saintvc: Logic boy, why are u nt answerin my question?

What question?

Logicboy03:


Hitler was not the only war general.


There was Himmler (A Nazi war general). Furthermore, gernans didnt wear armour of steel. They were not medieval knights.



You twist and turn and remix the rant to make it fit with history so that it becomes a prophecy. Try again.

are you saying that there are no prophesies that has ever come true even in the bible inclusive?

truthislight:

are you saying that there are no prophesies that has ever come true even in the bible inclusive?

Yes. Even Jesus failed in his prophecy


12) Jesus’ prophecy in John 13:38 ("The cock shall not crow, till thou [Peter] hast denied me three times" is false. Mark 14:66-68 shows the cock crowed after the first denial, not the third.

Logicboy03:


Hitler was not the only war general.


There was Himmler (A Nazi war general). Furthermore, gernans didnt wear armour of steel. They were not medieval knights.



You twist and turn and remix the rant to make it fit with history so that it becomes a prophecy. Try again.

the terms Armour or armor may also refer to: Military and naval: An armoured fighting vehicle Vehicle armour, protection for vehicles or warships The metal belt armour, deck armor, turret armor, and command
citadel armor of battleship and
cruisers Personal armor, protection for individuals which of course were used in the war

mkmyers45: the terms Armour or armor may also refer to: Military and naval: An armoured fighting vehicle Vehicle armour, protection for vehicles or warships The metal belt armour, deck armor, turret armor, and command
citadel armor of battleship and
cruisers Personal armor, protection for individuals which of course were used in the war

My point exactly, you interpret Nostradamus's sayings in such a way that you force it to meet the story of hitler.


-Changing hister to hitler

-selecting a particular meaning of "armour"

-Assuming that the river had significance in hitlers life

-Assuming that it was not himmler


etc

Logicboy03: I first lost my belief in God (the christian god) through slavery which I will go into further.

Would you mind shedding more light on what you mean by slavery?

Logicboy03: However, the main reason for the non-existence of god is the lack of evidence for him.

You must be specific on the kind of evidence you're looking for.

Judging from your posts on Nairaland, its right for me to conclude that you had a very weak christian background. Therefore, it would be very difficult for you to understand certain issues that were being made in the bible.

I understand your quest for knowledge, therefore I would advise that you lower your guard on the evidence issue and take your time to look properly into the reality of the bible.

If you're expecting God to appear from heaven and say hey logic boy here I am, then you'd wait till eternity cos God doesn't work that way.

If you've made up your mind that he doesn't exist, then there's no way he'd exist in your world...so like I stated earlier, lay down your guard...open up your heart...let go the early christianity where all forms of cruel practices was at its peak, and make up your mind to know who this God is.

Logicboy03: Furthermore, the religions I know all have paradoxical and self-refuting gods. They claim that god is omnipotent (but can he make a rock that he can not move?) god is omniscient (why would such a god test people's faith?) etc.

This is where I would have to cut in....you can't judge a religion from what you read on the internet.

You claim to have knowledge of all these religions, question what's the level of commitment you have with them?

There's a difference between I've read about America therefore I can say that America is an immoral nation, and I've been to America and I can say that not all of them are immoral.

Unless you commit yourself to a religion, you can never know what it entails

CrazyMan:
Would you mind shedding more light on what you mean by slavery?

The bible has many quotes on slavery and supports it. God chose to ignore West Africa for over 4000 years till the 16th century when the british came with slavery.

Such a racist and slavery god can not exist when christians also claim that he is a loving god. The conditions of those slaves were worse than hell.

CrazyMan:


You must be specific on the kind of evidence you're looking for.

There is only one kind of evidence.

Material evidence or logical conclusion from material evidence. Unfortuantely, your god is very immaterial.

CrazyMan:
Judging from your posts on Nairaland, its right for me to conclude that you had a very weak christian background. Therefore, it would be very difficult for you to understand certain issues that were being made in the bible.

I understand your quest for knowledge, therefore I would advise that you lower your guard on the evidence issue and take your time to look properly into the reality of the bible.

If you're expecting God to appear from heaven and say hey logic boy here I am, then you'd wait till eternity cos God doesn't work that way.

