openmine:

You are very wrong sir....tithes was extensively instructed(commanded) in d old testament by God to the people of israel as a way of feeding d levites that had no allotment in d land(lev 27:30-34;numbers 18:25-32)...Abraham was never instructed or commanded to tithe like the jews did...dats because it was a free will gesture and nothing more dan dat...i will repeat dis again to you...a tithe is wat it is..a tithe which is a compulsory requirement by God to d people of israel to give a tenth of their farm produce...i guess u bypassed those scriptures in d old testament

Barnabaseloka:

Why do tithers give one-tenth (tithe) of their income at stipulated periods of time? Are they not trying to follow the law as the Israelites did? Free-will offering or giving for Christians is not bound to be one-tenth, but what one decides to give (whether one-tenth or not).
On the otherhand, if one promises God a tenth of one's income at a stipulated time (every month or every two months or every year), such agreement is between the person and God. It is called VOW. it has nothing to do with the one-tenth people are subjected to pay every month in churches today.

openmine:

now seriously,i wud like 2 know ur definition of tithes according 2 d scriptures...so i know am not having an unfruitful dic=scus wit u...thanks?

NumberOne2:


No you quote me out of context:
I spelt out the entire Deut 14:22-27 didnt I? I am trying to show that MONEY tithing existed in OLD Testament. What it is done with is NOT my issue. I am not a Priest.

NumberOne2:


Oh, the English man will not kill us with English.
What is the difference between command and instruction
"A new commandment I give unto you, That ye love one another; as I have loved you, that ye also love one another." - John 13:34
Is Jesus forcing us to love in the above text?

Tithing is NOT at a stipulated time? Not everyone gets income by months end.
Some people pay tithes 3 or 4 times in the same month. Some just 2 times a year.

Thanks for the question. As I have been saying. Tithe is 10% of my income given to GOD OUT of LOVE (NOT FORCE). God is NOT a GOD of force.
If you dont want to pay, leave it but DONT bring scripture to negate it. The fact it wasnt mention in New testament does mean it is DEAD. Masturbation wasnt mention neither was smoking. Are they good? We have the Holy Spirit to lead us.

MrPristine:


If you had quoted verse 25 in full it would have proved that money was not acceptable as tithes because God asked the tither to use the money to buy food stuff and wine but in your dishonesty you left out that part and only quoted the part that mentioned money in order to deceive those who haven't read that passage properly before.

NumberOne2:


Tithing is NOT at a stipulated time? Not everyone gets income by months end.
Some people pay tithes 3 or 4 times in the same month. Some just 2 times a year.

NumberOne2:


The post you refers to talks of giving in love. If tithing, tithe in love or dont bother. It doesnt say NOT to tithe.

OK, the NEW convenant talks of going beyond 10% to giving ALL.
The early Christians sold all they had and brought to the Apostles feet to be shared by the brethren. Can you do that? Also NOTE that the ALL was not given to the poor.

"And sold their possessions and goods, and parted them to all men, as every man had need.
And they, continuing daily with one accord in the temple, and breaking bread from house to house, did eat their meat with gladness and singleness of heart,
Praising God, and having favour with all the people. And the Lord added to the church daily such as should be saved." - Acts 2:45-47

So you are neither for TITHING or for GIVING ALL. Where do you stand?

Barnabaseloka:

This means that tithers pay tithe when it is convenient for them. God did not command the Israelites to pay these tithes when it was convenient for them or anytime they wished. Tithing as demanded by the law was at stipulated times. They must wait till the appointed times for the tithes to be paid and according to its rules.
God is all-knowing. He knew that some Israelites would not be able to meet up with the payment if it involved money. He knew that some Israelites would be owed by their employers and some might not make profit before such tithes were paid. That was why he did not involve money but crops and animals, so that no one will give excuse for not paying tithes. He knew that before the tithing periods the Israelites would have got an increase in their livestock and crops. Money existed at that time yet they did not tithe with money. This means that if you are being subjected to pay tithes with money, you are not doing it rightly. It means you are giving your money out unnecessarily being coerced into it unknowingly.
If you want to involve money, it is no more as a law and the blessings in Malachi will not come to you. This blessings pronounced in Malachi come when one tithe as God commanded.
If one wants to involve money, it is no more of the law but of free-will and no one has to subject you that you must pay it within a given period in a month. If you desire to give a tenth of what you have to God as a choice, go ahead. But if you cannot make it up to that, let no man subject you into giving up to such amount..

