rabcnesbit:
Good day house. So my quest for a septic tank and soak-away continues. Size of septic tank is (10ft x 8ft x 10ft) and soak-away is (7ft x 7ft x 6ft). Location is Sango Ota, Ogun State.

Digging – already done for N70k after hard bargaining.

Quote from bricklayer work: 1 lorry (20 tons) of sharp sand = N65k. 400 pcs of 9” blocks at N190/pc = N76k. Labour (includes setting blocks, plastering and casting) = N80k. Total = N221,000.

Quote from Welder: 12lengths (39ft) of 16mm N3,500/length = N42,000. 17 lengths (39ft) of 12mm at N2,000/length = N34,000. 7 lengths of 10mm N1,500/length = N10,500, binding wire = N2,000 labour = N8,000. Total = N96,500

Quote from Carpenter: 2 x 3 plank of 11 pcs at N500/pc = N5,500. Somi-wood 23 pcs at N1300/pc = N29,900. Nails 2 inches = N3000, 3 inches = N3000. Labour = N18, 000. Total = N59,400

Grand Total = (70k + 221k + 96.5k + 59.4k) = N446,900 Is this a reasonable amount for constructing a ST and SA of the aforementioned size! Cement, soft sand and granite not included as I have some of these already. Thank you

Aaaah!
They have killed this Client!

diordaves:


To be honest with you, the quote is good. I only have problem with the digging cost. Is Ota that rocky? 40k would do but you never know. But I think it's a good quote.

The quote is not good at all!

1.) Client is not building in a swampy area and as such, his septic tank need not be concrete all the way.
he can set it with Blocks and used Colums/Beams to reinforce it for added strength. Egun has given a pointer to laying cost and we know how much Blco is sold.

2.) With the chosen size and the Client having Sand, granite and Cement on ground already, why on earth does he need half-a-million Naira to do that size of septic tank?

3.) Did you notice that even at that, the bricklayer is asking for 20Tons of SAND?

Twenty Tons of sand, for christ sake!, when it is not that he wants to do Decking!

Anyway, what do l know.

NB: I dont recall who owns the attached pix but they are not mine.

AZUH:
omo I'm now a case study because of bad contractors ,I don't think my house will collapse , because there linter beam and paravet beam as well . This guys wan use fear kill me . I build that house with many money . More than 15m now.

Dont worry Azuh, it was all done in good humor.
I am sure you have also learned a lot, along the line and wont allow the same mistakes to be repeated!.
Remember that at a time, it was Egun (Chicken Coop, today Egun's Garage is looking very beautiful), and then back2sender and then so many other builder-clients like that.
Dont think you were singled-out because nobody has anything personal against you.

And Yes, your house wont collapse. You have good Columns.
You only need to take special steps to avoid water ingress and l hope you are not in nay area prone to flooding?

spyder880:


Thank you Sir, I actually played the stock market heavily in 2004-2009. One of the sweetest feelings in this world, is having to open your mailbox to collect cheques sent from your companies. I was heavily invested in so many good stocks, and a few worthless companies. I sold out about 80% of my holdings when Sanusi arrived with his policies which aimed at killing investments. Used the funds realised to build houses.

My target this year is a more diversified portfolio of investments. I am looking at returning some funds to the stock market while increasing my holdings on lands. A new estate in Awka is on my mind. I also plan to start the production of something since I have free lands in many locations. Agricultural products, building material and any other type of products needed daily in Nigeria. May GOD bless us all.

My brother you are one of the lucky ones. Those same stock you are talking about, I have some of them back when they were less than N1 then. Around that period of time you mention, I and my of my friends invested some good money in it. Many of them as we speak today became worthless paper. I can see you posted some of GT receipt, GT was not that bad. I remember when First Bank thumbled, all I saw was a decrease in value and increase of share numbers. One thing I can't not really understand is the recent system of linking Bank accounts to dividends, it has not been successful for me. Even when I instructed my account manger to link some of the dividends to my account. I do not have the luxury to go to those registrar office that scatter all over when I came around because of my limited time, to consolidate the accounts. I have not received any dividend in the last 14 years. I hope I have time one day to go and consolidate all those dividends to see if they have not turned into worthless paper again.

