alpontif:
The OP should accept responsibility. Psychologically speaking, you posted this article because your conscience is truly judging you that you did not give your best.

You want to pass the blame to your Oga, and hide under "orders" from above for plain cowardice to do the right thing.

Heroes are made in impossible situations.

You have no consolation from me. It is your fault that some died. You could have made a difference.

You are a big disappointment to the profession, and humanity.

Exactly

Cosmatika

symbianDON:
this attitude of, 'don't touch until money is paid bla bla' by senior doctors is quite depressing! to be candid, the doctors have no basis for blaming government policies or whatever if doctors can go on strike for on the basis of wage increase, implementation etc, what stops them from embarking on a strike to have policies that are patient-centred?? i don't suppose they will ever do that.....because the average nigerian isn't his brother's keeper...fact! reminds of a medical doctor friend i once lost in a vehicle crash. it was he who was on call duty that evening. at some point he left the hospital (a federal medical centre) to quickly get something outside the premises. he was driving when a drunk driver crashed into his car at top speed. he was brought to the same hospital....and when he was brought in, no one wanted to attend to him simply because they didn't think it was important to do so. somehow, along the line, they got to know he was a member of their staff...by then it was too late because he had already passed on!!! so sad...so callous

Good for them

abbey621:
The people bashing the OP deserve to be flogged! Some even brought up suggestion that the person pay out of pocket and be reimbursed later, what a stupid suggestion! I've yet to see one single person actually acknowledge the fact that money matters more than lives in Nigeria. Till we come to this drastic realization we are all just kidding ourselves! Where did it all go wrong? Politicians! They are the ones responsible for enabling laws which protects accident victims and those in need of urgent care. There should be a budget set aside every year for such expenses but rather they would rather spend money on luncheons and private dinners, private jets and clothing allowances. These morons are clueless and unfortunately the Nigerian masses are even more clueless. I weep for this bastaard of a nation, where medical professionals are forced to watch injured citizens wallow in pain till they pay up or die, I pity the nation where medical professionals are so severely underpaid that they must choose between survival and morality. Finally I pity the youths wishing for a better tomorrow,there's no such thing as tomorrow when today we keep making the same mistakes of yesterday, our politicians visit abroad for medical treatments,they know how the system works yet prefers the stone age system of Nigeria. My advice to all medical professionals is to not be discouraged but rather do your best and leave the rest.....shalom.

Did you read the testimonies of the doctors that have done that, paying for patients, ? If everybody keeps waiting for the time things would be better before doing the little one could do, things would definitely get worse and worse.

muy:
A life is more important and sacred than any order you could have received from above. The worst that you could get was a sack but conscience would have vindicated you for saving a life and heavens would have smiled on you. You failed in your Primary Responsibility of life saving, apparently you watched her die while you could help, why lament here when the deed was done. I am afraid, u valued money more than life.
You wouldn't allow your fiance pass away in your presence because of an order from above will you?
At a time like this, disobeying orders to save lives is better than obeying orders when a life is at stake.
You have faults here.

Cosmatika

ikombe:
that moment wen u dont think before you write


too many stupid individuals on nairaland

You're a very big fat dolt!

ajuwarhodes:


God bless u jare,that doctor is a killer not a doctor,I feel like seeing him right now,to give him a good slap,he now comes here to talk rubbish, may the lady's ghost torment u and ur oga them.bad Doctor

Ameen

Leopantro:
I give up.

I read on with frustration all the attempts you made to politely throw some light on the realities on ground and the limitations doctors practicing here face.

You should have known by now that it is extremely difficult to make anyone understand your point of view if the person is not in the profession.

Kudos for keeping your cool.

Analysiscorner:
Did you read the testimonies of the doctors that have done that, paying for patients, ? If everybody keeps waiting for the time things would be better before doing the little one could do, things would definitely get worse and worse.

Ask yourself how many doctors or medical professionals working at government hospitals can afford to pay for a patient out of their own pocket? It might be helpful if you can research how much they make and how easily government forgets to pay their salaries.

emmchi:
I think saving a life is paramount irrespective of the order from above.

talk is cheap, have you visted any of the government owned or run hospitals lately? Then you willl know live has no value in naija. When you find yourself in a tight corner then you will understand the enormity of the decay in the nigerian system, corruption everywhere, if the person in charge sees he can profit from a scheme he ensures nothing works as long as he is benefitting. If youask me I sometimes doubt if Nigeria as a country will work normal again because virtually everyone rthinks and does things opposite What is done in more civilized economies, people don't want to fight or are afraid to fight for thjeir rights, if people aren't involved they aren't bothered. We are on a long thing. ON YOUR OWN(OYO)

cramjones:


You are such an idiot to assert that! What he is saying is true. An accident victim came, you could not even at least do the following:

-Secure IV access, since they may be loosing blood.

