I find this post on the subject quite insightful and enlightening:
“For better for worse” is NOT in the Bible. “Till death do us part” is NOT in the Bible.

I know many of you don’t read your Bible so what I’m saying now is very shocking to you.

Let me say it clearly again-
The phrase “for better for worse” is NOT in the Bible.

E shock you abi

It’s a dangerous rhetoric smuggled into christian marriage vows but those exact phrases are totally ABSENT from the Bible.

But not many Christians and not many Nigerians know this.

People just hear “till death do us part” and “for better for worse” and they assume it’s in Bible

The popular traditional vows dates back to 1549 recorded in the “Book of Common Prayer” BCP used by The Church of England.

Even the popular words “speak now or forever hold your peace” are also NOT in the Bible. It also traces its origins back to the marriage liturgy in the BCP.


The oldest standard wedding vows traced back to the Book of Common Prayer was written by a priest called Thomas Cranmer.

He was the was a leader of the English Reformation and Archbishop of Canterbury during the reigns of Kings HenryVIII, Edward VI and, for a short time, Mary I... Thomas Cranmer wrote:

I, _____, take thee, _____, to be my wedded Husband, to have and hold from this day forward, FOR BETTER FOR WORSE, for richer for poorer, in sickness and in health, to love, cherish, and to obey, till death us do part, according to God's holy ordinance."

I expect few ignorant Christians will gather under this post and start twisting things writing ridiculous nonsense.

“Oh it’s implied”
“But Bible says don’t put asunder”
“How about cleaving to become one flesh”

All sorts of pseudo-intelligent rebuttals. But my position is clear.

And for people who are interested in history: you will be interested to know that the same Thomas Cranmer helped to build the case for the divorce of King Henry from Catherine of Aragon.

What’s the point of this?
The SAME man who wrote the wedding vows of “till death do us part”

The same man who wrote the popular wedding vows of “till death do us part” helped the King of England to divorce his wife at the time: Catherine of Aragon.

So when people use the vows he wrote over 500 years ago as justification for spousal abuse in marriage- it’s a huge shame.

So in summary, to be clear:
The popular Christian wedding vows of “till death do us part”, “for better for worse” is NOT in the Bible.

It was written by a priest in England.
You can write your own vows and make your own promise to your partner using your own language.

The end.

@DrOlufunmilayo

Gomesh2783:
1. For better for worse is Christian!

2. When one gets into marriage one needs to know that it will not just be a bed of roses. Some days, some months and/or some years will be better, when things goes well, but there will be those periods of need, lack, periods of want where one will feel like 'I think I made a mistake by marrying' these are the worst periods in one's life and he/she is not supposed to quit or even think of that when things goes wrong.

3. The vows mentioned that I will have and I will hold onto what I have from this day (wedding day) forward and I will hold on in better days and even in the worse of the worst days, I will love and cherish him/her even when he/she lost an eye, a leg, burnt his/her face and is completely defaced.

4. For better, worse he/she will be mine. I will not think of divorce because ( Matt 19:8 ) of the hardness of your hearts Moses permitted you to divorce your wives, which was not so from the beginning.

1. That is a bloody lie!

2. All this here gobbledygook there has nothing to do with Jesus Christ nor Christianity.

3. The vows have nothing to do with Jesus Christ nor Christianity.

4. Divorce is not a sin. In that verse Jesus Christ said divorce wasn't so in the beginning but when exactly was the beginning He spoke of? Well, as it turns out, the beginning was Genesis 2 vs 24 when instituted marriage. However, because of the hardness of the hearts of men, in Genesis 3 vs 16, God cursed marriage, and made divorce a choice in marriage. No where in scripture does God in fact stipulate divorce as sin against Him. It is instead men that fed you such a lie.

engrtee:
"I _____, take you ______, to be my wedded wife. To have and to hold, from this day forward, for better, for worse, for richer, for poorer, in sickness or in health, to love and to cherish ’till death do us part. And hereto I pledge you my faithfulness". (I can't see the verse in the Bible)



