KingEbukasBlog:

There is young earth creationism - the belief earth is between 10,000 - 6000 years

There is Old Earth creationism - the belief earth is as old as science says it is

There is Progressive Creationism - the belief God created life gradually over millions of years

There is theistic evolution - The belief God used natural selection as a mechanism for creation

It is clear the OP is ignorant of these .

Thank you

Thread closed !

GrizzlyBear:


All this has nothing to do with the premise of my thread.

No offense, but most times you act like an immature little kid. You just make comments without thinking. You see every thread on religious section as a platform for you to show off how much of a smartass you are, which is quite ironic, and how easily you can discredit atheist arguments.
You see NL as a circus, and you a dancer, and you hop into every thread like a ballerina, dancing to the melody of unabashed ignorance.

This approach is harmful to your intellectual growth. I have noticed that you don't engage in debates to learn, you engage in debates to just win and that is a serious problem. When I create threads, I do it with the open possibility that someone would change my mind, but sadly, all I get is ad-hominem attacks and side stepping of the premise.

The problem with you outspoken Christians on this section, like you and the guy above, is that a simple intelligent argument from you guys is all that would convince us athiests. Not ad-hominem attacks, not circumventing the premise of our thread, not obfuscating of the debate, not posting memes and presenting erroneous data as facts. Just a well written, persuasive and reasonable argument.

You clicked on this thread, read a few lines of my op, and proceeded to post nonsense that has nothing to do with my thesis. Please read my op line by line and come up with a tenable response.

Thanks.

KingEbukasBlog:


Why are you butt-hurt

You believe that life is meaningless . So what do you tend to achieve by opening this thread ? Give me a reasonable response and I will take my time to refute every single sentence you have put up there .

hopefulLandlord:
^^

Red Herring alert!

KingEbukasBlog:


Its not a Red Herring . What is his gain if I abjure my belief in God ? What exactly would he gain ? Why should I pay attention to a proponent of Nihilism ? He believes lives is meaningless - do you how dangerous that is to hold such beliefs

GrizzlyBear:


Still evading the premise of this thread...

I would have loved to present a well thought out reply to your question, but it would definitely devolve into an argument that would stray from the premise of this thread.

Please attend to the premise of this thread.

KingEbukasBlog:


Ruminate on these :

1. There are Christians who believe in reincarnation and that souls (spirits ) are the ones who would be judged . That means the souls of those who existed in the past -thousands of years ago -are still being reincarnated during this present time .

2. There are Christians who believe the Pre-Adamites were sub-humans and were destroyed by Lucifer's flood . So they(Pre-Adamites) don't get judged .

3. The bible says that Nature serves as evidence for God and that the desire to know God has been ingrained in humans . So those humans who have existed before Christ will be judged by their works . Example : Abraham was saved by grace through faith . He was justified by his works. Abraham believed in God and it was credited to him as righteousness .

4. The knowledge of God was revealed to humans even during the antediluvian period . Example Enoch

Book of Enoch in verses 14-15

“Enoch, the seventh from Adam, prophesied about these men: ‘See, the Lord is coming with thousands upon thousands of his holy ones to judge everyone, and to convict all the ungodly of all the ungodly acts they have done in the ungodly way, and of all the harsh words ungodly sinners have spoken against him.’”

That means there were others that indeed walked with God without Religion .


There are so many perspectives Christian see this , so stop being fixated on one .

naijadeyhia:



Again Thread Closed!!

GrizzlyBear:


Still evading the premise of this thread...

I would have loved to present a well thought out reply to your question, but it would definitely devolve into an argument that would stray from the premise of this thread.

Please attend to the premise of this thread.

naijadeyhia:



Again Thread Closed!!

GrizzlyBear:


How does this close the thread? How about you? What's your own perspective? Or are you going to sheepishly cling on to someone else's like you usually do?

GrizzlyBear:
The adjective form of the noun Myopia is - Myopic.
Myopic means shortsighted. In the context of the premise of this thread, what I mean by myopic is the inability to see or reason beyond a limited or constrained scope.

