efficiencie:


read your bible bro before making comments on christian matters based on total ignorance...read Acts 4:33-37 people in the church of Acts did not only pay tithes and offerings they sold what they had and brought it to the feet of the apostles...they gave with a true heart better than we do nowadays...read scriptures well sir, for by they you think you have eternal life...

Maybe you are the one who do not read ur bible well. That's why they deceive you guys.

We read:

[ESV] Acts 4:33 And with great power the apostles were giving their testimony to the resurrection of the Lord Jesus, and great grace was upon them all.

[ESV] Acts 4:34 There was not a needy person among them, for as many as were owners of lands or houses sold them and brought the proceeds of what was sold

[ESV] Acts 4:35 and laid it at the apostles' feet, and it was distributed to each as any had need.

[ESV] Acts 4:36 Thus Joseph, who was also called by the apostles Barnabas (which means son of encouragement), a Levite, a native of Cyprus,

[ESV] Acts 4:37 sold a field that belonged to him and brought the money and laid it at the apostles' feet.

What is tenth there?

What led to the contribution in the first place, where they given the tenth of there monthly income there?

JMAN05:


Maybe you are the one who do not read ur bible well. That's why they deceive you guys.

We read:

[ESV] Acts 4:33 And with great power the apostles were giving their testimony to the resurrection of the Lord Jesus, and great grace was upon them all.

[ESV] Acts 4:34 There was not a needy person among them, for as many as were owners of lands or houses sold them and brought the proceeds of what was sold

[ESV] Acts 4:35 and laid it at the apostles' feet, and it was distributed to each as any had need.

[ESV] Acts 4:36 Thus Joseph, who was also called by the apostles Barnabas (which means son of encouragement), a Levite, a native of Cyprus,

[ESV] Acts 4:37 sold a field that belonged to him and brought the money and laid it at the apostles' feet.

What is tenth there?

What led to the contribution in the first place, where they given the tenth of there monthly income there?

Bro don't be in a haste to criticize for criticizing sake...the issue that led to my comment was not on the quantity of what was given but on whether what was given was given in the public or not

...and besides whether you give offering, tithe or sell all you have and put at the feet of Apostles...you are giving to the church...and bro JMAN it appears your grouse is against the churches as a whole...i'm calling on the pentecostals and charismatics that have something against TBJ's doctrines...

Image123:


What are his teachings/doctrines? As a self appointed umpire, you should have some idea what his teachings are na. Bring up his teachings and we will consider them in the light of God's Word. Sorry to say this, but i do not listen to him and do not have time for such. However, the 'few' times i have seen him, ¹ it has always being something superficial; some deliverance, or rice sharing or transformer giving, some prediction making. That seems to be about 95% of what i've seen TBJoshua doing. i've hardly seen him preach and the few times, it has still being very vague and superficial; nothing concrete or distinct. Any PROFESSING christian preacher would say the things he would say. Stuff close to motivational talk, God answers prayer, trust in God, focus on God, tell your neighbour Jesus is good. Some things close to that, these are all general.
i have a big problem with many of his practices and methods as they are not scriptural or biblical. ² The thread is about doctrine/teaching, so please, let's know his doctrine/teaching. Someone said something about T B Joshua's doctrine of love. Well, let's not get it twisted. Love is not sharing rice and money BTW. The Bible itself says so. On the scale of 1 Corinthians 13;
1Co 13:3 And though I bestow all my goods to feed the poor, and though I give my body to be burned, and have not charity, it profiteth me nothing.

According to this scripture, one can distribute a lot of money, rice, scholarships, and whatever else TBJ does and still not have charity/love. People tend to say TBJ is a good man/top christian because he televises giving. Giving alone does not make one a christian as good and COMMENDABLE as it is. In fact, it is not even a proof of love according to the scripture passage above. ³
Usually, for me, the clearest proof of a child of God is their fruits. In this case, as a pastor, their converts or church members. The SCOAN members i have met are not it at all, lemme leave it at that.
Charity vaunteth not itself, is not puffed up. Charity doesn't advertise itself, it is not vain or puffed up, neither does it boast or brag. In that, TBJ's alleged charity scores low.
Charity doth not behave itself unseemly. A lot of unseemly stuff happens in the Synagogue deliverances. TBJ was one time a kind of specialist in making women clutch to their genitals, and some other not too fine things. Thank God for recent rebrandings sha, SCOAN has stepped up much, as it were. Of course you have video evidence, but it can be supplied in case you require. What more should one say, about the recent tragedy that happened in one of the Synagogue hostels and how SCOAN, TBJ and members handled it. The doctrine of love doesn't score high in my humble opinion.