If couples take a wedding vow that is not in the Bible, is the vow to God or to man? This made me to sit and wonder: what kind of vow Abraham and Sarah took and they stayed together for 90-solid years, even though childless? What kind of vow did Mary the mother of Jesus and Joseph her husband sign that they stayed together, even though Jesus was conceived by the Holy spirit? Were there any happily married people in the Bible that we can make references to? did they take any vows that we need to read and learn from? For better or for worse, our parents and grandparents, some of whom came from polygamous homes seem to still have it better than what we have nowadays. They didn’t take any vows, did they?
For better or for worse is not in the Bible, where did Christendom get it from? Are there not other things Christians grow up with, beliefs they have, orientations they have which are not in the Bible


the recommendationsmost Christians make for marriage are good. The failure of Christian marriage, however, is that those same people would tell you “for better or worse” means you have to put up with abuse, sexual neglect and addiction. My criticism of this concept has been the same for years: it works great as long as everyone obeys the rules; when they don’t, you’re stuck with no recourse for a spouse’s bad behavior. All the good ideas in the world mean nothing if your misbehaving spouse knows you will never leave. Such a marriage philosophy just creates a breeding ground for neglect and abuse.
I strongly believe that marriages should be for BETTER

Somewhere in 1st Corthinans 7, Apostle Paul said a wife is bound to her husband as long as he lives and a husband is bound is his wife as long as she leaves.

For better for worse was never about behavioral vices, it was about situations of life. The next line says for poorer for richer, in sickness and in health bla bla bla.

Like you rightly said, it works well when everyone is aligned with it. Hence, I think the concern should be 'getting someone aligned' like Amos 3:3 and 1 Cor 6: 14 - 18 instead of looking for loopholes.

Besides, the Bible also says we should let the unbelieving party go (if they want to); Jesus said because of the hardness of the people's hearts, Moses permitted divorce.

Irrespective of how people choose to interpret their Bibles, one thing is clear: To run away from an abusive situation.

While I know the Church can do much better (I have opened a thread or two) in marriage teachings and counselling, EVERYONE NEEDS to take responsibility for their decisions.

The same Church tells you not to drink, commit fornication, adultery, lie, steal, pay your tithe, don't abuse your leaders, obey the authorities etc etc. yet people do not conveniently listen and do those things. Why can't you apply the same energy when it comes to marriage teachings?

Just went through the thread and noticed:
1. It is a 2014 thread

2. I had engaged on it previously

engrtee:
"I _____, take you ______, to be my wedded wife. To have and to hold, from this day forward, for better, for worse, for richer, for poorer, in sickness or in health, to love and to cherish ’till death do us part. And hereto I pledge you my faithfulness". (I can't see the verse in the Bible)



If couples take a wedding vow that is not in the Bible, is the vow to God or to man? This made me to sit and wonder: what kind of vow Abraham and Sarah took and they stayed together for 90-solid years, even though childless? What kind of vow did Mary the mother of Jesus and Joseph her husband sign that they stayed together, even though Jesus was conceived by the Holy spirit? Were there any happily married people in the Bible that we can make references to? did they take any vows that we need to read and learn from? For better or for worse, our parents and grandparents, some of whom came from polygamous homes seem to still have it better than what we have nowadays. They didn’t take any vows, did they?
For better or for worse is not in the Bible, where did Christendom get it from? Are there not other things Christians grow up with, beliefs they have, orientations they have which are not in the Bible


the recommendationsmost Christians make for marriage are good. The failure of Christian marriage, however, is that those same people would tell you “for better or worse” means you have to put up with abuse, sexual neglect and addiction. My criticism of this concept has been the same for years: it works great as long as everyone obeys the rules; when they don’t, you’re stuck with no recourse for a spouse’s bad behavior. All the good ideas in the world mean nothing if your misbehaving spouse knows you will never leave. Such a marriage philosophy just creates a breeding ground for neglect and abuse.
I strongly believe that marriages should be for BETTER

To cut all this long story short Jesus said: Matthew 19:5-6 And said, For this cause shall a man leave father and mother, and shall cleave to his wife: and they twain shall be one flesh? Wherefore they are no more twain, but one flesh. What therefore God hath joined together, let not man put asunder.