Barnabaseloka:

Thanks for your comment,but let me clarify this more.
1. I think we misunderstand something here. When we talk of tithe, we view it from two perspectives: tithe as a law and tithe as a free-will offering. Tithe simply means one-tenth. Actually, tithing (giving one-tenth) did not start from the Israelites. People still give one-tenth (tithe) of what they have to God.
Our concern is whether Christians are expected to tithe (give one-tenth) as a law (command) or as a free-will giving. One can decide within oneself to give a tenth (tithe) of one's income to God, if one is led by the Holy Spirit to do so. It is not a command that one must give one-tenth (tithe) of one's possession at a stipulated period of time (every month, week or two weeks). Giving is as one decides in one's heart (whether one-tenth or not). It is not that one must (under a command) give one-tenth of one's income as we see today being preached in churches. So tithing (giving one-tenth) of one's income still exists today but not as a command but a choice.

2. God has given us free-will to obey what he commands us to do or not to obey. He will not force any man to obey his commands. The Israelites were commanded by God (as a law) to tithe according to the laid-down guidelines concerning these tithes. Tithe (as a law) was not just done in one way but in different ways and in different chosen times and places (Deut.14:22-29). All the laws given to Moses were commands from God which the Israelites should keep. It is left for any Israelite to keep them or not, b/c it is not by force, yet a command. Disobedience to such commands attracted punishment from God to the Israelites, including payment of tithes. It was due to their disobedience that God rebuked them in Malachi.

There was no such command (or law) given to Abraham to tithe (give one-tenth) of his possession. As such, no consequence would have come to him if he decided not to give one-tenth of what he had. Abraham could have given less than or more than what he gave. It was of his own choice to give one-tenth and would not be punished even if he did not give at all.

Why do tithers give one-tenth (tithe) of their income at stipulated periods of time? Are they not trying to follow the law as the Israelites did? Free-will offering or giving for Christians is not bound to be one-tenth, but what one decides to give (whether one-tenth or not).
On the otherhand, if one promises God a tenth of one's income at a stipulated time (every month or every two months or every year), such agreement is between the person and God. It is called VOW. it has nothing to do with the one-tenth people are subjected to pay every month in churches today.

openmine:

ohh am sorry so how do u explain Malachi 3:10-12 as been preached by ur likes as punishment for not tithing...as for john 13:34,a new command was given,unfortunately u Neva understood dat scripture or failed 2 see d part where he said "love as I loved u"..so my question sud b how did Jesus show love dem in john 13:34?
was his love dat of force or a willing heart?
was there any form of intimidation on his part?..dat kind of love is simply hard 2 force on sum one...nice try but Dats had nothing 2 do wit tithes...
ohh sorry u sud have told me 2 break down my English vocab so u cud comprehend dat a punishment was given 2 dose who refused 2 tithe according 2 d mosaic law..

NumberOne2:
There is too much hypocrisy about this tithing. Ok, you say tithing is OLD testament. In the NEW testament, early disciples gave ALL (selling lands and houses) and shared with other brethren in need. Why is this not being practiced today?

openmine:

Dats simple because most Christians r greedy and self-centered... I know of a wealthy guy who leaves home every Sunday 2 pay tithes in millions... but he has a beggar just close 2 his house and has Neva deemed it fit 2 offer dat beggar alms or some tin beta...d truth is according 2 d promises of God tru Abraham,we r not only blessed but a blessing 2 our world...

NumberOne2:


I NEVER quoted Malachi, it is you that did. I NEVER said God will punish non tither.
There is too much hypocrisy about this tithing. You are children of Abraham but not tithers like him. I see. Abrahams blessing are yours but not his tithes (its old testament). Perhaps you should use only NEW testament bible since OLD testament is for the JEWS.

You and your non tithing colleagues say tithing is OLD testament. In the NEW testament, early disciples gave ALL (selling lands and houses) and shared with other brethren in need. Why is this not being practiced today?

