City has a relatively weak squad though.

Aging fullbacks, injury prone captain, expensive but useless centerbacks, only 1 decent CM, 2 average wingers, a prospect in Kelechi, KDB and Aguero.

Silva and Toure look to be badly in decline...though in Silvas case, he has been playing with an injury for half the season

Pep is literally starting from the bottom here, though with almost unlimited amounts of cash

He has a lot of work to do.

raumdeuter:


You are the ones giving the excuse

I am saying Okay Pep and Jose are coming to the same league same city with teams in bad states and both teams have money to spend

I expect both Jose and Pep to win equally. Failure to win for either is a failure. I cant get any of you to agree rather you are telling us How top 3 or 4 is good enough for Jose while Pep only the winners medal is good for him

Both of them should win next season or they have failed yes or no?

Are you telling us Jose Mourinho the only active coach with the highest number of trophies doesnt come with a higher reputation

SO Mourinho is now Allardyce just because they told him to compete with pep of an equal footing

Before his appointment at City, Pep Guardiola was arguably the most sought-after manager in the world - as regards league titles, i doubt if his impeccable form/Record has been matched within the time frame I stated in my previous post.

Within the past 4-5years thereabout, we have been made to understand that the "Magical" Pep is literarily the "missing piece to City's jigsaw puzzle" - so many articles attest to the general consensus that Pep is the manager City need if they are to become a force to reckon with in Europe. Ofcourse, the idea isn't to "dominate" the continent at the expense of the domestic league.... afterall City's Ambition to unsurp Man utd as the kings of Manchester (and Britain as a whole) has never been in doubt ever Since the Sheikhs took over.

I need not remind you that we kinda employed Mourihno outta desperation.Under normal circumstances, I dunno of any top team that would hire a manager who has "relegation battle" as his most recent job experience - you sef don talk am on numerous occassions.

For me, a decent Manager (Mourihno is definitely one) and a few top-notch signings here and there should be enough for us to Challenge for the title - lemme categorically state here that if we had hired Pochettino or any other decent Manager instead...and strengthened the squad appropriately,my expectations wouldn't be reduced in anyway.


In a Nutshell, i expect both Managers to challenge for the title (since we expect their respective clubs to provide them with the required players) but bros, the jury would definitely be out more on Pep if he fails to win a league title for the 1st time in 5 straight seasons!

GBR1:
She meant ''courier'' service, i think.

Yea..

raumdeuter:


Suddenly there is no rivalry between Pep and Mourinho

Suddenly only Pep has something to prove Mourinho has nothing to prove

I accept Pep has to win rather we see mourinho fans giving excuses that he doesnt have to win because he has nothing to prove

If he has nothing to prove, he can decline the job and go to where he has something to prove

A coach sacked 5months ago and hired doesnt have anything to prove again? Hypocrisy must be spelt as T-E-S-S

Whether you like it or not, we`ll be waiting to assess Pep at the end of next season. Mind you, I am not a Mourinho fan.

Any coach can be sacked at any time, it doesn`t change anything not even when such a coach is a SERIAL WINNER. Mourinho has won the EPL in an average of every two years. Let Pep win it in his first season.

Was your new coach Ancelotti not sacked at both Chelsea and Real Madrid? Does that stop big clubs looking for his signature? Chelsea sacked him but that doesn`t stop Madrid from employing.

You are only bringing the rivalry issue to save face for him when he fails.

Nihilist:
City has a relatively weak squad though.
Aging fullbacks, injury prone captain, expensive but useless centerbacks, only 1 decent CM, 2 average wingers, a prospect in Kelechi, KDB and Aguero.
Silva and Toure look to be badly in decline...though in Silvas case, he has been playing with an injury for half the season
Pep is literally starting from the bottom here, though with almost unlimited amounts of cash
He has a lot of work to do.

So let me ask

A. what are the expectations for Pep at City,

B. what are the expectation for Jose in Man utd

C. In Case A and B are not the same, Give reasons

tess1:
Whether you like it or not, we`ll be waiting to assess Pep at the end of next season. Mind you, I am not a Mourinho fan.

Any coach can be sacked at any time, it doesn`t change anything not even when such a coach is a SERIAL WINNER. Mourinho has won the EPL in an average of every two years. Let Pep win it in his first season.

Was your new coach Ancelotti not sacked at both Chelsea and Real Madrid? Does that stop big clubs looking for his signature? Chelsea sacked him but that doesn`t stop Madrid from employing.