Your humble opinion in comments 1 and 2 are contradictory. How come you heard TBJ only a few times and consider listening to him a waste of time but yet you know so much of his PRACTICES AND METHODS to have problems with them? ...just a humble question!

On the comment 3, is love about taking, taking and taking? That verse:

1Co 13:3 And though I bestow all my goods to feed the poor, and though I give my body to be burned, and have not charity, it profiteth me nothing

Meaning that giving for any reason other than love is profitless and how do you give in love? it's giving by grace and giving by grace is giving not as an earning but as a gift... TBJ gives to people who have little or no capacity to give back in return...orphans, widows, muslims (strangers), the disabled... if 95% of so called men of God give like this we would no longer need GOVERNMENTS!

efficiencie:


Bro don't be in a haste to criticize for criticizing sake...the issue that led to my comment was not on the quantity of what was given but on whether what was given was given in the public or not

Who is talking about quality and publicity here?

Secondly, it appears you don't even know what you post. Let me show you what I replied to:

After bold-facing my comment which states that neither Jesus, Paul nor Peter collected tithe, you stated

"read Acts 4:33-37 people in the church of Acts did not only pay tithes and offerings they sold what they had and brought it to the feet of the apostles"

And after quoting the scriptures you gave I asked:

What is tenth there?

What led to the contribution in the first place, where they given the tenth of there monthly income there?

Can you answer my question now?

efficiencie:
...and besides whether you give offering, tithe or sell all you have and put at the feet of Apostles...you are giving to the church...and bro JMAN it appears your grouse is against the churches as a whole...i'm calling on the pentecostals and charismatics that have something against TBJ's doctrines...

I have not talked about all denominations in christendom. I am talking of your T.B Joshua. Of course if any of his unscriptural doctrine is practiced by another, that one gets a blame too.

I stated that his tithe doctrine is a disqualification 'cos he has no "NT" precedence, and you ve not provided a proof to the contrary.

Secondly, I have been asking you to [size=16]list all the doctrines of your T. B. Joshua here, lets weigh it with the bible,[/size] You refuse and keep beating about the bush.

JMAN05:


Who is talking about quality and publicity here?

Secondly, it appears you don't even know what you post. Let me show you what I replied to:

After bold-facing my comment which states that neither Jesus, Paul nor Peter collected tithe, you stated

"read Acts 4:33-37 people in the church of Acts did not only pay tithes and offerings they sold what they had and brought it to the feet of the apostles"

And after quoting the scriptures you gave I asked:



Can you answer my question now?

Bro what difference does it make paying tithes and selling all you have and giving to the church...you are paying to the church...

Spread the Gospel Light @ www.facebook.com/touchlightpage.

JMAN05:


I have not talked about all denominations in christendom. I am talking of your T.B Joshua. Of course if any of his unscriptural doctrine is practiced by another, that one gets a blame too.

I stated that his tithe doctrine is a disqualification 'cos he has no "NT" precedence, and you ve not provided a proof to the contrary.

Secondly, I have been asking you to [size=16]list all the doctrines of your T. B. Joshua here, lets weigh it with the bible,[/size] You refuse and keep beating about the bush.

if you have nothing against TBJ then switch to observation mode but if you have anything against TBJ's teaching then speak up and let's examine it in the light of God's word... and by the way, i was baptised, raised and trained in MFM as a son that seeks the truth in God's words irrespective of who teaches it

efficiencie:


if you have nothing against TBJ then switch to observation mode but if you have anything against TBJ's teaching then speak up and let's examine it in the light of God's word... and by the way, i was baptised, raised and trained in MFM as a son that seeks the truth in God's words irrespective of who teaches it

Do you attend his church?

