If Adam had just asked for forgiveness. . . . .

I realized a lesson from this, its not about not offending someone

Its about having the sense of responsibility and the humility to admit a wrong and ask for forgiveness

Something men the world over still struggle to do.

Adam had to blame someone, something for the wrong he partook in.
By blaming Eve,
Man now has to struggle for woman's respect.

Because really i cant even imagine a guy blaming me for a wrongdoing we both committed
especially when he was supposed to be the caretaker and stop me from doing the wrong thing.
i would definitely loose respect for him.

The womans role in this world today is to make the men feel good about themselves
and in return they pour themselves out to us
pretty good bargain!

Adam's offence was against God, who is infinite.

The atonement had to be infinite in nature and value.

But Adam was (is) finite. A simple sorry was neither here nor there.

Only a God-man could provide an atonement of infinite nature and value.

Praise be to Jesus!!!

Thanks for the enlightenment

But the Adam of then is different from when he was sent out

But then God is ALL in ALL , Alpha and Omega

i just felt it may have been possible for Adam to have asked for forgiveness

or even offered up himself. lol

Praise be to Jesus!

And that's assuming he even knew what he did was bad in the first place. Before eating the fruit, he was oblivious of good and evil, innit?

After Eating the Fruit, He obviously knew something was wrong

And decided to blame it on someone

But he had acted out of sheer ignorance, ab initio.  That alone should have made God forgive him, even without him asking (I would, if it were my child).  Perhaps, Adam himself didn't know what it meant to ask for "forgiveness"?  Considering the fact that he was a new human (more like a child), I think he was "innocently naive" then.

;DFUNNY THREAD, But even if he knew about forgiveness, he might not be forgiven cuz JESUS BROUGHT THE RIGHT WAY TO LINK TO GOD TO THE WORLD, JOY TO THE WORLD JESUS REIGNS

Adam didn't ask4 forgiveness. Anyway sha Jesus has help us. Glory be to God who gave us Jesus 2 die 4 us. hadn't be Jesus didn't come 2 this world. no hope of eternal life, but thank God 4 Jesus. Adam and Eve na u sabi!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

@All who have posted this far; [quote ;DFUNNY THREAD, But even if he knew about forgiveness, he might not be forgiven because JESUS BROUGHT THE RIGHT WAY TO LINK TO GOD TO THE WORLD, JOY TO THE WORLD JESUS REIGNS

You took the word right out of my mouth. All of you are naively funny. Was Jesus just standing idly doing nothing seeing his earthly Parents, Adanm and Even being suckered in to sin by ordinary Satan? Or Jesus was not there and therefore had no power to do anything about it? If he was there, he must not had any power to do anything, because it has been designed that Adam and Eve will sin, so that they can be sent to the earth, out of Paradise, for the process of procreation, worship/deed and death to occur, the prerequisite for Judgement day: Hell and Paradise as reward for worship/deed!

What you are saying about Jesus being a link, therefore concerning Adam and Eve is that Adam and Eve are probably not going to paradise, because they were not forgiven? How could Jesus be standing there to let Eve, a woman be deceived ad then in turn deceived Adam? How could Jesus be standing there and allow Adam to shift the blame on Eve, when he was supposed to be with her at all time? Afterall he did not have anything to do, except being a mate to her.

A simple observation of your entry, tells me that Jesus was not available, just like you and me! Further, God is not unjust to His creations. He had put forward a means of repentance for Adam and Eve's benefit. They repented and their repentance were forgiven. And a proof of that is that before Jesus ever came about from his mother's womb and then started his 'Gospel/good news,' there were people who had seek forgivenss. Tell me how did they know about how to seek acceptable forgiveness from God?

Adam didn't ask4 forgiveness. Anyway sha Jesus has help us. Glory be to God who gave us Jesus 2 die 4 us. hadn't be Jesus didn't come 2 this world. no hope of eternal life, but thank God 4 Jesus. Adam and Eve na u sabi!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Thank Allah the Almighty Creator that you have the inkling that God and Jesus are different and separate entities; One being the the Boss and master of the other, sending him on errands. My dear siste, before Jesus, if what you said about Jesus is true (but of course it is false), what happened to the fate of those who died before jesus? You have a big explanation to give, missy.


