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How Is Jesus A Descendant Of David? by McSterling(m): 2:21pm On Jul 20, 2015 |
According to the gospels, Jesus was born of a virgin betrothed to a man named Joseph. Joseph played no role whatsoever in Jesus' conception. In other words, Jesus and Joseph had no relationship by consanguinity. But the genealogies in Matthew and Luke trace Jesus to David through Joseph. The Messiah was to be a descendant of King David according to the prophets. Since Jesus and Joseph weren't related by blood, isn't it erratic to trace him to David through Joseph? And since Jesus had only a human mother, the only way he would have been related to David would have been through Mary. Even Luke notes in Chapter 3 verse 23 that Jesus was only "supposed" to be Joseph's son. It makes one wonder why he yet went ahead to trace him to David through Joseph. It seems rather like a frantic effort by the authors of the gospels to make Jesus the Messiah against all odds. What do you think? 5 Likes 3 Shares |
Re: How Is Jesus A Descendant Of David? by otipoju(m): 2:42pm On Jul 20, 2015 |
McSterling: If I remember well, His genealogy could also be traced to David through Mary as well...I dont have the facts now but you can do a little research and lets see what you find. 2 Likes 1 Share |
Re: How Is Jesus A Descendant Of David? by McSterling(m): 2:51pm On Jul 20, 2015 |
otipoju:Would love to see that. As much as I remember, only two genealogies of Jesus are recorded in two gospels respectively: Matthew and Luke. And they both trace him through Joseph. |
Re: How Is Jesus A Descendant Of David? by Nobody: 3:27pm On Jul 20, 2015 |
Carrying other peoples' problem on your head. How many of these foreigners care about your history? Was Oduduwa really a descendant of Olodumare? You don't care so why should they? Stupi.d slaves. 8 Likes 4 Shares |
Re: How Is Jesus A Descendant Of David? by McSterling(m): 3:29pm On Jul 20, 2015 |
It appears even the Church Fathers couldn't reach a consensus on this. For example, Augustine thought Jesus could claim descent from David through Joseph because Joseph was his legal adoptive father. Tertulian differed by thinking Jesus was descended from David through Mary. Tertulian's position makes more sense but doesn't seem to have scriptural backing. |
Re: How Is Jesus A Descendant Of David? by McSterling(m): 3:39pm On Jul 20, 2015 |
ROSSIKE:The difference between Jesus and Oduduwa as you likely already know,is that many people the world over, in this time and age still believe the incredible/supernatural claims attached to him (Jesus) whereas Oduduwa is mostly regarded as a myth. So, don't get worked up about me discussing Jesus. You can open a thread about Oduduwa if you want to. 1 Like |
Re: How Is Jesus A Descendant Of David? by buccunmie(m): 3:42pm On Jul 20, 2015 |
ROSSIKE:one bottle of origin for u 6 Likes |
Re: How Is Jesus A Descendant Of David? by Nobody: 7:24pm On Jul 20, 2015 |
McSterling: So, what is your own position? |
Re: How Is Jesus A Descendant Of David? by Nobody: 7:38pm On Jul 20, 2015 |
ROSSIKE: very stupi.d irredeemable slaves indeed. 3 Likes |
Re: How Is Jesus A Descendant Of David? by Aizenosa(m): 7:42pm On Jul 20, 2015 |
otipoju: Matthew 1:1-17 has all the answers u need |
Re: How Is Jesus A Descendant Of David? by johnydon22(m): 8:58pm On Jul 20, 2015 |
MrPresident:Not stupid and irredeemable, many of us were once like that, you have to try and understand the effect of belief on people 2 Likes |
Re: How Is Jesus A Descendant Of David? by DrLazDevitan: 9:50pm On Jul 20, 2015 |
Africans love coming behind for all we care.What we shall diasagree shall be accepted many years from now.By then,our white brothers shall have prepare another dough for us to swallow through our tight gullet.That we keep us muzzling everywhere until we accept it for an good years.... And so it goes! |
Re: How Is Jesus A Descendant Of David? by PraiseDLord: 10:03pm On Jul 20, 2015 |