NumberOne2:
I will tell you why. Jesus said if you are faithful in little, you will be faithful in MUCH.
How can a man who CANNOT give 10% ever give 100%? Its impossible. If a christian cannot tithe, he/she cannot give all?

NumberOne2:
I will tell you why. Jesus said if you are faithful in little, you will be faithful in MUCH.
How can a man who CANNOT give 10% ever give 100%? Its impossible. If a christian cannot tithe, he/she cannot give all?

NumberOne2:


Your speech is too generic and you are judging that brother (which is wrong). You know you are a Christian also so do you fall into this GREEDY and SELF-CENTERED category or have you given your ALL? This is a personal thing now. Its easy to point at others, how about YOU?

NOTE: That tithing brother will be so blessed according to Malachi 3. If he wasnt being blessed, he would have stopped tithing. He need to be taught that giving to the poor is like lending to God. God will Himself repay.
"He that hath pity upon the poor lendeth unto the LORD; and that which he hath given will he pay him again." - Proverbs 19:17

NumberOne2:



Your statements are too sentimental for me to reply properly.
I have made reference to several scriptures but you have none except emotional outburst.

"For God so loved the world, that he GAVE his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life." - John 3:16
Proof of love is in giving. You love God, where is your proof?
You love your wife so you give to her. Just keep telling her about love and not doing anything and see how long that marriage will last. Love talk is cheap.

brocab:

The only proof I can give you how does one love the Lord? When Jesus said give, He talks about seeking His kingdom, seeking His written word and truth, studying, searching, finding the truth about Him, this is the giving the Lord wants from His people, He is blessed, as we are blessed, Jesus wants us to know Him more, becoming closer to Him, having a relationship with Him. This is the proof I only need, to show I love the Lord.
It sounds strange saying I love the Lord, without personally knowing the Man?

NumberOne2:


I NEVER quoted Malachi, it is you that did. I NEVER said God will punish non tither.
There is too much hypocrisy about this tithing. You are children of Abraham but not tithers like him. I see. Abrahams blessing are yours but not his tithes (its old testament). Perhaps you should use only NEW testament bible since OLD testament is for the JEWS.

You and your non tithing colleagues say tithing is OLD testament. In the NEW testament, early disciples gave ALL (selling lands and houses) and shared with other brethren in need. Why is this not being practiced today?

zodiakzax:
pls read malachi 3 From verse 9 and you would see that God said the Jews were cursed with a curse because they profaned the old covenant(malachi 2) and they robbed God out of tithing and ordinance offerings. You people only manipulate the scriptures, you only quote what you want others to read. Plus if you have not giving your all to Lord doesn't mean others have not. The Lord told us to deny ourself and carry our cross and follow Him, maybe you don't understand this. No one is perfect here, we are all trying to walk with our Lord Jesus Christ and when we get to that maturity in Him, we would let go of all including oursleves in order to gain Christ. So it practiced today my friend.

openmine:

bro u r rite but pls don't bother urself dat much trying 2 explain 2 him...noticed he is not straightforward about his stand...first he said tithes predates d law as Abraham did his tithe b4 d law,den he runs 2 d old covenant 2 claim d blessings and directive of a tither of d mosaic law,wen he has been upended and boxed,he turns around claiming dat we non-tithers don't give,or give like d early Christians did...Haba can't he just take a stand and follow it 2 d end,wat concerns him wit whether Christians who don't pay tithes give or not give...?

NumberOne2:


"But whoso hath this world's good (wealth), and seeth his brother have need, and shutteth up his bowels of compassion from him, how dwelleth the love of God in him?
My little children, let us not love in word, neither in tongue; but in deed and in truth." - 1 John 3:17-18

NumberOne2:
These are the issues:
1) Malachi 3 makes promises to the tither. "rebuking the devourer and opening windows of heaven".
If a Christian (non Jew) tithes and holds on to that promise, does it mean it will NOT work cos it was for the JEWS?
2) If Abraham (non Jew) tithed and we as Christians are children of Abraham, what stops us from following his steps of faith?
3) The fact remains, Jesus or any Apostle (Jews and non Jews alike) never abolished tithing. Early disciples even went beyond tithing and gave all. Why is this not practiced today by the so called NEW conventant Christians?

When you answer these, you will begin to see the inconsistency in Non Tithing. Non tithing is an assumed position, there is NO fact about it in the Bible.