]

olabowale:

You took the word right out of my mouth. All of you are naively funny. Was Jesus just standing idly doing nothing seeing his earthly Parents, Adanm and Even being suckered in to sin by ordinary Satan?

Are you not being so naive yourself, olabowale? 

You refer to Satan as "ordinary", but Muhammad must have been such a tool in his hands to have been so scared every time he sought "refuge" from shaitan. If Satan was "ordinary", why would Muhammad have to wait for Jesus Christ to come back and fight the antichrist for him? You're simply being mischievous beyond belief!


@topic,

Perhaps there's something that not many people have considered here. If "forgiveness" was all that was required, then there would be nothing unique in Christianity. WHY? Because as far as I'm aware, every religion on the face on the earth ALSO preach "forgiveness". In which case, Islam would have lost its argument before the first adhan was called out by the muezzin from a minaret!

Beyond asking for forgivess, God desires to bless people with something entirely far above a religious attainment by man - He seeks to give man the gift of eternal life in Jesus Christ! Certainly, we need forgiveness from God - but that's not where it stops: beyond the forgiveness, one needs to deal with the question of sin as it affects the entire human race! Until that question is settled, the prospect of eternal life will continue to be a far-fetched exercise to seekers of merely forgiveness!

I can't resist replying to this subject,,,I personally agree that ADAM ABD EVE were predestined tosin before the earth was created,,,The Devil or the "everything bad guy" figured he had defeated God when he destroyed Adam and Eve in the Garden,

I haven't read anything , concerning their forgiveness,,All know for sure, everyoine born ad adam and eve were born with a sin nature. Evebn the new born babies were or had been given a death sentence,

The Gospel of Jesus is the good news, God the father introduced a way for man kind to be forgien and live eternally with the trinity. We all know abouit John 3 16, don't we? The mercy and love o0f God, the finished work of Christ at calvary, his ressyrection was all planned way before the ADAM AND EVE FIASCO. The devil was blindsided by Calvary. He thought he had control of the earth forever, this so called prince of the air.

Someone made the statement about Jesus being saved before Christ came to earth, Abraham and others were granted salvation by god for their obedience to his commands, Everyone else.>>

I cant Believe anybody is still Debatin dis Mythological Story Cooked up by Jewish Fulani Cattle Rearer 2 Stop Thier Children from Bothering Them about d 1st Human & How d world Truely Started.
Why Plant d Tree Where Adam Or Eve Can Reach it?
Its like puttin a Toy in a Room filled wit other Toys. U Tell a baby "Play wit every other Toy But This particular 1"

Dat Genesis Story is Plain Ridiculous

lol. It's actually a symbolic tale that's got nothing whatsoever to do with God. But try telling that to these christians. lol.

Gamine!

Adam committed no sin and therefore no "original sin" and no need for "atonement".

1.) the first time the word "sin" is mentioned in bible is when Cain killed Abel
2.) Adam was created from the beginning and according to God's plan to inhabit the earth and not a garden,therefore his removal from the garden to the earth did not amount to a punishment for a sin.his stay in the garden was transitory intended for him to attain maturity and transcend to the earth,a place for test and tribulation.if you pass,you will be rewarded more than just a garden per se but also eternity.
3.) Adam was created mortal and not immortal as christians want us to believe.in genesis we are told that Adam was expelled from the garden "lest he should eat from the tree of life and gain immortality".had Adam being made immortal,he would have never needed to eat from a tree for immortality and would have nevr being tried.this shows man was created to be tried and the incident of adam give a main lesson:the devil is always there to deceive man.it was more of a lesson for adam.
4.) genesis tells God did not want Adam to eat from the forbidden tree because it was the "tree of knowledge of good and evil".if man does not know what is good and evil,how can man avoid evil?does God not want us to know what is good and what is evil?does God wish us to be ignorant?
5.) if Adam's sin became known as "original sin" and our tendency to sin is blamed on our "sinful nature" and the sin and imperfection inherited from Adam,then who did Adam inherit his own "sinful nature" from since he also had a tendency to sin?
6.) had Adam not ate from the tree we would have never being born.it was upon eating from the tree that Adam's unclothedness was revealed to him and his power to pro-create made known to him.in other words,the eating from the tree was a timing point made by God for Adam to realize his maturity and know the time to commence his earthly journey.
7.) almost all versions of the bible contain a promise from God to adam:"the day you eat from the forbidden tree,you shall surely die".the devil disputed that and advised Adam to go ahead an eat.Adam lived for more than 900 years!!!