If your marriage is a holy matrimony joined by God then no one (including you or your spouse or your pastor or your relatives) is permitted to separate you both. And if for any reason you choose to separate you will remain single until your spouse dies (1 Corinthians 7: 11 and 1 Corinthians 7: 39).

So technically speaking the vow is absolutely correct. The moment you are married in a holy matrimony you are stuck to your partner no matter the situation or circumstance and if you must separate from your spouse you must remain single until your partner dies.

If you want to separate as a Christian, separate but know that it is either konji nearly kee you or you become a murderer and kee your spouse.

efficiencie:
1. To cut all this long story short Jesus said: Matthew 19:5-6 And said, For this cause shall a man leave father and mother, and shall cleave to his wife: and they twain shall be one flesh? Wherefore they are no more twain, but one flesh. What therefore God hath joined together, let not man put asunder.
if your marriage is a holy matrimony joined by God then no one (including you or your spouse or your pastor or your relatives) is permitted to separate you both. And if for any reason you choose to separate you will remain single until your spouse dies (1 Corinthians 7: 11 and 1 Corinthians 7: 39).

2. So technically speaking the vow is absolutely correct. The moment you are married in a holy matrimony you are stuck to your partner no matter the situation or circumstance and if you must separate from your spouse you must remain single until your partner dies.

3. If you want to separate as a Christian, separate but know that it is either konji nearly kee you or you become a murderer and kee your spouse.

1. There is no such thing as Holy Matrimony this since God cursed marriage in Genesis 3 vs 16 and that which is cursed is by definition unholy.

If you would pay close attention to what Jesus Christ in fact said in that very context, you would note that His explaination in Matthew 19 vs 5 - 6 was instead God's design for marriage in the beginning until man chose to reject God's way leading then to God's curse in Genesis 3 vs 16 - 22

2. Again, holy matrimony is an unholy lie. God cursed marriage and offered to men divorce as an option out of marriage. God never indicated divorce as sin, not in His Old Covenant and certainly not His New Covenant this since God cannot change His mind.

FYI: The laws of divorce given to even those of the Old Covenant by Moses came directly from God Himself..

3. If as a Christian, Konji still leads you, then you should reevaluate your entire belief instead.

engrtee:
"I _____, take you ______, to be my wedded wife. To have and to hold, from this day forward, for better, for worse, for richer, for poorer, in sickness or in health, to love and to cherish ’till death do us part. And hereto I pledge you my faithfulness". (I can't see the verse in the Bible)



If couples take a wedding vow that is not in the Bible, is the vow to God or to man? This made me to sit and wonder: what kind of vow Abraham and Sarah took and they stayed together for 90-solid years, even though childless? What kind of vow did Mary the mother of Jesus and Joseph her husband sign that they stayed together, even though Jesus was conceived by the Holy spirit? Were there any happily married people in the Bible that we can make references to? did they take any vows that we need to read and learn from? For better or for worse, our parents and grandparents, some of whom came from polygamous homes seem to still have it better than what we have nowadays. They didn’t take any vows, did they?
For better or for worse is not in the Bible, where did Christendom get it from? Are there not other things Christians grow up with, beliefs they have, orientations they have which are not in the Bible


the recommendationsmost Christians make for marriage are good. The failure of Christian marriage, however, is that those same people would tell you “for better or worse” means you have to put up with abuse, sexual neglect and addiction. My criticism of this concept has been the same for years: it works great as long as everyone obeys the rules; when they don’t, you’re stuck with no recourse for a spouse’s bad behavior. All the good ideas in the world mean nothing if your misbehaving spouse knows you will never leave. Such a marriage philosophy just creates a breeding ground for neglect and abuse.
I strongly believe that marriages should be for BETTER

Is there also the verse that talked about women not working and asking husbands for money in the bible?? Smh

Kobojunkie:
1. There is no such thing as Holy Matrimony this since God cursed marriage in Genesis 3 vs 16 and that which is cursed is by definition unholy.

If you would pay close attention to what Jesus Christ in fact said in that very context, you would note that His explaination in Matthew 19 vs 5 - 6 was instead God's design for marriage in the beginning until man chose to reject God's way leading then to God's curse in Genesis 3 vs 16 - 22

2. Again, holy matrimony is an unholy lie. God cursed marriage and offered to men divorce as an option out of marriage. God never indicated divorce as sin, not in His Old Covenant and certainly not His New Covenant this since God cannot change His mind.

