Dtruthspeaker:


MuttleyLaff in the house , welcome back! Hope all is well again?

truespeak:


Check the date he last posted!

Somebody obviously raised up this months old thread!

brainhgeek:


I am so sure nothing would have happened o he didn't fulfill His vow.

truespeak:


Even in spite of and against Judges 11:39 which expressly stated he did?

"And it came to pass at the end of two months, that she returned unto her father, who did with her according to his vow which he had vowed: .

Meaning he fulfilled his vow!

brainhgeek:


That was a typo from me. The 'o' was meant to be an 'if'. If you read the body of the response, you would have seen the direction the sentence was heading.
Of course, he did sacrificed her as a burnt offering according to what he promised

truespeak:


Alright then!

But in answer to your thinking nothing would happen, not true o!

He of his own will and volition made a very wicked vow knowing there is no going back on it and that he must fulfill it or incur the wrath of God!

And he intended to fulfill it without mercy thinking another not his own would be caught by it.

Thus now he was caught by his very vows and his wicked heart and evil intentions!

And so as he would not have shown mercy to another who would have been caught by his wickedness, so mercy would not be given him if he failed to fulfill his vows!

Which is why to save himself from the evil to come to him, he sacrificed his daughter!

brainhgeek:


This probably is an error of assumption.

brainhgeek:

Before Jephthah made the rash vow, God had already made huma sacrifices a sin ( Deut 12:30-31 ).

brainhgeek:

Can you imagine a just lawmaker who made a law to be an accomplice in breaking the very law he instituted?

brainhgeek:
Jephthah wouldn't be the only one who made a vow and broke it in the nearest old testament times;
Samson was a nazarite and by virtue the vows of a nazarite, he shouldn't touch dead bodies. As we know, he killed lot of people and touched them (Judges 15:7-8
David vowed to wipe out Nabal's family but he ended up marrying his widow, Abigail. Saul vowed that none of his men would eat nothing until evening and anyone who did would die but Jonathan, his son did eat honey and Saul eventually did not kill him. I am sure you have made a vow to do or not to do something if God did something for you, how many of those vows have you kept? In all of these cases, nothing bad happened that could be linked to the broken vows.

brainhgeek:
God had no hand in the sacrifice of Jephthah which is similar to the pagan worship of molech which God had condemned. It was a sinful vow

truespeak:


There is no error nor assumption in my presentation neither did you point out where I erred!

For you said, you did not think anything would happen if he did not fulfill his vow!

To which I have answered you to the effect that God hates wickedness in any and all forms!

And the Law is against the doing of Wickedness!

And the doing of Wickedness brings Wickedness back to you!

And did it not in the case of Japheth?

For now he was bound to fulfill the Wickedness he had planned for another on himself thus the sacrifice of his daughter!

Which he did!

Case closed!



I had already answered this in my earlier statement in this thread, to wit:
"Jephthah wickedly vowed to offer a human being as a burnt sacrifice to God in contradiction to the Law of God which specifically and expressly stated animal sacrifice even down to the types of animals and no where did He demand or request a human!

So offence 1- going against the law of God on sacrifice!
Offence 2. - wickedness against his fellow human in choosing a human rather than choice animals for the sacrifice!"



No complicity from God, for God was innocent of the matter thus could not be complicit.

It is rather all Japheth's offence and doing which he bore by himself thus only him and his suffered from his offence!

Which is the Law!



The question is why?

Because as I told you the Law is on Good and for the doing of Good!

Check all those cases you mentioned above and you would find the good that caused a revocation of the vows!

In the case of Samson was he not sent by God to torment and destroy the Philistines which he was verily doing?

So no wrong here!

Abigail did a very good thing which pleased David and brought about good to herself and family!

Again good, no wrong!

For Jonathan, was is not the people that saved him from Saul's unreasonable curse on whomsoever should eat, when every one was hungry?

Thus Jonathan was saved and Saul shamed for the people were ready to turn on him.

Again the Law is on the doing of Good!

Did you see this play out in Japheth's case?

No!

No one came to the rescue of his daughter for any would be horrified at his Wicked vow to burn a human and all stood aside!

For it could have been them!

Therefore he bore his wickedness by himself!




I have already taken care of this!

brainhgeek:

There are obvious misconceptions in some areas.
When I said 'error of assumption', I was referring to Jephthah assuming God accepted his (Jephthah's) unholy bargain of a human sacrifice.Before Jeph became a judge, Isreal had turned to the worship of the gods of the Ammonites and philistines. They worshipped Ba'al and his female version, ashera or ashtar. In some of these worship rites, burnt sacrifices were made to these gods, reports include the sacrifice of children to them. That could have been a reason Jephthah was quick to make an offer of a human sacrifice reward for God giving him victory. He was quick to run into an error of assumption that God consented to the act

brainhgeek:

Another area I do not totally agree with in your rejoinder is that you mentioned that Jephthah vowed because of the wickedness in his heart. The way you painted it sounds as if it was deliberate, premeditated wickedness on someone else, with an obvious exclusion of his only child. There is no part of the bible that gave a pointer to this exegesis. I do not see it as thus. In fact, in that bible passage, Jeph said in Jdg 11:31
' then it will occur, whatever comes forth from the doors of my house, •coming forth to meet me at my return- in peace from the sons of Ammon, it will become Yahweh's, and I will coffer it up as an ascent offering.' He cared the less whether it be an animal, human, or member of his household.

brainhgeek:

It was a careless, unholy, sinful vow to which God wouldn't put His signature to.

brainhgeek:


For those who broke their vows, like David, I don't see a righteous good in killing a man and inheriting his wife. David of course had a bad reputation for women. Sparing Abigail to marry her was no reason good enough to break his vow.

brainhgeek:


You also didn't mention if you had made a vow not to do or to do something if God did something for you and how many of those promises you have kept or broken.

brainhgeek:
to

All these are pointers to the fact that we are all fallible human needing grace. That is why Jesus mentioned that we should not even take an oath but be simple with our words, 'yes' or 'no'

truespeak:


Good thing you have stated the error is not mine but according to you Jephthah's!

Nonetheless, the issue is not if God accepted or consented to his wicked sacrifice but that you did not think anything would happen if he did not fulfill his vows which I have verily addressed and settled!



You have conveniently overlooked Judges 11:35 which clearly opposes you and supports me for it stated that "And it came to pass, when he saw her, that he rent his clothes, and said, Alas, my daughter! thou hast brought me very low, and thou art one of them that trouble me: for I have opened my mouth unto the Lord, and I cannot go back."

Meaning if he had known it was his daughter who would be sacrificed, he would not have made that vow!

Meaning he cared that it was his daughter meaning he was expecting it to be someone else!

Ehen! So E good make another person burn eh!

Is this not wickedness?

Thus you fall again!



I have answered this already, so you repeat yourself and fall again!


Was it not Abigail's good I stated stopped evil to herself and family? Where did I mention anything about David doing a good?

See because you cannot answer you seek to cheat and allude to me what is not mine!

Thus you fall again!


The issue is not with me but with Jephthah!

Thus making this a non-issue and not worthy of a response!

Another fall!


Again, another non-issue!

And a further fall!

FatherOfJesus:
My guy

truespeak:


You be character!