Bidam: Principle is a rule or belief governing one's personal behavior.e.g i tithe as a principle.While Law is a system of rules and guidelines which are enforced through social institutions to govern behavior..e.g thou shall not kill is a law. Principle validates a Law..i think u know dat there are individuals who don't cut corners to make money; such individuals are principled..While there are some who cut corners to make wealth and still maintain the laws of the land..

Bidam: Thank u for replying my post and dat shows u don't throw anybody's view to d dustbin as thrash..but let me take it slowly one by one am in no hurry and i hope u re not too...WAS KING DAVID A PRIEST? am not d only believer who believes king david was a priest..dats a whole new topic entirely and i dnt want to derail d thread cos its talking about tithing..but to find out if king david was a priest u can go the this link..www.askelm.com/doctrine/ The exposition dere will blow ur mind cos u can't talk about melchizedek and Christ witout d mention of david who also was a type of melchizedek.. As u know in ancient isreal one is not required to be specially consecrated in order to perform d sacrificial functions anyone might approach d altar and offer sacrifices..chek (2sam24:25). Even solomon before d ark in jerusalem(1king3:15): David on the occasion of the transferance of the ark to zion and solomon at d dedication of d temple ministered as priest(2sam6:14,17,18,1king8:22,54). The kings of isreal ordained as priest whomever they chose. David invested his own sons wiith priestly office(2chr11:15..2chr23:18,2chr29:27)... And as for who do we give our tithes and offering to...ayam am coming with scriptural quotations to back those claims.

Bidam:
we are talkin about spiritual issues which are beyond human reasoning and comprehension here...

Bidam:
i have replied goshen read my post...and pls STOP BEING LOGICAL ABOUT SPIRITUAL ISSUES..

Bidam:
it is not stated in d OT wat melchi did with d 10%..since He is a priest of the Most High God i believe He gave it to God..

Bidam:
Principle is a rule or belief governing one's personal behavior.e.g i tithe as a principle.

Bidam:
i wonder why u guys are not seeing it the way ayam seeing it..

Zikkyy:

...and yet you (Bidam) was able to comprehend but Goshen cannot abi you are not human?



You mean you don't believe i am functioning under the inspiration of the Holy Spirit? Just because i don't agree with you? if it your (probably crooked) pastor talking you will say he is filled with the spirit because he tells you what your itching ears want to hear. You see yourself.



Lol! You mean he took the war loot to heaven and gave it to God? Don't forget you said Melchi=Jesus If Melchi=Jesus he must have gone back to heaven after collecting the tithe. So what did he use to transport the loot?

Zikkyy:

...and yet you (Bidam) was able to comprehend but Goshen cannot abi you are not human?



You mean you don't believe i am functioning under the inspiration of the Holy Spirit? Just because i don't agree with you? if it your (probably crooked) pastor talking you will say he is filled with the spirit because he tells you what your itching ears want to hear. You see yourself.



Lol! You mean he took the war loot to heaven and gave it to God? Don't forget you said Melchi=Jesus If Melchi=Jesus he must have gone back to heaven after collecting the tithe. So what did he use to transport the loot?

Zikkyy:

...and yet you (Bidam) was able to comprehend but Goshen cannot abi you are not human?



You mean you don't believe i am functioning under the inspiration of the Holy Spirit? Just because i don't agree with you? if it your (probably crooked) pastor talking you will say he is filled with the spirit because he tells you what your itching ears want to hear. You see yourself.



Lol! You mean he took the war loot to heaven and gave it to God? Don't forget you said Melchi=Jesus If Melchi=Jesus he must have gone back to heaven after collecting the tithe. So what did he use to transport the loot?

Goshen360: Chai, Brother Zikky don finish exposing Brother Bidam o. Chai! I love Image123 (not that I hate Bidam because we don't agree on this subject anyway) more that Bidam simply because, Image123 have proved himself to be grounded in the word "by himself" even though he hold on to tithe teaching for the NT Christians. I lost confidence in Bidam because he is NOT saying things he learnt but what someone told him or what he got from somewhere, that is why he is talking and contradicting himself - in the case, from a website. That is the reason he is talking different things and who knows what he will say next.

@ Image123, you still haven't answered my kweshion o. Please do.

@ Bidam, I see Zikky, BERNIMOORE and Plappville had replied you already. I will not bother anymore. You erred when you said Melchi=Jesus. Concerning your Heb.5 where you said Jesus was referred to as Melchi. We covered that aspect from the beginning of this exposition/thread. This is it,

1. The historic Melchizedek of Genesis 14 is a type and foreshadowing and not the person of Christ. If he were, it then means Christ lived on this earth before his virgin birth and that destroys the many teachings about Christ.

2. The Prophetic Melchizedek appeared in Psalm when David used the historic Melchizedek prophetically to give a future office of Christ. Under the prophetic, it is the "order" of historic Melchizedek that was prophesied and used, NOT the "person" of Melchizedek that Christ fulfilled.

