Jesus is Lord

Wait a minute everybody! stop the name-calling and unnecessary tongue-lashing accompanied with insults that are inconsistent with the ideal christians nature. For heaven sake why should good people trade their 'religious' decency and moral restrains for the rags of public ignominy.

Forasmuch as l concent to the fact that joagbaje is indepted to providing more veritably cogent and convincing expainations to give credence to the perhaps particularly discuss of money and giving activities in CE, people like Sir. John ,KunleOshob and more recently siyanda and  the likes of all those who are always almost morethan ready to pounce on any topic on the church with regards to money and giving should realize that though salvation is a free gift of God's love the message of the gospel is morethan ever in the history of the church more expensive especially with the advent of more and more improved means of mass communication like the internet and with all due respect 'the blood of Jesus is not a legal tender', no TV station would accept a God bless you as payment for air.

Somebody might want to ask must we use them, ok! leave them and stay within the walls of your seemingly beautiful churches and gradually watch like a film how the world with the merciless cruelty of its disfunctional system overtake you and your beliefs as ruins of the aftermath its passage.

The church needs money, money and wealth rightfully belongs to the church and the church in a generic sense is illusive it only exist because you, me, him, her, they are part and parcel ot her membership framework thus our properity and wealth is the properity and wealth of the church which ofcourse means that if we don't give and hold back not will be done. Today some of us have several bibles and we can boast of them in translatoins and on several mobile formats but men and women like the 'Full Gospel Business Men Fellowship' gave for the mass printing of copies for distribution aside from those who paid the ultimate price of their lives.

Zachzrial 1:17
Cry yet, saying, Thus saith the LORD of hosts; My cities through prosperity shall yet be spread abroad; and the LORD shall yet comfort Zion, and shall yet choose Jerusalem.
among the synonyms used to explain the Hebrew word traslated 'prosperity' in this passage is the word 'wealth'

one of the most appropriate places to talk about money on earth is the church, if anybody is angry about is let him kiss the sun black in a bright noon day. So if you want to critisize be complete and logical.

Jesus is Lord

siyanda.N:

Please be advised that we are no foolish man arguing about giving - our arguement on this forum is about the danger of prosperity gospel of greed the false gospel that Chris teaches.

Yep, what Chris and his partners-in-crime (those similarly benefitting from fleecing the flock in Chris Embassy) teach or preach is no gospel at all or at best indeed only a false "gospel" --- which in the end is no gospel.

@enigma
the gospel simply means good news
and good news to you am sure is that christ was made poor so you can be rich
2 cor 8:9 for you know the grace of our lord jesus christ that though he was rich yet for YOUR sakes he became poor that ye through his poverty might be rich.

^^^ There is a difference between "good news" and "the good news" meaning the gospel of Christ.

Chri[b]S[/b] Embassy preaches false good news and not the good news of Christ; thus it preaches a false "gospel", which is no gospel, and not the gospel of Jesus Christ.

Jesus is Lord

Siyanda

Enigma pleads NOT guilty, look at the last few posts again.

Jesus is Lord

siyanda.N:

Giving to multi millionaire Chris Oyakhilome does not PROVE to God that you Love Him because you are doing the OPPOSITE of wehat He instructed you to do!!

siyanda.N:

Romans 12:8 talks of contributing to the NEEDS of others!! poor, widow, orpahans, sick, that is God's heart. God can NEVER change and EXPECT us to give to ministers so people can witness God is with them!! No. God does not change. God still has His heart set in sharing with less priviledged. You would rather have Chris buy a Jet than share your money with others who wont bless you back. You forget that blessing come from God.

