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Re: A Thread For Atheists, Skeptics, Agnostics, deists, Irreligious etc! by UyiIredia(m): 10:44pm On Aug 18, 2013 |
Logicboy03: Thanks Logicboy03: I know by inference. It is so damn elementary and I have repeated it in a number of forms on this forum. Note the line of thought below. Prop 1: Matter and its motion (even in the brain) lacks consciousness. Prop 2: Matter on its own has NEVER been seen to cause systems SIMULATING consciousness. Prop 3: We therefore infer that matter (and the laws it runs by) is causally inadequate to account for consciousness Prop 4: Only conscious and intelligent people have been seen to make computer systems SIMULATING consciousness or ascribing consciousness to matter. Prop 5: We therefore have a basis to infer a conscious and intelligent being that effected consciousness in human bodies. Prop 6: If such a being is material it is subject to matter and hence by Prop 1 could not cause consciousness, so we must assume it to be immaterial, it must be non-contingent so its existence doesn't further beg an explanation and the well-known absurdity of infinite regress be avoided. This immaterial, non-contingent consciousness intelligence I name as God 'As a man who has devoted his whole life to the most clear headed science, to the study of matter, I can tell you as a result of my research about atoms this much: There is no matter as such. All matter originates and exists only by virtue of a force which brings the particle of an atom to vibration and holds this most minute solar system of the atom together. We must assume behind this force the existence of a conscious and intelligent mind. This mind is the matrix of all matter.' How many times do I have to repeat this ish and the words of Max Planck before you get the point. I talk like imhotep, you laff it off, I talk like Mudley, I get banned whilst mocked, I talk like Spinoza, they yap about my pretence to intelligence. I'll make it up as I go along never mind others. For now, I'm Spinozist. Logicboy03: * From itself. [If you visualize a man making sand castles from sand you're off-track. I visualize something from nothing] * 6000 years ago if you are YEC or 13.7 billion years ago if you're with the mainstream scientists. [In essence time measurement of events really applies to matter. The essence of time (ie the thought which measures and knows it) is in truth timeless] * In itself. [Pause and ask yourself where we all exist in] Logicboy03: Answered 'em. Can you handle the answers ? The gbana I dey look get as e pass obadiah own oh ! Logicboy03: -Claim- Consciousness is a product of the brain Okay. Apparently as a result of evolutionary processess. I say a result because it supposedly wasn't intended and is one amongst other results. Logicboy03: In humans, I agree. Humans MUST have a brain to be conscious. Logicboy03: Of course, I disagree with evolution. The 1st part of your statement, if it is really what I think it is, is pleasing. It implies you know that time in humans is a function of intelligent consciousness, put simply no humans no time. Logicboy03: It is very applicable. Appeals to ignorance won't work here, moreso if they reject a good answer. If consciousness is not tangible, as you say, how can we account for its existence ? |
Re: A Thread For Atheists, Skeptics, Agnostics, deists, Irreligious etc! by UyiIredia(m): 10:44pm On Aug 18, 2013 |
Logicboy03: Thanks Logicboy03: I know by inference. It is so damn elementary and I have repeated it in a number of forms on this forum. Note the line of thought below. Prop 1: Matter and its motion (even in the brain) lacks consciousness. Prop 2: Matter on its own has NEVER been seen to cause systems SIMULATING consciousness. Prop 3: We therefore infer that matter (and the laws it runs by) is causally inadequate to account for consciousness Prop 4: Only conscious and intelligent people have been seen to make computer systems SIMULATING consciousness or ascribing consciousness to matter. Prop 5: We therefore have a basis to infer a conscious and intelligent being that effected consciousness in human bodies. Prop 6: If such a being is material it is subject to matter and hence by Prop 1 could not cause consciousness, so we must assume it to be immaterial, it must be non-contingent so its existence doesn't further beg an explanation and the well-known absurdity of infinite regress be avoided. This immaterial, non-contingent consciousness intelligence I name as God 'As a man who has devoted his whole life to the most clear headed science, to the study of matter, I can tell you as a result of my research about atoms this much: There is no matter as such. All matter originates and exists only by virtue of a force which brings the particle of an atom to