kabe1:


Sukhoi says it's a 5th Gen aircraft, however the cost is quite unrealistic.

It's target at South-American, African and South Asian clients.

Apparently the Russian MoD would buy them too.

They are joking. That's $90m at least. Don't forget they are exporting to partly finance the development of their own line of aircrafts to tackle F22s and B21s

RiceProducers:


They are joking. That's $90m at least. Don't forget they are exporting to partly finance the development of their own line of aircrafts to tackle F22s and B21s

There are significant offsets, this aircraft is only rated at 8 Gs, already developed tech from the SU-57 and SU-35 would be integrated reducing production cost including other benefits.

kabe1:


There are significant offsets, this aircraft is only rated at 8 Gs, already developed tech from the SU-57 and SU-35 would be integrated reducing production cost including other benefits.

The cost is $25-30 million, very cheap and affordable for a stealth 5th gen. Probably cheaper than the jf17 that were recently bought

kabe1:
Details on the Sukhoi Checkmate fighter:
-Short Take Off and Landing
-$25-30 million cost
-3k km range or 1.5k km combat radius
-1,900 kph speed
-More than 7 ton payload
-First flight set for 2023
-2024-2025 construction of prototypes
-2026-2027 pilot batch/serial deliveries

It can never be $25-$30m

youghs:


It can never be $25-$30m

Of course it can never be this cheap. Don't also forget this country is under comprehensive US sanctions. They won't get specialised equipment like some avionics, displays, ejection seats, some materials for carbon fibre, some engine alloys, chips et.c..which means Russia would need to get close to 100% local content for these sub components of components of systems.
This means they would be developing a lot of stuff locally. How then can this aircraft be cheap?

Legitimate information on Ruskies mic can be found here, use Google translate

https://bmpd.livejournal.com/

RiceProducers:

Of course it can never be this cheap. Don't also forget this country is under comprehensive US sanctions. They won't get specialised equipment like some avionics, displays, ejection seats, some materials for carbon fibre, some engine alloys, chips et.c..which means Russia would need to get close to 100% local content for these sub components of components of systems.
This means they would be developing a lot of stuff locally. How then can this aircraft be cheap?

Russian systems have always been 100% local since 2014.

I wonder how you're arguing with an OEM.

Do you work for Sukhoi Design Bureau?

Does Russia build military equipment using US dollars?

What's your rational to doubt Rostec?

youghs:


It can never be $25-$30m

Says who?

Nigerian Air Force A-29

Nigerian Air Force Aircrafts

youghs:


It can never be $25-$30m

It is very very optimistic of course but they will probably not develop any new components for this jet, instead they might utilize already developed radiation-absorbent materials, avionics, sensors, weapon-system integration and engines from the SU57. The air-frame design itself is inexpensive compared to those components. Setting up an advanced production line and managing sophisticated manufacturing processes would certainly need a huge amount of investments but this presupposes some substantial orders in the book.

kabe1:


Sukhoi says it's a 5th Gen aircraft, however the cost is quite unrealistic.

It's target at South-American, African and South Asian clients.

Apparently the Russian MoD would buy them too.

Yes saw the video where they stated its 5 th gen

Target countries will be americas africa and asian countries

Indian subcontinent maybe Bangladesh

Though they referred to In.dia in a previous trailer i dont think In.dia will be interested, LCA MK2 ( and it subsequent iterations ) will do the job what this aircraft is meant to do more or less , DRDO has made several breakthroughs in FSS / RAM / RAS technologies to implement stealth in absence of pure stealth shaping

Plus TEDBF airforce version will be a better alternative if required even though its twin engined

kabe1:


Russian systems have always been 100% local since 2014.

Not true perse , components level importation still exists eg bolometers for IR devices etc

Maybe over the years they will localise it eventually

kabe1:


Russian systems have always been 100% local since 2014.

I wonder how you're arguing with an OEM.

Do you work for Sukhoi Design Bureau?

Does Russia build military equipment using US dollars?

What's your rational to doubt Rostec?

Obviously you are not an engineer. Where does that happen?. I am saying they are going to have to build the 100% local content from scratch meaning I already know it is a possibility but it will take time for a new type of aircraft. To make matters more interesting, this is also supposed to be low cost as in, use existing components as much as possible. Where does that happen in less than 5 years

RiceProducers:


Obviously you are not an engineer. Where does that happen?. I am saying they are going to have to build the 100% local content from scratch meaning I already know it is a possibility but it will take time for a new type of aircraft. To make matters more interesting, this is also supposed to be low cost as in, use existing components as much as possible. Where does that happen in less than 5 years

If you followed the launch, you really won't be making these comments.

Nemesis4you:


Not true perse , components level importation still exists eg bolometers for IR devices etc

Maybe over the years they will localise it eventually

I was referring to major components.

Example engines for Project 22350 frigates which used to be imported from Ukraine have been substituted.

Generally bottlenecks capable of halting development of military systems have been removed.

kabe1:


Says who?

