pansophist:


If you read my post well, you would have saw where I wrote: ''The only lost here is the money the thief stole''.

Of course the thief went away with 1000 worth of goods, and thats the only lost incurred in this transaction. Refund of money borrowed is not loss, so definitely he lost nothing refunding John his money. The 200 the shopkeeper has left is the payment of the shoe the thief stole.

so you are saying that repaying money to someone out of your own pocket, due to the action of a thief, is NOT a loss by the shopkeeper?!?!?!?!?!
ahahahahahahahah. wasnt the money borrowed in exchange for FAKE money? how can that NOT be a loss?

pansophist:


The 1000 the shopkeeper gave to John is the only lost here (a replacement of the counterfeit), if he borrowed it from bank, he will have to refund the bank 1000.

Pause.
Our store keeper lost N800+ 200 worth if shoe right? That is agreed and balanced.

When John brought back the counterfeit money for a refund, where is the store owner going to take the money for the refund? Is it not from his own pocket? Remember that he destroyed the counterfeit oooo

MRBrownJ:


so you are saying that repaying money to someone out of your own pocket, due to the action of a thief, is NOT a loss by the shopkeeper?!?!?!?!?!
ahahahahahahahah. wasnt the money borrowed in exchange for FAKE money? how can that NOT be a loss?

You are getting it wrong. Refund of money borrowed is not loss. Repaying money due to the action of a thief is loss. Two different things here.

A question for you. If I borrow N1000 from you and I repaid in two weeks time, Did I lost N1000 the to you?

pansophist:


You are getting it wrong. Refund of money borrowed is not loss. Repaying money due to the action of a thief is loss. Two different things here.

A question for you. If I borrow N1000 from you and I repaid in two weeks time, Did I lost N1000 the to you?

If a thief stole that money from you and I insist that you have to pay me. Don't you lose N1000?

Mynd44:


When John brought back the counterfeit money for a refund, where is the store owner going to take the money for the refund? Is it not from his own pocket? Remember that he destroyed the counterfeit oooo

Where the shopkeeper will get N1000 to refund John has no significance here. If he borrowed it or took it from a private savings, the focal point is that he has to refund John for the counterfeit currency. If John never came for a replacement of this currency, then there is no lost from the shopkeeper's part but John (since he gave out genuine money for couterfeit).

Mynd44:

If a thief stole that money from you and I insist that you have to pay me. Don't you lose N1000?

I dont understand this question. Which money are you talking about?

pansophist:


You are getting it wrong. Refund of money borrowed is not loss. Repaying money due to the action of a thief is loss. Two different things here.

A question for you. If I borrow N1000 from you and I repaid in two weeks time, Did I lost N1000 the to you?

if the money borrowed is fake then YES its a loss. the fake money has NO VALUE therefore, if you take the borrowed money to settle a customer who paid with fake money, it IS a loss (because you will be left with a fake note that you paid 1000 but that has no value).

pansophist:


A question for you. If I borrow N1000 from you and I repaid in two weeks time, Did I lost N1000 the to you?

You asked this question right?
What if within that two weeks, that money is stolen and I insist that you refund the stolen money, do you lose or not?

MRBrownJ:



if the money borrowed is fake then YES its a loss. the fake money has NO VALUE therefore, if you take the borrowed money to settle a customer who paid with fake money, it IS a loss (because you will be left with a fake note that you paid 1000 but that has no value).

I agree. Does your reply in anyway conflict with my previous post?

By the way, no where in the question I saw that a fake currency was borrowed. wondering if your answer solves anything here.

Mynd44:

You asked this question right?
What if within that two weeks, that money is stolen and I insist that you refund the stolen money, do you lose or not?

You didnt answer the question to my previous question, so its hard to get your point exactly but I will attempt it.

I assume that the money that was stolen was the money I borrowed from you right? then of course I am at lost if I pay you back.

Phew

pansophist:


You didnt answer the question to my previous question, so its hard to get your point exactly but I will attempt it.

I assume that the money that was stolen was the money I borrowed from you right? then of course I am at lost if I pay you back.

Okay now imagine this. You lose if you pay back right? Agreed.

If you pay me back with a counterfeit note and I return that note to you. You have to give me another money and destroy the counterfeit note right? How much did you lose there? Is it not 2,000?

Compare this scenario with the store keeper and John

Mynd44:

Okay now imagine this. You lose if you pay back right? Agreed.

If you pay me back with a counterfeit note and I return that note to you. You have to give me another money and destroy the counterfeit note right? How much did you lose there? Is it not 2,000?