You are only bringing the rivalry issue to save face for him when he fails.

Just as you are waiting for Pep at the end of next season We are also waiting for Mourinho at the end of next season

Mourinho has always given excuses why Pep is perceived to be a better coach Whether he coached in an easy league or coached a team that was superstar filled now all excuses in the trash both are starting from the bottom and I am saying I am expecting Pep to win and I expect Mourinho to win too no excuse for either

ANyone who fails to win has failed

AGREE or DISAGREE

raumdeuter:


So let me ask

A. what are the expectations for Pep at City,

B. what are the expectation for Jose in Man utd

C. In Case A and B are not the same, Give reasons

Obviously both are expected to win.

United would not reportedly pay Jose 5m pounds just to stop him from speaking to other prospective employers, in addition to a further reported 12m pounds annual salary for him not to win.

The man himself said it today

"I'm ready for it. I'm proud. I'm honoured. I cannot wait for 7th July to go on the pitch.

"I think we can put our club into perspective. One perspective is the last three years; another is the history. I prefer to forget the past three years.

"I want to win. I need the supporters and players to feel that."

Pep too has to start winning straight away. He's the clubs first marquee signing this season.

Both must begin to win straight away in my opinion

We can only have measured expectations of both Jose and Pep after the transfer window is over. However if both clubs provide 'Limitless' cash for them in the transfer window, then the onus will be on both coaches to win the EPL. Though playing on Thursdays won't be very favorable to Jose.

Nihilist:

Obviously both are expected to win.
United would not reportedly pay Jose 5m pounds just to stop him from speaking to other prospective employers, in addition to a further reported 12m pounds annual salary for him not to win.
The man himself said it today
Pep too has to start winning straight away. He's the clubs first marquee signing this season.
Both must begin to win straight away in my opinion

This is what we call a balanced analysis from a Chelsea fan

If not for your excessive igbo smoking I would have paid your transfer fees to Bayern fan club

Both coaches are expected to start winning from day 1 at their respective clubs not the opata that one has nothing to prove and one has something to prove

forap:
We can only have measured expectations of both Jose and Pep after the transfer window is over. However if both clubs provide 'Limitless' cash for them in the transfer window, then the onus will be on both coaches to win the EPL. Though playing on Thursdays won't be very favorable to Jose.

I would prefer a no excuse setting. Both man Utd and Man City in the past 3yrs havent shied away from spending money and these 2 coaches are highly respected for management to give in to their demands especially players

Lets leave all the excuses and lets put both to the same standard anyone who fails or blinks first

We can also argue that Man utd has a bigger name and a better name recognition than City but lets leave story for now and wait till end of season for both coaches

raumdeuter:


I would prefer a no excuse setting. Both man Utd and Man City in the past 3yrs havent shied away from spending money and these 2 coaches are highly respected for management to give in to their demands especially players

Lets leave all the excuses and lets put both to the same standard anyone who fails or blinks first

We can also argue that Man utd has a bigger name and a better name recognition than City but lets leave story for now and wait till end of season for both coaches

What if there is a demand on Jose to play some younger players, where as Pep is able to get all established stars he wants? That's why I said we should wait till end of transfer window

ramdeuter and nihilist... i hail una for keeping it real jor!

forap:

What if there is a demand on Jose to play some younger players, where as Pep is able to get all established stars he wants? That's why I said we should wait till end of transfer window

If he knows he cant meet up with the demands then he should quit

What if the demand is also on Pep to play Iheabacho and Adarabioyo. at the expense of better players or he is told to make Demichelis and Navas world class players by force

If he cant achieve it then he should quit. No excuses at all for both.

Man utd want to start winning, City want to start winning both are in shambles right now

RuuDie:
ramdeuter and nihilist... i hail una for keeping it real jor!

Assuming it was Pep fans giving excuses like

He has nothing to prove
He doesnt have to win
Top 4 is enough
He might be asked to play youth team

We would have an army of people shouting upandan

Now its balance let both win with their respective squad failure to do so means they failed

I am not too interested in this JM vs Pep debate but Dayo is being a bit disingenuous here. Expectations for the coming season can only be made after the summer acquisitions have been completed and the NEW squads are known.