Just for the sake of discussion

Let's try to list very few of 5th gen characteristics

1. Stealth shaping cheap enough but that would require high cost composites , exotic materials/alloys , RAM / RAS , FSS materials which are expensive

2. Fly by light is a hallmark of 5 th gen aircrafts , which again required state of the art materials and technologies , very expensive to be bulk produced as they are niche products , developing them itself is very expensive

Only these 2 factors will push the aircrafts costs beyond 20 million let's not even talk about the avionics radars electro optical devices etc

My personal estimate 60-90 million depending on the capabilities being provided as per customer requirement

Also russian aircrafts base price is low but overall life cycle cost is very high . Lets see if they are able to address this in this aircraft

Nemesis4you:


Just for the sake of discussion

Let's try to list very few of 5th gen characteristics

1. Stealth shaping cheap enough but that would require high cost composites , exotic materials/alloys , RAM / RAS , FSS materials which are expensive

2. Fly by light is a hallmark of 5 th gen aircrafts , which again required state of the art materials and technologies , very expensive to be bulk produced as they are niche products , developing them itself is very expensive

Only these 2 factors will push the aircrafts costs beyond 20 million let's not even talk about the avionics radars electro optical devices etc

My personal estimate 60-90 million depending on the capabilities being provided as per budget

Also russian aircrafts base price is low but overall life cycle cost is very high . Lets see if they are able to address this

I think the onus is on the design bureau to walk the talk.

Let's see if and when the aircraft is launched, how far they would deviate from this original price.


My personal estimate would be 45 - 50 million as the tech would be more readily available in the coming decade.

No high development cost is envisaged and market availability.

kabe1:


I was referring to major components.

Example engines for Project 22350 frigates which used to be imported from Ukraine have been substituted.

Generally bottlenecks capable of halting development of military systems have been removed.

Term "components" usage is different perse , then there is subsystems , than systems

A system/subsystem can be indigenous but might ( might not ) include foreign components

The criteria is not about the capability to localise them but the costs to localise them , if it is deemed not worth it than importation continues , a good % of components are free to trade ( does not come under sanctions ) , but if local requirement is large enough to cover production costs than localisation is generally opted for

Yes bottlenecks with components under sanctions or critical for own technological supremecy have been removed , it's imperative to do that

kabe1:


I think the onus is on the design bureau to walk the talk.

Let's see if and when the aircraft is launched, how far they would deviate from this original price.


My personal estimate would be 45 - 50 million as the tech would be more readily available in the coming decade.

No high development cost is envisaged and market availability.

Yes the onus is on them , if they are able to pull it off , it will be very big business for them

I would rather have the Russians than the Americans / Chinese being successful in the aerospace market

Lets wait and see

Mig new designs

1. A single engine 4.5++ lightweight multirole fighter.
2. A carrier-based dual engine 4.5++ medium weight multirole fighter.
3. A carrier-based stealth UCAV.

Mig carrier-based dual engine 4.5++ medium weight multirole fighter

Nemesis4you:
Mig carrier-based dual engine 4.5++ medium weight multirole fighter

Beautiful designs and concepts, I love the stealthiness incorporated to the design.
But how come are these 4.5 gen, why it's not called the 5th gen ?

bidexiii:


Beautiful designs and concepts, I love the stealthiness incorporated to the design.
But how come are these 4.5 gen, why it's not called the 5th gen ?

The question is best put to the OEM ( MiG )

Afterall its their prerogative

Anyways one cannot determine stealth by simply looking at an aircraft , forget about determining its generation

SANDF Advance Force, comprising Special Forces and others, arriving in Pemba, Mozambique, today.

Lurker4Long:
SANDF Advance Force, comprising Special Forces and others, arriving in Pemba, Mozambique, today.

Botswana Defence Force, also Special Forces, arriving in Pemba Mozambique, today.

Nemesis4you:


The question is best put to the OEM ( MiG )

Afterall its their prerogative

Anyways one cannot determine stealth by simply looking at an aircraft , forget about determining its generation

Thanks man.
In other words it will be safer to call it a 4.5+ gen aircraft.

bidexiii:



Thanks man.
In other words it will be safer to call it a 4.5+ gen aircraft.

It will be far more safer to call it by the OEM given designation - 4.5++

Nemesis4you:
Mig carrier-based dual engine 4.5++ medium weight multirole fighter

I read an article that Russia is merging both sukhoi and MIG into the United Aircraft corporation.

Nemesis4you:


It will be far more safer to call it by the OEM given designation - 4.5++

Okay

More

RVV-SD Izd. 180 air-to-air missile.

#MAKS2021 #KTRV

Its Amazing how government development projects forces the govt to deploy more security to safeguard their investment and in the process end up securing the place for the people who live there, for the case of Lamu region and the whole of North-Eastern Kenya, they have had minimal security personnel permanently based there.

Since the first berth of Lamu port was completed this year, Kenya Navy Ship (KNS) - KNS Umoja, KNS Shujaa, KNS Jasiri and KCG Doria. have relocated from Mombasa and have been operating from Lamu port in order to secure the shipping routes as more ships express interest in using the port which is less than 60km from the border with Somalia. Under normal circumstances, Lamu would never have gotten this much attention from Kenya Navy.