Compare this scenario with the store keeper and John

If I pay you back with a counterfeit note, and you realized and returned it back to me, then that case is totally closed and there is no lost or gain here.

If I repay you the 1000 I owe you, then of course I paid you 1000 not 2000. Lol

pansophist:


I agree. Does your reply in anyway conflict with my previous post?

By the way, no where in the question I saw that a fake currency was borrowed. wondering if your answer solves anything here.

damn!!!!! was that not the fake money that was used to get money from John? so the shopkeeper lost TWICE. 1st to the thief and 2nd to john whom he had to repay out of fake money he got from thief.

pansophist:

If I pay you back with a counterfeit note, and you realized and returned it back to me, then that case is totally closed and there is no lost or gain here.

that would be right if the money was returned to the THIEF!!!! but since the thief took away 1000 worth of good, thats a LOSS.

If I repay you the 1000 I owe you, then of course I paid you 1000 not 2000. Lol

PLUS what the thief took away thats 2000

pansophist:


If I pay you back with a counterfeit note, and you realized and returned it back to me, then that case is totally closed and there is no lost or gain here.

If I repay you the 1000 I owe you, then of course I paid you 1000 not 2000. Lol

The thief stole 1,000
I insisted on collecting my money back
You give me a counterfeit note which I returned immediately and you destroyed the counterfeit
Then you gave me a new 1,000 from your pocket as I still insisted on collecting my money.

So imagine you have 10,000 and borrowed 1,000 from me. Making 11,000 right?

A thief stole the 1,000 which means you are left with 10,000

Then from the 10,000, you give me 1,000 which we discovered to be counterfeit and so it is destroyed. Now you have 9,000

Then you still have to refund the 1,000 I loaned you which you did how much do you have left? 8,000 right? Which means you lost 2,000

MRBrownJ:
lol now i see where you guys get it wrong.



are you saying that the money AND shoes the THIEF took is not a loss?!?!?!?!?!?!

the thief went away with ₦1000 worth of goods which is shopkeeper's loss, isnt it? or are you claiming that what the thief took is not a loss?... then on top of that the Shopkeeper had to repay JOHN the borrowed ₦1000, so thats a ₦2000 loss. now deduct the ₦200 left from the initial ₦1000 he got from john, thats ₦1800. simple mathematics!!!

Simple mathematics you called it, yet you still don't get it. Stop double counting, the loss is N1000. The N800 change from the lady was from John's neighbour and the N200 change with John represents the shoe the lady took away. C'est fini.

Cc Imanuelle

MRBrownJ:


damn!!!!! was that not the fake money that was used to get money from John? so the shopkeeper lost TWICE. 1st to the thief and 2nd to john whom he had to repay out of fake money he got from thief.

How could John have lost twice, when the N800 change he paid the lady was from his neighbour and he has N200 change in his pocket?

opeyemmmy:


Simple mathematics you called it, yet you still don't get it. Stop double counting, the loss is N1000. The N800 change from the lady was from John's neighbour and the N200 change with John represents the shoe the lady took away. C'est fini.

Cc Imanuelle

Hey bro, this was once tricky and gets some persons messed up in the head, but the answer is quite easy.

The fake note is the only loss. John exchanged a 1000 naira value of both cash and shoe for a fake note of 1k.

For those that say the loss is above 1k, what if the 1k note was not a fake note? That will take out 1k from the loss, then what else will cancel out the other loss?

This is quite warped to explain, but easy to understand.

Imanuelle:



Hey bro, this was once tricky and gets some persons messed up in the head, but the answer is quite easy.

The fake note is the only loss. John exchanged a 1000 naira value of both cash and shoe for a fake note of 1k.

For those that say the loss is above 1k, what if the 1k note was not a fake note? That will take out 1k from the loss, then what else will cancel out the other loss?

This is quite warped to explain, but easy to understand.

Simple. I know I can always count on you... gracias.

opeyemmmy:


Simple. I know I can always count on you... gracias.

Opportunities abound

Mynd44:

Pause.
Our store keeper lost N800+ 200 worth if shoe right? That is agreed and balanced.

When John brought back the counterfeit money for a refund, where is the store owner going to take the money for the refund? Is it not from his own pocket? Remember that he destroyed the counterfeit oooo

there was no loss until the money was discovered to be fake note, the business was normal.

Summary of the transaction is that: John did not lose anything neither did he gain anything, he simply got a refund of his money...The woman went away with N200 worth of items + N800 and gave mr shopkeeper a fake N1000. Mr shopkeeper had to burn the note...The shopkeeper lost N1000.

If you really want to understand the scenario, just get 3 characters and act it out, use real cash if you wish. That should clear all arguments.

lets invite some people to try this out