Brilliant, Adaku, just Brilliant!

This is an excellent desertatation - thorough in its scope and brilliant in analytic depth. Also not stubborn and humble.

We are now on the same page on Atheism.

But to digress a bit - i do think its is possible to prove the existence of God - if God is understood to be an element of Intelligent Design, however described. Definitely it is possible to prove Intelligent Design, just looking around the world and how specifically formed for purpose everything is should be enough to acknowledge that there is intelligent design. A mere glance at the palm of your own hand should show you intelligent design. What cannot be proven is the nature of that Intelligent Design - Is it a conscious supernatural being, or an element, or an astral equation of some sort. Whatever it is, it could be called God.

@ Tudor, what do you make of Aadaku's brilliant write-up, the chic is quite smart i told you,

Come to think of it i have always wanted to marry a smart, strong-willed lady, Adaku dont break my heart and tell me you are married already, !!!

@post
e be like say as oil don enter wahala FG don dey look for other means of raking up revenues. well the church angle no go work. period!!. a failed country with a sick president that cannot regulate what  its vampire politicians do with public funds should not even dream of regulating any religious body talkless of a church. dem carry chain tie any body for any church or mosque?, what are you going to regulate in the first place, seed sowing? or miracles? or preaching? or sing and pray? . if govt want's to protect the citizenry from abuse of  charlatans they should better the lives of the people they ruling and stealing from. it is poverty induced by bad leadership that drive many into places where they are being 'fleeced' .i say 'fleeced' b/c there churches that are true altars of God.

Deep Sight:

i do think its is possible to prove the existence of God - if God is understood to be an element of Intelligent Design, however described. Definitely it is possible to prove Intelligent Design, just looking around the world and how specifically formed for purpose everything is should be enough to acknowledge that there is intelligent design. A mere glance at the palm of your own hand should show you intelligent design. What cannot be proven is the nature of that Intelligent Design - Is it a conscious supernatural being, or an element, or an astral equation of some sort. Whatever it is, it could be called God.

 I agree it should. But it appears not to be sufficient enough evidence for the atheist.

I also agree when you said the nature of this Intelligent Designer cannot be "proven" - you're absolutely right. I cannot prove my faith or experiences to another, each person's path to finding and understanding God is unique to them.

It baffles me to see how mankind as turn away from the truth and how best to really revered the almighty. Man sees himself as the centre of creation, and which is not so. How do men thinks?, he can give money to the Almighty to make Him happy. This is ridiculous. There is nothing here on earth (materially) we do that will please GOD. What the Almighty demands from man is , for man to love his fellow men. That is all. Loving your fellow men, goes along way to demonstrate the true teaching of Christ. For Christ said, I was thirsty and you gave me water to drink, I was, gave food to eat, so on and so forth. Christ did not tell man to give to GOD but rather to his fellow brothers. This is one example and so many other examples are found in the bible and in nature. Don’t be deceive; the Almighty does not need our material money, for Him to survive hungry, or to buy drugs for medical reason. Man is just exploiting on the ignorance of his fellow being. For i tell you not all who call on the name of the lord shall be saved on the last day.
It is popular to hear people say this man is a man of god, is a pastor, then what name should you call your self?, a man of devil or what? Again don't be deceived, man is a resultant product of creation, and from the same source we all originated. I tell you no man is greater than another, we are all equal in the sight of the Almighty. If for any reason a man calls himself as being a man of God, then equally you are a man of God too.
Above this world, we do not need money for any thing and the Almighty will not ask on how much money you gave to your church, but rather on how much you were able to impart on your fellow men and nature.
This brings us to the topic, should religious bodies be regulated? The Almighty did not establish any form of religion; this was the handiwork of men. Wanting to have supremacy over another. Having Roman Catholic from Romans, Anglican from Britain, Pentecostal from aggrieves members of both domination's. The all ideal was just to have control and domination over the world's wealth. taking of poeples wealth today is  been seen in all churches.it stated right from the foundation days of the roman empires.

I have been following this debate, Now imust comment

Does tudor read the messages adaku sends or does he just comment?  tudor make u dey read the comments first
Adaku is obviously well read and doesnt take no for an answer, she seems to be quite strong,very educated and open minded,
deepsite is a good lawyer but na adaku know wetin she dey talk? no be so
See insult

adaku123:

 I refuse to engage in a battle of knowledge and common sense with an unarmed man.


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adakuu just dey put smart thinly-vieledl insults
Adaku u fit be my first lady? Forget deepsite i wan marry you now now!

Tudor has been schooled?

Adaku, i am really serious, you have to respond to my marriage proposal one way or the other.

@ Agent-X, back off, she's mine, i am warning you o.

It clearly does appear that some individuals have chosen to digress from my original intent of creating this thread. Can I request that @Tudor, @Adaku123 and oga judge @ Deep sight etc, if you're still hell bent on expressing your intellectual capacities regarding belief, religion and atheism, it would be better you create a different thread to do that. It's a bit annoying you all seem to have hijacked the topic to engage in endless arguments about simple terms whose meanings you can find in a dictionary but instead have chosen to play with words to create a mini lecture which put lightly comes across as been a bit patronising. There is nothing to doubt you all possess the gift of the gab in abundance but employing it purposefully seem to be lacking here.

