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Is Christian Salvation True Or False / Which Is Your Favorite Part Of Worship Service? / Why Is Christian Dating So Difficult? (2) (3) (4)
. by Nobody: 7:57am On Jul 10, 2009 |
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Re: . by kshow1(m): 8:27am On Jul 10, 2009 |
Stoneval: Please go to the nearest church around you. |
Re: . by Nobody: 8:29am On Jul 10, 2009 |
A true christian should be proud of his/her religion and tell me. |
Re: . by olabowale(m): 12:46pm On Jul 11, 2009 |
@Stoneval: Muslim's daily mode of worship is primarily what you in general sense, snce you are not a muslim, just said above in your first post. The muslims call this salah. It is nothing that they made up themselves. It is commanded upon them, right there in the Quran; word of Allah. Muhammad (AS) the prophet that singly spearhead the last batch of the system to completion was commanded to make the same daily salah. Salah consists of the intention: this is when you consciously says to yourself that your are going to prepare yourself so that you can make the next salah/ There are 5 salah in a day. Subh just immediately after dawn, Dhur just immediately after the Sun is past above the midday, Asr, just immediately the shadow is about twice the length of the subject casting it (in Nigeria it starts at 3.30pm; I think. I dont live in Nigeria, so not really sure any longer), Magrib is immediately after the sunsets and Isha is about 90 minutes after. Each salah will begin with the purification of the body and clothing. One have to be clean, in a way that their is no more impurity visible. The heart is completely prepared and the mind is focused this singular obligation, purposed by commandment as the daily physical frequent reminder (Dhikr) of your Lord. Therefore one enters this obligation, with the sole purpose and intention to have a personal conversation with the Creator. The relationship of the servant and Who is being Served is never in doubt. The servant/slave enters the salah with full humility and humbleness in reverence to the Creator. The praying person if he/she is making this obligation alone or in congregation, the humbleness is still the same. The leader in the congregation praised Allah (The God, Olorun, Chineke, Obangiji, etc) by the initial gesture to enter and begin. From their on, everyone who is praying behind him, enters the salah. There is the recitation of the portions of the Quran that is obligatory, each person stands up in rakah (Surah Fatiha), with any portion of the remaing Quran, to follow. The leader (Imam) the praises Allah, for the bending pasture (Rukuh). He will praiseAllah in a difference praise , until he raises himself up with a difference praise. He parsies Allah again, iwith a differet praise, yet again, quitely and then praise s again with (Allahu Akbar; most repeated praising words in Salah), for the prostration (Sajdah). In the face on the floor position is where the muslimsblieves that they are the clsest in reerence and humble humility, (and not humiliation) to Allah. A muslim paises the Lord yet again with a great praising words and the ask blessing for the prophet and then make the request that he/she wants from Allah, then covers it with asking for mercy again for the prophet (AS). The blessing and mercy that are asked is for the good of the prayeing person, which is actually obedience to Allah's command in Surah Azhab (the Confederate). There are two facial prostrations; forehead and nose, etc must make contact with the floor for every standing and bending. This process is repeated with a long sitting after the second round of the two bowing that will accompany the second standing/bending positions. If the salah to being offered is the after dawn salah (subuh) it will be 2 rakah and the long sitting will end the salah after the tashahuud. If it is Dhur ( after midday) is 4 rakah, Asr the late afternoon prayer is 4 rakah, the magrib at immediately the sun setsis 3 Rakah and isha that s the last prayer for the day is 4 Rakah, All persons is obligated to make thisdaily prayer, as long as they reach the age of pubery, anot mentally deranged and conscious not being in a coma. A sick person can lay on his/her side to pray. A person who has lost is voice can whisper or pray with the eye, and a ptraveller is provided an avenue of ease by shortening into 2 each of the salah that has 4 rakah. And he does not have have to make what we call sunnah sala either. I observed it as long as I lived in a place without my intention of staying there permanently. So if I were to arrive in Nigeria, on a visit and I spend 3 years straight in that