kopell:
My brother you are one of the lucky ones. Those same stock you are talking about, I have some of them back when they were less than N1 then. Around that period of time you mention, I and my of my friends invested some good money in it. Many of them as we speak today became worthless paper. I can see you posted some of GT receipt, GT was not that bad. I remember when First Bank thumbled, all I saw was a decrease in value and increase of share numbers. One thing I can't not really understand is the recent system of linking Bank accounts to dividends, it has not been successful for me. Even when I instructed my account manger to link some of the dividends to my account. I do not have the luxury to go to those registrar office that scatter all over when I came around because of my limited time, to consolidate the accounts. I have not received any dividend in the last 14 years. I hope I have time one day to go and consolidate all those dividends to see if they have not turned into worthless paper again.

Find time when you are back to engage the services of a stock booking firm ,your dividend payments issues will be sorted out by them into one consolidated account

diordaves and Daboomb, thank you for your advice. I appreciate it. Any suggestions what I should aim for in terms of materials and labour cost?

Daboomb:


Dont worry Azuh, it was all done in good humor.
I am sure you have also learned a lot, along the line and wont allow the same mistakes to be repeated!.
Remember that at a time, it was Egun (Chicken Coop, today Egun's Garage is looking very beautiful), and then back2sender and then so many other builder-clients like that.
Dont think you were singled-out because nobody has anything personal against you.

And Yes, your house wont collapse. You have good Columns.
You only need to take special steps to avoid water ingress and l hope you are not in nay area prone to flooding?

heart you bro . Yes linter , paravet . Can I use bricks all round? Will that help help to keep foundation going ?

rabcnesbit:
diordaves and Daboomb, thank you for your advice. I appreciate it. Any suggestions what I should aim for in terms of materials and labour cost?

With quotes like this, you don't have to worry about the materials. What you need to worry about is the labour cost. Whatever quantity of materials quoted for, just make sure the same quantity is delivered to site and used accordingly after payment is made. Artisans and contractors will always quote for materials and end up not using all the quantity quoted for. So don't worry about quantity.

Now labour:

Digging - I will settle for 40K max. 70k is high but you never know.

Bricklayer - 80k should cut it. Mind you, this also includes casting. Casting is a separate quote not done by bricklayer; casting is done by tappers which needs specialist knowledge and could be expensive in their own right. It is possible that 6 columns are going to be cast and then beamed round. Sometimes, we homeowners tend to over look the work and specialist knowledge involve and under price. Is it possible to do less than 80K labour cost? yes. But 80K for blinding, bricklaying, casting, plastering, decking including manhole cover is not bad.

Welder - 8k for tying of the columns and basket is good unless you want to do this for free.

Carpenter - 18k, I would give the bricklayer 3k or even 5k sef instead of the carpenter. The bricklayer or tapper can do the job of the carpenter on this occasion. Soakaway is not an elaborate carpentry work the bricklayer can't do.

The reality is you may not use all the materials quoted if all the quoted materials are delivered to site as quoted.

It is a good quote; just keep your eyes on your materials and the quality of job done.

spyder880:


Thank you Sir, I actually played the stock market heavily in 2004-2009. One of the sweetest feelings in this world, is having to open your mailbox to collect cheques sent from your companies. I was heavily invested in so many good stocks, and a few worthless companies. I sold out about 80% of my holdings when Sanusi arrived with his policies which aimed at killing investments. Used the funds realised to build houses.

My target this year is a more diversified portfolio of investments. I am looking at returning some funds to the stock market while increasing my holdings on lands. A new estate in Awka is on my mind. I also plan to start the production of something since I have free lands in many locations. Agricultural products, building material and any other type of products needed daily in Nigeria. May GOD bless us all.

diordaves:


With quotes like this, you don't have to worry about the materials. What you need to worry about is the labour cost. Whatever quantity of materials quoted for, just make sure the same quantity is delivered to site and used accordingly after payment is made. Artisans and contractors will always quote for materials and end up not using all the quantity quoted for. So don't worry about quantity.

Now labour:

Digging - I will settle for 40K max. 70k is high but you never know.