Ha! ha! ha! ha!

This is a small world indeed! I could swear i've seen this same exact argument (poorly modified) somewhere before.

@adaku.
"He should have said", " Then I will say", "He will then say" " I will now go on to say"- HABA!!
You should have just told me you had a prepared script you wanted us to act out.

This is the problem i've got with kids who go to christian apologist websites memorize debates therein not minding to even read and understand what exactly they're plagiarizing, the exact topic of discourse is obviously beyond them.
It's quite obvious you were overeager to show off your recently copied debate thats why you were moved to tears and wanted to tear me to pieces because i refused to act out your childish fantasies/dream debate which you saw on another forum and wanted to re-enact here- probably you wanted a medal or sumtin.

First you've got to understand that atheists are not programmed zombies with the same world views and arguments. The argument you dubbed was btw a theist and an atheist and you expected every atheist to to tow the same line verbatim- sorry to disappoint you.

You really are a confused fellow. . .Your first statement when you barged into this thread was
"@TUDOR,
WHEN DID ATHEISM STOP BEING A RELIGION".  Then in your subsequent posts you made it CLEAR that your keyword in defining religion is belief, Later you declare that atheism isn't just a religion but MANY RELIGIONS. At the end of your plagiarized post albeit modified (thats why we see the contradictions) we see this

In that manner, your "belief" in atheism is very similar to a "belief" in a God. You are correct that atheism is not a religion but in many cases neither is a belief in God.

Now what exactly have i been saying if not the highlighted above?
Reading your entire write-up, its quite glaring that From the website you poached this pre packaged debate the argument was along the lines of "Theism is not a Religion" as opposed to the view of "Atheism is a Religion" to which you're ignorantly trying prove with the copied debate.

Madam, NOBODY in the annals of NL has ever described THEISM as a religion. I defined religion to you as belief in and worship of god or gods while theism refers to belief in god or gods.
In that sense theism is the exact opposite of atheism and is NOT A RELIGION. What seperates theism from religion is mainly the worship element including the doctrines, dogma, infact everything is perfectly captured in your poached post below. . .

adaku123:

The Encyclopedia of Philosophy, in its article on Religion listed characteristics of religion namely:
1. Belief in supernatural beings (gods).
2. A distinction between sacred and profane objects.
3. Ritual acts focused on sacred objects.
4. A moral code believed to be sanctioned by the gods.
5. Characteristically religious feelings (awe, sense of mystery, sense of guilt, adoration), which tend to be aroused in the presence of sacred objects and during the practice of ritual, and which are connected in idea with the gods.
6. Prayer and other forms of communication with gods.
9. A social group bound together by the above.
It is quite difficult to claim ATHIESM is a religion from the above….However it is also difficult to claim THEISM is a religion… the mere belief in God doesn’t automatically qualify as a religion,and many ppl who belief in God do not practice the above…
In order to have a religion, you need quite a bit more than either simple belief or disbelief. This fact is clearly reflected in the real world, because we find theism which exists outside of religion.

The above is absolutely and sweetly spot on!!
It correctly states that in religion you need more than "simple belief" obviously contradicting your earlier declaration that The keyword in defining religion is belief. . . .you further go forward to embarrass yourself by stating "Atheism is not religion but "MANY RELIGIONS" then  the post ended with

" You are correct that atheism is not a religion but in many cases neither is a belief in God".
WHERE DO YOU BELONG?!
IS ATHEISM A RELIGION OR NOT?

Davidylan and co will attest to the fact that when we atheists on this forum refer to them guys, we use terms like religionists, christians, muslims, mohammedians e.t.c and NEVER THEISTS.
What seperates theism from religion is mainly that worship element and we all know that.
There are theists who are not religionists. They merely believe in god and not affiliated to any modality of worship and doctrines like xtianity, judaism, ifa, islam e.t.c.- But anyway that isn't the argument. The bone of contention in this thread is your declaration that ATHEISM IS A RELIGION.
You haven't yet proven your case!!
You don't start an argument with "atheism is a religion" then end with the conclusion "Atheism is not a religion" - it's illogical and wierd!
It's like you debating yourself. More pointer to the fact that you saw this debate somwhere, irked by my reluctance to indulge you, decided to debate yourself assuming both pro and anti & ending up with a self contradicting conclusion

When next you wanna plagiarize, make sure you read and understand what EXACTLY you're copying before coming to disgrace yourself with dancing contradictions in your post.

P.S; I'm doing a search and trying to find where i saw the original version of the work you plagiarized.

Deep Sight:

Brilliant, Adaku, just Brilliant!

This is an excellent desertatation - thorough in its scope and brilliant in analytic depth. Also not stubborn and humble.

We are now on the same page on Atheism.