country, if my intention has not changed to making a home as a primary permanent residence there, I will pray the prayers of traveller, and yet have a full reward. This is a merciful allowance from Allah to His servants who are under the stresss of journey. By the way, it is Salah that singly separates a believer in Islamic monotheism from the disbeliever of he same monotheistic belief! A muslim who joins the alah in the middle, say after the first bending, he will have to make up the number of rakah that he had missed. For a person to be able to be acreditted for a rakah, he will have to join the prayer, by entering it properly, and gets to the bending position, immediately, while the Imam still remain in that same bending position. When an Imam leaves the bending position and a person have not been in that position with him, he has lost that rakah, and must make it up in orer to have a full salah. Islam does not allow a person coming in at the tail end of the obligatory responsibility and says that he/she has prayed, just because he joins in with the others. Unlike other religions or ways, the responsibility of the obligation is personal and must be fulfilled fully complete. Other part of the daily worship is remembrance of Allah (Dhikr of a different form that Salah) and reading Quran. Charity; Zakah and Sadaqah and Fasting and Hajj and doing good and avoiding evil, all for the pleasure of Allah are part of worship. This is just a tip of what mode of worship is. Salah is the primary daily and which allows the community toknow that you are part of the community. Husband and wife sleeping with each other is a worship which elps and prevents each partner from the possiblity of straying.Good manner is a worship. Kindnes is a worship. |
Re: . by noetic2: 1:03pm On Jul 11, 2009 |
Stoneval: this shows that u have NO understanding of christianity, if u do, then u'd know. |
Re: . by Abuzola(m): 1:45pm On Jul 11, 2009 |
@poster, christian do not have a mode of worship, whatever they do such as dancing, clapping and singing , jesus never practice it even in the bible it is absent and thats why none of the christian will able to back their statement with verse from the bible most especially the new testament |
Re: . by noetic2: 1:46pm On Jul 11, 2009 |
Abuzola: what were u trying to say? |
Re: . by PastorAIO: 1:50pm On Jul 11, 2009 |
Check out this passages from an essay:
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Re: . by Nobody: 2:22pm On Jul 11, 2009 |
@OLABOWALE.thnx 4 the msg.i really do aprecia8 ur effort.wel i'm a muslim bt just wnt 2 knw others opinion.try holla me @07062369936.i'ld tel u my ful name.thnx |
Re: . by budaatum: 5:48pm On Jul 11, 2009 |
Increases in knowledge are generally good for buda for they make buda understand more and hence become a better person. With this post, you, olabowale, have increased the knowledge of buda and made buda better. olabowale: |
Re: . by Aremugangan(m): 1:01pm On Jul 12, 2009 |
@PASTOR AIO; can you please summarize your essay coz i don't seem to understand how i could reconcile eating of breads at churches with mode of worship. are you telling us that the christain's mode of worship is eating of breads at churches? |
Re: . by PastorAIO: 1:16pm On Jul 12, 2009 |
Aremugangan: A couple of things. Rather than mode of worship I would call it mode of fellowship. But the OP is not making that distinction so I presume that he means how do christians fellowship in church. I state quite categorically that Christian fellowship involved and should involve the sharing of a meal. You seem shocked by this and I guess that is because you do not understand the significance of the shared meal, What the bread and the wine means to christians, the significance of the eucharist. I don't blame you because all the 'christianity' that you've probably encountered in your life never practiced this. Yet this is the very central and essential practice of christianity. A practice instituted by Christ himself. This is the very core of christianity. So 'am I telling you that the christian mode of worship is eating of breads at churches'? Answer, YES. Eating of bread and drinking of wine. Any church that doesn't practice that (and there are many of them) is simply not practicing christianity. |
Re: . by javalove(m): 2:30pm On Jul 12, 2009 |
Pastor AIO: RUBBISH!!!!!!!!!! HOW DOES A CHRISTIAN WORSHIP GOD?? WHAT IS A CHRISTIAN MODE OF WORSHIP?? PRAYING TO GOD IS DIFFERENT FROM WORSHIPPING HIM. WHEN U PRAY, U REQUEST! AND WHEN U WORSHIP U GLORIFY, EXALT GOD'S NAME!!! SO PLEASE, IF U CANT ANSWER THE QUESTION, STOP QUOTING VERSES OF BREAD AND ZOBO JUICE ABEG! |
Re: . by Aremugangan(m): 2:54pm On Jul 12, 2009 |
