"A woman needs a man like a fish needs a bicycle."
Originated by Irina Dunn, an Australian educator.
But popularized by Gloria Steinem, founder of National Organization for Women (NOW) and Ms. Magazine.
A leading (if not the quintessential) American feminist of the 20th century.
(Just wanted to attribute the quote.)

@ToyM2B
Please, can you tell us why we need to retain patriarchy in societies of the world. Please give examples. I'm not trying to be sarcastic. Thanks.

@ chinani, their are some positions in soceity that if women take up, wld be inaffective. That is because we are emotional 2 handle such positions. An example of these positions is: RELIGIOUS LEADERS. By religious leaders i aint saying a priest in church, i mean Bishops, Popes (influential religious positions).

Dont get me wrong, i hate male chauvinism and egotistical behavious sometimes. But i have to agree that patriachy and matriachy works well in a soceity 2gether. If wowen were of equal leaders in religious situations, i'm so sure that we'll get 2 upheaved about most of the criticism and emotions that this men can recieve almost everyday.

Patriachy is not bad, equality is good, but we have 2 know the distinction between eqaulity and unreasonability.

chinani, their are some positions in soceity that if women take up, would be inaffective. That is because we are emotional 2 handle such positions. An example of these positions is: RELIGIOUS LEADERS. By religious leaders i aint saying a priest in church, i mean Bishops, Popes (influential religious positions).

Was Pastor Bimbo Odukoya, as a prominent female minister, inferior to the men in any way?

Seun:

Was Pastor Bimbo Odukoya, as a prominent female minister, inferior to the men in any way?

You! beat me to it. I was going to mention Mother Theresa, Kathryn Kuhlman, Joyce Meyer and our own Bimbo Odukoya.

Well I for one don't see where men take the religious or moral highground away from women. Think of the number of (male) hypocrites, adulterers and child abusers. . .now narrow your thoughts to only those who've been Pope! You'll find more than 2 dozen. I don't know that a woman could have done any worse.

Also, patriarchy & matriarchy are mutually exclusive. They can not exist at the same time.

ToyM28:

@ chinani, their are some positions in soceity that if women take up, would be inaffective. That is because we are emotional 2 handle such positions. An example of these positions is: RELIGIOUS LEADERS. By religious leaders i aint saying a priest in church, i mean Bishops, Popes (influential religious positions).

Dont get me wrong, i hate male chauvinism and egotistical behavious sometimes. But i have to agree that patriachy and matriachy works well in a soceity 2gether. If wowen were of equal leaders in religious situations, i'm so sure that we'll get 2 upheaved about most of the criticism and emotions that this men can recieve almost everyday.

Patriachy is not bad, equality is good, but we have 2 know the distinction between eqaulity and unreasonability.

LOL
I don't want to make any assumptions here, but I'll say you've got to broaden your horizon and move around with intelligent (and different types) of women so you can get a better perspective on life.
There's nothing written in a woman's DNA code that says she can't or cannot do THIS or THAT. How you grow up and the experiences you grow up with strongly affects the type of person you become. This is where generalizations--like the ones you made above-- loses the plot.

For example, you can't put a woman who grows up being prepped to become successful or to set high goals for themselves in the same category as those who are raised to believe that their ultimate goal in life is to become a good wife and know how to cook, or that being an emotional wreck is the norm. Conventional wisdom tells us that these people will likely take different paths in life. And will use what they have been taught accordingly. All in all, I will encourage you to move around different circles of women.

@ Chinani. Kudos, you actually did the footwork and provided those details I'd deliberately omitted. That gives me new respect for you.

But you do know what happened to/with Ms Steinem much later ba?

@Spikyn
Are you referring to her marriage? But feminists needn't be spinsters. I don't think that's a prerequisite.
And thanks for the respect.

chinani:

@Spikyn
Are you referring to her marriage? But feminists needn't be spinsters. I don't think that's a prerequisite.
And thanks for the respect.

i agree

U guyz dont get me wrong, and pls dont tell me 2 walk wiv intelligent woen cuz i walk wiv dose nd i work dem as well.

But as for bimbo odukoya, she was a minister but m talkng about high religious ppl. Ok lets 4get i sed religion. All am saying, is dat i'm a lady (well i hope so ), and i know dat sometimes things can be uneaual. But feminist that yap, DOWN WITH PATHRIACHY AND MEN, is taking it 2 d extreme.

I dont care about those, that just want equality, i respect that. But dose that take it 2 d extreme, 2 me are jobless and arent reasoning beyond their present state of mind. Because if ya'll shld think bout it, patraichy is a huge part of our lifes and existence. Whether we like it or not, and by waging war on men in general without having a specific focus (like equal pay or recognition for women enlightenment), they are just creating unnecesarry tension.

Well I'm glad you responded Toy2MB, b/c I don't think feminism is about bringing men down. (Or at least not the feminism I subscribe to.) I think that people are afraid of feminism b/c they think it's about bringing men down. Now, there's nothing wrong w/ humbling a person (gender notwithstanding) but bringing men and/or women down will not help the cause of humanity. We must respect each other.

Tell me, do you agree w/ Weev's (basic) defn of feminism on page 1?

Honestly, i do not mind that definition. Infact if that is d case i'll subscribe 2 feminism

But the truth is that not all feminism is like that, there are some who ve been reported in the papers 2 hold some kind of demonstration saying DOWN 2 MEN, WOMEN SHLD BE D ONLY ONES IN POLITICS, YEEE 2 POLITICAL LESBAINISM!

Well I have never heard or seen that, but you're right: not all feminist philosophy or practice is the same.