the lesson to learn from Adam's tale is as follows:

1.) it was revealed to Adam through a demonstration and experience that God gives guidance which man must follow
2.) it was also demonstrated to Adam who his enemy is and the enemy of mankind whose aim is to lead man astray
3.)the actions of Adam eventhough made to look like a contradiction of God's order was part of God's plan for Adam to use his initiative to decend to the earth.remember that God made Adam for the earth and not a garden.and the deception of the devil made Adam to realize that the devil wants him to disobey God.that is a lesson that have lived on forever.

LagosShia:

Adam committed no sin and therefore no "original sin" and no need for "atonement".

1.) the first time the word "sin" is mentioned in bible is when Cain killed Abel
2.) Adam was created from the beginning and according to God's plan to inhabit the earth and not a garden,therefore his removal from the garden to the earth did not amount to a punishment for a sin.his stay in the garden was transitory intended for him to attain maturity and transcend to the earth,a place for test and tribulation.if you pass,you will be rewarded more than just a garden per se but also eternity.
3.) Adam was created mortal and not immortal as christians want us to believe.in genesis we are told that Adam was expelled from the garden "lest he should eat from the tree of life and gain immortality".had Adam being made immortal,he would have never needed to eat from a tree for immortality and would have nevr being tried.this shows man was created to be tried and the incident of adam give a main lesson:the devil is always there to deceive man.it was more of a lesson for adam.
4.) genesis tells God did not want Adam to eat from the forbidden tree because it was the "tree of knowledge of good and evil".if man does not know what is good and evil,how can man avoid evil?does God not want us to know what is good and what is evil?does God wish us to be ignorant?
5.) if Adam's sin became known as "original sin" and our tendency to sin is blamed on our "sinful nature" and the sin and imperfection inherited from Adam,then who did Adam inherit his own "sinful nature" from since he also had a tendency to sin?
6.) had Adam not ate from the tree we would have never being born.it was upon eating from the tree that Adam's unclothedness was revealed to him and his power to pro-create made known to him.in other words,the eating from the tree was a timing point made by God for Adam to realize his maturity and know the time to commence his earthly journey.
7.) almost all versions of the bible contain a promise from God to adam:"the day you eat from the forbidden tree,you shall surely die".the devil disputed that and advised Adam to go ahead an eat.Adam lived for more than 900 years!!!

Great revelations here. But the bible made it clear Adam sinned. The sin was not the eating of the fruit, but that it was eaten before maturity and also at the devils command and not Gods.

if Adam knew what he did was bad, why was blaming it on Eve the first thing he did?

Gamine:


If Adam had just asked for forgiveness . . .

I realized a lesson from this, its not about not offending someone

Its about having the sense of responsibility and the humility to admit a wrong and ask for forgiveness

Something men the world over still struggle to do.

Adam had to blame someone, something for the wrong he partook in.

By blaming Eve,

Man now has to struggle for woman's respect.

Because really i cant even imagine a guy blaming me for a wrongdoing we both committed

especially when he was supposed to be the caretaker and stop me from doing the wrong thing.

i would definitely loose respect for him.

The womans role in this world today is to make the men feel good about themselves

and in return they pour themselves out to us

pretty good bargain!

@^^^

Yeah, Adam blamed Eve

and Eve passing the buck, blamed the serpent . . .

It was a  travesty. No one was remorseful

Adam built a fence (i.e. the ". . . if we touch the tree, we'll surely die . . . "

but hey wait-a-minute, God didnt anything about touching. This is/was Adam improvising for Eve's sake

Anyways, Eve climbed the fence, took the fruit, ate and handed rest to Adam to eat

I suppose Adam had a misleading relief when Eve did not drop dead after eating the fruit

The false sense of security probably contributed to him too taking a bite

Imagine Adam shock and horror when he realised the cookie's crumbled (i.e. epa oboro mo)

Chivalry? Not this one. That would be for another man.

Adam sang like a canary and dropped Eve in it . . .

But in actual sense, Adam wasnt really on about Eve or blaming Eve . . .

Or was he?

This was Adam's second and final act of rebellion

Yeah, a closing momentarily stance of defiance . . .

