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Nairaland Forum / Nairaland / General / Religion / In What Way Is God Good? Inviting Mr Anony And Any Intersted Party (16866 Views)
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Re: In What Way Is God Good? Inviting Mr Anony And Any Intersted Party by thehomer: 2:14pm On May 17, 2013 |
Mr anony: It is also common knowledge that I base morality on the idea of the well-being of conscious creatures yet I stated my own view. I just want you to state your own views so you don't accuse me of putting words into your mouth. Mr anony: By the idea that certain certain actions are objectively beneficial to e.g human well-being than others. Mr anony: But that isn't what I've said, I've said your God is not objectively good because his actions aren't at the very least beneficial to the well-being of humans at the very least. You on the other hand are asking me to maybe formulate your view for you. Mr anony: That which is generally beneficial to the well-being of conscious creatures. Now can you tell me what you think "good" is? Mr anony: Wrong. How people like their tea in the morning can be contribute to their well-being. We don't need an absolutely perfect definition in order to have this discussion. While you have actually said nothing. Mr anony: Discussions don't work that way. You have to actually present your own position and be ready to defend it rather than merely sitting back and folding your own hands. Now to help you out and move this conversation forward, does your idea of goodness have anything at all to do with the well-being of humans? |
Re: In What Way Is God Good? Inviting Mr Anony And Any Intersted Party by Mranony: 2:23pm On May 17, 2013 |
thehomer:I would have answered point by by point but it is unnecessary because all I would have kept on repeating is "what is human well-being? is it objective?" Until you can settle that, I really can't help you |
Re: In What Way Is God Good? Inviting Mr Anony And Any Intersted Party by plaetton: 2:26pm On May 17, 2013 |
shdemidemi: So your infant deserves to be killed by Boko Haram because your child is not Allah's elect? Why dont you serve up your children to be murdered, you moro.n. |
Re: In What Way Is God Good? Inviting Mr Anony And Any Intersted Party by mazaje1: 2:50pm On May 17, 2013 |
I can see thehomer answering questions thrown at him and anony dancing around his tail as usual. . . |
Re: In What Way Is God Good? Inviting Mr Anony And Any Intersted Party by Mranony: 4:28pm On May 17, 2013 |
mazaje1: I can see thehomer answering questions thrown at him and anony dancing around his tail as usual. . .I can see you blissfully failing to notice that thehomer is yet to define what he means by objective good. |
Re: In What Way Is God Good? Inviting Mr Anony And Any Intersted Party by shdemidemi(m): 5:14pm On May 17, 2013 |
plaetton: You tend to look @ things from a myopic view.I look @ things from God's view. Forget emotions and face the reality of the faithfulness of Christ. If you look @ things from God's view It saves you from high blood presure and the rest. |
Re: In What Way Is God Good? Inviting Mr Anony And Any Intersted Party by plaetton: 5:52pm On May 17, 2013 |
So in your gods view, genocide, boko haram and other islamo-terrorism can be justified under the right interpretation of scripture? People like you represent a clear danger to human life, freedom and dignity. 1 Like |
Re: In What Way Is God Good? Inviting Mr Anony And Any Intersted Party by mazaje1: 5:58pm On May 17, 2013 |
Mr anony: I think he has, he said "That which is generally beneficial to the well-being of conscious creatures". |
Re: In What Way Is God Good? Inviting Mr Anony And Any Intersted Party by Mranony: 6:45pm On May 17, 2013 |
mazaje1:Lol, really? |
Re: In What Way Is God Good? Inviting Mr Anony And Any Intersted Party by Kay17: 7:02pm On May 17, 2013 |
shdemidemi: There is no point defending God for anything. If you as an unbeliever want to know anything about condemnation, there you have it. The same way He killed every first born of Egypt-- Unfortunately, you didn't talk about how Good God was, rather you spent/wasted valuable time discussing about the necessity of worshipping God. The necessity of worshipping God doesn't equate to God's Goodness. You should stick to the topic more often. |
Re: In What Way Is God Good? Inviting Mr Anony And Any Intersted Party by thehomer: 7:07pm On May 17, 2013 |