3. The fulfilled Melchizedek is now Christ in the "order" of the prophetic Melchizedek from the Psalms, NOT from historic Melchizedek of Genesis 14. I mentioned that, for instance....Out of Egypt I have called my son - historically refers to National Israel coming out of Egypt BUT prophetically refers to and fulfilled in Christ.

RanchOwner:
One thing that must be made clear is that Christians are not mandated to tithe, that practice has long gone, discarded, stopped after Jesus Christ came to fulfill the law.

I believe the NT guidelines for regular giving (if there are any) are found in 2 Corinthians 8 and 9, which go far beyond tithing.

The New Testament does not once introduce tithing into the grace of giving. Tithes are mentioned only three times in the New Testament:
(1) in censoring the Pharisees for neglect of justice, mercy, and faith while giving meticulous care to the tithing of even garden produce (Matt. 23:23; Luke 11:42)
(2) in the exposure of the proud Pharisee who 'prayed to himself,' boasting that he fasted twice each week and tithed all his possessions (Luke 18:12)
(3) in arguing for the superiority of Melchizedek, and hence of Christ, to Levi (Heb. 7:6-9).

It is clear that Jesus approved tithing as a part of the Temple system, just as in principle and practice he supported the general practices of the Temple and the synagogues. But there is no indication that he imposed any part of the Temple cultus on his followers.
Tithes were chiefly produce, formerly eaten at the sanctuary by the one tithing and later eaten by the priests. Tithing as set forth in the Old Testament could be carried out only in a religious system built around a system of animal sacrifice.

Many Christians find the tithe to be a fair and workable plan for giving. So long as it is not made to be a coercive or legalistic system, it may prove to be a happy plan. However, one may not validly claim that tithing is taught in the New Testament. It is recognized as proper for Jewish observance (Matt. 23:23; Luke 11:42), but it is not imposed upon Christians. In fact, it is now impossible for Jews or Christians to tithe in the Old Testament sense. Tithing today only faintly resembles the ancient ritual practice belonging to the sacrificial system of the Jews.

While much may be said for adopting the tithe voluntarily as a standard for one's giving without rigidly imposing it upon others as a Christian requirement, it is clear in adopting such a practice that one is not carrying on the Old Testament practice. At most one is doing something only remotely analogous to the tithing practice of the Old Testament, which was a tax to support the Temple and the priestly system, a social and religious system which no longer exists.

Bidam: are u after the praise of men? Ofcos i read books to enhance my understanding...and i believe u do too..paul understood by books..daniel also jus to mention a few..and as for zikky he is sounding logical in order to win an argument..not teachin in love..and dat to me is unchristian attitude cos he has recieved d praise of men..sorry, as far as am concerned tithing is scriptural and God validates it..end of story

Goshen360:

Zikky is not taking praise from men. He teaches the truth of God's word and consistency is the bedrock for any sound teaching. You should know that not everything in the bible is for Christians just because it is written therein. The bible is written to 2 major groups but subsequently three. We are under a better covenant and our high priest don't demand tithe in order to bless us or as a per-requisite to bless us. When you understand this truth, you are free for you shall know the truth and the truth shall make you free. God bless you.

Goshen360:

Zikky is not taking praise from men. He teaches the truth of God's word and consistency is the bedrock for any sound teaching. You should know that not everything in the bible is for Christians just because it is written therein. The bible is written to 2 major groups but subsequently three. We are under a better covenant and our high priest don't demand tithe in order to bless us or as a per-requisite to bless us. When you understand this truth, you are free for you shall know the truth and the truth shall make you free. God bless you.

Goshen360: ^^^ Okay. No vex. I apologize on behalf of Zikky, you hear....we are all humans.....but make you leaf this tithing for Christians alone.....it is not a sound doctrine, that's if you have really learnt one or two sound doctrine from RanchOwner..... . (No mind my yeye o, sometimes I can be a naughty boy you know) God bless you bro. Love you bro!

Goshen360: ^^^ Yes, All scripture is given by the inspiration of the Holy Spirit.....Does that mean "All Scriptures" MUST be obeyed and followed

Bidam: As long as it is profitable for correction and instruction to righteousness why not.

Bidam: As long as it is profitable for correction and instruction to righteousness why not.

Bidam:
Yes i said so backing it with scriptural quotations..If God know show u something zikky no argue blindly..calling my pastor(Jesus) crooked does show d side u belong..u be d judge not me.

Bidam:
Mayb melchizedek went by whirlwind to heaven with the tithes..

Bidam:
Remember i asked u WHO IS YOUR FATHER? answer my queshion and stop being self righteous and hypocritical.

Image123: @zikky

You've asked more than one question, even if i answered this one, you'd ask three more. i'm not under a debt to answer your every question. i'm answering your questions in order of relevance to the points being discussed, so that you see the real issues instead of gallivanting around aimlessly. BTW, the goal of the law, which is love, is achieved by anyone who adheres to it. Love has not passed away.1Corinth 13.


i retain that they should be. if you agree to tithes and offerings, fine, very fine. Pastors are maintained with tithes and offerings today. there are different types of offerings. If you feel like giving your own pastor food, crops and animals, go ahead. they'll do with it, what they know is best. your own na to bring the animal. A giver like you, i expect cow, goats, fat chicken and turkey aplenty. It's very good and welcome.