Does he teach the true gospel?

efficiencie:


Bro what difference does it make paying tithes and selling all you have and giving to the church...you are paying to the church...

Do you now see you mentioned tithe? next time read very well before writing.

You want to know the difference?

1. define tithe.

2. under the law was contribution limited to tithe or where there times when other types of contributions were made?

Why didnt we see clamor for tithe in the "NT"? why then do this so called "man of God" initiate that practice?

Mind you. When you contribute, you are not paying to the church as if you are owing it. Those people that were selling houses and contributing were not doing so out of duty nor are they paying to the church, and they are not paying any tithe there. They just gave from there heart what will be used to feed there xtian brothers who had nothing to eat in Jerusalem.

The money is not for the apostles to use and buy private jets or personal properties.

efficiencie:


if you have nothing against TBJ then switch to observation mode but if you have anything against TBJ's teaching then speak up and let's examine it in the light of God's word... and by the way, i was baptised, raised and trained in MFM as a son that seeks the truth in God's words irrespective of who teaches it

If you seek truth, answer me these questions:

1. Did the apostles collect or teach tithing?

2. Do T. B. Joshua collect tithe? If yes, what does that tell you about him?

But it seems you eyes is still blind to what I have been saying here since. ok, do you know T B. Joshua's teachings? if yes, [size=15]list them here[/size]. I know I will not need to say this again. I hope you can now see.

efficiencie:



Your humble opinion in comments 1 and 2 are contradictory. How come you heard TBJ only a few times and consider listening to him a waste of time but yet you know so much of his PRACTICES AND METHODS to have problems with them? ...just a humble question!

On the comment 3, is love about taking, taking and taking? That verse:

1Co 13:3 And though I bestow all my goods to feed the poor, and though I give my body to be burned, and have not charity, it profiteth me nothing

Meaning that giving for any reason other than love is profitless and how do you give in love? it's giving by grace and giving by grace is giving not as an earning but as a gift... TBJ gives to people who have little or no capacity to give back in return...orphans, widows, muslims (strangers), the disabled... if 95% of so called men of God give like this we would no longer need GOVERNMENTS!

Spot on

JMAN05:


If you seek truth, answer me these questions:

1. Did the apostles collect or teach tithing?

No

2. Do T. B. Joshua collect tithe? If yes, what does that tell you about him?

Have no idea.

But it seems you eyes is still blind to what I have been saying here since. ok, do you know T B. Joshua's teachings? if yes, [size=15]list them here[/size]. I know I will not need to say this again. I hope you can now see.

If you want to find out about his teachings go to:

http://www.scoan.org/media/sermons/

JMAN05:


If you seek truth, answer me these questions:

1. Did the apostles collect or teach tithing?

2. Do T. B. Joshua collect tithe? If yes, what does that tell you about him?

But it seems you eyes is still blind to what I have been saying here since. ok, do you know T B. Joshua's teachings? if yes, [size=15]list them here[/size]. I know I will not need to say this again. I hope you can now see.

Well bro, i pardon your insults, at least we can say happy new year without insulting eachothers,but i restate my position. if you do not have anything against TBJ you don't have to comment at all...this thread is for persons that know about TBJ's teachings and have evidence against his teachings!

Thank God paulgrundy has given you a clue as to where you can get the evidence you need!

efficiencie:


Your humble opinion in comments 1 and 2 are contradictory. How come you heard TBJ only a few times and consider listening to him a waste of time but yet you know so much of his PRACTICES AND METHODS to have problems with them? ...just a humble question!

Thanks for your humble question, and Happy New Year. i did not claim to know SO MUCH of him or his. i said that "i have a big problem with many of his practices and methods as they are not scriptural or biblical." There is NOTHING contradictory in that. i can see you ONCE and have a big problem with you and what you do. i don't have to see you a million times to make an assessment. For instance, if i met a girl for the first time today, and she tried to seduce me into immorality, that's a big problem for me. She doesn't need to do that several times before it becomes a big problem with me.
Now, i said the 'few' times i have seen him, notice FEW in quote. Why, because few is relative. i've known about TBJ for a looooooong time, but i've never had to settle down to watch him or whatever he usually does on TV. i have many other things to do than to sit and watch TV, especially if it is something superficial(which is what 99% of SCOAN's episodes used to be). SCOAN would always show deliverance, deliverance, deliverance upon deliverance sessions, or some charity work. You hardly see the man preach, at least not until recently. Even the preaching, it's usually about some predictions. i'm talking about what they usually aired on the usual TV stations.