NumberOne2:
These are the issues:
1) Malachi 3 makes promises to the tither. "rebuking the devourer and opening windows of heaven".
If a Christian (non Jew) tithes and holds on to that promise, does it mean it will NOT work cos it was for the JEWS?

30 “A tenth of all crops belongs to the Lord. This means the crops from fields and the fruit from trees—a tenth belongs to the Lord. 31 So if you want to get back your tenth, you must add one-fifth to its price and then buy it back.

32 “The priests will take every tenth animal from a person’s cattle or sheep. Every tenth animal will belong to the Lord. 33 The owner should not worry if the chosen animal is good or bad or change the animal for another animal. If this happens, both animals will belong to the Lord. That animal cannot be bought back.”

34 These are the commands that the Lord gave Moses at Mount Sinai for the Israelites.
(lev 27:30-34

Now we know that whatever the law says, it says to those who are under the law, so that every mouth may be silenced and the whole world held accountable to God. Romans 3:19

NumberOne2:
2) If Abraham (non Jew) tithed and we as Christians are children of Abraham, what stops us from following his steps of faith?

NumberOne2:
3) The fact remains, Jesus or any Apostle (Jews and non Jews alike) never abolished tithing. Early disciples even went beyond tithing and gave all. Why is this not practiced today by the so called NEW conventant Christians?

for christ is the end of the law to them that believe Romans 10:4

23 Before the coming of this faith, we were held in custody under the law, locked up until the faith that was to come would be revealed. 24 So the law was our guardian until Christ came that we might be justified by faith. 25 Now that this faith has come, we are no longer under a guardian of the law

26 So in Christ Jesus you are all children of God through faith, 27 for all of you who were baptized into Christ have clothed yourselves with Christ. 28 There is neither Jew nor Gentile, neither slave nor free, nor is there male and female, for you are all one in Christ Jesus. 29 If you belong to Christ, then you are Abraham’s seed, and heirs according to the promise ....Galatians 3:23-29

Each of you should give what you have decided in your heart to give, not reluctantly or under compulsion, for God loves a cheerful giver. 2 corinthians 9:7

32 All the believers were one in heart and mind. No one claimed that any of their possessions was their own, but they shared everything they had. 33 With great power the apostles continued to testify to the resurrection of the Lord Jesus. And God’s grace was so powerfully at work in them all 34 that there were no needy persons among them. For from time to time those who owned land or houses sold them, brought the money from the sales 35 and put it at the apostles’ feet, and it was distributed to anyone who had need. Acts 4:32-35

NumberOne2:
When you answer these, you will begin to see the inconsistency in Non Tithing. Non tithing is an assumed position, there is NO fact about it in the Bible.

NumberOne2:
Maybe I have not been clear enough. You see, there is a BIG difference between Abraham tithing and the law of Moses.
The Israelites were obligated or commanded to because Jacob (Isreal) vowed to tithe. see scripture below:

"And Jacob vowed a vow, saying, If God will be with me, and will keep me in this way that I go, and will give me bread to eat, and raiment to put on,
So that I come again to my father's house in peace; then shall the LORD be my God:
And this stone, which I have set for a pillar, shall be God's house: and of all that thou shalt give me I will surely give the tenth unto thee." - Genesis 28:20-22

You call it spoils of war, but it was Abrahams legitimate property.
He was a man of the spirit and saw the need (not force as I have always state) to tithe to the King of Salem who Paul explained in Hebrews. (This is why I tithe).
I tithe as a seed of Abraham NOT as a Jew (Abraham was NOT a Jew). This is why I had not mentioned Malachi 3 until you brought it up.

PS: You keep missing my point because you are comparing me with Pastors that insist on tithing by force. I have share with you a deep personal revelation. Kindly meditate on it.