"Adam said unto the Lord God, "The woman (Eve) whom you gave to be with me, she gave me fruit of the tree, and I ate

Adam was actually pointing the finger of blame at the Lord God not realising three were point back at him

(i.e. He was saying literally "Pftt! You gave me the woman in the first place, so suck it up and deal with it"

Starting with Adam, this is now a very common practice . Blame God for the personal and all the world problems . . .

Anyways, Adam was a gibberish DROWNING man clutching at straws,

blurting out nonsensicals when he saw the world slip through his fingers

There are a lot of lessons and hallmarks on how to be a man here; a real man

- a noble man of valor for that matter

^{References: Genesis 3:12}

Gamine:


If Adam had just asked for forgiveness . . .

I realized a lesson from this, its not about not offending someone

Its about having the sense of responsibility and the humility to admit a wrong and ask for forgiveness

Something men the world over still struggle to do.

Adam had to blame someone, something for the wrong he partook in.

By blaming Eve,

Man now has to struggle for woman's respect.

Because really i cant even imagine a guy blaming me for a wrongdoing we both committed

especially when he was supposed to be the caretaker and stop me from doing the wrong thing.

i would definitely loose respect for him.

The womans role in this world today is to make the men feel good about themselves

and in return they pour themselves out to us

pretty good bargain!

@Gamine

Now say for reasoning sake, Adam was really blaming Eve and Gamine was right about "Man now has to struggle for woman's respect."

It is imaginable that Adam could find it hard loving Eve after the fiasco

and Eve too in the same vein could find it hard respecting Adam

but at the end of the day, Ephesians 5:33 states:

"So again I say, each man must love his wife as he loves himself, and the wife must respect her husband"

This means that anyone who belongs to Christ has become a new person. The old life is gone; a new life has begun!

so the new man should not struggle for the woman's respect

and neither should the new woman struggle for the man's love.

^{References: Genesis 3:12; 2 Corinthians 5:17}

[Quote]« #9 on: January 29, 2008, 04:01 PM »
Quote from: olabowale on January 29, 2008, 02:40 PM
You took the word right out of my mouth. All of you are naively funny. Was Jesus just standing idly doing nothing seeing his earthly Parents, Adanm and Even being suckered in to sin by ordinary Satan?

Are you not being so naive yourself, olabowale? Grin

You refer to Satan as "ordinary", but Muhammad must have been such a tool in his hands to have been so scared every time he sought "refuge" from shaitan. If Satan was "ordinary", why would Muhammad have to wait for Jesus Christ to come back and fight the antichrist for him? You're simply being mischievous beyond belief! Grin[/Quote]But Muhammad (AS) was a Human prophet. He didnt claim to be God. He didnt claim to be powerful. He didnt claim any autonomy or independence from God. He depended on God. Thats different from Jesus who was all in all and able to do all things, having all the powers on earth and heavens, all according to the christians and their Bible. You should not be comparing your god or one of your Gods with my human Prophet.

By some chance did you read of the hadith that Satan was humiliated, time and time, again and could have been tied to the post in Madina except that since Solomon prayed about his uniqueness to be maintained on the jinn, and satan is a jinn, the Messenger (AS) didnt make the arrest of satan physical. Jesus return was not the making of Muhammad (AS) and he will not fight because Muhammad couldnt, since I indicated the Madina story above, all of the affairs are as God Almighty Wills.




[Quote]@topic,
Perhaps there's something that not many people have considered here. If "forgiveness" was all that was required, then there would be nothing unique in Christianity. WHY? Because as far as I'm aware, every religion on the face on the earth ALSO preach "forgiveness". In which case, Islam would have lost its argument before the first adhan was called out by the muezzin from a minaret! Undecided

Beyond asking for forgivess, God desires to bless people with something entirely far above a religious attainment by man - He seeks to give man the gift of eternal life in Jesus Christ! Certainly, we need forgiveness from God - but that's not where it stops: beyond the forgiveness, one needs to deal with the question of sin as it affects the entire human race! Until that question is settled, the prospect of eternal life will continue to be a far-fetched exercise to seekers of merely forgiveness![/Quote]And forgiveness is all that is required, hence nothing unique about christianity. Just imagine what Satan did to not have favor with God. Are we saying that he sort forgiveness at all? Are we saying that Adam (AS) and his mate Hawa didnt? Are we therefore saying that God didnt forgive Adam and his mate or that they were forgiven without seeking it?

