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Debunking All Distortions About History Of Yorubas Through Ifa & Science by IjapaTiroko: 11:12am On Aug 22, 2022
UFE LANDS: IS THIS ILE IFE THE ROOT OF HUMANITY?

RESPONSE TO THE VOICE OF OMO'OBA ONIJEBU ON "ILE-IFE OR UGBOMOKUN: THE NEED TO UNDERSTAND THE FANTASY OF EUROPEAN COLONIAL ROGUES!
By Akoda Awo

"I will respond to the questions on the above topic. The response stems from the fact that our history is being mangled out of shape just because we have allowed foreigners (and local stooges) to define who we are and where we come from.

The information on Wikipedia regarding the Ooni dynasty and Oduduwa is nothing but a fallacy. It stated that the Ooni dynasty existed before the reign of Oduduwa, which historians have argued to have been between the 7th to 9th centuries A.D.

We need to be careful with what we put on social media; information is a powerful tool that can shape people's lives for better or worse. As an Ifa practitioner, I will respond to the following questions asked.
+ Was this Ile-Ife not Ugbomokun before now?
+ Did Obatala and Oduduwa ruled over Ugbomokun?
+ Are Obatala, Ogun, Oduduwa, etc. 800 to 1100AD (1,600 years old) existence in this world?
+ Was Oduduwa from Mecca or from Israel and amongst the children of Abraham?
+ How many Ufe Lands existed or were mentioned inside IFA CORPUS?
+ How many years old can we say IFA CORPUS has been existing?
+ What's the definition of IGBA IWASE, or is IGBA IWASE different from Before Common Era (BCE)?
+ Was IFA CORPUS, Before Common Era (BCE) or After Death Of Jesus Christ (A.D.)?

It is unfortunate that most Yoruba indigenes, including traditional Obas, supposedly the custodians of tradition and history, cannot even give a true account of their own historical origin without recourse to written accounts and standards set by foreigners and or conquerors in today's global and religious affairs.

Apparently, their ignorance and mental slavery had jaundiced their reasoning, and they could not differentiate between Western education and civilization.

My question is, why is it so difficult to set our own "tradometrics" to measure our standards and develop our chronological dating based on socio-cultural and anthropological landmarks in our own God-given body of knowledge (Ifa)? We need to know at what point in history did the Irunmole (such as Oduduwa, Orunmila, Ogun, Esu, Obatala, Sango, Osun, etc.) inhabit the earth? Which event preceded which?

These and many more questions are begging for answers. We need to get our history straight and remove all fallacies created and forced on us by historians whose biased accounts were mere assertions by assumptions without adequate empirical evidence to support their claims.

Let me begin with "Igba Iwase," which simply means the primeval time at the beginning of creations. Igba iwase is beyond the confines of this planet earth as it dates back to the beginning of time when the universe was created. This is explained briefly in the verse of Osa Ogunda, which reads in part thus:

Iri tu wili tu wili
Iri tu wili tu wili
Iri tu wili-wili
Koo tu reke-reke
Difa fun Origun ti nloo seda ibu orun ati aye nigba ijinji
Nigba iwase

Translation:
May the dew burst gently
May the dew burst rapidly
May the dew burst continuously
And be so vast throughout the expanse
These were the declarations of Ifá for Origun
When going to create the vast expanse of the universe

At the beginning of time and creations (animate and inanimate) From the above stanza, the creation of the universe, in the beginning, was done in stages by different universal and supernatural beings who were being controlled by an unfathomable universal spirit of the universe (some call it Akamara; others call it Olodumare).

According to Ifa, Origun breathed into a speck of sand with a divine command of Akamara, and suddenly the speck busted with a profuse emission of dew continuously with so much fog scattered all over the entire space. This action continued for so long a time throughout the vast expanse of the universe.

The whole story of this primeval dew and creation is beyond the scope of this discourse. Igba Iwase can also be used to denote the beginning of human existence on earth. Whichever way it is, Igba Iwase can imply Before Common Era (BCE).

Understanding all about Ife civilizations and Igba Iwase cannot be possible if we base our account on the history taught in schools because history itself is based on speculations, assumptions, and assertions.