On the comment 3, is love about taking, taking and taking? That verse:

1Co 13:3 And though I bestow all my goods to feed the poor, and though I give my body to be burned, and have not charity, it profiteth me nothing

Meaning that giving for any reason other than love is profitless and how do you give in love? it's giving by grace and giving by grace is giving not as an earning but as a gift... TBJ gives to people who have little or no capacity to give back in return...orphans, widows, muslims (strangers), the disabled... if 95% of so called men of God give like this we would no longer need GOVERNMENTS!

No, love is not about taking, taking and taking. i never suggested that. i simply stated what a Bible passage said. And that is that one can give and yet lack love.
1Co 13:3 And though I bestow all my goods to feed the POOR, and though I give my body to be burned, and have not charity, it profiteth me nothing

Clearly, one can give to the POOR and have not charity. i don't think it gets any clearer. If 95% of so called men of God give like this, and have not charity, it profiteth them nothing. It is useless and of no good.

Greetings to you in the name of the Lord.

We should never try to defend prophet T.B Joshua despite the love that we have for him.

Al this must be fulfilled but woe unto whome such is fulfilled.

There is no compromise about this at all has we are in the presence of a mighty prophet sent from Jesus.

WHO IS T.B. Josua?

T.b. Joshua is just like Moses and Elijah of our time.
He is representing the picture of the word of God.


Some watchful character in him

1) He has always been a prophet been blessed with great spiritual blessings so that is why persecutions were attracted.

If your christain life does not invite persection, check wether you are still a christian.
Am not supprised why he is hated and persecuted but should have been supprised if it were not so.
You love smooth words.
He also raised wise man in which one was droped. Ain't you observant enough how this is similar to Judas or Peter.

Check Jeremiahs ministry you will know the truth.

Image123:

Thanks for your humble question, and Happy New Year. i did not claim to know SO MUCH of him or his. i said that "i have a big problem with many of his practices and methods as they are not scriptural or biblical." There is NOTHING contradictory in that. i can see you ONCE and have a big problem with you and what you do. i don't have to see you a million times to make an assessment. For instance, if i met a girl for the first time today, and she tried to seduce me into immorality, that's a big problem for me. She doesn't need to do that several times before it becomes a big problem with me.
Now, i said the 'few' times i have seen him, notice FEW in quote. Why, because few is relative. i've known about TBJ for a looooooong time, but i've never had to settle down to watch him or whatever he usually does on TV. i have many other things to do than to sit and watch TV, especially if it is something superficial(which is what 99% of SCOAN's episodes used to be). SCOAN would always show deliverance, deliverance, deliverance upon deliverance sessions, or some charity work. You hardly see the man preach, at least not until recently. Even the preaching, it's usually about some predictions. i'm talking about what they usually aired on the usual TV stations.



No, love is not about taking, taking and taking. i never suggested that. i simply stated what a Bible passage said. And that is that one can give and yet lack love.
1Co 13:3 And though I bestow all my goods to feed the POOR, and though I give my body to be burned, and have not charity, it profiteth me nothing

Clearly, one can give to the POOR and have not charity. i don't think it gets any clearer. If 95% of so called men of God give like this, and have not charity, it profiteth them nothing. It is useless and of no good.

Ma bro, unless u jst wana argue! read my comment honestly:

1Co 13:3 And though I bestow all my goods to feed
the poor, and though I give my body to be burned,
and have not charity, it profiteth me nothing


Meaning that giving for any reason other than love
is profitless and how do you give in love? it's giving
by grace and giving by grace is giving not as an
earning but as a gift... TBJ gives to people who
have little or no capacity to give back in
return...orphans, widows, muslims (strangers), the
disabled... if 95% of so called men of God give like
this we would no longer need GOVERNMENTS!