NumberOne2:
Maybe I have not been clear enough. You see, there is a BIG difference between Abraham tithing and the law of Moses.
The Israelites were obligated or commanded to because Jacob (Isreal) vowed to tithe. see scripture below:

"And Jacob vowed a vow, saying, If God will be with me, and will keep me in this way that I go, and will give me bread to eat, and raiment to put on,
So that I come again to my father's house in peace; then shall the LORD be my God:
And this stone, which I have set for a pillar, shall be God's house: and of all that thou shalt give me I will surely give the tenth unto thee." - Genesis 28:20-22

You call it spoils of war, but it was Abrahams legitimate property.
He was a man of the spirit and saw the need (not force as I have always state) to tithe to the King of Salem who Paul explained in Hebrews. (This is why I tithe).
I tithe as a seed of Abraham NOT as a Jew (Abraham was NOT a Jew). This is why I had not mentioned Malachi 3 until you brought it up.

PS: You keep missing my point because you are comparing me with Pastors that insist on tithing by force. I have share with you a deep personal revelation. Kindly meditate on it.

NumberOne2:
Maybe I have not been clear enough. You see, there is a BIG difference between Abraham tithing and the law of Moses.

NumberOne2:
The Israelites were obligated or commanded to because Jacob (Isreal) vowed to tithe.

NumberOne2:

see scripture below:

[i]"And Jacob vowed a vow, saying, If God will be with me, and will keep me in this way that I go, and will give me bread to eat, and raiment to put on,
So that I come again to my father's house in peace; then shall the LORD be my God:
And this stone, which I have set for a pillar, shall be God's house: and of all that thou shalt give me I will surely give the tenth unto thee." - Genesis 28:20-22

NumberOne2:
You call it spoils of war, but it was Abrahams legitimate property.

NumberOne2:
He was a man of the spirit and saw the need (not force as I have always state) to tithe to the King of Salem who Paul explained in Hebrews. (This is why I tithe).

NumberOne2:
I tithe as a seed of Abraham NOT as a Jew (Abraham was NOT a Jew). This is why I had not mentioned Malachi 3 until you brought it up.

NumberOne2:
PS: You keep missing my point because you are comparing me with Pastors that insist on tithing by force.

NumberOne2:
I have share with you a deep personal revelation. Kindly meditate on it.

MrPristine:


Is there any biblical injunction to tithe as a seed of Abraham or is it your own self made doctrine

I tithe AS A seed of Abraham NOT as a Jew (Abraham was NOT a Jew). This is why I had not mentioned Malachi 3 until you brought it up

openmine:

Pls let me be clear with you...which spirit are you talking about? The spirit of God which is the holy spirit? or abraham's own spirit?
please don't confuse urself ohhh...Christ promised his disciples the holy spirit as their comforter after he ascended into heaven...

openmine:

It was after his resurrection dat d law no longer held sway..Christ became a high priest by nullifying d laws of moses and that happened after his death and resurrection..not before...ok?

for christ is the end of the law to them that believe Romans 10:4

NumberOne2:
As always (and I am getting tired of), English translation and comprehension has been the reason for this lenghty thread.

When I said,
did I say, I tithe TO BE as seed of Abraham? Why dont you read my comments properly.

If I pay tax AS A Nigerian, am I paying tax TO BE a Nigerian? What is it?

TO THE BIBLE: I say again, the spoils of war were Abrahams legit property. If not, will he TITHE on someone elses goods. Even the King of Sodom knew this (highlighted in BOLD below). It was Abraham that CHOSE TO RETURN those things back for personal reasons.

"And the king of Sodom said unto Abram, Give me the persons, and take the goods to thyself.
And Abram said to the king of Sodom, I have lift up mine hand unto the LORD, the most high God, the possessor of heaven and earth,
That I will not take from a thread even to a shoelatchet, and that I will not take any thing that is thine, lest thou shouldest say, I have made Abram rich:" - Genesis14:21-23


To your comments about Abraham being in the spirit, the Spirit of God (before Jesus came) did come upon men in those days. Read about Samson, David and others too many in the OLD TESTAMENT.


This is irrelivant. Tithing PRECEEDED the Law. I have showed you this in Abraham. Abraham WAS NOT under the LAW. He was NOT a JEW.


So far, I am yet to be convinced that tithing AS A (NOT TO BE) seed of Abraham is wrong or OLD testament cos Abraham was NOT a JEW.

To the OP, tithing is relevant in the NEW convenant. However, the NEW convenant even goes beyond tithing to giving ALL (only if you can). All should be done WILLINGLY not BY FORCE. God sees the heart. He doesn't really need your goods or money. Its just a way of putting God first even in your finances.