Christians and muslims are not just myopic in their thinking, but also in their perception of their environment. Within this myopia, there is also a thread of selfishness that runs through it.

When one examines the beliefs of these people, one would notice that it's constrained to a limited radius. These people actually believe that the world and everything in it exists solely for the manifestation and fulfillment of their beliefs. They believe that everything that preceded the origin of their beliefs was designed to culminate in the birth and progress of their beliefs. In my opinion, this represents a huge problem. Because if anyone can reason this way, then I don't think such a person is intellectually competent to handle any position that requires reasoning.

Think about this. Christianity and Islam are roughly 2000 years old. Their mother religion, Judaism, is 6000 years old. The earth is over 4 billion years old. Biological species have existed since 3.5 billion years ago. Let's say humans didn't evolve from apes, okay. Let's just say the first humans miraculously originated from dust, since to religious people, this a more sensible and plausible explanation for our origin. Evidence from anthropology and paleontology suggests that modern humans have been existing for at least 60,000 years. But for the sake of most religious folks who believe that science is lying about this, let's say that modern humans have been existing for the past 10,000 years. No person with a functioning brain and a history textbook would argue against this.

Now, going by this agreed, needless hypothesis, it means that humans have been existing 4000 years or so before God decided to show himself to man. Now, this is the point where the myopia of religious people begins to unfold. Biological species have been existing for the past 3.5 billion years. This value shouldn't cause an argument. It's a scientific fact. If you deduct 6000 from 3.5 billion years, it wouldn't make much difference. It would still be a well over 3 billion years. Consider the amount of species that have existed throughout this time. Consider the genetic defects. Consider the deaths that have occurred. Consider the fact that 99% of every organism that ever existed throughout this time have gone extinct.

Religious people actually believe that all this happened so that it would pave a way for their religion to be established. Because when you think about it, life is like a domino. Everything that we are currently experiencing, was formed in a crucible of prior causes. So according to religious people, all the animals that died and all the pain they experienced was for the survival of a particular specie of that could be domesticated and sacrificed to a God, who surprisingly, liked the scent of their burning skin.

Now let's leave the animals and come to humans. Bear in mind that for the sake of ignorance, we are using the 10000 year old hypothesis. Now imagine what the humans species had to pass through between the year 10000BCE and 6000BCE. Humans at that time were hunter gatherers, moving aimlessly from place to place. An important question has to be raised at this point. Where was God then? Why didn't he show himself to these people then? Why did he have to wait 4000 years to do this?

Now lets consider the lives of these early humans. They didn't have sophisticated weapons then. All they had were crude tools. Definitely a lot of them would have died and lost their children to wild animals and harsh weather conditions. Religious people believe that all this happened just to pave a way for the manifestation of their religion.

Fast forward 6000 years into the future. It's 4000BCE. God has already appeared to the Jews. But the religion is solely theirs. The creator of the universe decided to choose a particular branch of humanity to bestow his love and care, while ignoring the remaining sect of his creations. Christians and Muslims also don't see anything wrong with this. I don't even think that their thoughts have ever wandered towards this space of thinking. So while the whole world was wallowing in darkness, the creator of the universe decided to show his light only the jews. Wow. It had to take 4000 years before he'd establish his true intentions by sending his son Jesus to the earth to die, or in the Islamic system of belief, Mohammed to be divinely inspired to pen the quran.

Now just examine the above. Does this make any sense? Our universe is about 13.8 billion years old. God, the creator of the universe, decided to wait for 13.8 billion years before he'd reveal his true intentions for creating it. Then probably less than 2500 years later, going by the whole christ is coming soon mantra, he'd destroy it. Does this in any way make sense?

So the whole point of creating the world with all the suffering and death and banality and all large space of time in between, was for Jesus christ to come and take people to heaven 2000 and something years after manifesting billions of years after the creation of this world?