For example if City somehow acquires Messi, Javi Martinez, Gundogan, and Pogba and United get Harry Kane, Andre Gomes and Kante the expectations can't be the same.
The expectations of a club would be made only after the players are known. As we are now none of us knows who would be playing for these clubs next season so why would anybody set bench marks for either coach?
If United buy Aubameyang/Kane, Thomas Muller/Reus, Martinez, Kante, Matuidi and Varane I would expect JM to win us the league and label him a failure if he does not.
But if we sign only Zlatan and Wanyama I won't have the same expectations.
IT ALL DEPENDS ON WHO WE SIGN

Dadehmola:




Please what is Korea Service?

afrodoc2:


Ojigbijigbi
I weep for Nigerian education

Why?

raumdeuter:


If he knows he cant meet up with the demands then he should quit

What if the demand is also on Pep to play Iheabacho and Adarabioyo. at the expense of better players or he is told to make Demichelis and Navas world class players by force

If he cant achieve it then he should quit. No excuses at all for both.

Man utd want to start winning, City want to start winning both are in shambles right now

In the end, each of them will only be assessed based on what they are able to work with. I won't expect Jose to outperform Pep, if he only has 3 world class players in his team, whereas Pep has up to 6 in his team, and vice versa

The minimum for both guys of course is champs league football.
The finer details of who comes 1st or 2nd or 4th to a major extent depends on the players they have available.

forap:


In the end, each of them will only be assessed based on what they are able to work with. I won't expect Jose to outperform Pep, if he only has 3 world class players in his team, whereas Pep has up to 6 in his team, and vice versa

Exactly.

afrodoc2:
I am not too interested in this JM vs Pep debate but Dayo is being a bit disingenuous here. Expectations for the coming season can only be made after the summer acquisitions have been completed and the NEW squads are known.

For example if City somehow acquires Messi, Javi Martinez, Gundogan, and Pogba and United get Harry Kane, Andre Gomes and Kante the expectations can't be the same.
The expectations of a club would be made only after the players are known. As we are now none of us knows who would be playing for these clubs next season so why would anybody set bench marks for either coach?
If United buy Aubameyang/Kane, Thomas Muller/Reus, Martinez, Kante, Matuidi and Varane I would expect JM to win us the league and label him a failure if he does not.
But if we sign only Zlatan and Wanyama I won't have the same expectations.
IT ALL DEPENDS ON WHO WE SIGN

Both have not signed anyone as at today

If Man Utd signs Sodje Olofinjana and ramires while Pep signs Messi Suarez and neymar

That means those are the players both coaches have in mind to win them trophies. Pep sold Yaya in favor of Busquets and won, Mourinho also did same sold Mata for Oscar and won

I believe whoever they sign by Sept 1 are the players they beliueved can deliver for them. if they end up not winning then its on the coach not the signings

I see a desperate attempt by some folks to prepare some form of easy landing and excuse for Mourinho here

I am not giving any excuse for Pep and I am not expecting any from the Mourinho camp.

forap:
In the end, each of them will only be assessed based on what they are able to work with. I won't expect Jose to outperform Pep, if he only has 3 world class players in his team, whereas Pep has up to 6 in his team, and vice versa

That would mean thats all he needs to win. Like he did at porto.

When porto won, they didnt have the most World class players in Europe

How come we are suddenly coming up with all sorts of "WHAT IF's" that are mostly applicable to Mourinho but not for other coaches

Most of you call Wenger a failure, you dont factor all these number of world class players, transfer budgets etc when you say that do you?

Or how many World class players and transfer fee have wenger spent compared to Mourinho for everyone to unanimously say Wenger is better

All the excuses that were not tenable for Wenger and other coaches are suddenly thrown up for Jose

raumdeuter:


Both have not signed anyone as at today

If Man Utd signs Sodje Olofinjana and ramires while Pep signs Messi Suarez and neymar

That means those are the players both coaches have in mind to win them trophies. Pep sold Yaya in favor of Busquets and won, Mourinho also did same sold Mata for Oscar and won

I believe whoever they sign by Sept 1 are the players they beliueved can deliver for them. if they end up not winning then its on the coach not the signings

I see a desperate attempt by some folks to prepare some form of easy landing and excuse for Mourinho here

I am not giving any excuse for Pep and I am not expecting any from the Mourinho camp.

I am not in any camp apart from United camp and that is why I want JM to succeed . Personally I think I would have preferred Pep but that is not even the issue.
We all know coaches don't get who they want so your statement is untrue.
We have seen in the last few years how United chased Neymar, Thomas Muller, Sergio Ramos, Fabregas and ended up with Depay, Herrera, Rojo and Fellaini.
Man City with bottom less pockets and an attack minded coach with the lure of CHAMPIONS LEAGUE FOOTBALL would be at an advantage when the summer acquisitions start.