For me to delve into the discussion on the primordial Ife, there is a need to understand it through the lens of scientific comprehension (archeological, social anthropological landmarks, and ethnographical features), historic angle (events, date and time of the event, location of the event), and of course Ifa perspective.

SCIENTIFIC:
According to the Smithsonian National Museum of Natural history, humans first evolved in Africa, and much of human evolution occurred on that continent.
The fossils of early humans who lived between 6 and 2 million years ago come entirely from Africa. Humans are primates. Physical and genetic similarities show that the modern human species, Homo sapiens, has a very close relationship to another group of primate species, the apes. Humans and the great apes (large apes) of Africa -- chimpanzees (including bonobos, or so-called "pygmy chimpanzees"wink and gorillas -- share a common ancestor that lived between 8 and 6 million years ago.

In a New York Herald Tribune published in 1995, at least two recent findings suggest that the large-brained species known as Homo Erectus migrated out of Africa just under 2 million years ago. The Homo Erectus were known to immediately precede today's humans Homo Sapiens on the evolutionary tree.

Archeological evidence has dated the earliest human skeleton found in Yoruba land (Iho Eleru near Akure) to be between the 8th and 10th millennium B.C.

Judging from the ethnographic features such as oriki (lineage praise names) and some sources that suggest that this archeological site (Iho Eleru, some spell it Iwo Eleru) belongs to parts of the present Ondo and Ekiti States. This site was believed to be originally called Ife Akelubebe or Ife Atelubebe, which was dated historically between 20,000 and 10,000 years B.C.


Regarding the scientific evidence through archeological excavations of artifacts in various sites/compounds in Ile Ife, Ile Ife was believed to have been first occupied at least as early as the 1st millennium C.E. It was most populous and important to the Ife culture during the 14th and 15th centuries C.E, and it is considered the traditional birthplace of the Yoruba civilization, of the latter part of the African Iron Age.

The excavation sites included Wumonije Osangangan Obamakin grove on the Modakeke side of Ile Ife, Lafogido, Odo Ogbe, Obalara, Iwunrin, Orun-Oba-Ado (a place believed to be the final burial place for the past Benin rulers).

For example, Ifè terracotta – 1000 and 1400 AD, Ìfẹ́ bronze head - 14th - 15th-century C.E. History Yoruba historians such Olumide Lucas, Samuel Johnson, Saburi Biobaku, Prof. Aderibigbe, Bolaji Idowu, etc., all have different accounts regarding the origin of the Yorubas.

While some proposed the Yoruba Egyptian origin, some proposed the Palestine/Mesopotamia origin, and others proposed the Arabian Mecca origin. Even though some accounts agree at some points, especially with regard to the ancient Ife origin, there has not been a consensus regarding where the people of Ife originated from.

What was evident was that the ancient Egyptians and the Yorubas have similarities in terms of anthropological and ethnographical features. These features include language, religious beliefs, religious ideas and practices, and traditional customs concerning names of persons, places, objects, etc.

One important commonality I found among these (above) historians is that they all practiced foreign religions and leaned towards their religious affiliations in rendering their accounts.

Almost all were Christians except Saburi Biobaku, who was a Muslim. When Biobaku gave an account of the Arabian Mecca origin, Samuel Johnson argued against it and pitched his tent with Olumide Lucas, a fellow Christian, about the Egyptian origin but added that the Yorubas hailing from upper Egypt, were either Coptic Christians or at any rate they had some knowledge of Christianity. What a contradiction!

If the origin of the Yorubas could be traced to ancient Egypt, which predated Christianity according to their accounts, where then or how did the Yorubas become Coptic Christians? If Samuel Johnson were to be alive today, he would have been in the best position to answer this question.

The Oduduwa being referred to by historians was more of a collective personality and era of a particular race rather than a single personality.

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Re: Debunking All Distortions About History Of Yorubas Through Ifa & Science by muyico(m): 2:03pm On Aug 22, 2022
IjapaTiroko:
UFE LANDS: IS THIS ILE IFE THE ROOT OF HUMANITY?

RESPONSE TO THE VOICE OF OMO'OBA ONIJEBU ON "ILE-IFE OR UGBOMOKUN: THE NEED TO UNDERSTAND THE FANTASY OF EUROPEAN COLONIAL ROGUES!
By Akoda Awo

"I will respond to the questions on the above topic. The response stems from the fact that our history is being mangled out of shape just because we have allowed foreigners (and local stooges) to define who we are and where we come from.