vibration and holds this most minute solar system of the atom together. We must assume behind this force the existence of a conscious and intelligent mind. This mind is the matrix of all matter.' How many times do I have to repeat this ish and the words of Max Planck before you get the point. I talk like imhotep, you laff it off, I talk like Mudley, I get banned whilst mocked, I talk like Spinoza, they yap about my pretence to intelligence. I'll make it up as I go along never mind others. For now, I'm Spinozist. Logicboy03: * From itself. [If you visualize a man making sand castles from sand you're off-track. I visualize something from nothing] * 6000 years ago if you are YEC or 13.7 billion years ago if you're with the mainstream scientists. [In essence time measurement of events really applies to matter. The essence of time (ie the thought which measures and knows it) is in truth timeless] * In itself. [Pause and ask yourself where we all exist in] Logicboy03: Answered 'em. Can you handle the answers ? The gbana I dey look get as e pass obadiah own oh ! Logicboy03: -Claim- Consciousness is a product of the brain Okay. Apparently as a result of evolutionary processess. I say a result because it supposedly wasn't intended and is one amongst other results. Logicboy03: In humans, I agree. Humans MUST have a brain to be conscious. Logicboy03: Of course, I disagree with evolution. The 1st part of your statement, if it is really what I think it is, is pleasing. It implies you know that time in humans is a function of intelligent consciousness, put simply no humans no time. Logicboy03: It is very applicable. Appeals to ignorance won't work here, moreso if they reject a good answer. If consciousness is not tangible, as you say, how can we account for its existence ? |
Re: A Thread For Atheists, Skeptics, Agnostics, deists, Irreligious etc! by MrTroll(m): 11:06pm On Aug 18, 2013 |
Logicboy03:God created man and sent him consciousness through TELEKINESIS |
Re: A Thread For Atheists, Skeptics, Agnostics, deists, Irreligious etc! by UyiIredia(m): 11:48pm On Aug 18, 2013 |
Mr Troll: God created man and sent him consciousness through TELEKINESIS I'm beginning to think telekinesis doesn't even hit at it. Popular depictions of it involve physical things and creation ex nihilo falls outside that. BTW umm telepathy would better describe God making man a living soul. Professor X thingz. |
Re: A Thread For Atheists, Skeptics, Agnostics, deists, Irreligious etc! by deeptesting(m): 12:53am On Aug 19, 2013 |
Religion has actually convinced people that there's an invisible man -- living in the sky -- who watches everything you do, every minute of every day. And the invisible man has a special list of ten things he does not want you to do.. And if you do any of these ten things, he has a special place, full of fire and smoke and burning and torture and anguish, where he will send you to live and suffer and burn and choke and scream and cry forever and ever 'til the end of time! ..But He loves you........George Carlin @Slogan you are not alone.... The existence of religion makes a great deal of sense : It has been the best way to earn money from idiots .....Carlos Mora 2 Likes |
Re: A Thread For Atheists, Skeptics, Agnostics, deists, Irreligious etc! by deeptesting(m): 12:57am On Aug 19, 2013 |
Sloganz: Okay i am starting to adjust to my life as an atheist. Atheism is more than just the knowledge that gods do not exist, and that religion is either a mistake or a fraud. Atheism is an attitude, a frame of mind that looks at the world objectively, fearlessly, always trying to understand all things as a part of nature....Carl Sagan 2 Likes |
Re: A Thread For Atheists, Skeptics, Agnostics, deists, Irreligious etc! by deeptesting(m): 1:13am On Aug 19, 2013 |
Living in fear or judgement is not how I will spend my life. Realizing that this life is all I get and your life is all you get, brings a need to make the best of all possible. Michael Stanton. An atheist is a man who has no invisible means of support.......John Buchan. 2 Likes |
Re: A Thread For Atheists, Skeptics, Agnostics, deists, Irreligious etc! by wiegraf: 6:08am On Aug 19, 2013 |
Mr Troll: God created man and sent him consciousness through TELEKINESIS |
Re: A Thread For Atheists, Skeptics, Agnostics, deists, Irreligious etc! by Nobody: 7:51am On Aug 19, 2013 |
Uyi Iredia:There you go again...labels, labels... Honey, i see an etc at the end, and i interprete that to mean any and everybody . And i always enjoy sound arguments , truth is its only in threads like this that you find that. So i'll chip in my bits here and there if you dont mind |
Re: A Thread For Atheists, Skeptics, Agnostics, deists, Irreligious etc! by Nobody: 8:19am On Aug 19, 2013 |
