jus curious y muslims contrary to the prophet's teaching kill each other and only unite in the presece of a common enemy. Iraq and iran fought a meaningless war for 8yrs, the taliban in afganistan regularly blow up innocent muslim civiliains, iraqis blow up each other on thousands with foriegners seldom targets. some in iraq even go to burial and blow up mourners! In gaza it got to a point where hamas and fatah started killing each other in a power struggle while the jews happily watched them reduce their population. Turks and kurds also have thier issues in turkey. The pakistani taliban blew up muslim cadets at a police training school to prove some kind of point which eventually degenerated into the pakistani military action in the swat valley, also shedding more blood. In the nigerian north, i lived tru countless religious crisis when all of a sudden, the hausa muslims see other muslims especially yoruba and igbirra as not good muslims and kill them. I witnessed alot of this in jos and kd. its really sad.

@poster, are you a muslim or non muslim before i give an insight

@ abuzola
i'm non muslim who admires parts of Islam.
also in addition to dat how do u reconcile on one hand sayin there is no compulsion in religion wit certain parts that a muslim who renounces his faith be killed.

An Apostates is a threat, even the Old testament encourage the killing of apostates. Deuteronomy 13:5-7.

In Islam an apostate that is considered a threat will be put away because of passing information to the enemy.
If he is not consider to be a threat then he will be banish from the territory. Thats the law of God for you, if the christians have been following their book like i illustrated above, they would do the same thing. But God's plan is strategic, there must be one truthhood and thats why only Islam is adopting the law, even jews neglect the law of moses for slaying the apostates. The truth remains the truth and it will never muzzle

The law of Apostate is only adopted in sharia law province, anything exterior is illegitimate because the people did not agree on it neither are they aware of a law for apostate. Islam is against indiscrimination

Abuzola:

An Apostates is a threat, even the Old testament encourage the killing of apostates. Deuteronomy 13:5-7.

In Islam an apostate that is considered a threat will be put away because of passing information to the enemy.
If he is not consider to be a threat then he will be banish from the territory. Thats the law of God for you, if the christians have been following their book like i illustrated above, they would do the same thing. But God's plan is strategic, there must be one truthhood and thats why only Islam is adopting the law, even jews neglect the law of moses for slaying the apostates. The truth remains the truth and it will never muzzle

You are indeed a lunatic.
An apostate is a threat to allah ?
why would a simple human changing religion be a threat to his wimpy ego
and he claims to be all knowing?
Mohammed made that rule because he and allah are one and the same
spineless
next time you'll tell us there's no compulsion in relion yet an apostate is a threat.
blood suckers
what is the difference between you folks and ritualists?

Abuzola:

An Apostates is a threat, even the Old testament encourage the killing of apostates. Deuteronomy 13:5-7.

In Islam an apostate that is considered a threat will be put away because of passing information to the enemy.
If he is not consider to be a threat then he will be banish from the territory. Thats the law of God for you, if the christians have been following their book like i illustrated above, they would do the same thing. But God's plan is strategic, there must be one truthhood and thats why only Islam is adopting the law, even jews neglect the law of moses for slaying the apostates. The truth remains the truth and it will never muzzle

I wonder what extra information an apostate will give about a proselytizing religion. Is there more to Islam than is readily available in the Koran and the Hadiths that any non muslim can easily buy in a bookstore and read? Or is this just the reaction of a Paranoid mentality?

$osisi:

You are indeed a lunatic.
An apostate is a threat to allah ?
why would a simple human changing religion be a threat to his wimpy ego
and he claims to be all knowing?
Mohammed made that rule because he and allah are one and the same
spineless
next time you'll tell us there's no compulsion in relion yet an apostate is a threat.
blood suckers
what is the difference between you folks and ritualists?

What is this, $osisi?

And then if Abuzola responds in kind he'll be accused of behaving harshly, huh?

Please behave your age, or I learn you are not a small kid; ven an elder. Thanks

An apostate is a threat to Islam??
Good to know Abuzola, I now understand why you declared jihad on NL

Unless my God guides me I shall surely be among those who go astray.

Thanks Allah, the Exalted, for guiding me.

Wish you will guide folks like my nairaland friend, Nezan, amen.

muhsin:

Unless my God guides me I shall surely be among those who go astray.

Thanks Allah, the Exalted, for guiding me.