The information on Wikipedia regarding the Ooni dynasty and Oduduwa is nothing but a fallacy. It stated that the Ooni dynasty existed before the reign of Oduduwa, which historians have argued to have been between the 7th to 9th centuries A.D.

We need to be careful with what we put on social media; information is a powerful tool that can shape people's lives for better or worse. As an Ifa practitioner, I will respond to the following questions asked.
+ Was this Ile-Ife not Ugbomokun before now?
+ Did Obatala and Oduduwa ruled over Ugbomokun?
+ Are Obatala, Ogun, Oduduwa, etc. 800 to 1100AD (1,600 years old) existence in this world?
+ Was Oduduwa from Mecca or from Israel and amongst the children of Abraham?
+ How many Ufe Lands existed or were mentioned inside IFA CORPUS?
+ How many years old can we say IFA CORPUS has been existing?
+ What's the definition of IGBA IWASE, or is IGBA IWASE different from Before Common Era (BCE)?
+ Was IFA CORPUS, Before Common Era (BCE) or After Death Of Jesus Christ (A.D.)?

It is unfortunate that most Yoruba indigenes, including traditional Obas, supposedly the custodians of tradition and history, cannot even give a true account of their own historical origin without recourse to written accounts and standards set by foreigners and or conquerors in today's global and religious affairs.

Apparently, their ignorance and mental slavery had jaundiced their reasoning, and they could not differentiate between Western education and civilization.

My question is, why is it so difficult to set our own "tradometrics" to measure our standards and develop our chronological dating based on socio-cultural and anthropological landmarks in our own God-given body of knowledge (Ifa)? We need to know at what point in history did the Irunmole (such as Oduduwa, Orunmila, Ogun, Esu, Obatala, Sango, Osun, etc.) inhabit the earth? Which event preceded which?

These and many more questions are begging for answers. We need to get our history straight and remove all fallacies created and forced on us by historians whose biased accounts were mere assertions by assumptions without adequate empirical evidence to support their claims.

Let me begin with "Igba Iwase," which simply means the primeval time at the beginning of creations. Igba iwase is beyond the confines of this planet earth as it dates back to the beginning of time when the universe was created. This is explained briefly in the verse of Osa Ogunda, which reads in part thus:

Iri tu wili tu wili
Iri tu wili tu wili
Iri tu wili-wili
Koo tu reke-reke
Difa fun Origun ti nloo seda ibu orun ati aye nigba ijinji
Nigba iwase

Translation:
May the dew burst gently
May the dew burst rapidly
May the dew burst continuously
And be so vast throughout the expanse
These were the declarations of Ifá for Origun
When going to create the vast expanse of the universe

At the beginning of time and creations (animate and inanimate) From the above stanza, the creation of the universe, in the beginning, was done in stages by different universal and supernatural beings who were being controlled by an unfathomable universal spirit of the universe (some call it Akamara; others call it Olodumare).

According to Ifa, Origun breathed into a speck of sand with a divine command of Akamara, and suddenly the speck busted with a profuse emission of dew continuously with so much fog scattered all over the entire space. This action continued for so long a time throughout the vast expanse of the universe.

The whole story of this primeval dew and creation is beyond the scope of this discourse. Igba Iwase can also be used to denote the beginning of human existence on earth. Whichever way it is, Igba Iwase can imply Before Common Era (BCE).

Understanding all about Ife civilizations and Igba Iwase cannot be possible if we base our account on the history taught in schools because history itself is based on speculations, assumptions, and assertions.

For me to delve into the discussion on the primordial Ife, there is a need to understand it through the lens of scientific comprehension (archeological, social anthropological landmarks, and ethnographical features), historic angle (events, date and time of the event, location of the event), and of course Ifa perspective.

SCIENTIFIC:
According to the Smithsonian National Museum of Natural history, humans first evolved in Africa, and much of human evolution occurred on that continent.
The fossils of early humans who lived between 6 and 2 million years ago come entirely from Africa. Humans are primates. Physical and genetic similarities show that the modern human species, Homo sapiens, has a very close relationship to another group of primate species, the apes. Humans and the great apes (large apes) of Africa -- chimpanzees (including bonobos, or so-called "pygmy chimpanzees"wink and gorillas -- share a common ancestor that lived between 8 and 6 million years ago.