Personally though, I can't wait for Pep to flop this season.

I hope to be close to the dugout at Etihad, when Burnley or West Brom give a collective middle finger to possesion footy and sneak a 1-0 win, so I can gather and drink his delicious tears.

My intention for next season is to groove on Bayernsale thread every time loses a game. If he does a losing streak, I might even outsource the faaji to Barca thread too

raumdeuter:


Assuming it was Pep fans giving excuses like

He has nothing to prove
He doesnt have to win
Top 4 is enough
He might be asked to play youth team

We would have an army of people shouting upandan

Now its balance let both win with their respective squad failure to do so means they failed

You get strength to dey go back and fourth though!

At the beginning of the just concluded season, I expected City to win the league but I noticed an alarming depreciation of their aging core players. Whereas United have a relatively young core (DDG-Smalling-Jones-Shaw-Martial). Based on last season's result I believe both teams are currently at par. Over the season United had the upper hand when both teams met.... 0-0 at Old Trafford and a lone goal from Rashford at the Etihad stadium.

The claim that Mourinho has nothing to prove is laughable, I think he has a lot to prove. A misfortune with United will significantly affect his stock after the Chelsea debacle.

Also Pep has got a lot to prove. He needs to show that he can be successful without being the coach of the best team in the league he finds himself. City's team are at the lowest point since they won their first EPL title.

For me, I expect the both of them to hit the ground running and to set a frantic pace. I am super sure they will both spend over 100M on acquisition of players.

Winning the league will be the ultimate target of both coaches and finishing in the top 3 will be a good result for both of them provided that the top 3 team remain in the race for the title till the last month of the season.

If Pep does not win the league at the first time of asking, it won't make him a failure. Same goes for Mourinho!

raumdeuter:


That would mean thats all he needs to win. Like he did at porto.

When porto won, they didnt have the most World class players in Europe

How come we are suddenly coming up with all sorts of "WHAT IF's" that are mostly applicable to Mourinho but not for other coaches

Most of you call Wenger a failure, you dont factor all these number of world class players, transfer budgets etc when you say that do you?

Or how many World class players and transfer fee have wenger spent compared to Mourinho for everyone to unanimously say Wenger is better

All the excuses that were not tenable for Wenger and other coaches are suddenly thrown up for Jose

I have never been a Mourinho apologist but Wetin concern Wenger with this one.
Wenger has never won a European trophy of any sort. Mourinho has 3, Pep has 3, Fergie has 3
When Wenger wins 1 just 1 we can talk about him. Wenger is a trainer not a manager

raumdeuter:


That would mean thats all he needs to win. Like he did at porto.

When porto won, they didnt have the most World class players in Europe

How come we are suddenly coming up with all sorts of "WHAT IF's" that are mostly applicable to Mourinho but not for other coaches

Most of you call Wenger a failure, you dont factor all these number of world class players, transfer budgets etc when you say that do you?

Or how many World class players and transfer fee have wenger spent compared to Mourinho for everyone to unanimously say Wenger is better

All the excuses that were not tenable for Wenger and other coaches are suddenly thrown up for Jose

I guess I was objective enough when I said vice versa, so I wasn't excluding only Jose. Mentioning Wenger, is another story I won't delve into.
If a coach has Porto '04 team, and also has Bayern '16 team, will you expect same output from both teams? All other factors being constant

afrodoc2:
I am not in any camp apart from United camp and that is why I want JM to succeed . Personally I think I would have preferred Pep but that is not even the issue.
We all know coaches don't get who they want so your statement is untrue.
We have seen in the last few years how United chased Neymar, Thomas Muller, Sergio Ramos, Fabregas and ended up with Depay, Herrera, Rojo and Fellaini.
Man City with bottom less pockets and an attack minded coach with the lure of CHAMPIONS LEAGUE FOOTBALL would be at an advantage when the summer acquisitions start.

Thats a moot point. No club except maybe Real Madrid gets everyone they wanted

Pep wanted Neymar at Bayern he got Gotze instead. Man City wanted Gotze they didnt get him.

No coach gets everyone he wants aside Mourinho of 2005 when they had a money monopoly.