-Take blood for urgent PCV, grouping and cross-matching for any emergency transfusion that the critical ones you triaged may need.

-At least examine the patient as a whole, look out for areas of injury, palpate the abdomen and make sure there is no guarding that could suggest internal organ rupture like the spleen.

-Provide pain relief etc etc.

-Did they not teach you the ABC of rescusitation? You don't know that A starts for

A- Airway
B-Breathing
C- Cardiac function
D - Drugs
E - Examination (Quick)

- How stupiid are you that critical patients would be brought to your center (Accident and Emergency), and the first thing you are saying is for them to be referred? Is your work place a Babalawo center that you have to refer them at just sighting them? Won't you make sure that they are in stable condition first.

-You are stupidly calling on the government - to do what? Are they doctors? Do they know how to rescucitate patients? you foolishly called your lazy asss medical officer...what do you expect... Infact, if I am Seun and moderators, I would ban you from Nairaland!

-You are a house officer for goodness sake, the first on call, you ought to have stabilized the patients before calling anyone.

-You should be ashamed to call yourself a doctor. If anything you and the hospital should be sued and made to repeat your housemanship!

Nonsense!

-CramJones

Don't mind the silly murderer > Cosmatika
And the dolt supporting him > ikombe and abbey621

kaziblake:
They are all the same. That was how they watch my father die in my arm without offering any help. General hospital,isolo. Wicked hospital stupid citizen

May God torment their lives too

Wicked souls

if i were i ur shoes i would have take money from my pocket to buy saline, giving set, canula etc to at least stablize them so they have a fighting chance cuz what kill most kills most RTA victims is shock due to blood loss to hell with the MO the worst that can happen is extension. its unfortunate that our health system is in disarray .

Lexusgs430:



And my point is, do you know how many patients have been stabilised in the past, and payment never came through?

Sorry, that's what the law provides and the benefits outweighs the disadvantages. It could happen to anyone bro.

Moreover, how do you expect an accident patient( probably unconscious at the time of being brought in) to make payments? . Except if deposit was made on his/her behalf by the person(s) who brought them in.

At least you administer first-aid and save a life. Does the Hippocratic Oath ring any bell? There's a probability that some ungrateful patients might take advantage of that- only but some -. That's the price for being professional . The most annoying being that the case under review here happened in a government-owned hospital!

abbey621:


Ask yourself how many doctors or medical professionals working at government hospitals can afford to pay for a patient out of their own pocket? It might be helpful if you can research how much they make and how easily government forgets to pay their salaries.

You are right, Bro. But, my question is : were his actions towards a critically ill patient justifiable, as a trained medical doctor that he is?

FuckTheMod:

May God torment their lives too

Wicked souls

Easy, Bro

Very sad

Classicman47:


U guys must really be so ignorant. Yes it is a govt. Hospital. But it don't mean the services are FREE!
U still get to pay even before any doctor sees u to hear ur complaint.
Just that in this case where an emergency situation was involved, they would have been primarily concerned with keeping the victims alive before demanding for payment.
Nigeria is messed up as it is. Money currently is more valuable than human lives.
TUFIA!

please when you have little or no knowledge of some subject matter try and ask people to educate you instead of ignroantly displaying your daftness. In a govt hospital setting, emergency or not , doctors dont collect money for treatment. Cashiers and people in records do that. In an emergency like that, they wont even take a dime, instead they will bill everything to the folder of the patient. Thats how govt hospitals work. Not only that the OP in incompetent, he also is not completely honest. We spotted some inconsistencies in his story and you are calling me ignorant. Please look in the mirror and see who actually is the ignorant one