I explained giving without love...and giving with love... TBJ does that...

efficiencie:


Well bro, i pardon your insults, at least we can say happy new year without insulting eachothers,but i restate my position. if you do not have anything against TBJ you don't have to comment at all...this thread is for persons that know about TBJ's teachings and have evidence against his teachings!

Thank God paulgrundy has given you a clue as to where you can get the evidence you need!

I do not read any post that falls within paulgrundy's writing. So I dont know what he posted and I dont care to know.

Immediately I see his name, I scroll over, so I dont see even "is" in his writing.

Well I have already said what I know about him and why it is wrong. I also know he bears title. Making certain prophesies about who will and who will not rule, when true xtians have nothing to do with the world. You can read john 12:31

JMAN05:


I do not read any post that falls within paulgrundy's writing. So I dont know what he posted and I dont care to know.

Immediately I see his name, I scroll over, so I dont see even "is" in his writing.

Well I have already said what I know about him and why it is wrong. I also know he bears title. Making certain prophesies about who will and who will not rule, when true xtians have nothing to do with the world. You can read john 12:31

What are you saying Is that the latest lie against me Is wrongfully identifying me as Yooguyz no longer the lie againnst me?

I honestly think the right thing for you is to address the points I raised or ignore them. A true Christain does not bear false against others or look for the slighest opportunity to accuse the brethren. Exodus 20:16, colossians 2:8, 1 peter 2:1.

efficiencie:


Ma bro, unless u jst wana argue! read my comment honestly:



I explained giving without love...and giving with love... TBJ does that...

I read your comment honestly already, whatever that means. I stand by my post.

Image123:


I read your comment honestly already, whatever that means. I stand by my post.

It's all gud bro! We don't have to agree...God's Spirit will teach us some more and bring us to the unity of faith...

JMAN05:


I do not read any post that falls within paulgrundy's writing. So I dont know what he posted and I dont care to know.

Immediately I see his name, I scroll over, so I dont see even "is" in his writing.

Well I have already said what I know about him and why it is wrong. I also know he bears title. Making certain prophesies about who will and who will not rule, when true xtians have nothing to do with the world. You can read john 12:31

Well bro with respect to your grudge against paulgrundy i believe if we are brothers we need not bear grudges against one another...we many not agree but i trust the HolyGhost to unite us in mind and doctrine...

With respect to TBJ, i'd advice you, as Gamaliel did in Acts 5:34-39, thread softly with your words...if TBJ's ministry is fake it won't last and both him and his teachings would be forgotten but if he's of God then be careful with your words against him...you may be hurting the God that called him.

The bible says it is to every man according to his faith . tho who am I to say God hs not called a prophet or not . I just have some comments to make .
This man advocates anoiting water , there is no where right from the time of adam till the time of the apostles where anoiting water was used in the bible . does this prophet pray over waters brought in by members or members are asked to buy an already prepared anoiting water ?
I watched on his tv station how he helped a family out of poverty , while showing the testimony , they showed this family eatin corn and pickin clothes from a waste dump. I was forced to ask my friend , how did they get a video of them eating from a waste dump because their faces were directly in the camera. Well the bible made it clear , you dont have to show the whole world you are giving . apparenty , that family was ased to eat from that waste dump so as just to potray a pathetic situation on the tv . My faith is not in this prophet.

“Good works do not make a good man, but a good man does good works.” – Martin Luther

efficiencie:


Well bro with respect to your grudge against paulgrundy i believe if we are brothers we need not bear grudges against one another...we many not agree but i trust the HolyGhost to unite us in mind and doctrine...

With respect to TBJ, i'd advice you, as Gamaliel did in Acts 5:34-39, thread softly with your words...if TBJ's ministry is fake it won't last and both him and his teachings would be forgotten but if he's of God then be careful with your words against him...you may be hurting the God that called him.

Like islam right? Or the million other religions that are lasting. If it is by works, he has scored a lot of criticism and unscriptural practices. Let someone bring up his doctrines/teachings maybe he will try small there.

efficiencie:


It's all gud bro! We don't have to agree...God's Spirit will teach us some more and bring us to the unity of faith...