In a New York Herald Tribune published in 1995, at least two recent findings suggest that the large-brained species known as Homo Erectus migrated out of Africa just under 2 million years ago. The Homo Erectus were known to immediately precede today's humans Homo Sapiens on the evolutionary tree.

Archeological evidence has dated the earliest human skeleton found in Yoruba land (Iho Eleru near Akure) to be between the 8th and 10th millennium B.C.

Judging from the ethnographic features such as oriki (lineage praise names) and some sources that suggest that this archeological site (Iho Eleru, some spell it Iwo Eleru) belongs to parts of the present Ondo and Ekiti States. This site was believed to be originally called Ife Akelubebe or Ife Atelubebe, which was dated historically between 20,000 and 10,000 years B.C.


Regarding the scientific evidence through archeological excavations of artifacts in various sites/compounds in Ile Ife, Ile Ife was believed to have been first occupied at least as early as the 1st millennium C.E. It was most populous and important to the Ife culture during the 14th and 15th centuries C.E, and it is considered the traditional birthplace of the Yoruba civilization, of the latter part of the African Iron Age.

The excavation sites included Wumonije Osangangan Obamakin grove on the Modakeke side of Ile Ife, Lafogido, Odo Ogbe, Obalara, Iwunrin, Orun-Oba-Ado (a place believed to be the final burial place for the past Benin rulers).

For example, Ifè terracotta – 1000 and 1400 AD, Ìfẹ́ bronze head - 14th - 15th-century C.E. History Yoruba historians such Olumide Lucas, Samuel Johnson, Saburi Biobaku, Prof. Aderibigbe, Bolaji Idowu, etc., all have different accounts regarding the origin of the Yorubas.

While some proposed the Yoruba Egyptian origin, some proposed the Palestine/Mesopotamia origin, and others proposed the Arabian Mecca origin. Even though some accounts agree at some points, especially with regard to the ancient Ife origin, there has not been a consensus regarding where the people of Ife originated from.

What was evident was that the ancient Egyptians and the Yorubas have similarities in terms of anthropological and ethnographical features. These features include language, religious beliefs, religious ideas and practices, and traditional customs concerning names of persons, places, objects, etc.

One important commonality I found among these (above) historians is that they all practiced foreign religions and leaned towards their religious affiliations in rendering their accounts.

Almost all were Christians except Saburi Biobaku, who was a Muslim. When Biobaku gave an account of the Arabian Mecca origin, Samuel Johnson argued against it and pitched his tent with Olumide Lucas, a fellow Christian, about the Egyptian origin but added that the Yorubas hailing from upper Egypt, were either Coptic Christians or at any rate they had some knowledge of Christianity. What a contradiction!

If the origin of the Yorubas could be traced to ancient Egypt, which predated Christianity according to their accounts, where then or how did the Yorubas become Coptic Christians? If Samuel Johnson were to be alive today, he would have been in the best position to answer this question.

The Oduduwa being referred to by historians was more of a collective personality and era of a particular race rather than a single personality.

2 Likes

Re: Debunking All Distortions About History Of Yorubas Through Ifa & Science by Olu317(m): 2:14pm On Aug 22, 2022
Interesting @OP but Oduduwa in ifáodù was the one who the kingship over the earth was handed over to. In Ẹlẹ́mẹrẹ̀ Méjì,
There was problem between oduduwa and Orìṣànlá Òsèrèmàgbò when the former was made king of all kings upon the earth.

Then Osèrèmàgbo conjured negativity and chaos upon earth that humanbeings were dying, drought , death of animals etc.
Out of helplessness,Orúnmìlà came to the rescue of oduduwa by reversing the negativism and chaos to productivity and wellbeing of all things that God created.

Secondly, there was nothing like Ooni dynasty in the previous era before Oduduwa. The leadership system was rotational among the three major groups that became thirteen huts or groups.

So, no Ooni iléifẹ before Ogún dynasty. Instead, Olúfẹ was the title being used.Ooni ifẹ means, Owner of the vast land inclusive humans, beast, etc .
Re: Debunking All Distortions About History Of Yorubas Through Ifa & Science by Quintopia: 11:38pm On Sep 06, 2022
Just about every major ethnic group in Nigeria is descended from settlers from the Nile Valley and the Levant.