Your excuse doesn't seem tenable or convincing to me. I'm also a medical doctor and there's nothing like order from above when life is involved, that's your sole responsibility as a doctor.
This is not to blame you or cast aspersions on you cos I believe you acted the way you did cos you're new and naive.
Your medical officer i.e your senior only asked you to refer them cos she was either not around or she didn't want to be bothered cos she knew she will be held responsible once you admit the patient and that's wickedness on her own part but having said that, it still doesn't stop you from resuscitating the patient before referring them.
You should only refer after you've resuscitated or at least stabilized or what's the point referring a patient whose condition is so critical that he/she may not even make it to the hospital.
Now you have to be careful and pray that the relatives won't take the case up with you cos you and your MO may not escape very serious punishment if this case is reported to the appropriate authority especially MDCN.
You also talked about a lot, and that was when I knew you're indeed new and naive, cos there's a law that all accident victim must be treated as an emergency without any constraints even including gunshot injury victims (in the past we used to demand for police report but the new law now is treat first then inform the police), that law was passed by the Senate about 2 or 3 years ago.
Pls make sure you learn from this incident, God bless you

cramjones:


You are such an idiot to assert that! What he is saying is true. An accident victim came, you could not even at least do the following:

-Secure IV access, since they may be loosing blood.

-Take blood for urgent PCV, grouping and cross-matching for any emergency transfusion that the critical ones you triaged may need.

-At least examine the patient as a whole, look out for areas of injury, palpate the abdomen and make sure there is no guarding that could suggest internal organ rupture like the spleen.

-Provide pain relief etc etc.
i can understand your frustation but u are saying this cuz u are not in the system

-Did they not teach you the ABC of rescusitation? You don't know that A starts for

A- Airway
B-Breathing
C- Cardiac function
D - Drugs
E - Examination (Quick)

- How stupiid are you that critical patients would be brought to your center (Accident and Emergency), and the first thing you are saying is for them to be referred? Is your work place a Babalawo center that you have to refer them at just sighting them? Won't you make sure that they are in stable condition first.

-You are stupidly calling on the government - to do what? Are they doctors? Do they know how to rescucitate patients? you foolishly called your lazy asss medical officer...what do you expect... Infact, if I am Seun and moderators, I would ban you from Nairaland!

-You are a house officer for goodness sake, the first on call, you ought to have stabilized the patients before calling anyone.

-You should be ashamed to call yourself a doctor. If anything you and the hospital should be sued and made to repeat your housemanship!

Nonsense!

-CramJones

i can understand your frustration but things are not so straight forward in real practice. who will pay for the resources to stabilize i mean (iv canula syringe diazepam, iv pcm , giving set , etc and moreover there is a standing order from a superior no t to touch the victims .

interesting to see the various comments on this thread, the op shouldn't have posted this and the op could have done simple ATLS(a, b, c, d, e) on the patient before anything...
what this post just shows is the deep rot in the Nigerian health care, the deep rot starts from the lack of funding, to the lack of basic equipment, to the deficient medical training, to the poor welfare packages, its just a shame...
if there's anything I've learnt, its that people would criticize poor doctors doing their jobs first than look for solutions and the average Nigerian does not give a damn about the poor healthcare system until he/she has cause to use public hospitals

segalex:
Your excuse doesn't seem tenable or convincing to me. I'm also a medical doctor and there's nothing like order from above when life is involved, that's your sole responsibility as a doctor.
This is not to blame you or cast aspersions on you cos I believe you acted the way you did cos you're new and naive.
Your medical officer i.e your senior only asked you to refer them cos she was either not around or she didn't want to be bothered cos she knew she will be held responsible once you admit the patient and that's wickedness on her own part but having said that, it still doesn't stop you from resuscitating the patient before referring them.
You should only refer after you've resuscitated or at least stabilized or what's the point referring a patient whose condition is so critical that he/she may not even make it to the hospital.
Now you have to be careful and pray that the relatives won't take the case up with you cos you and your MO may not escape very serious punishment if this case is reported to the appropriate authority especially MDCN.
You also talked about a lot, and that was when I knew you're indeed new and naive, cos there's a law that all accident victim must be treated as an emergency without any constraints even including gunshot injury victims (in the past we used to demand for police report but the new law now is treat first then inform the police), that law was passed by the Senate about 2 or 3 years ago.
Pls make sure you learn from this incident, God bless you

The voices of doctors still confirming that the op's action wasn't good enough.

bigsmoke2:
if i were i ur shoes i would have take money from my pocket to buy saline, giving set, canula etc to at least stablize them so they have a fighting chance cuz what kill most kills most RTA victims is shock due to blood loss to hell with the MO the worst that can happen is extension. its unfortunate that our health system is in disarray .

you don't even need to use your money to buy anything from pharmacy. Just take the patients folder to the pharmacy and bill it to the folder. Its An Accident and Emergency pharmacy, they will do it sharp sharp. The OP did not know what to do , which is understandable at his level, but trying to heap his incompetence on his senior and the govt is what I will not tolerate. People should learn to take responsibility for their actions/inactions

emmchi:
I think saving a life is paramount irrespective of the order from above.