McSterling: Beloved, kindly read below extract from Matthew Henry's commentary with an open heart: "(New Matthew Henry Commentary, The) His genealogy (Lk. 3 vv. 23 – 38). Matthew gave us something of this but went no further back than Abraham; Luke takes it as far back as Adam. Matthew intended to show that Christ was the son of Abraham, in whom all the families of the earth are blessed (Ge 12:3), and that he was heir to the throne of David, and so he began with Abraham and brought the genealogy down to Jacob, who was the father of Joseph, who was therefore a male heir of the house of David. Luke, however, wanting to show that Christ was the seed of the woman, who would break the serpent’s head (Ge 3:15), traces his genealogy as far back as Adam, and begins it with Eli, or Heli, who was the father not of Joseph but of the Virgin Mary. Matthew draws the genealogy from Solomon, but since Solomon’s natural line ended in Jechonias (Jeconiah or Jehoiachin), the legal right was transferred to Salathiel (Shealtiel), who was of the house of Nathan, another son of David, and Luke here follows that line, thus leaving out all the kings of Judah. It is good for us that our salvation does not depend on our being able to solve all these difficulties. It is further worthy of observation that when those records of the Jewish genealogies had continued for thirty or forty years after these extracts from them, they were all lost and destroyed with the Jewish state and nation, because now there was no longer any need for them. The genealogy concludes with this: who was the son of Adam, the son of God. He was both the Son of Adam and the Son of God, so that he could be a proper Mediator between God and the sons of Adam and make the sons of Adam, through him, the sons of God." 1 Like 1 Share |
Re: How Is Jesus A Descendant Of David? by PraiseDLord: 10:04pm On Jul 20, 2015 |
McSterling: Beloved, kindly read below extract from Matthew Henry's commentary with an open heart: "(New Matthew Henry Commentary, The) His genealogy (Lk. 3 vv. 23 – 38). Matthew gave us something of this but went no further back than Abraham; Luke takes it as far back as Adam. Matthew intended to show that Christ was the son of Abraham, in whom all the families of the earth are blessed (Ge 12:3), and that he was heir to the throne of David, and so he began with Abraham and brought the genealogy down to Jacob, who was the father of Joseph, who was therefore a male heir of the house of David. Luke, however, wanting to show that Christ was the seed of the woman, who would break the serpent’s head (Ge 3:15), traces his genealogy as far back as Adam, and begins it with Eli, or Heli, who was the father not of Joseph but of the Virgin Mary. Matthew draws the genealogy from Solomon, but since Solomon’s natural line ended in Jechonias (Jeconiah or Jehoiachin), the legal right was transferred to Salathiel (Shealtiel), who was of the house of Nathan, another son of David, and Luke here follows that line, thus leaving out all the kings of Judah. It is good for us that our salvation does not depend on our being able to solve all these difficulties. It is further worthy of observation that when those records of the Jewish genealogies had continued for thirty or forty years after these extracts from them, they were all lost and destroyed with the Jewish state and nation, because now there was no longer any need for them. The genealogy concludes with this: who was the son of Adam, the son of God. He was both the Son of Adam and the Son of God, so that he could be a proper Mediator between God and the sons of Adam and make the sons of Adam, through him, the sons of God." 2 Likes 1 Share |
Re: How Is Jesus A Descendant Of David? by McSterling(m): 7:05am On Jul 21, 2015 |
theAtheist101:I really have no vested interest in the matter. I do not believe in Jesus. I think, like I noted in the op, that it seems the authors of the gospels made frantic efforts to show that Jesus was the Messiah against all odds. Part of their frantic efforts include ascribing to Jesus many old testament prophecies that were clearly not about the Jewish Messiah. 3 Likes 1 Share |
