James 2:14-26
14 What good is it, my brothers, if someone says he has faith but does not have works? Can that faith save him?

15 If a brother or sister has nothing to wear and has no food for the day,

16 and one of you says to them, "Go in peace, keep warm, and eat well," but you do not give them the necessities of the body, what good is it?

17 So also faith of itself, if it does not have works, is dead.

18 Indeed someone might say, "You have faith and I have works." Demonstrate your faith to me without works, and I will demonstrate my faith to you from my works.

19 You believe that God is one. You do well. Even the demons believe that and tremble.

20 Do you want proof, you ignoramus, that faith without works is useless?

21 Was not Abraham our father justified by works when he offered his son Isaac upon the altar?

22 You see that faith was active along with his works, and faith was completed by the works.


23 Thus the scripture was fulfilled that says, "Abraham believed God, and it was credited to him as righteousness," and he was called "the friend of God."

24 See how a person is justified by works and not by faith alone.

25 And in the same way, was not Rahab the harlot also justified by works when she welcomed the messengers and sent them out by a different route?

26 For just as a body without a spirit is dead, so also faith without works is dead.

JeSoul:


how funny! so now you want to quote Paul's words huh? I will show your duplicity:
quote from imhotep: Why all of a sudden is it okay for you to take Paul's words literally?

This is exactly my point! you quote the bible only when it suits and supports your position.
but when that same bible contradicts it you completely ignore it!

SysUser:

imhotep , please stop the verbal semantics,

I am not interested in what kind of denomination or how many denominations exist, since the bible did not tell me salvation is dependent on which denomination one belongs to , rather the bible is sufficient for the development of every Christian independent of any denomination.

I am not telling you or asking your questions based on denominations. I am strictly basing my statements and question on what the bible clearly says and not what a denominations says, as such try not to deviate the focus away from the points raised on this thread without points about sect or denominations. I am basing my statements on denominational believe or statements of ordinary people, instead i am basing it solely on what the bible clearly says. So in order to save readers from undue diversion, try and restrict your responses to within biblical context (and i mean the actualy bible and not the Catholic bible).

So you would do well to try and answer or respond to the raised issues point by point and try not to deviate into other issues that are not relevant to this thread.

You can pick and choose from any other the points that have already being raised on this thread,

By the way, i am still waiting for your answers to the following questions and raised point:


1. Was Mary actually crucified.

2. Is Salvation by Faith Alone in Jesus Christ

3. Was Mary born a Sinner

4. Did Mary die, at all

5. How come Semeramis (the origin of Baal worship) has more in commmon with Catholism

6. How come the practises and actions of catholism are vehemently spoken against by the bible

7. How come a catholic bible says Mary is going to crush the serpent's head even though the Biblical verses and Biblical prophecy that was fufilled with the Birth, Death and Ressurection of Jesus Christ clearly shows that the seed of the woman was going to crush the serpent's head:

8. Can anyone be saved without honouring or worshipping the mental or physical image of Mary

9. Does purgatory exist in the bible

10. Why does the catholic church believe in evolution , giving that evolution is absolutely contrary to the SIX LITERAL 24HRS DAYS OF CREATION

11. Is salvation dependent on Mary, show me where the bible says so,

11. Is salvation dependent on Catholic Traditions, show me where the bible says so


The catholic bible "Douay-Rheims Version" shows of the lies of catholism when it says (or imply) that Mary (woman) was going to crush the serpent's head:

Douay-Rheims Version Gen 3:15 I will put enmities between thee and the woman, and thy seed and her seed; she shall crush thy head, and thou shalt lie in wait for her heel.


Yet "The KJV Bible" bluntly shows that the "seed of the woman (Jesus Christ) who is going to crush the head of the serpent as quoted below:

Gen 3:14 And the LORD God said unto the serpent, Because thou hast done this, thou art cursed above all cattle, and above every beast of the field; upon thy belly shalt thou go, and dust shalt thou eat all the days of thy life:
Gen 3:15 And I will put enmity between thee and the woman, and between thy seed and her seed; it shall bruise thy head, and thou shalt bruise his heel.

imhotep okay over to you,

Sysuser:
I am not telling you or asking your questions based on denominations. I am strictly basing my statements and question on what the bible clearly says and not what a denominations says, as such try not to deviate the focus away from the points raised on this thread without points about sect or denominations

I am basing my statements on denominational believe or statements of ordinary people, instead i am basing it solely on what the bible clearly says.