FYI: The laws of divorce given to even those of the Old Covenant by Moses came directly from God Himself..

3. If as a Christian, Konji still leads you, then you should reevaluate your entire belief instead.

Why did you evade the Corinthian verses? Explain away those verses too. I dey wait you and while you are at it tell me why Paul made marriage a criterion to hold church positions in 1 Timothy 3:2 and 1 Timothy 3:12. Also I would like you to show me where God cursed marriage in the Bible because the verse you posted showed God cursing Adam and Eve and not their union. GOD told Adam to be fruitful and to multiply before man fell so how come God's curse didn't prevent the fulfilment of a blessing pronounced before man fell and associated with man's ability to reproduce. Answer this as well. Oya over to you!

Oh also address this. You claimed divorce was not a sin in old testament now tell me why God said this:

“For I hate divorce,” says the LORD, the God of Israel. “He who divorces his wife covers his garment with violence,” says the LORD of Hosts. So guard yourselves in your spirit and do not break faith. [/b] Malachi 2:16 (Berean Study Bible)

And why did Jesus deem divorcees to be committing adultery if they put away their spouses and married another: [color=red] And he saith unto them, Whosoever shall put away his wife, and marry another, committeth adultery against her. And if a woman shall put away her husband, and be married to another, she committeth adultery. Mark 10:11-12 (KJV)

You have a lot to answer ohh

efficiencie:
1. Why did you evade the Corinthian verses? Explain away those verses too.

2. I dey wait you and while you are at it tell me why Paul made marriage a criterion to hold church positions in 1 Timothy 3:2 and 1 Timothy 3:12.

3. Also I would like you to show me where God cursed marriage in the Bible. God cursed Adam and Eve but I don't know where God cursed the union of Adam and Eve.

4. GOD told Adam to be fruitful and to multiply before man fell so how come God's curse didn't prevent the fulfilment of a blessing pronounced before man fell and associated with man's ability to reproduce. Answer this as well. Oya over to you!

1. I ignored what is posted in Paul's letters since they do not overule nor add nor remove in any way or form from that declared by God Himself. You have to understand what it means to say Jesus Christ is God. It means no one should add or change or even remove from that which He has commanded.

2. Jesus Christ sent His followers out to teach the Gospel as taught by Him to those in the world - Luke 20 vs 34 - 36. And one particular lesson that Jesus Christ taught is that your marriages are of this world and not of the Kingdom of God. This means Paul was wrong to teach you of marriage and of giving it as a criterion for holding anything in relationship to the Kingdom of God.

3. Marriage, according to Genesis 2 vs 24 is simply an agreement between a man and woman to become husband and wife(marriage). The very same husband and wife on whom the curse in Genesis 3 vs 16 is placed on by God..

You(wife) will want your husband very much,
    but he(husband) will rule over you(wife).” - Genesis 3 vs 16

Implicated are the very same husband and wife(one) that is a marriage.

God didn't place that curse on single women or single men, but on men and women in marriage(husband and wife) .I.e. on marriage itself..

4. "Be fruitful and multiply", is not a blessing but instead a command God gave to mankind before the fall of man. After the fall God cursed the works of man's hands and also childbirth- Genesis 3 vs 16 - 22

Kobojunkie:
1. I ignored what is posted in Paul's letters since they do not overule nor add nor remove in any way or form from that declared by God Himself. You have to understand what it means to say Jesus Christ is God. It means no one should add or change or even remove from that which He has commanded.

2. Jesus Christ sent His followers out to teach the Gospel as taught by Him to those in the world - Luke 20 vs 34 - 36. And one particular lesson that Jesus Christ taught is that your marriages are of this world and not of the Kingdom of God. This means Paul was wrong to teach you of marriage and of giving it as a criterion for holding anything in relationship to the Kingdom of God.

3. Marriage, according to Genesis 2 vs 24 is simply an agreement between a man and woman to become husband and wife(marriage). The very same husband and wife on whom the curse in Genesis 3 vs 16 is placed on by God..
Implicated are the very same husband and wife(one) that is a marriage.