If you've made up your mind that he doesn't exist, then there's no way he'd exist in your world...so like I stated earlier, lay down your guard...open up your heart...let go the early christianity where all forms of cruel practices was at its peak, and make up your mind to know who this God is.

Nonsense. Doesnt your bible tell you not to judge? I was a christian for 22 years. I went to church, read the bible and prayed. For you to even insult my past as if you were there only makes you look foolish.

CrazyMan:
This is where I would have to cut in....you can't judge a religion from what you read on the internet.

You claim to have knowledge of all these religions, question what's the level of commitment you have with them?

There's a difference between I've read about America therefore I can say that America is an immoral nation, and I've been to America and I can say that not all of them are immoral.

Unless you commit yourself to a religion, you can never know what it entails

Nonsense. Then how do you know that islam is not the truth? or belief in Wicca?

This was my initial question to you

truthislight:

are you saying that there are no prophesies that has ever come true even in the bible inclusive?

and this is your answer i supposed.

Logicboy03:


Yes.

well then,

lets see, i will take it one at a time with you so that you can cope Since you can get overwhelm.

"And Babylon, the glory of kingdoms, the beauty of the Chaldees’ excellency, shall be as when God overthrew Sodom and Gomorrah. It shall never be inhabited, neither shall it be dwelt in from generation to generation: neither shall the Arabian pitch tent there; neither shall the shepherds make their fold there." (Isaiah 13:19-20).

"For I will rise up against them, saith the LORD of hosts, and cut off from Babylon the name, and remnant, and son, and nephew, saith the LORD. I will also make it a possession for the bittern, and pools of water: and I will sweep it with the besom(broom) of destruction, saith the LORD of hosts." (Isaiah 14:22-23).

Now, i will give you the benefit that you know history or can make use of wiki to find out things:

1. In what region was babylon and is their an inhabitant on that land to proof that that ^^^ prophesy did not come to pass?

2. The attempt to remediate the geographical area of babylilon has it been successful that it can be inhabited till date in contrast to what that prophesy made about 3000yrs ago had said?

3. Are you aware that the military commander that will lead that onslaugth was mentioned over 200yrs befor he was born in that prophesy?(i will show it to you)

start with those ^^^

truthislight: This was my initial question to you
and this is your answer i supposed.



well then,

lets see, i will take it one at a time with you so that you can cope Since you can get overwhem.

"And Babylon, the glory of kingdoms, the beauty of the Chaldees’ excellency, shall be as when God overthrew Sodom and Gomorrah. It shall never be inhabited, neither shall it be dwelt in from generation to generation: neither shall the Arabian pitch tent there; neither shall the shepherds make their fold there." (Isaiah 13:19-20).

"For I will rise up against them, saith the LORD of hosts, and cut off from Babylon the name, and remnant, and son, and nephew, saith the LORD. I will also make it a possession for the bittern, and pools of water: and I will sweep it with the besom of destruction, saith the LORD of hosts." (Isaiah 14:22-23).

Now, i will give you the benefit that you know history or can make use of wiki to find out things:

1. In what region was baboon and is their an inhabitant on that land to proof that that prophesy did not come to pass?

2. The attempt to remediate the geographical area of babylilon has it been successful that it can be inhabited till date in contrast to what that prophesy made about 3000yrs ago had said?

3. Are you aware that the military commander that will lead that onslaugth was mentioned over 200yrs befor he was born in that prophesy?(i will show it to you)

start with those ^^^

Yawn?


See, I cant be bothered to find out these things. The bible has already been proven to be flawed and faulty. I cant bother to waste my time checking the historical accuracy of all the parts of the bible. For instance, Isrealites were never enslaved by Egyptians.

truthislight:

"And Babylon, the glory of kingdoms, the beauty of the Chaldees’ excellency, shall be as when God overthrew Sodom and Gomorrah. It shall never be inhabited, neither shall it be dwelt in from generation to generation: neither shall the Arabian pitch tent there; neither shall the shepherds make their fold there." (Isaiah 13:19-20).

"For I will rise up against them, saith the LORD of hosts, and cut off from Babylon the name, and remnant, and son, and nephew, saith the LORD. I will also make it a possession for the bittern, and pools of water: and I will sweep it with the besom(broom) of destruction, saith the LORD of hosts." (Isaiah 14:22-23).