@Pastor AIO, u're d firts christian to make sense on this forum. If you don't mind, can you please give me the address to your church? Atleast its better to go to a church and eat thatn to goto a church where i will only be investing my money into a man's private account. pastor AIO, i gbadun you die, U're too gbaski. |
Re: . by PastorAIO: 2:55pm On Jul 12, 2009 |
javalove: If you do not understand the OP you ought to read it again carefully or ask someone (your imam perhaps) to please explain it to you. Stoneval: The OP says that muslims worship God by saying "some certain words(prayer)". You say
While I'm at the stage of attempting to answer the question it seems that you still haven't got to the stage of understanding the question. Having said that though, I agree with you that Worship is distinct from prayer cos Worship is to exalt and glorify. Though I agree with you, I also acknowledged the fact that the OP did not make that distinction and so I still tried to address his question as best I could by presuming that he meant how do christians fellowship. Hence my mention of 'Bread and Zobo juice'. |
Re: . by Tudor6(f): 3:00pm On Jul 12, 2009 |
Aremugangan:I knew you were always after a free meal. |
Re: . by javalove(m): 3:04pm On Jul 12, 2009 |
@Pastor Thats my problem wiv u guys. U post some gibberish that is not relevant to the topic and u expect us to understand you. So now, WORSHIP and FELLOWSHIP now mean the same thing? Any verse you quote to tell us how u guys worship, u must also quote a verse where Jesus did the same. . |
Re: . by Aremugangan(m): 3:12pm On Jul 12, 2009 |
@tudor; u said i'm always, Can you please quote my previous actions about free meal? By the way, if i do not eat a free meal from jesus as claimed by my able pastor AIO, what do you expect me to eat? Abi you no like jesus free meal |
Re: . by PastorAIO: 3:14pm On Jul 12, 2009 |
javalove: I never said worship and fellowship were the same thing. Perhaps you just lack aptitude for understanding. I don't know what more I can say to help you understand. Here are some examples of christ doing exactly the same. In fact even establishing the practice for christians to follow. 22While they were eating, Jesus took bread, gave thanks and broke it, and gave it to his disciples, saying, “Take it; this is my body.”Mark Chapter14 verse 22 to 23 For I received from the Lord that which I also delivered to you, that the Lord Jesus in the night in which He was betrayed took bread; and when He had given thanks (eucharistéō), He broke it and said, "This is My body, which is for you; do this in remembrance of Me." (1 Corinthians 11:23-24, NASB)This is what the apostles taught their converts and as Paul told the corinthians it was a practice that they received from the Lord himself. I hope this satisfies your enquiries. |
Re: . by PastorAIO: 3:19pm On Jul 12, 2009 |
One of the earliest historical manuscripts describing christianity that is not actually a christian document is the letter of Pliny to Trajan. Here is an objective outsiders report on how the christians practiced when they met. Actually Pliny is contemplating how best to punish the christians but in so doing he describes their activities and guess what? Sharing a meal was at the center of their meetings.
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Re: . by Aremugangan(m): 3:20pm On Jul 12, 2009 |
Worship: lets see what the bible says about worship; Abraham: "And Abram fell on his face: and God talked with him, saying," (Genesis 17:3). David; "O come, let us worship and bow down: let us kneel before the LORD our maker." (Psalm 95:6). Jesus; "And he went a little farther, and fell on his face, and prayed, saying, O my Father, if it be possible, let this cup pass from me: nevertheless not as I will, but as thou wilt. " (Matthew 26:39). |
Re: . by Aremugangan(m): 3:29pm On Jul 12, 2009 |
@pastor AIO, u were already making sense before considering the bread and tea(zobo) stuff but your last post was kind of a run off line. so, please summarize and say somthing more relevant to the topic of discussion. i'm still expecting your church address. |
Re: . by MUZBO(m): 3:32pm On Jul 12, 2009 |
Pastor AIO:Sincerly, I don't give a rat's tail whether or not y'all eat bread in church but please list these churches that according to you is not practising christianity. Also answer this my sarcastic question: Did you eat bread today? |
Re: . by PastorAIO: 3:33pm On Jul 12, 2009 |
If you read through the whole letter, especially the part highlighted in blue then you will see what christians in the 2nd century said about the manner in which they practiced christianity.
