BetaThings:

What is sad is that the Prophet(PBUH) is no longer around to help us make one form of Tawassul

but he is around in Lagos,thousands of miles from Medina where he is buried to answer you greeting him,right?

you better go and learn Islam very well before turning into a fake preacher using wahhabism to tie your brain stiff.

Yes, I believe that you should say salaam when you visit a grave, but you should not ask for help.
Allah hears us all the time. So it is not a problem

The hadith from Tirmidhi offers guidance on this matter:

Be mindful of Allah, and Allah will protect you. Be mindful of Allah, and you will find Him in front of you. If you ask, ask of Allah; if you seek help, seek help of Allah. Know that if the Nation were to gather together to benefit you with anything, it would benefit you only with something that Allah had already prescribed for you, and that if they gather together to harm you with anything, they would harm you only with something Allah had already prescribed for you. The pens have been lifted and the pages have dried.

my friend you do not believe in Allah (swt) more than we do.we know Allah (swt) does everything.but must we really keep going in circles? i have told you and presented Quranic verses to support my assertion that Allah (swt) has permitted us to seek the Prophet's (sa) intercession.according to you,we cannot seek the Prophet's (sa) intercession because he is dead.to us whether he is dead or alive,he matters the same to Allah (swt) and therefore our intercession would be answered by Allah (swt) and not by anyone else.you said he is dead but i pointed out that you send greetings to the dead.

i do not see the difference why it is okay to send salam but not okay to do shafa'a.i think now you will again go in another cirle and tell me the dead can do nothing for me.well i have just answered you a few lines ago and i hope you do not forget the answer so quickly and easily.

Intercession by the Prophet (PBUH) is available on the day of resurrection to every muslim.
We make salawat to the Prophet (PBUH) every day during our salat. We also for pray for every believing man and woman, dead and alive
We ask Allah by the 3 methods of Tawassul - (1) names and attributes of Allah (2) by our good deeds made sincerely seeking the favour of Allah and (3) by asking somebody we believe is righteous. Eg The prayer of parents for children is usually answered

i agree with all that and we also do likewise.

we only disagree on doing shafa'a with the Prophet (sa) presently.that is allowed because he is the most beloved of Allah (swt).so whether dead or alive,he matters.

The above is a favourite hadith of yours to mislead people into thinking that the same sahabas that were given the good news of going to Jannah apostasised after the death of the Prophet. Of course those referred to in this hadith are not mentioned, but the people informed that they would go to Jannah are known by name, so they are not the same.

show me from the Quran who is promised even not by name of going to jannah besides the Prophet (sa) and his Ahlul-Bayt (as).do not give me a fabricated hadith about "ashra al-mubasharina bil jannah".you cannot substantiate your claim.however if the Prophet (sa) made it a possibility and something he was sure of that some of his companions would go astray and enter hell fire,then why do you treat them as if they were prophets or angels who cannot hurt a fly and cannot be misguided or do evil deeds?

However, my point is this. You have to make up your mind: is the Prophet (PBUH) dead that he (PBUH) did not know what his followers did after his death or is he (PBUH) alive making intercession?

the Prophet (sa) knows.and besides he also got divine knowledge from Allah (swt).remember that he even prophesied the tragedy of Karbala.

Where have you been LagosShia, we missed you in these parts. . . . . .

Thanks 'fellis' for missing me.I also miss you all.my absence was partly due to the eidul fitri period.I didn't want nairaland to spoil my fun.I have also being busy.but insha'Allah I'd be back soon enogh like before.

LagosShia: Thanks 'fellis' for missing me.I also miss you all.my absence was partly due to the eidul fitri period.I didn't want nairaland to spoil my fun.I have also being busy.but insha'Allah I'd be back soon enogh like before.

Ok.
apart from the Shia thing, you are a pretty cool guy to have around when the bashers come to this section.

LagosShia:

but he is around in Lagos,thousands of miles from Medina where he is buried to answer you greeting him,right?

Of course we are required to make salawat to him (PBUH) during salat and when his (PBUH) name is mentioned. Who are we to dispute Allah's ability to transmit that to him (PBUH). For instance kissing the black stone in Makkah is just what we are required. No muslim believes that the stone has any special powers. But we follow the instruction to do so. We are muslims and hear and obey. Being buried in Madina is irrelevant. Wherever he (PBUH) is buried does not matter. He (PBUH) has been given that right of salawat by Allah.

LagosShia:

you better go and learn Islam very well before turning into a fake preacher using wahhabism to tie your brain stiff.

Better to call to tawhid while seeking knowledge as I concede that I need to do than mislead people into shirk which nullify their toils
BTW this your wahhabi, wahhabi mantra is very funny. So every one who disagrees with the shias is a "Wahhabi"?

LagosShia:

you better go and learn Islam very well before turning into a fake preacher using wahhabism to tie your brain stiff.

My brain? Yes, it is tied to Islam - Alhamdu li Llah

LagosShia:

my friend you do not believe in Allah (swt) more than we do.we know Allah (swt) does everything.

Good. Show it by calling on Allah alone. Leave the dead in peace

LagosShia:

but must we really keep going in circles? i have told you and presented Quranic verses to support my assertion that Allah (swt) has permitted us to seek the Prophet's (sa) intercession.according to you,we cannot seek the Prophet's (sa) intercession because he is dead.to us whether he is dead or alive,he matters the same to Allah (swt) and therefore our intercession would be answered by Allah (swt) and not by anyone else.you said he is dead but i pointed out that you send greetings to the dead.

i do not see the difference why it is okay to send salam but not okay to do shafa'a.i think now you will again go in another cirle and tell me the dead can do nothing for me.well i have just answered you a few lines ago and i hope you do not forget the answer so quickly and easily.