I know right?

Doc, you had a choice to TAKE an order or TAKE a life!

I think its murder and utter insensible madness to implement an unrealistic policy that insist DYING AND UNCONSCIOUS ACCIDENT VICTIMS pay money before they are treated!

They should be revived first, given the first aid emergency treatmentthat will stabilize them and afterwards refusing to go further till they pay upfront.

Isn't it common sense?

Meanwhile this is a government hospital o, not private! Smh!

Analysiscorner:
You are right, Bro. But, my question is : were his actions towards a critically ill patient justifiable, as a trained medical doctor that he is?

In Nigerian context very justified. After all no bi you dey feed am. .

Doc, next time after calling for help, start CPR, you don't have to use anything until the patient is fully yours....I mean officially yours sanctioned and backed by every of your hospital policies. These people here won't come to your aid when the bloodhounds are sent after you.
A similar case early in my career made me to make up my mind the way I will have to practice. I have a case where a patient was brought in as an emergency and iv medication was administered in the course of the resuscitation and coincidentally the patient stopped breathing even before the syringe can be withdrawn and the relatives accused us of killing their son. Quite unbelievable!! The teams had to answer queries from the hospital and suffer bouts of anxieties and sleeplessness because of that. Their hospital bill was deducted from the salaries of the team members even with the threat of sack every here and then because the people refused to pay for "killing their son".
I do not care what you tell the poor guy but for me and many others ones beaten twice shy, it is because of things like this that Nigerian medical workers are scaling the fence and jumping ship to better climes. For those saying what if it was his mother, friend and all whatnot, I will do something cos I know they will not abscond and I have zero chance of being seen in court on obvious case of negligence and malpractice.
A nurse was beaten in calabar last week and last month team members were set upon by an emergency patients and beaten to pulp and the relations are their taking pics.
What a mess!!..
Don't bother quoting me to rant and show your frustrations.

cosmatika:
Tears run down my cheek as I type this. I went into d medical profession to Save lives, but today I watched a patient die and I could do nothing.
It was around 11am today, 26th Dec 2015, I wz in the emergency room as the only Dr & House officer on call in a state Specialist hospital wen a peugeot wagon followed by a police van drove in. They opened d doors & trunk and started bringing out Accident victims. I did a quick triage & saw dat d 2 in d trunk were in a more critical condition, So d immediate plan was to refer d 2 to FMC wia dey hav better hands and equipment to handle it. So I asked d policeman who d driver is so dat d 2 will be rushed to FMC & he said he died at d Accident scene. I ran outside to buy airtime to start calling other HOs, b4 I could return, dey had dropped d 2 & drove off.
I called other HOs, only 2 showed up, others had travelled. To my greatest suprise, I called a medical officer who is a snr colleague in d proffession, she said I shud nt touch anyone till dey paid. That I shud Infact refer all of dem. I was incapacitated, d patients were in pains, crying, calling on us to help, some already unconscious, but we couldnt help cos we have an order frm above.
Within 5mins, 1 young lady in her early 20s died. Abt 10mins later, another police van came and carried d remaining 7 to FMC.
This evening, some road safety corps came to inquire if any Accident victims were brought to our center. They had retrieved d manifest frm d vehicle and contacted d families of d passengers. Dey came wit d relations of one of d patients, and wen I told dem 1 of dem died, dey asked for d Description of d 1 dat died and I showed dem d pix of d gal dat died, behold she was d 1 dey were looking for and right there was the gal's fiancee. Their traditional wedding was to be in 3days tym
I want to use this medium to call on the govt to make policies dat"ll enable Drs treat patients in such condition. Let's Save the human race

U shld have done sth to help d poor girl but u choose to watch her die on ur boss orders, u n ur boss r both killers n murderer. U have blamed it on Govt abi, y were u on duty in dt Hosp when u can't treat patients on critical health condition?