Wish you will guide folks like my nairaland friend, Nezan, amen.

did you have your PC facing East while typing this?

$osisi:

did you have your PC facing East while typing this?

I wonder

I think the kiriyos always in the kneeling position with eyes closed when they are responding to the muslims. You see why the christians are always off the wall when they respond to the muslims?

And by the way, those who are north of Kaaba will have no choice but face the south, towards the kaaba, rather than facing east which will be away "direction" having no Kaaba in that direction!

@osisi and co-
your problem is myopia because you obsess with Islam-

how does an apostate become a threat ?

He leaks information to enemy on how to deteriorate the muslim ummah, bush was adviced to bomb to Iraq and Afghanistan as the only solution to dwind the muslim ummah, instead Mujahidun are rising from all over the world. U.S is in a grip of fear of mujahidun attack in the U.S, they ain't in peace of mind.


We do not expect God to come down on earth to fight for us, many verses have clarified this, God wants to test us and want to use us to destroy them so that it become a lesson for them. Yesterday 6 U.S forces lost their lives in Afghanistan. The more they kill us the more we come out to fight them. Death is no fear to us. When the christians were persecuted by the romans what made them to fight back instead of waiting for God to descend. Lol

Warning:
Let all the contributors here watch their words before it degenerates into exchange of hot words.

So you muslims kill apostates, i.e. those who renounce islam for fear of leaking islamic secrets to us kafir? At least you are been honest,,,,,,olabowale will argue that apostates are not murdered in islam

mezan go read my summation on what happens if a wife leaves islam, before you start running around like headless chicken! Something interesting happened yesterday: this young woman became a muslim to proof to her Muslim Intended (the whole relation is up to this point without any sexual intercourse or the usual boyfriend/girlfriend functionaries of Kissing or grabbing, etc), that she loves him.

They have known each other for about 2 years, but definitely over a year. The beautiful woman of 24 was amazed how this guy have not one time demanded sex from her, part of the reasons she became facinated. So she gravitated on her own and started cultivating friends with female muslims to know about islam, from woman's perspective. Finally she attended Jumuah prayer, right there in Lagos. That was less than 2 months ago.

She has become a full fledged muslims, now, who stated that even if the Intende man and her are not married, she will remain Islam, because she is now a Muslim for Allah and the guy has nothing to do with it, now. Her mother and her father are going to fast for the very first time as herself, because she has brought life into their home. Her older sister is now considering becoming Muslim woman herself, in South Africa where she lives with her fiance.


Her Intented was telling her to be patient with her parents, because if her father sees a great improvement in her, and he turns to Islam, the whole family will beome Muslim in one singlesweep. Allah brough Seyi to become the leader, leading her family into the light of the Creator, Al Nur! (Nur is Light, Al Nur, is a name of Allah and it means The Light).

@ Olabowale: Read your post again. How is it related to this discuss? If you are ashamed of Islam killing apostates, then renounce islam, period, instead of looking for stories(lies??) to narrate.

Nezan:

So you muslims kill apostates, i.e. those who renounce islam for fear of leaking islamic secrets to us kafir? At least you are been honest,,,,,,olabowale will argue that apostates are not murdered in islam

Abuzola is not a politically correct Muslim like Olabs.
He says it like it is.You saw how Olabs argued about Aisha's age not being 6 at marriage and abuzola set him straight.

They kill them lest they convert other Muslims by their testimony.
Islam is a religion of force.
You see how quickly the deceptive verse of "there's no compulsion" has been relegated to the background.

There are 2 Islamic messages.

1.The Meccan writings when Mohammed and his new religion were in the minority.He appealed to Christians,Jews,Idolators,Homosexuals ,zoroastrians by borrowing part of their practices and preaching peace,no compulsion,allah sent down the Torah and confirmed it etc

2.The medinian writings when he had become powerful,that's where you hear ,hunt down and hack down your enemies, sleep with your slave girls,cut down the Jews and Christians,wage war,kill,kill ,kill.

any Koran verse you see will depend at what point Mohammed was in

countless examples

Mistake makes one more humane, for only God is perfect.

I meant to write "Wish [b]HE [/b]will guide folks like my nairaland friend, Nezan, amen."

And nobody among you is above mistake. Is there?

muhsin:

Mistake makes one more humane, for only God is perfect.