West Africa was very sparsely populated, perhaps only by a few pygmies, in ancient antiquity. Majority of black Africans lived in the north, north east, east, and south of Africa.
Re: Debunking All Distortions About History Of Yorubas Through Ifa & Science by XAUBulls: 10:47pm On Jan 01, 2023
IjapaTiroko:
UFE LANDS: IS THIS ILE IFE THE ROOT OF HUMANITY?

RESPONSE TO THE VOICE OF OMO'OBA ONIJEBU ON "ILE-IFE OR UGBOMOKUN: THE NEED TO UNDERSTAND THE FANTASY OF EUROPEAN COLONIAL ROGUES!
By Akoda Awo

"I will respond to the questions on the above topic. The response stems from the fact that our history is being mangled out of shape just because we have allowed foreigners (and local stooges) to define who we are and where we come from.

The information on Wikipedia regarding the Ooni dynasty and Oduduwa is nothing but a fallacy. It stated that the Ooni dynasty existed before the reign of Oduduwa, which historians have argued to have been between the 7th to 9th centuries A.D.

We need to be careful with what we put on social media; information is a powerful tool that can shape people's lives for better or worse. As an Ifa practitioner, I will respond to the following questions asked.
+ Was this Ile-Ife not Ugbomokun before now?
+ Did Obatala and Oduduwa ruled over Ugbomokun?
+ Are Obatala, Ogun, Oduduwa, etc. 800 to 1100AD (1,600 years old) existence in this world?
+ Was Oduduwa from Mecca or from Israel and amongst the children of Abraham?
+ How many Ufe Lands existed or were mentioned inside IFA CORPUS?
+ How many years old can we say IFA CORPUS has been existing?
+ What's the definition of IGBA IWASE, or is IGBA IWASE different from Before Common Era (BCE)?
+ Was IFA CORPUS, Before Common Era (BCE) or After Death Of Jesus Christ (A.D.)?

It is unfortunate that most Yoruba indigenes, including traditional Obas, supposedly the custodians of tradition and history, cannot even give a true account of their own historical origin without recourse to written accounts and standards set by foreigners and or conquerors in today's global and religious affairs.

Apparently, their ignorance and mental slavery had jaundiced their reasoning, and they could not differentiate between Western education and civilization.

My question is, why is it so difficult to set our own "tradometrics" to measure our standards and develop our chronological dating based on socio-cultural and anthropological landmarks in our own God-given body of knowledge (Ifa)? We need to know at what point in history did the Irunmole (such as Oduduwa, Orunmila, Ogun, Esu, Obatala, Sango, Osun, etc.) inhabit the earth? Which event preceded which?

These and many more questions are begging for answers. We need to get our history straight and remove all fallacies created and forced on us by historians whose biased accounts were mere assertions by assumptions without adequate empirical evidence to support their claims.

Let me begin with "Igba Iwase," which simply means the primeval time at the beginning of creations. Igba iwase is beyond the confines of this planet earth as it dates back to the beginning of time when the universe was created. This is explained briefly in the verse of Osa Ogunda, which reads in part thus:

Iri tu wili tu wili
Iri tu wili tu wili
Iri tu wili-wili
Koo tu reke-reke
Difa fun Origun ti nloo seda ibu orun ati aye nigba ijinji
Nigba iwase

Translation:
May the dew burst gently
May the dew burst rapidly
May the dew burst continuously
And be so vast throughout the expanse
These were the declarations of Ifá for Origun
When going to create the vast expanse of the universe

At the beginning of time and creations (animate and inanimate) From the above stanza, the creation of the universe, in the beginning, was done in stages by different universal and supernatural beings who were being controlled by an unfathomable universal spirit of the universe (some call it Akamara; others call it Olodumare).

According to Ifa, Origun breathed into a speck of sand with a divine command of Akamara, and suddenly the speck busted with a profuse emission of dew continuously with so much fog scattered all over the entire space. This action continued for so long a time throughout the vast expanse of the universe.