Bludeville: Such a fence sitter..... We profile people based on labels and we choose. We all do it If we ask you, Ms/Mrs Bluedeville who you want for a husband/boyfriend/partner (dunno your s.exual orientation), you would start listing labels -a freethinking man/partner -a handsome man/partner -a banker/bureaucrat -an adventurer etc |
Re: A Thread For Atheists, Skeptics, Agnostics, deists, Irreligious etc! by MrTroll(m): 9:14am On Aug 19, 2013 |
Uyi Iredia: Mr Troll: God created man and sent him consciousness through |
Re: A Thread For Atheists, Skeptics, Agnostics, deists, Irreligious etc! by Nobody: 1:56pm On Aug 19, 2013 |
God is loving and kind, but he is also holy and he will not allow sin to go unpunished. The only way to overcome sin is by accepting Christ's victory over it as your own. Sin is the problem. God judges sin. He recognized our helplessness and sent Jesus to save. God loves, he is for you. Quit fighting and embrace him. Hell was not made for you, it was originally made for God's enemies, the devil and his angels, and everyone who perishes in rebellion against God. God made heaven for you. He loves ya. God is not seeking to condemn you, he loves you and saved you. Accept his salvation. |
Re: A Thread For Atheists, Skeptics, Agnostics, deists, Irreligious etc! by Judas2013: 2:43pm On Aug 19, 2013 |
Chibuebem: God is loving and kind, but he is also holy and he will not allow sin to go unpunished. The only way to overcome sin is by accepting Christ's victory over it as your own. Sin is the problem. God judges sin. He recognized our helplessness and sent Jesus to save. God loves, he is for you. Quit fighting and embrace him. Hell was not made for you, it was originally made for God's enemies, the devil and his angels, and everyone who perishes in rebellion against God. God made heaven for you. He loves ya. God is not seeking to condemn you, he loves you and saved you. Accept his salvation. Exactly what i was taught in Sunday school. Fortunately i knew it was a silly story told in the church to brainwash us and make us comply to all the bull rap we taught. The idea of using fear of hell to make people worship a diety is wrong. If jesus truly died for me, then why do i need to worship his dad. The debt has been paid,why preaching to me again. The bible is chock full of these contradictions. Thou Shalt Not kill, BUT its ok to stone a Witch. God is Love, BUT God hated Esau. 1 Like |
Re: A Thread For Atheists, Skeptics, Agnostics, deists, Irreligious etc! by UyiIredia(m): 3:07pm On Aug 19, 2013 |
The idea that God as Love has no hate is inane to me. It would mean we are privy to something God isn't. I think Christian theology should have space for the idea that God does hate. |
Re: A Thread For Atheists, Skeptics, Agnostics, deists, Irreligious etc! by UyiIredia(m): 3:08pm On Aug 19, 2013 |
@ logicboy: Why didn't you reply me ? |
Re: A Thread For Atheists, Skeptics, Agnostics, deists, Irreligious etc! by Nobody: 5:02pm On Aug 19, 2013 |
Uyi Iredia: @ logicboy: Why didn't you reply me ? Your post was full of bull 2 Likes |
Re: A Thread For Atheists, Skeptics, Agnostics, deists, Irreligious etc! by UyiIredia(m): 8:23pm On Aug 19, 2013 |
Logicboy03: Logic demands you apply logic to expose its nonsense. You never fail to show you ain't fit to have the logic in logicboy. You always show you are 3x times the errant boy child. Shoot ! In less than 2 years you've been banned and had cause to make 3 Nairaland profiles. |
Re: A Thread For Atheists, Skeptics, Agnostics, deists, Irreligious etc! by Nobody: 8:40pm On Aug 19, 2013 |
Judas2013:the message is simple, why is it so hard for people to comprehend? It's a message of salvation and love, of faith and victory. I don't blame people much. The devil has tried so hard to alter this message, and some bearers of this message have not preached the true message. The message is not about hell. It's about God's love. Its real in our lives. Believe this first, then God's word will be opened to you. But there are still some rebels who refuse to ACCEPT this salvation, who refuse to commit to God, don't be like them. The reality of God's love is in usm we fellowship with the father, enjoy true depth of life. Come, fellowship with us, and enjoy freedom from sin and darkness, and bask in God's light. Colossians chapter 1 verses 13&14 13 Who hath delivered us from the power of darkness, and hath translated us into the kingdom of his dear Son: 14 In whom we have redemption through his blood, even the forgiveness of sins: 1 John chapter 1 1-2 From the very first day, we were there, taking it all in—we heard it with our own ears, saw it with our own eyes, verified it with our own hands. The Word of Life appeared right before our eyes; we saw it happen! And now we're telling you in most sober prose that what we witnessed was, incredibly, this: The infinite Life of God himself took shape before us. 3-4 We saw it, we heard it, and now we're telling you so you can experience it along with us, this experience of communion with the Father and his Son, Jesus Christ. Our motive for writing is simply this: We want you to enjoy this, too. Your joy will double our joy! |