Most Doctors are murders and too money conscious, u all r wicked. This ur post shld b titled "how I and my boss murdered our patient "

Bitter experience indeed!!! U dnt care abt human live so shout up at once. If it was ur sis in dt state n ur boss gave dt order wat would u ve done? Sure u will deposit ur money abi, y didn't u deposit for this one at least until their ppl shows up.

If u deposited ur money I would have nominated u for a national award but right nw I feel like arresting u n ur boss for murder

cosmatika:
Tears run down my cheek as I type this. I went into d medical profession to Save lives, but today I watched a patient die and I could do nothing.
It was around 11am today, 26th Dec 2015, I wz in the emergency room as the only Dr & House officer on call in a state Specialist hospital wen a peugeot wagon followed by a police van drove in. They opened d doors & trunk and started bringing out Accident victims. I did a quick triage & saw dat d 2 in d trunk were in a more critical condition, So d immediate plan was to refer d 2 to FMC wia dey hav better hands and equipment to handle it. So I asked d policeman who d driver is so dat d 2 will be rushed to FMC & he said he died at d Accident scene. I ran outside to buy airtime to start calling other HOs, b4 I could return, dey had dropped d 2 & drove off.
I called other HOs, only 2 showed up, others had travelled. To my greatest suprise, I called a medical officer who is a snr colleague in d proffession, she said I shud nt touch anyone till dey paid. That I shud Infact refer all of dem. I was incapacitated, d patients were in pains, crying, calling on us to help, some already unconscious, but we couldnt help cos we have an order frm above.
Within 5mins, 1 young lady in her early 20s died. Abt 10mins later, another police van came and carried d remaining 7 to FMC.
This evening, some road safety corps came to inquire if any Accident victims were brought to our center. They had retrieved d manifest frm d vehicle and contacted d families of d passengers. Dey came wit d relations of one of d patients, and wen I told dem 1 of dem died, dey asked for d Description of d 1 dat died and I showed dem d pix of d gal dat died, behold she was d 1 dey were looking for and right there was the gal's fiancee. Their traditional wedding was to be in 3days tym
I want to use this medium to call on the govt to make policies dat"ll enable Drs treat patients in such condition. Let's Save the human race

you had the time to take pictures.

OP you are young in the profession and this is a first time experience, and at this point in time guilt will not do you any good..
I think you should just read and learn some other possibilities where you can help if the situation repeats itself or some similar situations.

Let me share this with you..
A lecturer gave us a story of while they were recruiting for medical doctors in their facility
So there was this smart guy that they wanted to employ but when they went through his history, he had criminal record (drunk driving while he was 18) which most facilities would not tolerate for their doctors.
So one lady in the panel insisted that they employ the guy, although she didn't know him from Adams but she agreed to sign a guarantors form for him. Really the guy turned out to be exceptional.
When they asked the lady why she insisted on that guy even with his criminal record, she said at 18YO he was still an teenager and you cannot judge him very well based on that action and while they were interviewing the guy, she could tell during the interview that the guy is not the type that will take laid down rules to the grave.....he had this sweet stubbornness in him that he can bend some hospital policies to save lives since saving life is the ultimate. But if he was applying as a pharmacist she would have not taken the risk with him..

Truth is that maybe you were naïve, confused, scared about your job or so many things that's why you went about looking for credit but then saving lives ranks far above all those...
Right now, take some warm milk and sleep

Its your fault, someone told you not to save a life and you are bold enough to say it. If you really care you would have donated ur money. Nobody takes his or her money to the grave.. When i was a kid i sold my best phone nokia n70 to save a life,.. Spits on ur face.

Prince16:

... And d "doctor" was slayed by cramjones!

I concur

In the facility I did my housemanship, we have direct link to d CMD and he always gv go ahead for accident victims,we request for police report only for criminal cases...save life first

ogawisdom:


U shld have done sth to help d poor girl but u choose to watch her die on ur boss orders, u n ur boss r both killers n murderer. U have blamed it on Govt abi, y were u on duty in dt Hosp when u can't treat patients on critical health condition?

Most Doctors are murders and too money conscious, u all r wicked. This ur post shld b titled "how I and my boss murdered our patient "

i am a dr and i dont kill people. People like you are ingrates and bad example to the society. Please next time you are sick kindly visit a babalawo near your place of residence since you believe drs are murderers. The OP is a young dr that made a mistake and is stupid enough to put it on nairaland. He will grow and learn. People like you should not generalize about drs because of this incidents. Drs risk their lives daily to save people and you come here and open your dirty mouth to call us names. Idiot!!!!