Deep sight, your view (as well as mine) is atheism is NOT a religion meanwhile her's for which she baraged me with insults labelling atheists hypocrites is "Atheism is Religion". - I wonder how she magically concluded that atheism isn't a religion while spicing up the body of her write-up with quotes like "atheism is many religion". . . .could you please explain it to me?

@ Tudor, what do you make of Aadaku's brilliant write-up,  the chic is quite smart i told you,

Come to think of it i have always wanted to marry a smart, strong-willed lady,  Adaku dont break my heart and tell me you are married already, !!!

Quite a brilliant debate between a theist and an atheist. Sadly the topic it was meant for is THEISM IS NOT RELIGION and not atheism is religion as adaku wrongly dubbed it. Read it carefully and you'll see it.

Anyways i'm trying to see if i can get where i saw the original.

@ tudor (olodo)
Dont act like an idiot,  instead of you to check the topic you are talking of plagiarizm Of cos adaku didnt know all dat information in her head
the point is dat she searched it b4 for arguing instead of just arguing ignorantly(ignoramus). The quote about color was an argument by some american reverend and the stuff about belief is from o'reilly and there is even a book on the church of liberalism!She is obviously read and searched for her info and used it as ammunition.what she concluded is dat atheism falls into religion, because the definition of religion is very poor. the moral of the story is dat b4 u argue read or plagarize your work cos nobody cares dis no be exam or homework!!IGNORAMUS

@adaku i still wan marry you where u dey na

Who would have thought it . . . tudor on the defensive?

davidylan:

Who would have thought it . . . tudor on the defensive? 

Yeah yea yeah
Sanusi has just sacked five CEO's. You were one of the fiercest critics, go here and bring them down to earth. . . .the sharia man is getting too much praise like he just saved nigeria from a recession (really tiring)
https://www.nairaland.com/nigeria/topic-309802.256.html

ikemefuna1:

tudor dont u think its harsh to insult ppl like dat, its unfair.

Screw you!
I'll report you for multiple id's too!
Adaku, agent X and ikemefuna are all the same ONE PERSON.
Hope you know the moderators can see your I.P address and confirm.

You give yourself away by your penchant for commenting on topics involving "wedding dresses". Be smarter next time.

Quiet jare !!
What was your original argument and what was the conclusion of your plagiarized write up?

Your initial declaration was "atheism is a religion" at the end of your stolen write up we see "atheism is NOT a religion" Two different things! - are you not ashamed of yourself

Just wait till i dig up that link and i'll expose you for the shameless pirate you are. . .

P. S; You're yet to prove your case that atheism is a religion- i'm waiting.

@ Tudor;

Really your abusive words are a bit much i must say.

You show high intelligence in your arguments, and that interests me, also you have really witty come-backs that have me laughing really hard.

I would expect a man of such intelligence and humour to be rather less abusive. Let's take a shot at it: no more insults, ok?

Notice Adaku has since abandoned any insults and now sticks with the issues. That's the way to go.

Facing our little debate: i would advise you to learn a little subtlety: Sometimes when you score a point, and the other person comes round and agrees with you, rather than stomp on that person and scream your victory, you only need to quietly accept the point and carry on: it shows more grace.

Adaku has now stated that Atheism is not a religion. This is a point that both you and i insisted on. So what do we want to do now - have her hanged for conceding reasonably? What she has now sought to do, is to show that there are many complexities which should also be taken into consideration. That's fine and good.

@ Adaku -

Damn, what a pity (u are engaged!), Abel, lets go lick our wounds over some cat-fish peppersoup at Iya-Basirat!

I call Truce y'all. . . .may the force be with you. . .

eh. I think church should be regulated.

Too many poor people are being brainwashed

1) people lose money to church leaders who use their money for the wrong things.
2) Church gives them no life. o.o
3) They lose the right to choose.
4) They lose their common sense.

A good example is the Unification Church
Reverend Moon claims to be the Messiah 20 years ago.
Now he claims to be God on Earth

He also claims Jesus is a failure :/

what do you think o.0?

I think hes a crazy, greedy person

He preaches what he himself can't even do go do some research on him.
I can guarantee you if you have a brain. You will see why we need to regulate churches all around the world to protect the innocent from people like him

I think (I stand to be corrected) the religious bodies are already regulated. But the question is, are they effective. Hmmm. In my opinion, No!
Religious bodies are one of the top 10(5??) employers in the private sector in Nigeria. PAYE (pay as u earn) should also apply to them.



How can they be regulated?

1. The finances of the Religous entities must be audited by an external independent body who will be reporting to a governmental dept( within Tax Office).
2. Also within that governmental body, there should be internal auditing taking place in the background implementing controls and checks over the dept.

ADVANTAGE

The church will be contributing directly to the coffers of the Goverment. Imagine the religious bodies contributing  just 10% of their total revenue. I call that pratical solution to nigeria's woes.

DISADVANTAGE

The problem is the naija factor. Greed, corruption and dishonesty might prevail. Then you wonder, will the Bishops, Overseers, Pastors, Imams,etc become partners in crime?
The odds are staked against them

.....