The difference between a good person and a bad perdon is their God consciousness. A good person will sin or make error and seek forgiveness from God and try not to repeat the error. A bad person will not seek forgiveness, but instead be arrogant and pile up more sinful acts, becoming a second nature in him.

Who was the first people to make mistake but the first people to seek forgiveness and were granted it but Adam and his mate Hawa.

Folks in christendom, if your God does not forgive, Allah does. Personal responsibility to your Lord is far better than shoving your responsibility on a person who is powerless by his own admission. If you christinas did not know that Adam and Eve sort forgiveness and were granted, and their infractions were wiped off, who was the first to seek forgiveness and who do you get the tradition from? People have been seeking forgiveness and have been receiving forgiveness long before your human God was an egg in his mother's ovary.

great revelations ko, what with your poor choice of words(because i know you'll pull out the 'misunderstood' card)?

If only the bible god built a high fence around that damn tree. . .

Of course, it is a symbolic tale. An allegory. But, the literal translation is much more fun for the adherents of all three abrahamic faiths. Enables all the male adherents to persecute women for their woes and the women to revel in guilt all their lives, for example. Isn't that much more fun? All that drama. . .

ROSSIKE:

lol. It's actually a symbolic tale that's got nothing whatsoever to do with God.

Don't even bother.

ROSSIKE:

But try telling that to these christians. lol. 

Joagbaje:

Great revelations here. But the bible made it clear Adam sinned. The sin was not the eating of the fruit, but that it was eaten before maturity and also at the devils command and not Gods.

what i gave is the perspective of shia islam.we believe in the sinlessness of all prophets.Adam was the first prophet and thus sinless.it is unreasonable and ridiculous that God sent prophets to guide us and then these same men were sinful and were the first to disobey God instead of obeying Him and practicing what they preached.therefore we reject instances mentioned in the bible where these men of God are said to have sinned or misbehaved.take David,Lot, and Noah,as examples.

if you read my first post,i stated (that based on the old testament),the first time the word "sin" is used in the bible is not in reference to Adam but in reference to Cain.

Also Adam did not eat the fruit "at the devil's command".the devil used deception to trick Adam.since this was a plan of God which exposed the devil and Adam experienced it first hand,Adam's intention was not to obey the devil at the expense of God.being God's plan,and the removal of Adam from the garden to the earth was also God's plan,that does not amount to punishment for sin.Adam was made mortal and destined to inherit the earth.taking him to the earth was no punishment.it was the plan for the trial to begin.

if you say that Adam ate "at the command of the devil",then that means the devil commanded Adam to eat and Adam and Adam just followed like an obedient servant.the devil was deceitful.and like i said,that was the first time the devil was totally exposed and his true colors showed to man.thereafter,anything he says or do,if you listen to him,that is sinful.before that Adam had no such experience.

Gamine:
If Adam had just asked for forgiveness. . . . .

I realized a lesson from this, its not about not offending someone

Its about having the sense of responsibility and the humility to admit a wrong and ask for forgiveness

Something men the world over still struggle to do.

Adam had to blame someone, something for the wrong he partook in.
By blaming Eve,
Man now has to struggle for woman's respect.

Because really i cant even imagine a guy blaming me for a wrongdoing we both committed
especially when he was supposed to be the caretaker and stop me from doing the wrong thing.
i would definitely loose respect for him.

The womans role in this world today is to make the men feel good about themselves
and in return they pour themselves out to us
pretty good bargain!

How about if satan had asked for forgiveness.

Nigerians talking about jewish myths as though it were theirs, such a pity...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4URKHvdky8g&t=12s


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LxiOheZe4ks&t=28s

What if there is no Adam...just metaphors ?

Will you have sense ?

kimco:


How about if satan had asked for forgiveness.

Satan's crime was WILL FULL CHALLENGE AND DISOBEDIENCE.

ADAMS OFFENCE IS BASED ON GUILT BY REASON OF UNDUE UNLAWFULL PRESSURE AND COERCION,FROM HIS LAWFULL WIFE!

So definitely, no chance for Satan, but Adam indeed had a chance but he blew it.