hello guys the issue of this demo thing is really a problem, i did a demo for a coy called BARGAINERS with all the sweet mouth i did the demo, and i sent it out to them and it was suppose to be submited let say on saturday and on monday they will right cheque or bring cash whatever uptill now not even a call, i spend much time on the demo and i did my best the guy who link me up saw it and they like it.

but uptill now not even call brother. i woun't be suprise if they will give it to a N4,000 guy at Computer village to copy my layout and do samething,

Like same issue for a fashion designer, the guy who also link me up to the manager said if i can create a demo for him to see, the so called guy knew little of HTML after charging N200,000 for the site ooooo my HTML guy collected the demo uptill now i didn't see him oooo infact i will say he ran cos after giving him the demo, he disappeared.

Sometimes i just get fraustrated about the whole thing called WEB

i don't really get. Do you give clients your demo. Man, na show i dey show them o. I don't give clients the files for the demo. except they have paid somthing (atleast 30% of whatever charge). Dont ever give any client your files o! Even if it's a multi whatever company.

The normal thing is you present the demo, you both review the demo, take down changes e.t.c and when you are done carry your laptop or flash back to your house. Don't leave anything. Except its a client you cant trust (meaning they have given you part payment or something).

@smartsoft,

How many times will I tell you never to do a demo for free?

If anyone wants a demo make sure it is being paid for.

No matter how serious you think these people are don't waste your time because they will ask about 3 or 4 other people for the same thing and later take the best from all of them.

evergie contacted me for a school project he claimed he was doing for a bank, he even sent me a copy of one website he claimed the bank asked him to better and the money will be made available.

I insisted on getting N30,000.00 for the demo and that is after I confirm that the money is in my account. He kept making promises about going to pay N10,000.00 today, N10,000.00 the second day and I kept reminding him that anytime the money is in my account I will do the demo.

He refused to answer his calls neither would he respond to chat messages even when he was always calling and sending text messages before hoping that promises will be enough to make me do the demo after he realized that I wouldn't even write a single line of code without the cash.

There are so many evergie's out there, your portfolio or past projects should be enough to convince a client on your capability, if the person wants a demo then charge for it.

@Afam
I never heard a fool talk that way. Your price was too cheap for such a big project, that i don't believe you could deliver. And your home page is not impressive at all. A portal with much modules needs an experienced develop. If you cares to know, i got a better guy, believe it or not he did it for free. And i won the project.
Afam please post the link to your previous jobs so we can all review it. You claim you are on every business (power, energy, forex, stocks, etc), so tell me and my fellow nairalander whats your area of expertise. Afam please improve on your so called previous job or homepage www.afamnnaji.com , there is no sign of core programming on your job, just normal HTML.

I am presently seeking for developer for out right employment, i dnt even need people like you because you are so worthless. People like you kill this web business, cheap, jobless, lousy, infact I don't even know what to qualify you with. Hungry programmer.

Please compare this site to afam's homepage http://www.netxpertsolutions.com, which will you like to work with?

evergie:

@Afam
I never heard a fool talk that way. Your price was too cheap for such a big project, that i don't believe you could deliver. And your home page is not impressive at all. A portal with much modules needs an experienced develop. If you cares to know, i got a better guy, believe it or not he did it for free. And i won the project.

Too cheap for the demo that you spent time and money begging for the price to come down? You contacted me, over over a period of 10 days, you asked for my bank account after going through some sites, you are sounding as if you saw an advertisement somewhere.

The person could even pay you self for him to do the demo, it is not my headache but yours.

evergie:

Afam please post the link to your previous jobs so we can all review it. You claim you are on every business (power, energy, forex, stocks, etc), so tell me and my fellow nairalander whats your area of expertise. Afam please improve on your so called previous job or homepage www.afamnnaji.com , there is no sign of core programming on your job, just normal HTML.

Sorry, I am into 2 things, web solutions and alternative energy, I don't do stocks, forex etc.

evergie:

I am presently seeking for developer for out right employment, i dnt even need people like you because you are so worthless. People like you kill this web business, cheap, jobless, lousy, infact I don't even know what to qualify you with. Hungry programmer.

Please compare this site to afam's homepage http://www.netxpertsolutions.com, which will you like to work with?

The last time I spoke with you was when you told me on phone that you were in a bus and that you will be making payment into my account and that I should just go ahead and start (a day after collecting my business bank details).

So, when did you realize all these? I just hope you don't go about collecting people's bank details and using same for fraud because that will be your greatest undoing.

Don't worry Everestus your details will be effortlessly sent to the EFCC anyday any scam is related to my bank account, that is a promise I intend to fulfill.

I won't go into comparing my websites with others as that would be childish but obtaining bank details with possible usage for fraud is one think that will keep you out of circulation for quite a long time.

As a matter of fact I will do an official letter to my bank informing them that my account details may have fallen into the hands of a fraudster along with your full names. At least it will make life easier for me should you try any nonsense with my business account.

Afam im not as you think. Please if you find my act offensive, im sorry about that.

Ok. Content deleted.

@Afam
Way to go posting someone's photo in a public forum. Did he ask you to do that? What about his privacy? That's vindictive

@evergie
To be fair http://www.netxpertsolutions.com is a pretty crappy website. It's clearly a cobbled together template and for my money i think Afam's site is way better (well, more reassuring). Don't just fall in with them just because their links end with .php

And yes, i used to be a web designer long ago. . .

texazzpete:

@Afam
Way to go posting someone's photo in a public forum. Did he ask you to do that? What about his privacy? That's vindictive

I think the high probability of this guy using my bank details for fraud is way too important to me than his photo, if he is genuine then he has nothing to fear but if he is not, I am really sorry for him because it is this type of nonsense that make people believe that majority of Nigerians are fraudsters.