Re: A Thread For Atheists, Skeptics, Agnostics, deists, Irreligious etc! by Nobody: 9:01pm On Aug 19, 2013 |
Jesus isn't out to condemn you, he's out to save you! Here's what he says himself: The thief comes only in order to steal and kill and destroy. I came that they may have and enjoy life, and have it in abundance (to the full, till it overflows). John 10:10 Satan is the thief, he decieves men and gives them false conceptions of the father, he makes men fools who speak evil against someone they don't even know, who insult a life they have not lived. Jesus saves. Take a look at this and see that Jesus is NOT condemning you: John chapter 3 9 Nicodemus asked, "What do you mean by this? How does this happen?" 10-12 Jesus said, "You're a respected teacher of Israel and you don't know these basics? Listen carefully. I'm speaking sober truth to you. I speak only of what I know by experience; I give witness only to what I have seen with my own eyes. There is nothing secondhand here, no hearsay. Yet instead of facing the evidence and accepting it, you procrastinate with questions. If I tell you things that are plain as the hand before your face and you don't believe me, what use is there in telling you of things you can't see, the things of God? 13-15 "No one has ever gone up into the presence of God except the One who came down from that Presence, the Son of Man. In the same way that Moses lifted the serpent in the desert so people could have something to see and then believe, it is necessary for the Son of Man to be lifted up—and everyone who looks up to him, trusting and expectant, will gain a real life, eternal life. 16-18 "This is how much God loved the world: He gave his Son, his one and only Son. And this is why: so that no one need be destroyed; by believing in him, anyone can have a whole and lasting life.[b] God didn't go to all the trouble of sending his Son merely to point an accusing finger, telling the world how bad it was. He came to help, to put the world right again.[b/] Anyone who trusts in him is acquitted; anyone who refuses to trust him has long since been under the death sentence without knowing it. And why? Because of that person's failure to believe in the one-of-a-kind Son of God when introduced to him. 19-21 "This is the crisis we're in: God-light streamed into the world, but men and women everywhere ran for the darkness. They went for the darkness because they were not really interested in pleasing God. Everyone who makes a practice of doing evil, addicted to denial and illusion, hates God-light and won't come near it, fearing a painful exposure. But anyone working and living in truth and reality welcomes God-light so the work can be seen for the God-work it is." See? God does not speak a message of death, he speaks one of salvation, love, victory, don't act like that man, don't procastinate, accept this great salvation. And keep it, and speak it! Accept the reality of this message. |
Re: A Thread For Atheists, Skeptics, Agnostics, deists, Irreligious etc! by DrGboy(m): 10:58pm On Aug 19, 2013 |
Hi everyone, i just want to a pass a very important mssg. first of all, creating this thread won't give u PEACE, it can never give u that succour or comfort u've been looking for. Fine u've finally been able to convince yourself ( which obviously took alot of effort to do) that God does not exist. Well the devil himself didn't have the courage to do that. Let's not deceive ourselves, u made that decision because of your selfish personal interest, no wonder CHRIST himself said the road is very NARROW and only FEW find it. Living a life without CHRIST is full of crisis, suicidal thoughts, jealousy, hatred, fear, anger, lust. This life u hv is very short, very very very SHORT! u won't wake up every day and come to nairaland to express ur bitterness, someday u're gonna say bye bye to dis world. Then u'll find out that nothing else matters. obviously, if u're so certain that God doesn't exist, then why don't u die for what u believe in, or perhaps has any atheist every ressurected from the dead. CHRIST died to prove a point. U might rain abuses on my post, but remember one day u'll exit dis world and i must tell u d gospel is d only TRUTH dat u can find, not only that it gives us peace, joy, hope,love, grace to live above sin and most importantly PARADISE. HEAVEN or HELL the choice is yours, someday in d future i'm 100% sure u'll rmbr dis post, i pray it won't be too LATE by then. PEACE!!! |