God didn't place that curse on single women or single men, but on men and women in marriage(husband and wife) .I.e. on marriage itself..

4. "Be fruitful and multiply", is not a blessing but instead a command God gave to mankind before the fall of man. After the fall God cursed the works of man's hands and also childbirth- Genesis 3 vs 16 - 22

Oh also address this. You claimed divorce was not a sin in old testament now tell me why God said this:

“For I hate divorce,” says the LORD, the God of Israel. “He who divorces his wife covers his garment with violence,” says the LORD of Hosts. So guard yourselves in your spirit and do not break faith. Malachi 2:16 (Berean Study Bible)

And why did Jesus deem divorcees to be committing adultery if they put away their spouses and married another: And he saith unto them, Whosoever shall put away his wife, and marry another, committeth adultery against her. And if a woman shall put away her husband, and be married to another, she committeth adultery. Mark 10:11-12 (KJV)

efficiencie:
1. Oh also address this. You claimed divorce was not a sin in old testament now tell me why God said this:

“For I hate divorce,” says the LORD, the God of Israel. “He who divorces his wife covers his garment with violence,” says the LORD of Hosts. So guard yourselves in your spirit and do not break faith. Malachi 2:16 (Berean Study Bible)

2. And why did Jesus deem divorcees to be committing adultery if they put away their spouses and married another: And he saith unto them, Whosoever shall put away his wife, and marry another, committeth adultery against her. And if a woman shall put away her husband, and be married to another, she committeth adultery. Mark 10:11-12 (KJV)

1. Well, recall again that God's original Holy design for marriage did not include a plan for divorce. However, since His Holy design was rejected by man(the fall), it doesn't mean God changed His mind about divorce.

God allows us divorce from what is unholy marriage and He gave us laws to indicate this both in the Old and New Covenant.

2. If you read the verses carefully, you would see that even there in Mark, Jesus Christ tells you that it is in remarriage, not divorce, that you commit adultery.

The only situation where remarriage is allowed is in case where fornication was reason for ending the previous marriage, else adultery is committed if remarriage occurs.

Kobojunkie:
1. Well, recall again that God's original Holy design for marriage did not include a plan for divorce. However, since His Holy design was rejected by man(the fall), it doesn't mean God changed His mind about divorce.

¹ God allows us divorce from what is unholy marriage and He gave us laws to indicate this both in the Old and New Covenant.

² . If you read the verses carefully, you would see that even there in Mark, Jesus Christ tells you that it is in remarriage, not divorce, that you commit adultery.

³ The only situation where remarriage is allowed is in case where fornication was reason for ending the previous marriage, else adultery is committed if remarriage occurs.

On your point 1. I still say that marriage was not cursed by God rather God cursed individuals. The curse that stemmed from Adam to all men happens to all men irrespective of whether they are married or not. The punishment apportioned to Eve happens to all women whether they are married or not. Men toil whether they are married or not and women go through the pain of birth whether they are married or not. This invalidates your heretical view that God cursed marriage.

On your point 2. Yes that is very correct and hence if you are divorced you must remain single. Any attempt to marry another is tantamount to adultery.

On your point 3. Where in the Bible did Jesus say that you can remarry if your spouse is caught in adultery? You have no scriptural basis for it. If you marry you remain married till either party to the marriage dies. If you must divorce you must either remain single or return to your spouse as long as your spouse is alive. The words of Jesus was crystal clear unless ofcourse you want to write your own bible.

efficiencie:
1a. On your point 1. I still say that marriage was not cursed by God rather God cursed individuals. The curse that stemmed from Adam to all men happens to all men irrespective of whether they are married or not. The punishment apportioned to Eve happens to all women whether they are married or not.

1b. Men toil whether they are married or not and women go through the pain of birth whether they are married or not. This invalidates your heretical view that God cursed marriage.

On your point 2. Yes that is very correct and hence if you are divorced you must remain single. Any attempt to marry another is tantamount to adultery.