Now, i will give you the benefit that you know history or can make use of wiki to find out things:

1. In what region was babylon and is their an inhabitant on that land to proof that that ^^^ prophesy did not come to pass?

2. The attempt to remediate the geographical area of babylilon has it been successful that it can be inhabited till date in contrast to what that prophesy made about 3000yrs ago had said?

3. Are you aware that the military commander that will lead that onslaugth was mentioned over 200yrs befor he was born in that prophesy?(i will show it to you)

start with those ^^^

Nothing at all impressive about this. Babylon's location is actually not wet but pretty dry. And it was abandoned. So what. Many cities have suffered the same fate.

I would be much more impressed if the Bible had described in detail some previously unknown and unknowable scientific principle before it was possible. Like microbes being the cause of disease. Or an accurate description of the solar system. But no, the knowledge of the Bible is by coincidence limited to the same knowledge that human beings had at that time.

Logicboy03:



Yawn?


See, I cant be bothered to find out these things.

well, ignorance is no excuse.

The complete ruin of babylon is situated 50miles south of baghdad, Irag.


This is the name of the conqueror of babylon as attested to by history.

You will now need your second brain(wiki):

"That saith of Cyrus, He is my shepherd, and shall perform all my pleasure: even saying to Jerusalem, Thou shalt be built; and to the temple, Thy foundation shall be laid." (Isaiah 44:28).

"Thus saith the LORD to his anointed, to Cyrus, whose right hand I have holden, to subdue nations before him; and I will loose the loins of kings, to open before him the two leaved gates; and the gates shall not be shut; I will go before thee, and make the crooked places straight: I will break in pieces the gates of brass, and cut in sunder the bars of iron:" (Isaiah 45:1-2).

"And I will give thee the treasures of darkness, and hidden riches of secret places, that thou mayest know that I, the LORD, which call thee by thy name, am the God of Israel. For Jacob my servant’s sake, and Israel mine elect, I have even called thee by thy name: I have surnamed thee, though thou hast not known me. I am the LORD, and there is none else, there is no God beside me: I girded thee, though thou hast not known me:" (Isaiah 45:3-5).
^^^
this was said 200yrs befor he was born.

Now, that done, wait for the next.

truthislight:

well, ignorance is no excuse.

The complete ruin of babylon is situated 50miles south of baghdad, Irag.


This is the name of the conqueror of babylon as attested to by history.

You will now need your second brain(wiki):

"That saith of Cyrus, He is my shepherd, and shall perform all my pleasure: even saying to Jerusalem, Thou shalt be built; and to the temple, Thy foundation shall be laid." (Isaiah 44:28).

"Thus saith the LORD to his anointed, to Cyrus, whose right hand I have holden, to subdue nations before him; and I will loose the loins of kings, to open before him the two leaved gates; and the gates shall not be shut; I will go before thee, and make the crooked places straight: I will break in pieces the gates of brass, and cut in sunder the bars of iron:" (Isaiah 45:1-2).

"And I will give thee the treasures of darkness, and hidden riches of secret places, that thou mayest know that I, the LORD, which call thee by thy name, am the God of Israel. For Jacob my servant’s sake, and Israel mine elect, I have even called thee by thy name: I have surnamed thee, though thou hast not known me. I am the LORD, and there is none else, there is no God beside me: I girded thee, though thou hast not known me:" (Isaiah 45:3-5).
^^^
this was said 200yrs befor he was born.

Now, that done, wait for the next.

Lol.....I know that if I waste my time fact checking this story of prophecy, I would meet selective interpretations and exaggerations.


Onetack has already found something wrong with your story.

The bible is flawed. Using it to prove prophecy is laughable. There is a long list of Jesus's failed prophecies in the bible with references.
http://www.evilbible.com/jesus_false.htm

Now for the third post (3) on bible prophesy:


This was my initial question to you

truthislight:

are you saying that there are no prophesies that has ever come true even in the bible inclusive?

and this is your answer i supposed.

Logicboy03:


Yes.

"For unto us a child is born, unto us a son is given: and the government shall be upon his shoulder: and his name shall be called Wonderful, Counsellor, The mighty God, The everlasting Father, The Prince of Peace." (Isaiah 9:6).