I meant to write "Wish HE [/b]will guide folks like my [b]nairaland friend, Nezan, amen."

And nobody among you is above mistake. Is there?

A muslim can only pretend to be your friend,,,,,,when the chips are down, you are just another keferi to be hacked down in reward of the famed 72 virgins in a muslim's warped view of paradise.

Nezan:

A muslim can only pretend to be your friend,,,,,,when the chips are down, you are just another keferi to be hacked down in reward of the famed 72 virgins in a muslim's warped view of paradise.

I have said this a million times,let him who has an ear hear.
Muslims are obligated by Islam to lie and deceive non Muslims.
That is their Islamic duty.
They cannot be trusted.
Anyone trusting them doesn't know what they believe in.
They can lie in some instances and are not in the wrong according to their religion.
Thats why nations signing treaties with them are just wasting their time.
They can say yes when they really mean know then when your guards are down.they strike you unexpectedly.
That is Islam!

"Allah will not call you to account for thoughtlessness (vain) in your oaths, but for the intention in your hearts; and He is Oft-forgiving, Most Forbearing." Surah 2:225. The principal also has support in the Qur'an 3:28 and 16:106.



There you see it for yourselves.

What you people are focusing is on secular state which is different from my first quote.

The law of apostate is only applicable to Sharia adopted states. Anybody who kill an apostate in a non sharia land has sin against God and humanity.

Whether you like it or not thats God law,

deuteronomy 13:5-7 order to kill Apostate- this is a portion of the bible.


'there is no compulsion in religion' Quran 2:256


A christian can't be force into islam, hindu, jew etc can't be compel, the scenario is different, an apostate is different from a born unbeliever. If you fear persecution hadith urge you to leave the sharia state and go to secular state and convert.
'say (O Muhammad) 'i am not a new thing among the messengers nor do i know what will be done with me or with you. I only follow that which is revealed to me, and i am but a plain warner'

'o mankind ! Fear your Lord and fear a day when no father can avail aught for his son' Quran 31:33

@ Abuzola: How true is that? Nigeria is a secular state but a core Northern muslim who dare renounce is hunted down.

[size=16pt]Whoever changes his religion from Islam should be congratulated as rejoining the human race[/size]

Thor:

[size=16pt]Whoever changes his religion from Islam should be congratulated as rejoining the human race[/size]

Amen!

$Osisi will continue in her deceitful ways until she will finally realise (Allah Willing) that she must change. I guess she will wait until the pruneness or raisiness catches up to her. In the maintime, the 2:225 she lied about above is debunked below! Read and enjoy. Your three Idols of Idolatry Makkan, at least 2 are mentioned to illustrate the Ayah: You see how the Mercy of the Merciful eradicates the unintended sinful mistakes because of newness to Islam and the habit they have acquired from Kufr. Osisi, let me tell you, I have even heard muslims in the mosque says Jesus Christ! He did not mean it. However he used to say Jesus Christ in the days of ignorance before he came to Islam. Such a person is in laghw; unintentionally uttered a lie. He will have to take the Shahada, again. Well it will rid him of the ignorant statement.

The Laghw (Unintentional) Vows: 2; 225.
Allah said: [لاَّ يُؤَاخِذُكُمُ اللَّهُ بِالَّلغْوِ فِى أَيْمَـنِكُمْ] (Allah will not call you to account for that which is unintentional in your oaths,). This Ayah means, `Allah does not punish or hold you accountable for the Laghw (unintentional) vows that you make.' The Laghw vows are unintentional and are just like the habitual statements that the tongue repeats, without really intending them. For instance, it is reported in the Two Sahihs that Abu Hurayrah narrated that Allah's Messenger said: «مَنْ حَلَفَ فَقَالَ فِي حَلِفِهِ بِاللَّاتِ وَالْعُزَّى، فَلْيَقُلْ لَا إِلَهَ إِلَّا الله»


[b](Whoever swore and (unintentionally) mentioned Al-Lat and Al-`Uzza (two idols) in his vow, should then say, `There is no deity worthy of worship except Allah'.) The Messenger said this statement to some new Muslims whose tongues were, before Islam, used to vowing by their idol Al-Lat. Therefore, the Prophet ordered them to intentionally recite the slogan of Ikhlas, just as they mentioned these words by mistake, so that it (the word of Ikhlas) may eradicate the word (of Shirk). This is why Allah said:


[وَلَـكِن يُؤَاخِذُكُم بِمَا كَسَبَتْ قُلُوبُكُمْ] (, but He will call you to account for that which your hearts have earned.) and in another Ayah:[بِمَا عَقَّدتُّمُ الاٌّيْمَـنَ] (, for your deliberate oaths) (5:89)Abu Dawud reported under Chapter: `The Laghw Vows' that `Ata' said that `A'ishah said that Allah's Messenger said: «اللَّغْوُ فِي الْيَمِينِ هُوَ كَلَامُ الرَّجُلِ فِي بَيْتِهِ: كَلَّا وَاللهِ، وَبَلَى وَالله» (The Laghw in the vows includes what the man says in his house, such as, `No, by Allah,' and, `Yes, by Allah'.) Ibn Abu Hatim reported that Ibn `Abbas said, "The Laghw vow includes vowing while angry.'' He also reported that Ibn `Abbas said, "The Laghw vow includes vowing to prohibit what Allah has allowed, and this type does not require a Kaffarah (expiation).'' Similar was said by Sa`id bin Jubayr.[/b]


In addition, Abu Dawud related under Chapter: `Vowing while Angry' that Sa`id bin Musayyib said that two Ansari brothers both received inheritance and one of them asked that the inheritance be divided. His brother said, "If you ask me about dividing the inheritance again, then all of what I have will be spent on the Ka`bah's door.'' `Umar said to him, "The Ka`bah does not need your money. So break your vow, pay the Kaffarah and come to terms with your brother. I heard Allah's Messenger saying:
«لَا يَمِينَ عَلَيْكَ وَلَا نَذْرَ فِي مَعْصِيَةِ الرَّبِّ عَزَّ وَجَلَّ، وَفِي قَطِيعَةِ الرَّحِمِ، وَفِيمَا لَا تَمْلِك»


(Do not make a vow against yourself, nor to disobey the Lord, cut the relations of the womb or dispose of what you do not own.)'' Allah said: [وَلَـكِن يُؤَاخِذُكُم بِمَا كَسَبَتْ قُلُوبُكُمْ] (. , but He will call you to account for that which your hearts have earned,) Ibn `Abbas, Mujahid and several others said that this Ayah means swearing about a matter while knowing that he is lying. Mujahid and others said this Ayah is similar to what Allah said: [وَلَـكِن يُؤَاخِذُكُم بِمَا عَقَّدتُّمُ الاٌّيْمَـنَ] (, but He will punish you for your deliberate oaths.) (5:89) Allah said (2:225 above):[وَاللَّهُ غَفُورٌ حَلِيمٌ]
(And Allah is Oft-Forgiving, Most-Forbearing.) meaning, He is Oft-Forgiving to His servants and Most Forbearing with them.


[لِّلَّذِينَ يُؤْلُونَ مِن نِّسَآئِهِمْ تَرَبُّصُ أَرْبَعَةِ أَشْهُرٍ فَإِن فَآءُوا فَإِنَّ اللَّهَ غَفُورٌ رَّحِيمٌ - وَإِنْ عَزَمُواْ الطَّلَـقَ فَإِنَّ اللَّهَ سَمِيعٌ عَلِيمٌ ] (226. Those who take an oath not to have sexual relation with their wives must wait for four months, then if they return, verily, Allah is Oft-Forgiving, Most Merciful.) (227. And if they decide upon divorce, then Allah is All-Hearer, All-Knower.)

[al-Baqarah 2:217]

And it was proven that the[size=16pt] Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) said: “Whoever changes his religion, execute him.”[/size] Narrated by al-Bukhaari in his Saheeh. What this hadeeth means is that whoever leaves Islam and changes to another religion and persists in that and does not repent, is to be executed. It was also proven that the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) said: [size=16pt]“It is not permissible to shed the blood of a person who bears witness that there is no god but Allaah and that I am the Messenger of Allaah except[list]

[/list] in three cases: a life for a life, a previously-married person who commits adultery, and one who leaves Islam and forsakes the jamaa’ah[/size].” Narrated by al-Bukhaari and Muslim.



there you read it yourselves
nothing to do with threat to Islam as Abuzola insinuates.
Mo hammed says to kill anyone who leaves Islam.
God help us!

And when I show the falsehood of your statement you will become persistent in your game playing as if you did not read it all along! I will be back.