Re: How Is Jesus A Descendant Of David? by McSterling(m): 7:09am On Jul 21, 2015 |
Aizenosa:It doesn't. It only traces Jesus to David through Joseph. |
Re: How Is Jesus A Descendant Of David? by McSterling(m): 7:12am On Jul 21, 2015 |
johnydon22:Really I'm sick and tired of people referring to me online as a "religious slave". Do I sound like one? Maybe I just don't come across as atheist enough. 2 Likes 1 Share |
Re: How Is Jesus A Descendant Of David? by McSterling(m): 7:20am On Jul 21, 2015 |
PraiseDLord:Where does it say that Heli was Mary's father? Is this simply an assumption? My English translation says nothing like that. And the reference to "son of God" was made to Adam not Jesus. Jesus was at the initial rung of the ladder and Adam at the final rung. |
Re: How Is Jesus A Descendant Of David? by johnydon22(m): 8:42am On Jul 21, 2015 |
McSterling:Am sure you know i never referred you so, the Op was enough for anybody to see you are not a christian. Anyway i am not sure it is important if people refer you to be religious or not, it doesn't change who you are |
Re: How Is Jesus A Descendant Of David? by Nobody: 11:40am On Jul 21, 2015 |
good question bro. |
Re: How Is Jesus A Descendant Of David? by jcross19: 5:31pm On Jul 21, 2015 |
Jesus christ have no earthly biological father but was legally adopted to joseph lineage and historians of that gospels try make jesus the heir to the throne of david which they believe to be the greatest throne ever in the history of israel. |
Re: How Is Jesus A Descendant Of David? by Nobody: 5:37pm On Jul 21, 2015 |
By natural birth through the seed of Joseph. There was no Virgin birth , simply a myth. |
Re: How Is Jesus A Descendant Of David? by malvisguy212: 9:53pm On Jul 21, 2015 |
frosbel:the virgin birth is not a myth, God plans of salvation begins long before christ was born, go and do more study on the Passover, the Passover revealed Jesus christ. The Passover lamb was to be a "male without DEFECTS," which is the same description given to Jesus, which indicate the virgin birth, christ was born without defects: Exodus 12:5 The animals you choose must be year-old males without DEFECT, and you may take them from the sheep or the goats. I hope you know what this mean ?which prophet is without defect? On many occasion, bible say Jesus is sinless. If you called this a coincidence, then what about this ? This is How they are to ate the Passover lamb: Exodus 12:46 "It must be eaten inside one house; take none of the meat outside the house. DO NOT BREAK ANY OF THE BONES. And this is the proved Jesus is the Passover lamb : John 19:32, 33, 36 The soldiers therefore came, and broke the legs of the first man, and of the other man who was crucified with Him; but coming to Jesus, when they saw that He was already dead, they did NOT BREAK HIS LEGS ;... For these things came to pass, that the Scripture might be fulfilled, "NOT A BONE of Him shall be broken." Bottomline!! Jesus is the Passover lamb who is without DEFECT , I advice you to do more study on the Passover. @op By the virtue of the marriage, Joseph become the legal father of Jesus and not the biological father,matthew trace his lagal line, matthew begins with Abraham: read it here http://biblia.com/bible/nasb95/Matt%201.1-17 And luke trace his biological line and it was in luke Jesus is called the son of God http://biblia.com/bible/nasb95/Luke%203.23-38 Note: women are not added in geanology only men. Jesus being the legal father of Joseph mean he bypass the curse of Jeconiah in Jeremiah 22:24-30, read it here: http://biblia.com/bible/nasb95/Jer%2022.24-30 On the other hand, Luke, writing for Gentile readers, carries his ancestral list back to Adam, the progenitor of both Jews and Gentiles, in order to prove Christ to be the Saviour of both. Matthew gives the direct descent, from Abraham to Jesus, whereas Luke presents it in reverse order, from Jesus back to Adam. Matthew, writing primarily an apologetic to Jews proving Jesus to be the Messiah, wanted to show Jesus’ legal right to the throne of David.Therefore his genealogy begins with Abraham and goes through David and his son Solomon to Jesus’ legal father, Joseph. On the other hand, Luke is writing primarily to Gentiles and the world and, therefore, wants to show Jesus’ physical lineage as the perfect man. So he traces Mary’s line back to Adam through Heli, Mary’s father- the father-in-law of Joseph--and on through David’s son Nathan. Peace!! 2 Likes 1 Share |
