makahlj2: Humans play God, torture mice... sure sign that the end times are upon us.

Hope you know most drugs and cosmetics are tested on animals too. So I'll advise you to refrain from drugs, soap and cream so as to be free from all blame.

Television Science! and very bad journalism
What they have demonstrated is "association" which is not quite the same as memory ,or a very crude form at best,especially as they are trying to extrapolate it with human false memory which usually involves significant detail and recollection eg memories of the Biafra War; who said what where etc. Associating "black" people with bad things is not quite the same as identifying OJ Simpson with his wife's killing. Unless the mouse can tell you its thoughts it is silly to talk about "implanting" memories. We have been using association to train dogs for ever since Pavlov and his dog. "Memory " in the human context requires more detail and specifics not the crude Peasure /aversion associations that are shown here

Haaaaaa I b won read am buh una don discourage me

Haaaaaa I b won read am buh una don discourage me

makahlj2: Humans play God, torture mice... sure sign that the end times are upon us.

Lock up!! Don't bring that Armageddon thrash here. . Many of the drugs you take were first tested on animals. What's playing "playing God" in that.?

makahlj2: Humans play God, torture mice... sure sign that the end times are upon us.

Lock up!! Don't bring that Armageddon thrash here. . Many of the drugs you take were first tested on animals. What's "playing God" in that.?

Interesting

This is so wonderful... I'll like to know how this is connected to De javu

Hm... Nice one sha!!!! Scientists are just too busy. Great pals. They love discovering things.

Make them no use play play introduce ZOMBIE tinx ooo

Bawss1: Brings to mind the movie Inception. It was based on the premise of planting ideas in people's minds.

Inception was more of interconnected lucid dreams

0monnakoda: Television Science! and very bad journalism
What they have demonstrated is "association" which is not quite the same as memory ,or a very crude form at best,especially as they are trying to extrapolate it with human false memory which usually involves significant detail and recollection eg memories of the Biafra War; who said what where etc. Associating "black" people with bad things is not quite the same as identifying OJ Simpson with his wife's killing. Unless the mouse can tell you its thoughts it is silly to talk about "implanting" memories. We have been using association to train dogs for ever since Pavlov and his dog. "Memory " in the human context requires more detail and specifics not the crude Peasure /aversion associations that are shown here

Considering it's an animal, that's how their memory is assessed.
There's still much work to be done if they're to apply it to humans

ciphoenix:

Considering it's an animal, that's how their memory is assessed.
There's still much work to be done if they're to apply it to humans

Humans are not animals ? are they plants?
I am not sure what you mean What is animal memory ? can you define it and how is this different from Pavlov's Bell ringing salivation experiment?

The story claims they "implanted FALSE memories" what does that mean in the ANIMAL world

0monnakoda:
Humans are not animals ? are they plants?
I am not sure what you mean What is animal memory ? can you define it and how is this different from Pavlov's Bell ringing salivation experiment?

The story claims they "implanted FALSE memories" what does that mean in the ANIMAL world

Humans are higher animals whose memory can be assessed by more advanced methods because they can express themselves in a more advanced way with specific details. For lower animals though, it's always crude (the assessment)

ciphoenix:

Humans are higher animals whose memory can be assessed by more advanced methods because they can express themselves in a more advanced way with specific details. For lower animals though, it's always crude (the assessment)

Before you go far come back to earth and DEFINE memory. Without a working definition of memory we will go round in circles.
It is possible even to talk about memory in plants so really we must agree on what "memory" means.

Secondly the claim is about implanting "FALSE" memories so in order to talk about false we must know what memory is and what the concept of FALSE memories is all about.

Pavlov trained dogs to salivate to bell . Was this a case of planting a false memory?

0monnakoda:
Before you go far come back to earth and DEFINE memory. Without a working definition of memory we will go round in circles.
It is possible even to talk about memory in plants so really we must agree on what "memory" means.

Secondly the claim is about implanting "FALSE" memories so in order to talk about false we must know what memory is and what the concept of FALSE memories is all about.

1 a : the power or process of reproducing or recalling what has been learned and retained especially through associative mechanisms
b : the store of things learned and retained from an organism's activity or experience as evidenced by modification of structure or behavior or by recall and recognition
http://i.word.com/idictionary/memory

Pavlov trained dogs to salivate to bell . Was this a case of planting a false memory?

He implanted a new spatial memory, yes

ciphoenix:

1 a : the power or process of reproducing or recalling what has been learned and retained especially through associative mechanisms
b : the store of things learned and retained from an organism's activity or experience as evidenced by modification of structure or behavior or by recall and recognition
http://i.word.com/idictionary/memory
According to your definition power or process of recalling does not need to be accurate as long as there is a process>

He implanted a new spatial memory, yes

Spatial? how is salivating to a bell spatial

I asked it it was false not new. There is nothing spatial about the dog salivating and I believe you are wasting my time

0monnakoda: Spatial? how is salivating to a bell spatial

I asked it it was false not new. There is nothing spatial about the dog salivating and I believe you are wasting my time

Pavlov's wasn't false memory
Your point being ....

ciphoenix:

Pavlov's wasn't false memory
Your point being ....

My point is you have no point and are talking on an issue which you are clearly ignorant.You are saying nothing absolutely nothing.
Once again how is salivating to a bell an example of spatial memory


We should be very careful to talk with confidence and certainty on things for which there is very little evidence

These scientists claim to have implanted "false" memory .Their experiment is no different from that of Pavlov in so far as is appears to make secondary associations between stimuli and response. Whether the response is based on MEMORY or just reflexes is an assumption or speculation since animals cannot tell us whether they "remember" . Dogs kept alive on machines with their brains removed can be made to salivate,produce erections etc in response to environmental stimuli. Is this memory?

There is nothing new or earth shatttering here. Animals can be trained to respond with fear to ropes because they look like snakes , does this amount to a false memory? If we say the Pavlov situation is not a "false" memory what makes the situation described by these guys any diffferent?
By the way I use the word "false" in relation to memory cautiously .You seem to have a very clear idea what a false memory is or is not though I am not sure the basis for this

0monnakoda:

Whether the response is based on MEMORY or just reflexes is an assumption or speculation since animals cannot tell us whether they "remember"

This is exactly why I pointed out the assessment of the memory of an animal is limited unlike humans so they have the right to take it they implanted "false" memories.

Dogs kept alive on machines with their brains removed can be made to salivate,produce erections etc in response to environmental stimuli. Is this memory?

No it isn't and that’s different from this very case.

There is nothing new or earth shatttering here. Animals can be trained to respond with fear to ropes because they look like snakes , does this amount to a false memory?

I never said it was earth shattering. Was only pointing out that they're not entirely wrong to call it a memory since we can't clearly assess memory in animals. Maybe you got me wrong

ciphoenix:

Pavlov's wasn't false memory
Your point being ....

EDIT: Pavlov's wasn't false memory?
Your point being ....


Perhaps the missing punctuation sent a wrong message

I think this exchange has exhausted its useful life

mhmmm

Moderator this topic should be suitable for frontpage now., www.nairaland.com/1404370/latest-inventions-nubrella-funny-looking-hands-free