Both coaches would get some they want and would miss some, They are both expected to use whatever is at their disposal

Man Utd has outspent City recently and have a bottomless pocket too and are also desperate to be back among the elites

All these excuse all are giving is hilarious. Doctor I didnt remember you giving Pep this much excuse when we were discussing his tenure at Bayern despite not having all the players he wanted

Nihilist:
Personally though, I can't wait for Pep to flop this season.

I hope to be close to the dugout at Etihad, when Burnley or West Brom give a collective middle finger to possesion footy and sneak a 1-0 win, so I can gather and drink his delicious tears.

My intention for next season is to groove on Bayernsale thread every time loses a game. If he does a losing streak, I might even outsource the faaji to Barca thread too

Personally I cant wait for Chelsea and manure plus Arsenal to flop domestically next season. I dont mind Pep winning all there is to win in England

But in CL I hope he makes beyond the group stages and gets brutally molested by Barca, Bayern and Madrid in the second round or quarter final So he wont get the opportunity to fall back into Europa

I would get double groove, wjhen Chelsea fails and when Manure fails.

party must shelle per weekend

afrodoc2:
I have never been a Mourinho apologist but Wetin concern Wenger with this one.
Wenger has never won a European trophy of any sort. Mourinho has 3, Pep has 3, Fergie has 3
When Wenger wins 1 just 1 we can talk about him. Wenger is a trainer not a manager

These excuses are sounding like what Arsenal fans give and you join others to laugh at them
We dont have enough money to spend, we are depending on young players, we dont have enough world clas players
I never knew a day wuld come these same excuses would be used for Mourinho

forap:


I guess I was objective enough when I said vice versa, so I wasn't excluding only Jose. Mentioning Wenger, is another story I won't delve into.
If a coach has Porto '04 team, and also has Bayern '16 team, will you expect same output from both teams? All other factors being constant

My point is both coaches MUST win with whatever they get.

Mourinho has not even gone to the market you are already coming with "WHAT IF" scenarios. So if he fails it would be because he didnt get Ronaldo or Pogba

Both teams are known to spend, Both coaches regardless of what they get would be judged solely on the trophies they win or dont win by season end

olabode89:
You get strength to dey go back and fourth though!

At the beginning of the just concluded season, I expected City to win the league but I noticed an alarming depreciation of their aging core players. Whereas United have a relatively young core (DDG-Smalling-Jones-Shaw-Martial). Based on last season's result I believe both teams are currently at par. Over the season United had the upper hand when both teams met.... 0-0 at Old Trafford and a lone goal from Rashford at the Etihad stadium.

The claim that Mourinho has nothing to prove is laughable, I think he has a lot to prove. A misfortune with United will significantly affect his stock after the Chelsea debacle.

Also Pep has got a lot to prove. He needs to show that he can be successful without being the coach of the best team in the league he finds himself. City's team are at the lowest point since they won their first EPL title.

For me, I expect the both of them to hit the ground running and to set a frantic pace. I am super sure they will both spend over 100M on acquisition of players.

Winning the league will be the ultimate target of both coached and finishing in the top 3 will be a good result for bothere of them provided that the top 3 team remain in the race for the title till the last month of the season.

If Pep does not win the league at the first time of asking, it won't make him a failure. Same goes for Mourinho!

I agree with everything in this post

I even forgot that Man Utd edged City in head to head this last season yet people are saying Man Utd is inferior to City

raumdeuter:


Thats a moot point. No club except maybe Real Madrid gets everyone they wanted

Pep wanted Neymar at Bayern he got Gotze instead. Man City wanted Gotze they didnt get him.

No coach gets everyone he wants aside Mourinho of 2005 when they had a money monopoly.

Both coaches would get some they want and would miss some, They are both expected to use whatever is at their disposal

Man Utd has outspent City recently and have a bottomless pocket too and are also desperate to be back among the elites

All these excuse all are giving is hilarious. Doctor I didnt remember you giving Pep this much excuse when we were discussing his tenure at Bayern despite not having all the players he wanted

I am not giving excuses for anyone. Go back and check our debate on Pep.
I have always maintained that the quality of players you have is number 1, the quality of coaching comes after that.
That is why I asked you the question about Pep coaching the bottom club and that club's coach in charge of Bayern.
The quality of players is the most important.

And I don't know why you mentioned the "moot" point since you were the on that asserted that coaches get the players they go for, now you are coming back to say they sometimes miss out on targets. You seem to be arguing with yourself on that one.