The whole story of this primeval dew and creation is beyond the scope of this discourse. Igba Iwase can also be used to denote the beginning of human existence on earth. Whichever way it is, Igba Iwase can imply Before Common Era (BCE).

Understanding all about Ife civilizations and Igba Iwase cannot be possible if we base our account on the history taught in schools because history itself is based on speculations, assumptions, and assertions.

For me to delve into the discussion on the primordial Ife, there is a need to understand it through the lens of scientific comprehension (archeological, social anthropological landmarks, and ethnographical features), historic angle (events, date and time of the event, location of the event), and of course Ifa perspective.

SCIENTIFIC:
According to the Smithsonian National Museum of Natural history, humans first evolved in Africa, and much of human evolution occurred on that continent.
The fossils of early humans who lived between 6 and 2 million years ago come entirely from Africa. Humans are primates. Physical and genetic similarities show that the modern human species, Homo sapiens, has a very close relationship to another group of primate species, the apes. Humans and the great apes (large apes) of Africa -- chimpanzees (including bonobos, or so-called "pygmy chimpanzees"wink and gorillas -- share a common ancestor that lived between 8 and 6 million years ago.

In a New York Herald Tribune published in 1995, at least two recent findings suggest that the large-brained species known as Homo Erectus migrated out of Africa just under 2 million years ago. The Homo Erectus were known to immediately precede today's humans Homo Sapiens on the evolutionary tree.

Archeological evidence has dated the earliest human skeleton found in Yoruba land (Iho Eleru near Akure) to be between the 8th and 10th millennium B.C.

Judging from the ethnographic features such as oriki (lineage praise names) and some sources that suggest that this archeological site (Iho Eleru, some spell it Iwo Eleru) belongs to parts of the present Ondo and Ekiti States. This site was believed to be originally called Ife Akelubebe or Ife Atelubebe, which was dated historically between 20,000 and 10,000 years B.C.


Regarding the scientific evidence through archeological excavations of artifacts in various sites/compounds in Ile Ife, Ile Ife was believed to have been first occupied at least as early as the 1st millennium C.E. It was most populous and important to the Ife culture during the 14th and 15th centuries C.E, and it is considered the traditional birthplace of the Yoruba civilization, of the latter part of the African Iron Age.

The excavation sites included Wumonije Osangangan Obamakin grove on the Modakeke side of Ile Ife, Lafogido, Odo Ogbe, Obalara, Iwunrin, Orun-Oba-Ado (a place believed to be the final burial place for the past Benin rulers).

For example, Ifè terracotta – 1000 and 1400 AD, Ìfẹ́ bronze head - 14th - 15th-century C.E. History Yoruba historians such Olumide Lucas, Samuel Johnson, Saburi Biobaku, Prof. Aderibigbe, Bolaji Idowu, etc., all have different accounts regarding the origin of the Yorubas.

While some proposed the Yoruba Egyptian origin, some proposed the Palestine/Mesopotamia origin, and others proposed the Arabian Mecca origin. Even though some accounts agree at some points, especially with regard to the ancient Ife origin, there has not been a consensus regarding where the people of Ife originated from.

What was evident was that the ancient Egyptians and the Yorubas have similarities in terms of anthropological and ethnographical features. These features include language, religious beliefs, religious ideas and practices, and traditional customs concerning names of persons, places, objects, etc.

One important commonality I found among these (above) historians is that they all practiced foreign religions and leaned towards their religious affiliations in rendering their accounts.

Almost all were Christians except Saburi Biobaku, who was a Muslim. When Biobaku gave an account of the Arabian Mecca origin, Samuel Johnson argued against it and pitched his tent with Olumide Lucas, a fellow Christian, about the Egyptian origin but added that the Yorubas hailing from upper Egypt, were either Coptic Christians or at any rate they had some knowledge of Christianity. What a contradiction!

If the origin of the Yorubas could be traced to ancient Egypt, which predated Christianity according to their accounts, where then or how did the Yorubas become Coptic Christians? If Samuel Johnson were to be alive today, he would have been in the best position to answer this question.

The Oduduwa being referred to by historians was more of a collective personality and era of a particular race rather than a single personality.

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Re: Debunking All Distortions About History Of Yorubas Through Ifa & Science by AreaFada2: 3:53am On Jan 02, 2023
Interesting thread.

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