On your point 3. Where in the Bible did Jesus say that you can remarry if your spouse is caught in adultery? You have no scriptural basis for it. If you marry you remain married till either party to the marriage dies. If you must divorce you must either remain single or return to your spouse as long as your spouse is alive. The words of Jesus was crystal clear unless ofcourse you want to write your own bible.

1a. So you think that what God said in Genesis 3 vs 16 is a lie, this since you claim women alone, regardless of marital status, were cursed when the verse indicates that the curse applies only to wives and husbands(married couples)?

1b. Try to make sure to pay attention to what is being shown you..

Genesis 3 vs 16 contains two different curses, of which I chose to focus entirely on just the part that applied to marriage for this here conversation.

---

Marriage, according to Genesis 2 vs 24 is simply an agreement between a man and woman to become husband and wife(marriage). The very same husband and wife on whom the curse in Genesis 3 vs 16 is placed on by God..

You(wife) will want your husband very much,
    but he(husband) will rule over you(wife).” - Genesis 3 vs 16b

Implicated are the very same husband and wife(one) that is a marriage.

God didn't place that curse on single women or single men, but on men and women in marriage(husband and wife) .I.e. on marriage itself..

---

The portion that deals with child birth ofcourse is not in anyway limited to only the married.

Before you rush off thinking to invalidate, first make certain you fully comprehend the conversation first!

2. Unless ofcourse in the case or fornication where one is free to remarry.

3. ▪︎Matthew 5 vs 31 - 32
▪︎ Matthew 19 vs 7 - 9

Kobojunkie:
1a. So you think that what God said in Genesis 3 vs 16 is a lie, this since you claim women alone, regardless of marital status, were cursed when the verse indicates that the curse applies only to wives and husbands(married couples)?

1b. Try to make sure to pay attention to what is being shown you..

Genesis 3 vs 16 contains two different curses, of which I chose to focus entirely on just the part that applied to marriage for this here conversation.
Marriage, according to Genesis 2 vs 24 is simply an agreement between a man and woman to become husband and wife (marriage). The very same husband and wife on whom the curse in Genesis 3 vs 16 is placed on by God..
Implicated are the very same husband and wife(one) that is a marriage.

God didn't place that curse on single women or single men, but on men and women in marriage(husband and wife) .I.e. on marriage itself.. The portion that deals with child birth ofcourse is not in anyway limited to only the married.

Before you rush off thinking to invalidate, first make certain you fully comprehend the conversation first!

2. Unless ofcourse in the case or fornication where one is free to remarry.

3. Matthew 5 vs 31 - 32
Matthew 19 vs 7 - 9

I say again God did not curse marriage as an institution rather God cursed a man who sinned and a woman who sinned and a serpent who sinned. God did not curse marriage anywhere in the Bible so stop this heresy. The curses of Genesis 3:13-19 hold irrespective of the marital status of men and women and this is proof that the curse is not associated with marriage. Yes, God cursed a couple in a marriage but the marriage itself was not cursed. If the curses were active only on married couples then wow the world would be living by a different set of rules that would totally exclude marriage in a bid to avoid a marital curse. You are reading into the scriptures your own scriptures.

The verses you referenced do not lead to your conclusions. And here again you are doing what you usually do, reading into a verse what is not there.

Matthew 5 vs 31 - 32
Matthew 19 vs 7 - 9

Where in these verses did you see that you can divorce and remarry if your spouse is caught in fornication? Where? Unless you are referring to your own Bible, authored by you. These verses you posted indicate that if your spouse is caught in fornication or adultery you can put him or her away but whoever marries a divorced spouse commits adultery. Anyone with a little logical skills can see that this verse prevents marriage involving divorcees but here you are claiming falsely that the Bible allows you to divorce (in the event of infidelity) and remarry. Another heresy.

efficiencie:
I say again God did not curse marriage as an institution rather God cursed a man who sinned and a woman who sinned and a serpent who sinned. God did not curse marriage anywhere in the Bible so stop this heresy. . .

I see you are not even willing to honestly digest what is written right there in plain human language in scripture. So I choose to leave you to yours folly as that is between you and the one you claim is over your soul. When you are ready to honestly ply what is written, let me know..

Fake religion - fake marriage!
All the name of copying western culture and their oyinbo jesus!