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Re: . by Nobody: 3:47pm On Jul 12, 2009 |
Pastor AIO: Pastor please dont commit heresy,the christians of the second century clearly considered the eucharist to be the real body of Jesus,yiu dont have to start quoting non christian writings to butress your point . St ignatius of antioch matyred my Trajan in 107AD wtote this about the euscharist on his way to matyrdom On the Eucharist, Ignatius wrote in his letter to the Smyrnaeans: “ Take note of those who hold heterodox opinions on the grace of Jesus Christ which has come to us, and see how contrary their opinions are to the mind of God. . . . They abstain from the Eucharist and from prayer because they do not confess that the Eucharist is the flesh of our Savior Jesus Christ, flesh which suffered for our sins and which that Father, in his goodness, raised up again. They who deny the gift of God are perishing in their disputes. — Letter to the Smyrnaeans 6:2–7:1 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ignatius_of_Antioch |
Re: . by Aremugangan(m): 3:55pm On Jul 12, 2009 |
pastor AIO, Is/are there any difference(s) between those days and theses days christians? I'm confused. What quoting for us now? Is that letter also a scripture? Please quote the bible to butress your point more better. @OP please try and understand those my biblie quotations very well, hence, you will appreciate the christians mode of worship |
Re: . by PastorAIO: 4:06pm On Jul 12, 2009 |
chukwudi44: Not everyone on this forum is a christian. The OP doesn't seem to me like he is a christian. Therefore I believe that his question is best answered by quoting a variety of sources. I don't think that is heretical. Aremugangan: There are big differences between those days and these days 'christians'. People can profess christianity till they are blue in the face. They can come here and be rude, spit bile and attack other people in the name of their 'christianity', they can scream 'Jesus is Lord' till the cows come home but at the end of the day if it don't look like a duck, walk like a duck or sound like a duck then I'm not gonna call it a duck. There is plenty of evidence within christianity and outside of christianity of what christian practice entails. The majority of 'churches' today are simply not christian churches. However if they want to fight me over the word christianity and the right to use it then I'll let them have the word. It is not professing it but rather practicing it that matters. MUZBO: Does the above answer your sarcastic question? (yes I ate bread today). Perhaps you can tell me the last church you went to where they brought out food, gave thank (eucharistos) and then shared the food with the congregation. |
Re: . by javalove(m): 5:12pm On Jul 12, 2009 |
@Pastor I swear u dey fall my hand. . .! Explain simple questions, u are quoting letters. Maybe that letter didnt make the final selection of letters to make up the encyclopedia called bible. All I can deduce from ur posts is that christians worship God by feasting together . . right? If that is what you are saying, I wont argue that with you cos it has answered the question. . . rather than quoting unnecessary letters. . . NB No rwal commandmensts from God. . .letters, Gospels According to and all other bollocks are all that make up the fraud called xtianity |
Re: . by PastorAIO: 6:37pm On Jul 12, 2009 |
javalove: I can see that you have ensnared yourself with this compulsive desperation to discredit christianity. There is One and Only One way to worship God. I am not talking about fellowshiping now or about any religious rites or practices. But Pure worship. Since you are a muslim I will articulate it in the terminology of your religion. It is something available to all creatures in the world not just to those capable of intellectual gymnastics and debating ideological points. It is available to beasts and birds. “See you not that it is God Whose praises are celebrated by all beings in the heavens and on earth, and by the birds with extended wings? Each one knows its prayer and glorification; And God is aware of what they do.” An-Nur vs.41 It is not by falling on their faces that these creatures worship and glorify God. The correct worship is something that apparently you are not aware of, otherwise you wouldn't be spouting this vitriolic rubbish. “So direct your face towards the religion, inclining to Truth. Adhere to the Fitra of Allah upon which he has created all people. NO CHANGE should there be in the creation of Allah. That is the CORRECT RELIGION but most of the people do not know.” Ar-Rum vs.30 There is no worship other than Fitra. That is True nature, Essential Nature, Pure being. All the other ceremonial ritual that I know is what you are trying to tout here is a detraction. bow your face, stand up bow your face, stand up spin round and stick your finger up your butt three times or you are not practicing real religion. Nothing else is acceptable as true worship other than Fitra. Purity of being. Stoneval: ablution, bow down, and certain words of prayer is not Worship that is acceptable. End of story. If you are trying to use underhand tactics to take pot shots at christianity then I feel very sorry for you. Me, I adhere to the truth. I was openly and honestly trying to contribute to a thread by showing historical evidence of how christians fellowship and you were coming with some superficial idiocy. I don't know whether I'm sorry for you or just disgusted by you. You are a munafiqeen. |
Re: . by Aremugangan(m): 7:55pm On Jul 12, 2009 |
When i first saw the name, i thought it was one somebody worthy of talking with but you proved me wrong with time. Pastorn AIO, u be comedian? |
Re: . by javalove(m): 8:11pm On Jul 12, 2009 |
LMAO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Now u have shut urself!!!! Quote for me verses in the bible that relate to exactly or close to what u have quoted from the quran U saw that the Quran didnt talk about bread and zobo . . . neither did it talk about feasting and fellowshipping If u are sincere, which version of verses as regards WORSHIP OF GOD will you give to ur son? The Quranic or the Biblical? Did u see how clear the quranic version is . . that needs no further statements like "u guys cant understand" . . . u saw that uts direct in its meaning . . . so all in all . . . most of the things we see in churches today are not biblical the singing and dancing which jesus never did or the clapping and shouting . . all of these are what modern day xtians refer to as worship |
Re: . by PastorAIO: 8:12pm On Jul 12, 2009 |
Aremugangan: I know I'm a comedian, but I don't know how that relates to Worship or to what I've posted above. Please clarify. |
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