"Of the increase of his government and peace there shall be no end, upon the throne of David, and upon his kingdom, to order it, and to establish it with judgment and with justice from henceforth even for ever. The zeal of the LORD of hosts will perform this. The Lord sent a word into Jacob, and it hath lighted upon Israel." (Isaiah 9:7-.

& 700yrs befor he was born the specifics of where he will be BORN:

"But thou, Bethlehem Ephratah, though thou be little among the thousands of Judah, yet out of thee shall he come forth unto me that is to be ruler in Israel; whose goings forth have been from of old, from everlasting." (Micah 5:2).

& where in actuality was he born?

"Now when Jesus was born in Bethlehem of Judaea in the days of Herod the king, behold, there came wise men from the east to Jerusalem," (Matthew 2:1).

"When Herod the king had heard these things, he was troubled, and all Jerusalem with him. And when he had gathered all the chief priests and scribes of the people together, he demanded of them where Christ should be born. And they said unto him, In Bethlehem of Judaea: for thus it is written by the prophet," (Matthew 2:3-5).

"And thou Bethlehem, in the land of Juda, art not the least among the princes of Juda: for out of thee shall come a Governor, that shall rule my people Israel." (Matthew 2:6).

Wait for the next.

Please i want to be cleared, LOGICBOY and LOGICBOY03 are they different individual. I suggest that the owner of this forum should make the forum to be for matured men and women and not for small BOYZ.

ogoamaka99: Please i want to be cleared, LOGICBOY and LOGICBOY03 are they different individual. I suggest that the owner of this forum should make the forum to be for matured men and women and not for small BOYZ.

Same person.

Now for the forth post (4) on bible prophesy:


This was my initial question to you

truthislight:

are you saying that there are no prophesies that has ever come true even in the bible inclusive?

and this is your answer i supposed.

Logicboy03:


Yes.

the appearance of the messaiah:

"Know therefore and understand, that from the going forth of the commandment to restore and to build Jerusalem until the Messiah the Prince there shall be seven weeks, and threescore and two weeks: the street shall be built again, and the wall, even in troublous times." (Daniel 9:25).

Note the sign to mark the appearance of the mesaiah :

"from the "going forth of the commandment" to restore and to build Jerusalem until the Messiah"
(going forth of the commandment)

and when was this words given to rebuild Jerusalem ?

"And it came to pass in the month Nisan, in the twentieth year of Artaxerxes the king, that wine was before him: and I took up the wine, and gave it unto the king. Now I had not been beforetime sad in his presence." (Nehemiah 2:1).

"And I said unto the king, If it please the king, and if thy servant have found favour in thy sight, that thou wouldest send me unto Judah, unto the city of my fathers’ sepulchres, that I may build it. And the king said unto me, (the queen also sitting by him,) For how long shall thy journey be? and when wilt thou return? So it pleased the king to send me; and I set him a time." (Nehemiah 2:5-6).

"Moreover I said unto the king, If it please the king, let letters be given me to the governors beyond the river, that they may convey me over till I come into Judah;"
"And a letter unto Asaph the keeper of the king’s forest, that he may give me timber to make beams for the gates of the palace which appertained to the house, and for the wall of the city, and for the house that I shall enter into. And the king granted me, according to the good hand of my God upon me." (Nehemiah 7:8.)

^^^ now we know when the words were given by the letter authorising the rebuilding of Jeruselam :

the month Nisan, in the twentieth year of Artaxerxes the king, (Nehemiah 2:1).


So, From secular sources history also shows that the first year of king Artaxerxes as ruler was 474BCE and as such the twentieth year of his rule that the word went forth was = 455BCE, we have the date for the going forth of the word and the starting point for the appearance of the messaiah

so, the duration will be a day = 1year as in yearly sabbath (Exodus 23:11). :

seven weeks(7*7= 49years) and threescore(3*20 = 60weeks *7 = 420 years) and two weeks(7*2 = 14).
(Daniel 9:25)

Total = 49+420+14 = 483years befor the Messiah will appear.