Re: A Thread For Atheists, Skeptics, Agnostics, deists, Irreligious etc! by UyiIredia(m): 11:36pm On Aug 19, 2013 |
Death ! Let's not go into my thoughts on that one. It's bad enough that I've asked or stated some weird stuff, I must wonder still where people of old who knew next to nothing about Christianity would be, heaven or hell or . . . |
Re: A Thread For Atheists, Skeptics, Agnostics, deists, Irreligious etc! by Nobody: 3:43am On Aug 20, 2013 |
Uyi Iredia: I sense butthurt. You see, I brought you out of the depths of religious psychopathy only for you to go back to another form of insanity. I am disappointed in you. You think that you are like Deepsight who is deist. No, you are just someone who left christianity with some ridiculous views. By the way, I have had far more than 3 Nairaland profiles. Unfortunately, sheep on Nairaland are too silly to see why that can be a good thing 1 Like |
Re: A Thread For Atheists, Skeptics, Agnostics, deists, Irreligious etc! by Nobody: 3:45am On Aug 20, 2013 |
Dr.Gboy: If you are going to be one of the people in that so called PARADISE, let me start packing my bags for hell. A holier-than-thou douchebag like you in heaven? Lmao 2 Likes |
Re: A Thread For Atheists, Skeptics, Agnostics, deists, Irreligious etc! by Nobody: 6:26am On Aug 20, 2013 |
has logicboy no job? 1 Like |
Re: A Thread For Atheists, Skeptics, Agnostics, deists, Irreligious etc! by Nobody: 7:37am On Aug 20, 2013 |
Logicboy03:You know..these things don't surprise me at all...honestly. Everything is written in the Bible..the love of many will wax cold... You're fulfilling the prophecies of the 'non-existing' God..right? There will be a time.....u'll regret that u even came to this world. Singing songs of had I known. Jesus is coming soon...infact he's at the door-step. U have a choice....PARADISE or HELL . And if u're one of those cynics that won't believe anything until they see it,then maybe u should wait and see things for yourself.. After rapture...then the Great tribulation.......maybe then,u'll believe.. Maranatha ! |
Re: A Thread For Atheists, Skeptics, Agnostics, deists, Irreligious etc! by Nobody: 7:54am On Aug 20, 2013 |
Doc_Miss: You know..these things don't surprise me at all...honestly. Everything is written in the Bible..the love of many will wax cold... You're fulfilling the prophecies of the 'non-existing' God..right? There will be a time.....u'll regret that u even came to this world. Singing songs of had I known. Jesus is coming soon...infact he's at the door-step. U have a choice....PARADISE or HELL . And if u're one of those cynics that won't believe anything until they see it,then maybe u should wait and see things for yourself.. After rapture...then the Great tribulation.......maybe then,u'll believe.. Maranatha ! There were atheists before your religion 1 Like |
Re: A Thread For Atheists, Skeptics, Agnostics, deists, Irreligious etc! by UyiIredia(m): 9:57am On Aug 20, 2013 |
Logicboy03: You BROUGHT me out of where ? SMH. You give yourself too much credit. In any case, I'm reconsidering my earlier insanity, and tbh inane statements like yours make me wish I never left, lucky for you my quest for truth is more important. That said, you apparently have little ability to reason. When I make a good argument, instead of rebutting, you go jeepers. Sigh ! What more should one expect from one sho defined atheism as 'Atheism is not the belief that God doesn't exist.' Now respond to that argument instead of making unsupported claims about it. |
Re: A Thread For Atheists, Skeptics, Agnostics, deists, Irreligious etc! by Teesoft12: 3:14pm On Aug 20, 2013 |
For standing up to say No to this level of programming in Nigeria, i say kudos dudes, will like to have your numbers so we can atleast chat sometimes, Good to see people waking up! 1 Like |
Re: A Thread For Atheists, Skeptics, Agnostics, deists, Irreligious etc! by MrTroll(m): 10:23pm On Aug 20, 2013 |
What do these christians have to offer apart from threats of hellfire and rapture? Its getting old man. These guys are actually gonna bore somebody to death here 3 Likes |
Re: A Thread For Atheists, Skeptics, Agnostics, deists, Irreligious etc! by Teesoft12: 5:56am On Aug 22, 2013 |
And hey same goes to all religion....No hard feelings!!!!
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Re: A Thread For Atheists, Skeptics, Agnostics, deists, Irreligious etc! by Nobody: 6:26am On Aug 22, 2013 |
Mr Troll: What do these christians have to offer apart from threats of hellfire and rapture? Its getting old man. you do know that you can refuse to view threads here right? We would hate to have you bored when you certainly could be doing something more productive with your time than whining about a faith you claim is false. |
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