Mr anony: And you finally reveal that you actually weren't ready to defend you own view because so far, you've not been able to present one to answer the very first set of questions in the OP. I expected you to answer them using whatever notion of good you want to use but you're unable to present your own "objective good" while claiming that I haven't presented anything. I'm still here whenever you're ready to hold up your own ideas to the light of reason. |
Re: In What Way Is God Good? Inviting Mr Anony And Any Intersted Party by thehomer: 7:08pm On May 17, 2013 |
Mr anony: Even if I cannot define what I mean by objective good, it doesn't stop you from defining what you mean by objective good does it? |
Re: In What Way Is God Good? Inviting Mr Anony And Any Intersted Party by Mranony: 7:16pm On May 17, 2013 |
thehomer:Yawn. when you are ready to discuss goodness, start by defining it |
Re: In What Way Is God Good? Inviting Mr Anony And Any Intersted Party by Mranony: 7:17pm On May 17, 2013 |
thehomer:If you cannot define what you mean by objective good your whole op breaks down. You cannot begin to question God's goodness if you lack a standard with which to question it. That's like trying to measure a straight line without first taking two points of reference |
Re: In What Way Is God Good? Inviting Mr Anony And Any Intersted Party by thehomer: 7:49pm On May 17, 2013 |
Mr anony: If you cannot define what you mean by objective good your whole op breaks down. Just so you know, my points of reference are on the effects of Gods actions on humans at the very least. In fact, that much was made clear in my OP here. Edit: What is your own point of reference? |
Re: In What Way Is God Good? Inviting Mr Anony And Any Intersted Party by shdemidemi(m): 8:18pm On May 17, 2013 |
plaetton: So in your gods view, genocide, boko haram and other islamo-terrorism can be justified under the right interpretation of scripture? You take this matter too personal...life is only but for a while anyway, the hope and faith I have in Christ makes me rejoice at any point in time. Genocide or no genocide every one's life is but for a short period. The WILL of God in this temporal world must be accepted my friend. |
Re: In What Way Is God Good? Inviting Mr Anony And Any Intersted Party by shdemidemi(m): 8:25pm On May 17, 2013 |
Kay 17: Of course He is good... Your wisdom and my wisdom is limited to our 5 senses. A man will say seeing is believing, God does not operate under that. You don't know where you were coming from before you were born and you don't know what is on the other side when you die thus, you are limited to this earth and the knowledge within. If you probably see God spiritually and not through your profane and limited thoughts you would realise how good and merciful he is. |
Re: In What Way Is God Good? Inviting Mr Anony And Any Intersted Party by plaetton: 8:30pm On May 17, 2013 |
shdemidemi: Temporal world? I assume that you have been to the other types? If you have not, don't you think that you might just be a victim of mortgage fraud? You are willing to mortgage your life in this your so-called temporal world, including sacrificing your infants and children to genocidal maniacs and their blood thirsty god, so that you might enjoy eternal bliss in another imaginary world which you know nothing about? A sucker is born everyday. I have a nice piece of real estate in everlasting land, do you wanna buy? |
Re: In What Way Is God Good? Inviting Mr Anony And Any Intersted Party by shdemidemi(m): 8:35pm On May 17, 2013 |
plaetton: We are definitely talking from different perspectives. I never said I support book haram attacking anyone, all I am saying is whatever happens to me is the will of God. |
Re: In What Way Is God Good? Inviting Mr Anony And Any Intersted Party by thehomer: 8:40pm On May 17, 2013 |
Beretta92: this god is infact the devil. Oh that is a sneaking suspicion. |
Re: In What Way Is God Good? Inviting Mr Anony And Any Intersted Party by Mranony: 9:16pm On May 17, 2013 |
thehomer:Lol, first I'll ask if an action's morality is based on it's intent or is it based on it's effect? Second I'll ask for an objective moral standard by which you evaluate the goodness of the action i.e. is the effect objectively good or evil, is the intent objectively good or evil? As long as you keep shying away from defining an objective moral standard, we have nothing to work with. |