Dats why i have an issue wiv feminism, not dat my work and walk wiv illiterates. In fact, momsy and popsy, are hell bent on educating african women 2 speak out. And dat it their job. They do that.

So ppl saying i shld walk with more educated are just being unfair, i know wat am talkng about. M not just some illiterate trying 2 sound funky, i know that feminism has been takng 2 d extreme and if we are not careful, it wld be again.

ToyM28:

Dats why i have an issue with feminism, not that my work and walk with illiterates. In fact, momsy and popsy, are hell bent on educating african women 2 speak out. And that it their job. They do that.

I don't completely get this.

ToyM28:
So people saying i shld walk with more educated are just being unfair, i know what am talkng about. M not just some illiterate trying 2 sound funky, i know that feminism has been takng to the extreme and if we are not careful, it would be again.

Well I don't think that the fear of extremes is the best reason to not join. For instance, ice cream and a big Mac might make a child fat and diabetic if they are abused (or taken to extremes) but as long as caution and common sense prevails there is not much to fear. We must trust ourselves with common sense. We can not pretend that men have common sense and we do not. That is not fair and it's irresponsible of women to do/think so. Furthermore, doesn't patriarchy have ugly extremes? The extreme of institutionalized, societal patriarchy is. . . Slavery. That's right folks; it is not only women who suffer under patriarchy. And the "lesser" extreme of patriarchy is serfdom. (I'm sure that living in the UK you must know that such staples as tea time were inventing to keep the unbathed, illiterate working classes alive on hot water and stale bread so that they would not die of malnourishment before the end of their 12 hour work day.)

So you see they both have extremes. But perhaps we'd do better to compare other things and not just the slippery slope.

Abeg, where is _{the resident feminist on Nairaland}, Nferyn? Holiday?

ToyM28:

Dats why i have an issue with feminism, not that my work and walk with illiterates. In fact, momsy and popsy, are hell bent on educating african women 2 speak out. And that it their job. They do that.

So people saying i shld walk with more educated are just being unfair, i know what am talkng about. M not just some illiterate trying 2 sound funky, i know that feminism has been takng to the extreme and if we are not careful, it would be again.

When I said you should broaden your horizon, I wasn't trying to be offensive. It's just that when someone writes things like "women are too emotional to_______ " or "women can't do this cause they are women " it speaks more about the writer and it comes across like the person who is speaking has a limited view of the real world. Again, I wasn't trying to be offensive. (For example, I know several women who kicks ass in everything they do because they have high expectations of themselves. I also know women who can't be bothered with competing for top positions and those who lack the competitive drive to be in leadership positions.) Having said this, it would be hard for me to make the type of generalizations you did in your post or claim that patriarchy is what society needs.

I understand your point that some people take feminism to the extreme. And I oppose those kind of extreme life styles partly because it is a quick way to turn into the same thing you're trying to fight against. Not to mention that men have also greatly contributed to the feminist movement. 
Having said this, though, the extremities in feminism is no reason to demonize the entire movement or cast a shadow on the accomplishments this movement has made in our world today. Especially when we consider that without such movement, you prolly wouldn't be able to log on to Nairaland and share your opinion unless a male guardian gives you permission  

Most of the freedoms women have today would not be possible without the past feminists that dedicated their lives to such a cause. Again, I, too, oppose extremities and I will also add that feminism still has some ways to go.

ToyM28:

M not just some illiterate trying 2 sound funky, i know that feminism has been taken to the extreme and if we are not careful, it would be again.

ToyM28 when exactly was it taken to the extreme?  what would be the extreme? did I miss it?
the definition i gave would be recognized and accepted by any sociologist if you wrote me an essay with this as the basis of you argument you would be my star pupil,

However if anyone wrote, to quote you- "But the truth is that not all feminism is like that, there are some who ve been reported in the papers 2 hold some kind of demonstration saying DOWN 2 MEN, WOMEN SHLD BE D ONLY ONES IN POLITICS, YEEE 2 POLITICAL LESBAINISM!"  they would be rewriting it as they clearly do not understand the feminist perspective.

so ToyM28 stop worrying about the few militant feminists that the media love to report and embrace the feminist in you.

As Nia said if i were not for the feminists of yesteryear you would not be taking part in the discussion today.

Nia, i agree wiv u. Not all is taken 2 d extreme. But wen women say, i support eqaul pay nd down wiv chauvinism, can u consider dat as feminism?

Weev, tnx alot. M flattered, but its true nd it happesn

ToyM28- yeah that is most definitely feminism, you are (like it or not) a feminist. let me embrace you my feminist sister

@Nia- i am very impressed

@chinani- as always, excellent points well put.

you ladies put me to shame your arguments are enthralling

@weev, thanks  


@ToyM28
IMO, yes, I would consider that feminism as well.

Thanks Weev! Now can you write me a grad school rec? ~j/k~

abeg, what is going on o  ? enh? something (somebody??) keep putting an m next to my name and I know I didn't do it. I am not a man jo!

@Nia
You can change your gender just got to the "Please update your profile!" button at the top of the page.

From my dictionary upstairs ~ Feminism is the process whereby God / earthly demons manufactured a female (girl) and is given birth to by a woman.

my signature is what i subscribe to
i think im a feminist because i belive in the equal rights of both genders

It's a movement or theory supporting women's right on the grounds of equality of the sexes.

Feminism is shit! ! ! Even women are beginning to realize this.Type "feminism" or "dangers of feminism" on you tube and you will be amazed on how. . .

Jezz, this topic is so annoying.I'm done here.Make i sleep jare.