It all comes down to the belief giving to the MOG yields the best returns. I am sure Jo thinks so too, as a result would prefer to give to chris or other senior pastors. Oga Jo, it would be nice to hear you ‘dash’ out your car every two years to needy members of the congregation like the unemployed so they can use it for ‘kabu kabu’ to earn a living.

siyanda.N:

1 John 3:16-18: “We know what real love is because Christ gave up his life for us. And so we also ought to give up our lives for our Christian brothers and sisters. But if anyone has enough money to live well and sees a brother or sister in need and refuses to help — how can God’s love be in that person? Dear children, let us stop just saying we love each other; let us really show it by our actions.”

siyanda.N:

2 “So when you give to the poor (or Chris), do not sound a trumpet before you, as the hypocrites do in the synagogues and in the streets, so that they may be honored by men. Truly I say to you, they have their reward in full. 3 “But when you give to the poor, do not let your left hand know what your right hand is doing, 4 so that your giving will be in secret; and your Father who sees what is done in secret will reward you. Mathew 6

I don’t really blame chris, recognition award done in good faith should encourage/promote commitment (now I don’t know the motive for the award). The risk is that it also encourages insincerity on the part of the congregation. I think the participants should bear the larger chunk of the blame. Why would anybody want the recognition of man for a service to God? Maybe it’s the belief that pastor chris 'godly' hand shake translates to a downpour of (monetary) blessings.

mba emeka:

Anybody who was a member at anytime would have gone through what we call a foundation school. it is a preliminary class for new converts or old attendees that want to become full members of the church.

I want to believe this is where they do the brain-washing. For matters concerning the church, one is likely to graduate with the reasoning capacity of a zombie.

SirJohn:

@Joagbaje, you have consistently bullied Siyanda.N to answer your question but you have evaded mine for over two weeks now, can you please answer my own question COWARD!!!

Oga Jo no dey answer questions that will put in trouble. The man will pretend he never saw the question.

Joagbaje:
Nobody forget anybodys work. It is not every scale that is recognise, if that should be done , a whole year will not be enough to recognise everybody. Recognition award used to be one night before, now five night are not enough, yet many things still had to be cut down for time sake.

You know more people will want to meet the requirement for that ‘godly’ handshake. Chris will have to continually raise the threshold for qualification to reduce the crowd.

Joagbaje:
Restrictions had to be raised for those who stand out among others.

I don’t really support people standing for recognition for a service to God. I have to say I have been guilty of it in the past, but I don’t think its right. I really like to know why you choose to measure outstanding contributors using a minimum threshold. What about the man/woman that gave everything even if his/her contribution does not come close to the minimum threshold for recognition? Do I really stand out when I give 10% of my worth or when I give 90-100% of my worth. If you ask me sir, I think your criteria for measuring performance is flawed.

@ siyanda

siyanda.N:

I answered you, I DO NOT TITHE!!! then what??

You not answered me, I said in your new church, what is the pastors stand about tithes and offerings. What does he teach. And do you give offerings there?

@Siyanda.N
Please do not answer this coward further until he answers my question.
Thanks

SirJohn:

@Siyanda.N
Please do not answer this coward further until he answers my question.
Thanks

What's your question

Jesus is Lord

Jesus is Lord

p/z is there any new job on board?

SORRY ENIGMA THIS IS MEANT FOR OPINION, SORRY BROTHER
@siyanda
that definitely was not a mistake
also read the whole scripture! the church gave out of what they have,
this means they had,

@zikky
'Maybe it’s the belief that pastor chris 'godly' hand shake translates to a downpour of (monetary) blessings.

am sure you do not have a pastor,you have no respect for men of god at all,if not you would know 1 chronicles 16:22

Zikkyy:

You know more people will want to meet the requirement for that ‘godly’ handshake. Chris will have to continually raise the threshold for qualification to reduce the crowd.

I don’t really support people standing for recognition for a service to God. I have to say I have been guilty of it in the past, but I don’t think its right. I really like to know why you choose to measure outstanding contributors using a minimum threshold. What about the man/woman that gave everything even if his/her contribution does not come close to the minimum threshold for recognition? Do I really stand out when I give 10% of my worth or when I give 90-100% of my worth. If you ask me sir, I think your criteria for measuring performance is flawed.