SysUser:

oooops, the following quote was a misnormer, a typo error!

the real statement that i meant was that:

I am not basing my statements on denominational believe or statements of ordinary people, instead i am basing it solely on what the bible clearly says.

@Sysuser
These questions derive from conspiracy theories. Do not recycle ignorance in this information age of ours.

Go and browse http://www.vatican.va. There is nothing secret about the Catholic church's teachings; they are beautifully documented.

Catholic theology is well documented here -> http://www.sacred-texts.com/chr/aquinas/summa/index.htm

It usually takes years to fully understand the entire teachings of the 2000 year old Catholic Church.

Study these teachings from the right sources, and you will learn to ask the right questions.

SysUser:


once again imhotep, you are begging , dodging and sweeping the questions under the already dirty carpet of catholism

imhotep:

@Sysuser
These questions derive from conspiracy theories. Do not recycle ignorance in this information age of ours.

Go and browse http://www.vatican.va. There is nothing secret about the Catholic church's teachings; they are beautifully documented.

Catholic theology is well documented here -> http://www.sacred-texts.com/chr/aquinas/summa/index.htm

It usually takes years to fully understand the entire teachings of the 2000 year old Catholic Church.

Study these teachings from the right sources, and you will learn to ask the right questions.

It usually takes years to fully understand the entire teachings of the 2000 year old Catholic Church.

Study these teachings from the right sources, and you will learn to ask the right questions.

SysUser:

imhotep , aba, i am not asking you for Catholic History, rather what i am asking you is that use the bible to justify that catholic claims and then also use the bible to disprove the fact that the bible goes against catholic church.

Arakunrin!!!! , please answer, the questions , stop begging the questions

It usually takes years to fully understand the entire teachings of the 2000 year old Catholic Church.

SysUser:

The good news is very simple, its doesn't take years!
Salvation does not take years of church history, church history has nothing to do about SALVATION.

Salvation is not a human process that takes years, YOU ARE EITHER SAVED OR YOU ARE NOT!

SysUser:

Your 2000 year old church history only goes to show how far you have fallen , in don't need to know about your church history before i know what the bible says about salvation.

Your church history only becomes exposed and important, once it shows that it contradicts the bible (which it does),

SysUser:

IMHOTEP , THE MORE YOU SAY, THE MORE YOU SHOW THAT YOU DO NOT BELIEVE THE BIBLE HAS THE FINAL WORD ON ANYTHING.

SysUser:

So imhotep stop the excuses and answer points and questions raised on the thread

SysUser:



Only Two ways exist for a man or woman

either

1. The True and Only way via only Jesus Christ alone


or


2. The false and deceitful ways of the world (i.s.l.a.m, catholism, hinduism, buddism, taoism, mormonism, jehova witnessing etc) only lead to HELL,

~Lady~:

I also want to address the question about confessing to priests and who gave them the power to forgive. there was a thread about it and i couldn't find it. but people asked for the bible verse in which it says that we should confess and i gave it, but they also wanted one that gave men the power to forgive and here it is:

John 20: 19-23
19. On the evening of that first day of the week, when the doors were locked, where the disciples were, for fear of the jews, Jesus came and stood in their midst and said to them "peace be with u"
20. When he had said this, he showed them his hands and his side. The disciples rejoiced when they saw the Lord.
21. Jesus said to them again "peace be with u. As the Father has sent me, so I send you."
22. And when he had said this, he breathed unto them and said to them, "Receive the holy spirit"
23. "Whose sins you forgive are forgiven them, and whose sins you retain are retained"

God is the one who forgives our sins, without his grace, we are unable to forgive. It is through God that I forgive my biological father for abandoning me and my mother, it is through God that I forgive my boyfriend for cheating on me, it is through God that I forgive my friend for stealing from me. I forgive so that my sins too can be forgiven.