Ephesians 4:11 And he gave some, apostles; and some, prophets; and some, evangelists; and some, pastors and teachers; 4:12 For the perfecting of the saints, for the work of the ministry, for the edifying of the body of Christ: 4:13 Till we all come in the unity of the faith, and of the knowledge of the Son of God, unto a perfect man, unto the measure of the stature of the fulness of Christ:

He gave us apostles, prophets, evangelists, pastors and teachers for our perfection TILL we all come in the unity of the faith.

efficiencie:


Well bro with respect to your grudge against paulgrundy i believe if we are brothers we need not bear grudges against one another...we many not agree but i trust the HolyGhost to unite us in mind and doctrine...

With respect to TBJ, i'd advice you, as Gamaliel did in Acts 5:34-39, thread softly with your words...if TBJ's ministry is fake it won't last and both him and his teachings would be forgotten but if he's of God then be careful with your words against him...you may be hurting the God that called him.

Paulgrundy is not my enemy. I am only restricted by the scriptures. He was a JW who fail out, as such 1Cor. 5:11, 2john 9, 10 hinder me.

No, we cant take Gamaliel words to mean that false worship cant endure under criticism. It is true that false religion will eventually end, but God's time to end all of it is still future. Jesus himself didn't close his mouth when he see people teaching falsehood. Such criticism can make the humble one to change. But note that my statement against him is bible-based. If he was God-sent as he claims, he wont teach falsehood nor stay at home and expect the poor to find him. He will do the preaching as the Lord commands.

JMAN05:


Paulgrundy is not my enemy. I am only restricted by the scriptures. He was a JW who fail out, as such 1Cor. 5:11, 2john 9, 10 hinder me

The bolded is not even true, I have even explained to you before, but it seems like you are determined to hate me, because I am critical of the watchtower religion aka Jehovahs witnesses.

JMAN05: Paulgrundy and yooguyz are the same persons. and he is an apostate disfellowshiped for his bad conduct.

If you are a true witness, ignore his posts. 1cor. 5:11

paulGrundy:
^^^ funnily enough am not a JW, was never a JW can never be a JW. How many times do I have to keep the record straight. If you don't agree with my points why don't you engage me in a respectful dialogue or better still ignore my posts?

I still love you with the love of God even though you hate me very much

God bless you

https://www.nairaland.com/1922670/18-facts-may-not-know/3

Assuming its true that I was a JW, are you telling me that the Bible said JW's should talk to former JW's??

1 Corinthians 5:11
11 But tnow I have written unto you not to keep company, aif any man that is called a brother be a fornicator, or covetous, or an idolater, or a brailer, or a drunkard, or an extortioner; with such an one no not to eat.

You don't know me from anywhere, we have not met before, so how then did you now conclude that I am guilty of the above??

2 John 1:9-10English Standard Version (ESV)

9 Everyone who goes on ahead and does not abide in the teaching of Christ, does not have God. Whoever abides in the teaching has both the Father and the Son. 10 If anyone comes to you and does not bring this teaching, do not receive him into your house or give him any greeting,

am laughing at this one?? Are you by any way implying that only Jehovahs witnesses have the teaching of Christ, therefore justifying your non-response to my posts In that case why do you respond to efficience's post and other non-JW's e.g Emusan who is equally critical of the society just as I am your action best describes you as an HYPOCRITE! Period. Truth being said you are hurt by my expose's on this forum, hence the silent treatment and the malicious behaviour

A true christain does not tell lies or keep malice. 1 peter 2:1, Ephesians 4:31, exodus 20:16.

No, we cant take Gamaliel words to mean that false worship cant endure under criticism. It is true that false religion will eventually end, but God's time to end all of it is still future. Jesus himself didn't close his mouth when he see people teaching falsehood. Such criticism can make the humble one to change. But note that my statement against him is bible-based. If he was God-sent as he claims, he wont teach falsehood nor stay at home and expect the poor to find him. He will do the preaching as the Lord commands.

Well Mr JMAN it appears you've got it all figured out...We'll the end of time would put one of us in the right and the other wrong...As for me I'v listened to TBJ and I'v experienced the healing and prophetic services and i find him to be true

I am not a member of TBJ's church but i believe he's from and of God!