Their intercession for you will come on the day on resurrection. Be content to make salawat with him (PBUH) for now. Don't ask him (PBUH) anything yet.
By the way, assuming without conceding that we can ask the dead to intercede, why would anyone leave the Prophet's (PBUH) intercession and ask any other being. Remember all those make those phone calls to the grave? Why can they not call Madina. But we both really know that calling on anyone is shirk

Of course, the dead can avail nothing. They will be able to help again after their resurrection
And of course some sufis realise that and are now claiming that the Prophet (PBUH) did not die.
You can see the length people would go to justify some strange and wrong idea

LagosShia:

we only disagree on doing shafa'a with the Prophet (sa) presently.that is allowed because he is the most beloved of Allah (swt).so whether dead or alive,he matters.

show me from the Quran who is promised even not by name of going to jannah besides the Prophet (sa) and his Ahlul-Bayt (as).do not give me a fabricated hadith about "ashra al-mubasharina bil jannah".you cannot substantiate your claim.however if the Prophet (sa) made it a possibility and something he was sure of that some of his companions would go astray and enter hell fire,then why do you treat them as if they were prophets or angels who cannot hurt a fly and cannot be misguided or do evil deeds?

the Prophet (sa) knows.and besides he also got divine knowledge from Allah (swt).remember that he even prophesied the tragedy of Karbala.

The Shias believe that his (PBUH) intercession is possible now. We don't. Where are members of the Prophet (PBUH) family mentioned by name in the Qur'an? While at it, show me where in the Qur'an we are required to stone the adulterer since we must now rely only on the Qur'an.
Those given the tiding of jannah will NOT enter hellfire. No doubt about it. Our deeds cannot compare to theirs.

BetaThings:

Of course we are required to make salawat to him (PBUH) during salat and when his (PBUH) name is mentioned. Who are we to dispute Allah's ability to transmit that to him (PBUH). For instance kissing the black stone in Makkah is just what we are required. No muslim believes that the stone has any special powers. But we follow the instruction to do so. We are muslims and hear and obey. Being buried in Madina is irrelevant. Wherever he (PBUH) is buried does not matter. He (PBUH) has been given that right of salawat by Allah.



Better to call to tawhid while seeking knowledge as I concede that I need to do than mislead people into shirk which nullify their toils
BTW this your wahhabi, wahhabi mantra is very funny. So every one who disagrees with the shias is a "Wahhabi"?




My brain? Yes, it is tied to Islam - Alhamdu li Llah



Good. Show it by calling on Allah alone. Leave the dead in peace



Their intercession for you will come on the day on resurrection. Be content to make salawat with him (PBUH) for now. Don't ask him (PBUH) anything yet.
By the way, assuming without conceding that we can ask the dead to intercede, why would anyone leave the Prophet's (PBUH) intercession and ask any other being. Remember all those make those phone calls to the grave? Why can they not call Madina. But we both really know that calling on anyone is shirk

Of course, the dead can avail nothing. They will be able to help again after their resurrection
And of course some sufis realise that and are now claiming that the Prophet (PBUH) did not die.
You can see the length people would go to justify some strange and wrong idea




The Shias believe that his (PBUH) intercession is possible now. We don't. Where are members of the Prophet (PBUH) family mentioned by name in the Qur'an? While at it, show me where in the Qur'an we are required to stone the adulterer since we must now rely only on the Qur'an.
Those given the tiding of jannah will NOT enter hellfire. No doubt about it. Our deeds cannot compare to theirs.

i do not find any use in replying to your post point by point.i think there is already enough info given on these points.also your own post and the words you used actually would serve my case for any reasonable person bettter than wasting my time to respond to you.i won't waste my time further on a wahhabi influenced and padlocked head.greeting (i.e. sending salam,not doing salawat.note the differnece) a dead man thousands of miles away is okay but asking for his intercession with a request that Allah (swt) will answer is "shirk".kissing the black stone is "required to do",but to kiss a grave of the Prophet (sa)-we also know the stone can do nothing good or harmful-is "shirk".i wonder why wahhabis don't accuse Allah (swt)-astaghfirullah-of encouraging "shirk" too.this is aimed at framing a sectarian wahhabi agenda based on division and hatred of Islamic principles especially acts which are intended to honor Allah (swt) and to show love to His chosen servants.when you kiss a grave,it is not the stone you honor but the person in it.when you kiss the Quran,it is not the paper you honor but Allah (swt).when you kiss the black stone,mit doesn't mean you consider it a "god" or an object of worship,but you are honoring Allah (swt) because the black stone is a symbol of Allah (swt) that was sent down to mark the spot where the first house of worship for mankind is to be built.likewise when we face the Qiblah we do not worship the Ka'bah but we are only facing the first house of worship (Ka'ba) and following a universal direction.this is symbolism and the Quran supports such because there is no shirk.

Holy Quran 7:157
“So (as for) those who believe in him and honour him and help him, and follow the light which has been sent down with him, these it is that are the successful.”

Holy Quran 22:32
"That [is so]. And whoever honors the symbols of Allah - indeed, it is from the piety of hearts".

maclatunji: ^Talk about drama. Well, I still don't see a ban on you and I can guarantee that I have not banned you today. You are free to do whatever you like.

It is a free world.

Mr Mac. So why u con turn something else overnight Banning, hidden and deleting threads and comments that doesn't suit your taught?