Partners conference is not for handshake , it's a place of refreshing in the holyghost , the recognition and award session it's only a part, you know many africans don't understand the language " GRATTITUDE" it's a spiritual courtesy .

siyanda.N:

I do not give to give back. I could have stayed at CE and ride on Chris telling us by giving him I would get 100 fold back. Unlike you that is not what I wanted. I wanted to give because God moved me not expecting to get back. seeing homeless people receive a meal, smiling and thanking us put joy in my heart. Seeing orphans off loading food to their homes in jubilation puts joy in my heart. Seeing the elderly telling you thank you they can now have coffeee put joy in my house. Hearing old man 70 to 90 years calling you my child May God Bless you saying May I not die puts joy in my heart. And I then turn around and God loves you that is why I am here!

To me It is ENOUGH that I made them happy, it is enough that I told the about Jesus.

The above highlighted is what true christian giving is all about and it should give us Joy to see the the needy being helped, that is what we have been called out as christians to do. May God bless you richly for this post.

Joagbaje:

What's your question

Tell me you haven't seen my questions!

newmi:


one of the most appropriate places to talk about money on earth is the church, if anybody is angry about is let him kiss the sun black in a bright noon day. So if you want to critisize be complete and logical.

The devil himself has really taken residence in some of these so called churches, how does the hubris above stand in the face of scripture?

1 Timothy 6:10-11:
10 For the love of money is the root of all kinds of evil. And some people, craving money, have wandered from the true faith and pierced themselves with many sorrows

newmi:

The church needs money, money and wealth rightfully belongs to the church

newmi:

the message of the gospel is morethan ever in the history of the church more expensive especially with the advent of more and more improved means of mass communication like the internet and with all due respect 'the blood of Jesus is not a legal tender', no TV station would accept a God bless you as payment for air.

You do know that technology is expected to make processes more efficient and probably cheaper. You also need to consider the possibility that the MOGs spend more targeting the wrong audience. How do you explain a Redeem church for example setting up a branch or two on a 300 metres (long) street where you already have TREM, Winners, Baptist, MFM e.t.c. already established. What new souls will you be winning? Now imagine each of these churches taking their church global. Everybody wants to be on TBN preaching the same gospel. It’s no longer about the good news, it all come down to the brand. Money is being spent promoting the brand! I do believe the early apostles together spent far less than what the average celebrity church would spend today to spread the gospel. It didn’t cost the Europeans this much to bring Christianity to Africa. Now we are spending far more taking it back to them. With true sincerity of purpose, these churches will achieve far more with less money.

opinion15:

@zikky
am sure you do not have a pastor,you have no respect for men of god at all,if not you would know 1 chronicles 16:22

Did I say something wrong    I’ve read 1 Corinthians 16:22 and cant reconcile it to my post.

siyanda.N:

I wanted to give because God moved me not expecting to get back. seeing homeless people receive a meal, smiling and thanking us put joy in my heart. Seeing orphans off loading food to their homes in jubilation puts joy in my heart. Seeing the elderly telling you thank you they can now have coffeee put joy in my house. Hearing old man 70 to 90 years calling you my child May God Bless you saying May I not die puts joy in my heart. And I then turn around and God loves you that is why I am here!

This is true Christian giving. You don’t see Jo preaching this cos its bad for business.

Joagbaje:

Partners conference is not for handshake , it's a place of refreshing in the holyghost

You mean there is no holyghost at your current location (Bayelsa)

Joagbaje:

you know many africans don't understand the language " GRATTITUDE" it's a spiritual courtesy .

You don come again Kindly educate me sir, i dont understand the above.

Zikkyy:

It didn’t cost the Europeans this much to bring Christianity to Africa. Now we are spending far more taking it back to them. With true sincerity of purpose, these churches will achieve far more with less money.

They are not even taking the gospel back to the Europeans because their targets are firstly Nigerians and then Africans and other black people in these countries. Even more insidious in any event is that what they are taking back to these people (Nigerians, Africans etc) is not the gospel anyway but the false "gospel" which is no gospel of so-called "prosperity"!

Zikkyy:

I do believe the early apostles together spent far less than what the average celebrity church would spend today to spread the gospel. It didn’t cost the Europeans this much to bring Christianity to Africa. Now we are spending far more taking it back to them. With true sincerity of purpose, these churches will achieve far more with less money.