Re: How Is Jesus A Descendant Of David? by malvisguy212: 9:58pm On Jul 21, 2015 |
McSterling: malvisguy212: McSterling: |
Re: How Is Jesus A Descendant Of David? by sonmvayina(m): 10:33pm On Jul 21, 2015 |
Any body who is attempting to answer this question is ignorant..pope Benedict xvi was asked this same question, he could not answer.. 1 Like |
Re: How Is Jesus A Descendant Of David? by McSterling(m): 8:38am On Jul 22, 2015 |
frosbel:Seems more like it. Take away the virgin birth and he could well be a descendant of David. |
Re: How Is Jesus A Descendant Of David? by McSterling(m): 8:40am On Jul 22, 2015 |
sonmvayina:Interesting |
Re: How Is Jesus A Descendant Of David? by johnydon22(m): 8:42am On Jul 22, 2015 |
McSterling:The fables said he was born of a virgin, nobody has the right to take away the virgin birth. . . if you do it's better you disbelieve the whole story frosbel |
Re: How Is Jesus A Descendant Of David? by Scholar8200(m): 8:50am On Jul 22, 2015 |
Op, consider this: Luke 1:26,27 26 Now in the sixth month [after that], the angel Gabriel was sent from God to a town of Galilee named Nazareth, 27 To a girl never having been married and a [v]virgin engaged to be married to a man whose name was Joseph, a descendant of the house of David; and the virgin’s name was Mary. Here Mary's father's house in the tribe of Judah was clearly mentioned. Heli, her father a descendant of Nathan-David's son, was mentioned in Luke's gospel. Now if you study the genealogy in Matthew and Luke, the father of Joseph is different. Indeed, Joseph descended from Solomon(Matthew 1:6,7) while Mary from Nathan (Luke 3:31); Nathan and Solomon were two of David's sons (1 Chronicles 3:5). Hence the mention of Joseph in Mary's genealogy was a normal practice by recorders and scribes in genealogies. For example, you will agree with me that in Matthew's genealogy, only foreign women who naturalized to become Israelites were mentioned. 2 Likes 1 Share |
Re: How Is Jesus A Descendant Of David? by malvisguy212: 9:00am On Jul 22, 2015 |
McSterling:did you read my post ? Joseph is the legal father of Jesus and not the biological father, by legal right he inherited the throne of David. matthew trace his legal right just to proved he is succeeded the throne of David. Luke written was for both the gentile nation and the isrealite, read the geanology in luke , he added some gentile name just to proved Jesus is saviour of both Jew and the world. I notice, you guys on nairaland are soo bias in your searching, satan is manipulating you guys, the bible is sooo clear.read with open mind. I expect you to quoted my first post. 1 Like |
Re: How Is Jesus A Descendant Of David? by Nobody: 9:03am On Jul 22, 2015 |
McSterling: indeed so. |
Re: How Is Jesus A Descendant Of David? by McSterling(m): 9:12am On Jul 22, 2015 |
malvisguy212:Haba! No vex. I think I mentioned something about the "legal" thing in one of my earlier posts. It was the view Augustine held and Tertulian disagreed with. But didn't the scriptures talk about the Messiah being an actual descendant of David and not one by legal right? Isn't biblical prophecy supposed to be precise enough? Because as far as I'm concerned, if Jesus is assumed to be a descendant of David just because his adoptive father was, then he really isn't a descendant of David. And about Heli being Mary's father, where does Luke say that? 1 Like 1 Share |
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