Re: In What Way Is God Good? Inviting Mr Anony And Any Intersted Party by thehomer: 9:27pm On May 17, 2013 |
Mr anony: What is your own point of reference? And how have you evaluated whether or not it is objectively good or evil? You've come a long way with all the leeway you've been given yet you're unable to answer the basic questions in the OP. |
Re: In What Way Is God Good? Inviting Mr Anony And Any Intersted Party by Mranony: 9:32pm On May 17, 2013 |
thehomer:When you ask me a clear question I will answer. So far your op remains unclarified. I won't let you off the hook, if you cannot say what "good" is, you lack the right to condemn anything much less God. 2 Likes |
Re: In What Way Is God Good? Inviting Mr Anony And Any Intersted Party by thehomer: 5:00am On May 18, 2013 |
Mr anony: Using your own idea of what good is should enable to answer the question. So, simply use that to answer the question for yourself. |
Re: In What Way Is God Good? Inviting Mr Anony And Any Intersted Party by wiegraf: 8:35am On May 18, 2013 |
There are threads. And there are threads.. Too hot to handle? At least those who don't hide the crazy take it head on |
Re: In What Way Is God Good? Inviting Mr Anony And Any Intersted Party by thehomer: 1:25pm On May 18, 2013 |
wiegraf: There are threads. And there are threads.. Hmm I wonder why there isn't more interest. Maybe it actually is too hot for Christians to handle. |
Re: In What Way Is God Good? Inviting Mr Anony And Any Intersted Party by Mranony: 2:30pm On May 18, 2013 |
thehomer:..and what use will my idea of good be if we don't know what is objectively good. |
Re: In What Way Is God Good? Inviting Mr Anony And Any Intersted Party by thehomer: 2:59pm On May 18, 2013 |
Mr anony: Your idea will show us what you think it means to be good. I think that has to be looked at before trying to assess this objectivity. |
Re: In What Way Is God Good? Inviting Mr Anony And Any Intersted Party by Mranony: 3:09pm On May 18, 2013 |
thehomer:Fair enough let me help you so we can move this foward:- My argument is simple: Objective good is dependent on an objective human well-being (i.e. the way a human ought to be). We can only legitimately say that there is way humans are supposed to be if there is a designer who has purposely designed humans to be a certain way. Do you accept this? If not, why do you disagree? |
Re: In What Way Is God Good? Inviting Mr Anony And Any Intersted Party by thehomer: 3:16pm On May 18, 2013 |
Mr anony: Don't you realize what you've just said? This has to be huge irony. You're equating good with well-being when you say what is in bold. Oh I agree with the first part in bold but not the part about this designer unless of course you can tell me something about this designer like whether or not it cares about human well-being at the very least. So are you ready to answer the questions in the OP? |
Re: In What Way Is God Good? Inviting Mr Anony And Any Intersted Party by Mranony: 3:27pm On May 18, 2013 |
thehomer:That's exactly the same thing you've been doing earlier Oh I agree with the first part in bold but not the part about this designer unless of course you can tell me something about this designer like whether or not it cares about human well-being at the very least.Lol, he doesn't have to or are you about to give me a reason why he must? All I have said is that the way a human being ought to be cannot be objective unless there is a definite purpose which a designer has designed them to fulfill. Do you agree? If not, give me a logical reason why you disagree So are you ready to answer the questions in the OP?We haven't established an objective good yet |
Re: In What Way Is God Good? Inviting Mr Anony And Any Intersted Party by thehomer: 4:31pm On May 18, 2013 |
Mr anony: Oh I'm in agreement with that. It just means that you were railing against views you actually had. Mr anony: I do not agree because I don't accept the premise of a designer. That renders the rest of your statement moot. Now even if I granted you the notion of a designer, if the designer were malicious, it would mean that he is not in a position to assess what affects this well-being positively. That is why you have to know something about the designer you're proposing. Mr anony: Once you accept the idea of goodness being related to positive well-being, then the "objective good" you're harping on about isn't necessary for assessment. |
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