colleague Dr Rudolph Kuper pieced together the 10,000-year jigsaw of human migration and settlement; studying more than 100 archaeological sites over the course of 30 years.

In the largest study of its kind, they built up a detailed picture of human evolution in the world's largest desert. They found that far from the inhospitable climate of today, the area was once semi-humid.

Between about 14,000 and 13,000 years ago, the area was very dry. But a drastic switch in environmental conditions some 10,500 years ago brought rain and monsoon-like conditions.

Nomadic human settlers moved in from the south, taking up residence beside rivers and lakes. They were hunter-gatherers at first, living off plants and wild game.

Eventually they became more settled, domesticating cattle for the first time, and making intricate pottery.

Neolithic farmers

Humid conditions prevailed until about 6,000 years ago, when the Sahara abruptly dried out. There was then a gradual exodus of people to the Nile Valley and other parts of the African continent.


“ The domestication of cattle was invented in the Sahara in the humid phase and was then slowly pushed over the rest of Africa ”
Dr Stefan Kropelin of the University of Cologne

"The Nile Valley was almost devoid of settlement until about exactly the time that the Egyptian Sahara was so dry people could not live there anymore," Dr Kropelin told the BBC News website.

"People preferred to live on savannah land. Only when this wasn't possible they migrated towards southern Sudan and the Nile.

"They brought all their know-how to the rest of the continent - the domestication of cattle was invented in the Sahara in the humid phase and was then slowly pushed over the rest of Africa.

"This Neolithic way of life, which still is a way of life in a sense; preservation of food for the dry season and many other such cultural elements, was introduced to central and southern Africa from the Sahara."

'Motor of evolution'

Dr Kuper said the distribution of people and languages, which is so politically important today, has its roots in the desiccation of the Sahara.

The switch in environmental conditions acted as a "motor of Africa's evolution," he said.

"It happened during these 5,000 years of the savannah that people changed from hunter-gathers to cattle keepers," he said.

"This important step in human history has been made for the first time in the African Sahara."

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/science/nature/5192410.stm