~Lady~:

@SysUser
3. Was Mary born a sinner? Ask God who created her, he had her in mind from the beginning.
The church teaches that she was cleansed from original sin by Jesus Christ and stayed that way.
I'll seek more answers for u

OLAADEGBU:

Mary, animated by Elisabeth's address, and being also under the influence of the Holy Ghost, broke out into joy, admiration, and gratitude. She knew herself to be a sinner who needed a Saviour, and that she could no otherwise rejoice in God than as interested in his salvation through the promised Messiah.

This disqualifies the doctrine of the immaculate conception taught in the RCC. The doctrine that teaches that Mary was born without original sin.

imhotep:

@olaadegbu

The angel said to Mary "Hail full of grace." (Luke 1:28)

How many people in your bible are 'full of grace' before the death and resurrection of Christ?


==================
Let me also suggest, next time you pray, say to Jesus: I love you, but I think your mother is a useless woman.
Don't forget to try this.

OLAADEGBU:

You have not addressed the subject in Luke 1:47 As I pointed out this verse disproves the theory of the immaculate conception or the total absence of original sin in Mary as taught in the RCC . If God was her Saviour then she must have been a sinner in order to be saved.

OLAADEGBU:

As it is clear that Joseph did not have sexual relations with Mary before Mary conceived, the actual immaculate conception or rather virgin birth took place in Luke 1:35 where the Holy Spirit 'overshadowed' Mary preventing Mary's sinful nature to pass unto that 'Holy thing' who was to be known as the Son of God. Thus, the only begotten of the Father.

imhotep:

If Mary was saved before the Saviour was born, what can you deduce from that?
Think very well before you answer.


the Holy Spirit overshadowed a woman who was already FULL OF GRACE.
Sinfulness connotes a LACK OF GRACE.

======================
Please improve your logic.

OLAADEGBU:

There is no where in the scriptures that says that Mary was saved before the birth of Jesus.

OLAADEGBU:

What she said was what is called the 'Magnificat' that is, Mary's song of Praise. This was similar to what Hannah sang in 1 Sam.2:1-10. Mary's song recognized that God's work through Jesus fulfilled the promise God made to Abraham (Lk.1:55). It was a prophetic confirmation of the events that had been given in the Old Testament covenantal contexts. Mary praised God's acts of exalting the humble and bringing upon the proud and rich (Luke 1:46-56). In Jesus God had reversed the means of attaining greatness in the world. Her prophetic utterance brought both confirmation and exultation to the promise of Jesus who would be the Saviour of the world her included.

OLAADEGBU:

If God was her Saviour then she must have been a sinner in order to be saved.

OLAADEGBU:

In the gospel according to Luke 1:46-47 (King James Version)

46 And Mary said, My soul doth magnify the Lord,
47 And my spirit hath rejoiced in God my Saviour.

Mary, animated by Elisabeth's address, and being also under the influence of the Holy Ghost, broke out into joy, admiration, and gratitude. She knew herself to be a sinner who needed a Saviour, and that she could no otherwise rejoice in God than as interested in his salvation through the promised Messiah.

imhotep:

Then why did she refer to God as 'My Saviour' 33 years before the death + resurrection of Jesus?
Why did she not refer to God as 'my future Saviour'?

Luke 1:67-79 (King James Version)

67 And his father Zacharias was filled with[b] the Holy Ghost, and prophesied[/b], saying,

68 Blessed be the Lord God of Israel; for he hath visited and redeemed his people,

69 And hath raised up an horn of salvation for us in the house of his servant David;

70 As he spake by the mouth of his holy prophets, which have been since the world began:

71 That we should be saved from our enemies, and from the hand of all that hate us;

72 To perform the mercy promised to our fathers, and to remember his holy covenant;

73 The oath which he sware to our father Abraham,

74 That he would grant unto us, that we being delivered out of the hand of our enemies might serve him without fear,

75 In holiness and righteousness before him, all the days of our life.

76 And thou, child, shalt be called the prophet of the Highest: for thou shalt go before the face of the Lord to prepare his ways;

77 To give knowledge of salvation unto his people by the remission of their sins,

78 Through the tender mercy of our God; whereby the dayspring from on high hath visited us,

79 To give light to them that sit in darkness and in the shadow of death, to guide our feet into the way of peace.