And the starting point we hard was the 20th year OF the king Artaxerxes = 455BCE

so, 455 - 483 =29CE the year that Jesus was anointed as the masaiah(baptise)
^^^ perfect prophesy (note, no zero years in date)

again, masaiah's death :

there is a calculation for the cutting off of the messaiah also.

Next is COMING :

Now for the fifth post (5) on bible prophesy:


This was my initial question to you

truthislight:

are you saying that there are no prophesies that has ever come true even in the bible inclusive?

and this is your answer i supposed.

Logicboy03:


Yes.

am looking for very simple once so far cus if i go deep, men!

Prophesies that will fulfil on the messaiah:

1.
"The sceptre(rulership) shall not depart from Judah, nor a lawgiver from between his feet, until Shiloh(messaiah) come; and unto him shall the gathering of the people be." (Genesis 49:10).
^^^
Messaiah will come from the tribe of Judah:

(Luke 3:23 to 33)
"And Jesus himself began to be about thirty years of age, being (as was supposed) the son of Joseph, which was the son of Heli," (Luke 3:23).

"Which was the son of Aminadab, which was the son of Aram, which was the son of Esrom, which was the son of Phares, which was the son of Juda," (Luke 3:33).

2.

"And he made his grave with the wicked, and with the rich in his death; because he had done no violence, neither was any deceit in his mouth." (Isaiah 53:9).

Buried with the rich:

"When the even was come, there came a rich man of Arimathaea, named Joseph, who also himself was Jesus’ disciple: He went to Pilate, and begged the body of Jesus. Then Pilate commanded the body to be delivered. And when Joseph had taken the body, he wrapped it in a clean linen cloth," (Matthew 27:57-59).

"And laid it in his own new tomb, which he had hewn out in the rock: and he rolled a great stone to the door of the sepulchre, and departed." (Matthew 27:60).

*to be continued*

Now for the six post (6) on bible prophesy:


This was my initial question to you

truthislight:

are you saying that there are no prophesies that has ever come true even in the bible inclusive?

and this is your answer i supposed.

Logicboy03:


Yes.

Prophesies that will fulfil on the messaiah:


3.

"Rejoice greatly, O daughter of Zion; shout, O daughter of Jerusalem: behold, thy King cometh unto thee: he is just, and having salvation; lowly, and riding upon an ass, and upon a colt the foal of an as.s", (Zechariah 9:9).

Entered Jerusalem with "ass"

"And brought the as.s, and the colt, and put on them their clothes, and they set him thereon." (Matthew 21:7).

*to be continued*

Now for the seventh post (7) on bible prophesy:


This was my initial question to you

truthislight:

are you saying that there are no prophesies that has ever come true even in the bible inclusive?

and this is your answer i supposed.

Logicboy03:


Yes.

Prophesies that will fulfil on the messaiah:

4.
"For thou wilt not leave my soul in hell; neither wilt thou suffer thine Holy One to see corruption." (Psalm 16:10).

Concerning his resurrection befor corruption :

"Whom God hath raised up, having loosed the pains of death: because it was not possible that he should be holden of it." (Acts 2:24).

"Because thou wilt not leave my soul in hell, neither wilt thou suffer thine Holy One to see corruption." (Acts 2:27).



*to be continued*

Logicboy03:

My point exactly, you interpret Nostradamus's sayings in such a way that you force it to meet the story of hitler.


-Changing hister to hitler

-selecting a particular meaning of "armour"

-Assuming that the river had significance in hitlers life

-Assuming that it was not himmler


etc

Keep evading...I put it to you that God in material form is Pure Primordial Energy manifest in all things...Now Logically God must be eternal and all-powerful so also the manifest. I put it to you that you can never dispute the fact that

Energy: A fundamental entity of
nature that is transferred between
parts of a system in the production of physical/metaphysical change
within the system and usually
regarded as the capacity for doing work. Energy is not possessed but is a fundamental entity that ALL things must posses..Energy flows and manifest in ALL things.

is material evidence as only the infinite eternity of energy would have brought about the universe and the fact that there is no space devoid of energy..

mkmyers45: Keep evading...I put it to you that God in material form is Pure Primordial Energy manifest in all things...Now Logically God must be eternal and all-powerful so also the manifest. I put it to you that you can never dispute the fact that is material evidence as only the infinite eternity of energy would have brought about the universe and the fact that there is no space devoid of energy..

does this God have a mind/intelligence of its own?

mkmyers45: Keep evading...I put it to you that God in material form is Pure Primordial Energy manifest in all things...Now Logically God must be eternal and all-powerful so also the manifest. I put it to you that you can never dispute the fact that is material evidence as only the infinite eternity of energy would have brought about the universe and the fact that there is no space devoid of energy..