Enigma link=topic=193649.msg6973124#msg6973124 date=1287507652:

They are not even taking the gospel back to the Europeans because their targets are firstly Nigerians and then Africans and other black people in these countries. Even more insidious in any event is that what they are taking back to these people (Nigerians, Africans etc) is not the gospel anyway but the false "gospel" which is no gospel of so-called "prosperity"!

  I second you guys fully.

  On the flip side, isn't it funny, in the US (and I'm sure in the UK too) "missionaries" are constantly in churches raising funds to send the gospel to Africa. They come armed with video clips of under-nourished black children and awe-inspiring statistics of poverty in 'developing countries'. The West wants to send the gospel to Africa, Africa wants to send the gospel to the West. One has to just stop wonder . . .

Zikkyy:

You mean there is no holyghost at your current location (Bayelsa)
You don come again Kindly educate me sir, i dont understand the above.

Where did I mentioned that I stay in Bayelsa ?

@Zikky

     

Quote from: Joagbaje on Today at 03:31:27 PM
you know many africans don't understand the language " GRATTITUDE" it's a spiritual courtesy

Zikkyy:

You don come again  Kindly educate me sir, i dont understand the above.

You don't relate to everyone on the same level. God does not relate to everyone on the same level, Jesus did not relate to everyone on the same level. Some people are stands out by commitment and this makes them special. When God calls a man of God , gives him an assignment, their are certain individuals that God will use to bear the burden with him and those who recognise that callings are special.  Such people that have bought into such vision should be well handeled, encouraged and appreciated.  Many Africans dont like gratitude.

Pastor chris always teach us to appreciate, our parents, bosses, even employees! He says we should learn to say thank you!  Even to the house girl that give you water!  Jesus had many disciples . But herelated with them differently according to how vital they were to him.

So having opportunity to say thanks to partners and leader is a spiritual thing. We learn many principles of success in life  in such meetings with pastor chris and also receive impartation of spiritual ability to prosper.

Joagbaje:

Where did I mentioned that I stay in Bayelsa ?

Sorry sir, no vex. na assumption. I no know say you don move up. I don think am say you no fit collect prado jeep for Bayelsa, na only militants fit provide that kind egunje. Where you come dey na? na Aso rock chapel you dey?

Enigma:

They are not even taking the gospel back to the Europeans because their targets are firstly Nigerians and then Africans and other black people in these countries. Even more insidious in any event is that what they are taking back to these people (Nigerians, Africans etc) is not the gospel anyway but the false "gospel" which is no gospel of so-called "prosperity"!

True talk. See it as a market development/penetration strategy. The long term plan will be to ‘corner’ oyinbo market as well.

Zikkyy:

Sorry sir, no vex. na assumption. I no know say you don move up. I don think am say you no fit collect prado jeep for Bayelsa, na only militants fit provide that kind egunje. Where you come dey na? na Aso rock chapel you dey?

Joagbaje:

So having opportunity to say thanks to partners and leader is a spiritual thing.

I dont know much about this so no comment.

Joagbaje:

Pastor chris always teach us to appreciate, our parents, bosses, even employees! He says we should learn to say thank you! Even to the house girl that give you water!

I agree with pastor chris 100%

Joagbaje:

When God calls a man of God , gives him an assignment, their are certain individuals that God will use to bear the burden with him and those who recognise that callings are special.  Such people that have bought into such vision should be well handeled, encouraged and appreciated. Most Africans like gratitude.

I also agree 100% with the bit highlighted above. Most Africans like gratitude; it appears to be an inherent trait. I’ve heard of instances where people stopped giving in church after the MOG decided to do away with the recognition bit. I now understand the need for IPPC, the church need the cash inflow. I hope you also understand the risk here, some people will give just to be part of the program, because they want to ‘mingle’ with chris & CE ‘big boys’, get that ‘godly’ handshake. Giving then would no longer be for the joy it brings or the love for the gospel. To these people, you would have done more harm than good.