Consider the socio-political wars that preceded christianity and Islam. Consider the empires that had to fall. The changes that had to be made and the people that had to bare the brunt of these changes by death and suffering. Christians and Muslims actually believe that all this happened for their beliefs to be revealed to the whole of mankind. These people believe that the world revolves around their beliefs. Christians believe that soon the world will end, and they would be taken to heaven, because that's been the whole point all along.

If there is a scale for intellectual myopia, these people should rank highest on this scale.

Smh.

GrizzlyBear:
The adjective form of the noun Myopia is - Myopic.
Myopic means shortsighted. In the context of the premise of this thread, what I mean by myopic is the inability to see or reason beyond a limited or constrained scope.

Christians and muslims are not just myopic in their thinking, but also in their perception of their environment. Within this myopia, there is also a thread of selfishness that runs through it.

When one examines the beliefs of these people, one would notice that it's constrained to a limited radius. These people actually believe that the world and everything in it exists solely for the manifestation and fulfillment of their beliefs[/i]. They believe that everything that preceded the origin of their beliefs was designed to culminate in the birth and progress of their beliefs. In my opinion, this represents a huge problem. Because if anyone can reason this way, then I don't think such a person is intellectually competent to handle any position that requires reasoning.

Think about this. Christianity and Islam are roughly 2000 years old. Their mother religion, Judaism, is 6000 years old. The earth is over 4 billion years old. Biological species have existed since 3.5 billion years ago. Let's say humans didn't evolve from apes, okay. Let's just say the first humans miraculously originated from dust, since to religious people, this a more sensible and plausible explanation for our origin. Evidence from anthropology and paleontology suggests that modern humans have been existing for at least 60,000 years. But for the sake of most religious folks who believe that science is lying about this, let's say that modern humans have been existing for the past 10,000 years. No person with a functioning brain and a history textbook would argue against this.

Now, going by this agreed, needless hypothesis, it means that humans have been existing 4000 years or so before God decided to show himself to man. Now, this is the point where the myopia of religious people begins to unfold. Biological species have been existing for the past 3.5 billion years. This value shouldn't cause an argument. It's a scientific fact. If you deduct 6000 from 3.5 billion years, it wouldn't make much difference. It would still be a well over 3 billion years. Consider the amount of species that have existed throughout this time. Consider the genetic defects. Consider the deaths that have occurred. Consider the fact that 99% of every organism that ever existed throughout this time have gone extinct.

Religious people actually believe that all this happened so that it would pave a way for their religion to be established. Because when you think about it, life is like a domino. Everything that we are currently experiencing, was formed in a crucible of prior causes. So according to religious people, all the animals that died and all the pain they experienced was for the survival of a particular specie of that could be domesticated and sacrificed to a God, who surprisingly, liked the scent of their burning skin.

Now let's leave the animals and come to humans. Bear in mind that for the sake of ignorance, we are using the 10000 year old hypothesis. Now imagine what the humans species had to pass through between the year 10000BCE and 6000BCE. Humans at that time were hunter gatherers, moving aimlessly from place to place. An important question has to be raised at this point. Where was God then? Why didn't he show himself to these people then? Why did he have to wait 4000 years to do this? [i]

Now lets consider the lives of these early humans. They didn't have sophisticated weapons then. All they had were crude tools. Definitely a lot of them would have died and lost their children to wild animals and harsh weather conditions. Religious people believe that all this happened just to pave a way for the manifestation of their religion.

Fast forward 6000 years into the future. It's 4000BCE. God has already appeared to the Jews. But the religion is solely theirs. The creator of the universe decided to choose a particular branch of humanity to bestow his love and care, while ignoring the remaining sect of his creations. Christians and Muslims also don't see anything wrong with this. I don't even think that their thoughts have ever wandered towards this space of thinking. So while the whole world was wallowing in darkness, the creator of the universe decided to show his light only the jews[/i]. Wow. It had to take 4000 years before he'd establish his true intentions by sending his son Jesus to the earth to die, or in the Islamic system of belief, Mohammed to be divinely inspired to pen the quran.