1Co 9:13 Do ye not know that they which minister about holy things live of the things of the temple? and they which wait at the altar are partakers with the altar?
1Co 9:14 Even so hath the Lord ordained that they which preach the gospel should live of the gospel.

CEV

1Co 9:13 Don't you know that people who work in the temple make their living from what is brought to the temple? Don't you know that a person who serves at the altar is given part of what is offered?
1Co 9:14 In the same way, the Lord wants everyone who preaches the good news to make a living from preaching this message.



You are proving lazy and dishonest. i don't do online dictionaries and thesaurus as i have one. But i'll oblige you with the microsoft on my system. Merriem Webster is also similar.


in·come [ín kùm]
(plural in·comes)
noun
1. money received over period: the amount of money received over a period of time either as payment for work, goods, or services, or as profit on capital
2. inflow: an act of coming in or flowing in

Thesaurus: profits, proceeds, returns, revenue, earnings, wages, pay, salary, take-home pay, takings
Microsoft® Encarta® 2009. © 1993-2008 Microsoft Corporation. All rights reserved.



har·vest [hrvəst]
noun (plural har·vests)
1. quantity of crop: the quantity of a crop that is gathered or ripens during a season

Thesaurus: crop, yield, produce, return, fruitage, ingathering
Microsoft® Encarta® 2009. © 1993-2008 Microsoft Corporation. All rights reserved.

yield [yeeld]
verb (past and past participle yield·ed, present participle yield·ing, 3rd person present singular yields)
1. transitive verb produce something: to produce something naturally or as a result of cultivation

Thesaurus: harvest, crop, produce, vintage, profit, earnings, INCOME, revenue, return

Microsoft® Encarta® 2009. © 1993-2008 Microsoft Corporation. All rights reserved.



Neither were they fasting or praying to God.


Wrong, Acts 15 provides details of the aspect of the law of Moses they were required to comply with. Fortunately for us, the laws of God are not limited to the law of Moses. Tithing was BEFORE Moses' grandfather!


The bolded is right and is what i've been saying for about 12pages, except you mistakenly wrote this.


You make it sound so cool, establishing, declared, defined, mandated, bla bla. All na grammar. Every Bible student knows when God was specific and detailed in the law. Compare the issues of making the tabernacle, or of cleansing, or of sacrifices, with what you're saying of tithes. There is no such detail and definition given. It simply states that the tithe is holy to God.

Lev 27:30 And all the tithe of the land, whether of the seed of the land, or of the fruit of the tree, is the LORD's: it is holy unto the LORD.

Lev 27:32 And concerning the tithe of the herd, or of the flock, even of whatsoever passeth under the rod, the tenth shall be holy unto the LORD.

It's not limiting it or defining it or establishing it. The focus is that tithes belong to God. In other places, it mentioned of some tithe that belong to widows and levites. Take the scriptures cumulatively not in some regimented isolation nobody demanded of you.


selective reading yet again. paul never gave a reason for not collecting tithes or for collecting tithes. i thought you loved to argue that Paul did not talk about tithes? suddenly you know the reason why Paul did not collect what he did not talk about? i didn't say tithe is any key to wealth, dunno why you're devilishly trying to push that on me. Paul didn't 'burden' people but could have. He had the power to, it was his personal decision as shown here.
1Co 9:11 If we have sown unto you spiritual things, is it a great thing if we shall reap your carnal things?
1Co 9:12 If others be partakers of this power over you, are not we rather? Nevertheless we have not used this power; but suffer all things, lest we should hinder the gospel of Christ.


On the basis that they were mindful of the words of the holy prophets. Words like Malachi 3 and co.
The gentiles gave more than 10%. they didn't need to be taught giving. Many of them gave their all. The early christians were serious and practical. Today, we have little of their type left, people need to be taught to give. You don't teach alphabets to an O'levels student. Why should they be taught on 10% when they had given their all and were ready to give their eyes? Its unlike many of the wishy washy folks today, who are still asking if it is reading the Bible is necessary or not.

Image123: thank you.

Zikkyy:

This is all you have to say? After all your 'gra-gra' when you were shouting "count me in Gosh, count me in" I was thinking Goshen was in serious trouble. You dey fall my hand

Bidam:
..and as for zikky he is sounding logical in order to win an argument..not teachin in love..and dat to me is unchristian attitude cos he has recieved d praise of men.

Enigma:

You mean to say he was gragravating the matter?

Bidam: @Ranchowner..God bless u jare! Atleast i got one or two sound teachings from ur post..dats how a christain attitude should be..not castigating and antagonisin sumone even going as far as using abusive words on my pastor in order to win an argument, just becos i dont hold ur views concerning tithing..dats very unchristian attitude i tell you.

Goshen360:
(No mind my yeye o, sometimes I can be a naughty boy you know) God bless you bro. Love you bro!