I need to be certain that my bank details have not fallen into the hands of a crook that's all. I never asked anyone to bring projects to me as I get to turn down more than 50% of the requests that come my way for different reasons.

you all are just yarning bullshit, i taught i was gonna get something usefull thing like that of Afam.! Mr afam please leave evegie alone abeg, i didn't raise this for this kinda fight here

@smartsoft,

Sorry your post was turned into something else, all I wanted to pass across was that you need to make sure you are not wasting your time, money and energy doing a demo for someone that may not need it.

I have only done a demo for free just once and that was because the team in the bank begged for it because I was blunt and told them I have better use for my time. They even admitted that I was the 3rd person they were asking for the same demo when I told them that their ways are certainly not new to me as I have been in this business since 2003.

At the end of the day I spent about 30 minutes to set it up and posted it online, sent an email to them and gave them 20 minutes to view the site as I removed it after 20 minutes.

Up till today they have not implemented any new thing on that website even though they were talking as if they wanted the upgrade immediately.

Only God knows the time and energy the other 2 developers spent in trying to win the project which has not taken off and this is about 12 months ago when the Philips Consulting rating came out and rated the bank 24th out of the 25 banks in Nigeria.

On evergie, he called and pleaded to have my posts removed. I shall do so once he deletes the nonsense he put down here and present the true picture of what transpired between the two of us.

I have worked hard to provide honest and professional services to Nigerians and will certainly not tolerate anyone trying to toy with the integrity of my business.

What's going on with Afam the Web elder and evergie the Newbie,plz show some respect though Afam is kind of harsh and not the friendly type anyway it's seem you guys both know each other before.Enjoy!!

O boy, see world war 3 for nairaland o!!! the guys no jus wan gree for each other, kai.
na only God and the two of them fit sabi the full details of wetin happen anyway, back to the demo discussion.

on my own part sha, i ve done unused demo, and i ve also done used demos. the fact with this is (like in every other biz), win some, loose some.
Personally, i dont charge for demos. they come free of charge, but the catch is I show you from my laptop. i dont post if for them and i dont give it to them before payment. wen u agree to do a demo for a client for free, you are doing what oyibo people call "Winning customer loyalty". the clients are sumhow obliged to work with you (provided your demo is good o).
so for me, in a month somtimes i do as many as 10 demos and end up getting paid for about 4 (thats why i aint cheap )
thats my take on this issue sha, i may be wrong in my business approach, but with Gods grace, it has been working for me and it gets my bills paid

wetin una think?

nduaj,

I agree with 99% of what you have said, especially the "winning customer loyalty" part. Why not 100%?

1) Cos you are not dealing with oyibo in Nigeria but actual Nigerians (and you know how some of us are. Not to mention, your conversion ratio also says it all, assuming I could use it as a broad brush to paint the general Nigerian web dev landscape).

2) In general, I would like to know what we on this forum regard as a demo. Is it a full-fledged version of what the site will actually look like? In other words, if the client says yes, would it be safe to say you make a few tweaks and you are pretty much done? If so, this is not what I deem a demo.

A demo to me is a prototype. So assuming the site will have a page with a form. I will provide for you a page with form elements. No design/template whatsoever. I would then show you what would happen if you click on the form element. I would never go for a full-fledged version because I would hate to put in all the work only to find out that the client opts to choose another person over me. My time is way too precious biko.

The whole idea of a demo, at least to me, is to show the client what is possible and not how what is possible can be done. There are too many risks: client lifting your code, client taking what you have and giving it to someone to do at a cheaper rate, client saying no, etc. I bet you that if you the client were in a society where they were charged per hour, they wouldn't ask you to do a full-fledged demo.

I have dealt with 3 clients in Nigeria so far. Granted, it isn't enough to make me draw a conclusion, I can say that at least in my case, I did what Afam suggested above: ask them to visit your portfolio page (that is what that page is for) to see what you are capable of. If they don't see anything that tickles their fancy, then ask if there is any site they have visited which they would like for you to emulate. Between the two, the client usually can strike a balance.

So far, be it for Nigerian or US clients, I haven't had to redo a site/app due to customer dissatisfaction. Then again, it could be because I deal strictly with referrals which implies that my reputation precedes me. I treat the client the way I would want to be treated and so far, so good. It's all about trust folks. Look the client in the eye, be honest and tell them what you can and can not do. If you can't do it, be straight with them enough to tell them that hey, they might want to go elsewhere or better yet, you refer them to someone else (I have done this on various occasions). If they insist on a demo, either charge them for it or again, be frank enough with them to say hey, I don't do such and sorry we can't do business if they insist. I personally would respect such a person and trust him/her with my life.

When on the other hand, you are willing to take a string of buses/molues/bikes from oshodi to the ile epo at ore meta for a free demo, no wonder some clients over there are taking advantage of us. Maybe this is why there are so many unions out there.

Please don't take offense over what I have said here. I am only looking out for our best interests.

As always, my 2 cents.

very nice i appreciate your works

very nice i love yur woks

netexperts looked aesthetically pleasing to me but i didnt bother to go thru it
because he gave himself a bad impression attacking someone wt proven integrity whereas
he's a newbie

have all the talent in the world, w/out xter u're nothing

afam no let ur pawo swell oooooooo