Now just examine the above. Does this make any sense? Our universe is about 13.8 billion years old. God, the creator of the universe, decided to wait for 13.8 billion years before he'd reveal his true intentions for creating it. Then probably less than 2500 years later, going by the whole christ is coming soon mantra, he'd destroy it. Does this in any way make sense?

So the whole point of creating the world with all the suffering and death and banality and all large space of time in between, was for Jesus christ to come and take people to heaven 2000 and something years after manifesting billions of years after the creation of this world?

Consider the socio-political wars that preceded christianity and Islam. Consider the empires that had to fall. The changes that had to be made and the people that had to bare the brunt of these changes by death and suffering. Christians and Muslims actually believe that all this happened for their beliefs to be revealed to the whole of mankind. These people believe that the world revolves around their beliefs. Christians believe that soon the world will end, and they would be taken to heaven, because that's been the whole point all along.

If there is a scale for intellectual myopia, these people should rank highest on this scale.

Smh.

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EyeHateGod:
@Auki do you know that Allah wasn't actually worshiped until Prophet Muhammad came into the Scene?

KingEbukasBlog:
There is young earth creationism - the belief earth is between 10,000 - 6000 years

There is Old Earth creationism - the belief earth is as old as science says it is

There is Progressive Creationism - the belief God created life gradually over millions of years

There is theistic evolution - The belief God used natural selection as a mechanism for creation

It is clear the OP is ignorant of these and how they could affect his argument

Thank you

Thread closed !

dalaman:


This only shows that there is confusion in christianity and that christians do not know what exactly to believe and as such they just keep making things up as they go. How can people that claim to have the word of God and are guided by some elusive holy Spirit hold such different and divergent views?

Doesn't this show you that christianity is just another man made venture? Which is the true position of the Christian God and what does the christian God want people to know about creation? Is there an entity that is as confused as the Christian God?

dalaman:


This only shows that there is confusion in christianity and that christians do not know what exactly to believe and as such they just keep making things up as they go. How can people that claim to have the word of God and are guided by some elusive holy Spirit hold such different and divergent views?

Doesn't this show you that christianity is just another man made venture? Which is the true position of the Christian God and what does the christian God want people to know about creation? Is there an entity that is as confused as the Christian God?

KingEbukasBlog:


There are atheists in Religion and have religious beliefs , and there are atheists who mock religion and religious beliefs , does that mean atheists are confused people ?

Christians follow Christ and believe in salvation of their soul . All these differing views don't matter . Your saved soul is all that matters . Accepting Christ as your Lord and personal saviour .

KingEbukasBlog:


There are atheists in Religion and have religious beliefs , and there are atheists who mock religion and religious beliefs , does that mean atheists are confused people ?

Christians follow Christ and believe in salvation of their soul . All these differing views don't matter . Your saved soul is all that matters . Accepting Christ as your Lord and personal saviour .

felixomor:
So its arheists that now have "long sightedness" or satan worshippers?

Mschewww

EyeHateGod:
@Auki do you know that Allah wasn't actually worshiped until Prophet Muhammad came into the Scene?

KingEbukasBlog:


Why are you butt-hurt

You believe that life is meaningless . So what do you tend to achieve by opening this thread ? Give me a reasonable response and I will take my time to refute every single sentence you have put up there .

KingEbukasBlog:


Its not a Red Herring . What is his gain if I abjure my belief in God ? What exactly would he gain ? Why should I pay attention to a proponent of Nihilism ? He believes lives is meaningless - do you how dangerous that is to hold such beliefs

EyeHateGod:
@Auki do you know that Allah wasn't actually worshiped until Prophet Muhammad came into the Scene?

Auki:


Who is Allah?
Often one hears the Arabic word “Allah” being used in discussions regarding Islam.

This is certainly not the case, since the Pure Monotheism of Islam calls all people to the worship of the God of Noah, Abraham, Moses, Jesus and all the other prophets, peace be upon them.

dalaman:


Noah, Abraham, Moses and Jesus do not know any Allah. Allah is the invention of Mohammed and his cronies.