Energy is material while your god is immaterial. Your god cant be energy.

mkmyers45: Keep evading...I put it to you that God in material form is Pure Primordial Energy manifest in all things...Now Logically God must be eternal and all-powerful so also the manifest. I put it to you that you can never dispute the fact that is material evidence as only the infinite eternity of energy would have brought about the universe and the fact that there is no space devoid of energy..

Then everything that happens as a result of energy, murder, rape, sodomy, robbery, is all just God doing his thing? What an evil creature.

truthislight:

are you saying that there are no prophesies that has ever come true even in the bible inclusive?

Prophecy, at most, is an educated guess.
Economic forcasters, for example, are modern day prophets, same for polical forcastors.
One did not need to be called a prophet, to have forcasted, 25yrs ago, that Nigeria Nigeria was going to have very deep and dire economic, political and social upheavals.

Infact, I voluteer to prophesy that in the decades to come, cannibalism will become common again and that Nigeria would be like the Somalia of 10yrs ago.

truthislight:

does this God have a mind/intelligence of its own?

Yes

Logicboy03:



Energy is material while your god is immaterial. Your god cant be energy.

Oh so god is immaterial eh? How do you know that for sure?

onetrack:

Then everything that happens as a result of energy, murder, rape, sodomy, robbery, is all just God doing his thing? What an evil creature.

Negative interactions of octave energy at diffrent frequencies...Its not a creature but a manifestation

mkmyers45: Oh so god is immaterial eh? How do you know that for sure?

If god is material, where is he located, can we see him?

Logicboy03:

If god is material, where is he located, can we see him?

and i put it to you that Primordial Energy is indeed God..and we can see its manifestation

mkmyers45: and i put it to you that Primordial Energy is indeed God..and we can see its manifestation

Conversely,We can also put it that God is indeed just simple primordial energy, and nothing more.

Are theists willing to accept this definition?.

^^^^
If this definition is acceptable, we can also agree with you that the universe is a manifestation, perhaps one of many, of the primordal energy.

If the universe is the manifestation of primordal energy, the universe is part of that energy and not a creation of it.
A Manifestation and a creation are two different things.
Your shadow is a manifestation and not a creation. you and your shadow are one and the same. If you are immortal, self-existent and infinitely tall or fat, then so is your shadow. Not so?

It means that there is only, I repeat, only one thing that exists, and that thing is energy. Everything else, be it electrons, photons,quarks, stars, gallaxies, planets and biological life, manifests from one source, one singularity, energy, or if you like, call it God.
Others and I prefer to call it, The Flying Spaghetti Monster.lol. (what's in a name?)

If we agree so far, then it is false and illogical to claim that god created the universe and that god exists as a seperate entity outside of creation.

Therefore, the atheistic position denying the existence (existence in the context of creating and being outside of the universe)
of god is validated.

plaetton: ^^^^
If this definition is acceptable, we can also agree with you that the universe is a manifestation, perhaps one of many, of the primordal energy.

If the universe is the manifestation of primordal energy, the universe is part of that energy and not a creation of it.
A Manifestation and a creation are two different things.
Your shadow is a manifestation and not a creation. you and your shadow are one and the same. If you are immortal, self-existent and infinitely tall or fat, then so is your shadow. Not so?

It means that there is only, I repeat, only one thing that exists, and that thing is energy. Everything else, be it electrons, photons,quarks, stars, gallaxies, planets and biological life, manifests from one source, one singularity, energy, or if you like, call it God, or even the Flying Spaghetti Monster.

If we agree so far, then it is false and illogical to claim that god created the universe and that god exists as a seperate entity outside of creation.

Therefore, the atheistic position denying the existence (existence in the context of creating and being outside of the universe)
of god is validated.

Boom!


Nail in the coffin!