Bricklayer - 80k should cut it. Mind you, this also includes casting. Casting is a separate quote not done by bricklayer; casting is done by tappers which needs specialist knowledge and could be expensive in their own right. It is possible that 6 columns are going to be cast and then beamed round. Sometimes, we homeowners tend to over look the work and specialist knowledge involve and under price. Is it possible to do less than 80K labour cost? yes. But 80K for blinding, bricklaying, casting, plastering, decking including manhole cover is not bad.

Welder - 8k for tying of the columns and basket is good unless you want to do this for free.

Carpenter - 18k, I would give the bricklayer 3k or even 5k sef instead of the carpenter. The bricklayer or tapper can do the job of the carpenter on this occasion. Soakaway is not an elaborate carpentry work the bricklayer can't do.

The reality is you may not use all the materials quoted if all the quoted materials are delivered to site as quoted.

It is a good quote; just keep your eyes on your materials and the quality of job done.

The bold is not advisable
The slab & the slab beam formwork should be done by a carpenter to maintain some level of accuracy. Bricklayer will deliver a shoddy job.

diordaves:


With quotes like this, you don't have to worry about the materials. What you need to worry about is the labour cost. Whatever quantity of materials quoted for, just make sure the same quantity is delivered to site and used accordingly after payment is made. Artisans and contractors will always quote for materials and end up not using all the quantity quoted for. So don't worry about quantity.

Now labour:

Digging - I will settle for 40K max. 70k is high but you never know.

Bricklayer - 80k should cut it. Mind you, this also includes casting. Casting is a separate quote not done by bricklayer; casting is done by tappers which needs specialist knowledge and could be expensive in their own right. It is possible that 6 columns are going to be cast and then beamed round. Sometimes, we homeowners tend to over look the work and specialist knowledge involve and under price. Is it possible to do less than 80K labour cost? yes. But 80K for blinding, bricklaying, casting, plastering, decking including manhole cover is not bad.

Welder - 8k for tying of the columns and basket is good unless you want to do this for free.

Carpenter - 18k, I would give the bricklayer 3k or even 5k sef instead of the carpenter. The bricklayer or tapper can do the job of the carpenter on this occasion. Soakaway is not an elaborate carpentry work the bricklayer can't do.

The reality is you may not use all the materials quoted if all the quoted materials are delivered to site as quoted.

It is a good quote; just keep your eyes on your materials and the quality of job done.

Columns for soakaway/septic tanks does not require baskets.
The mason man along side his labour can handle the casting work.
The same amount to pay the carpenter is same for the iron works since both jobs requires 2 days and payment can be done based on per day rates but one can bargain less if the mason is better experienced to handle the construction all by himself.

bixton:


Columns for soakaway/septic tanks does not require baskets.
The mason man along side his labour can handle the casting work.
The same amount to pay the carpenter is same for the iron works since both jobs requires 2 days and payment can be done based on per day rates but one can bargain less if the mason is better experienced to handle the construction all by himself.

@bold...So sir u have constructed columns without baskets?

Rubbiish:

@bold...So sir u have constructed columns without baskets?

With regarding to soakaway/septic tanks construction; Yes.

bixton:


With regarding to soakaway/septic tanks construction; Yes.

Regardless of the type of construction, there must be a basket, there must be a platform the column reinforcement is resting on. The basket maybe small, but there should be basket. I might be wrong though, just talking from what i ve seen. Engineers in the house can throw more light on this.

Rubbiish:

@bold...So sir u have constructed columns without baskets?

This is my biggest issue with buying used houses.

You can never tell how it was constructed. I'm not an Engineer but would never allow any columns to be constructed on my site without a basket.

bixton:


Columns for soakaway/septic tanks does not require baskets.
The mason man along side his labour can handle the casting work.
The same amount to pay the carpenter is same for the iron works since both jobs requires 2 days and payment can be done based on per day rates but one can bargain less if the mason is better experienced to handle the construction all by himself.

Omo, ALL column settings need basket wether soakaway or upstairs. The basket is to spread the load. Placing columns without basket is like placing a pin on the ground, apply pressure and the pin will sink into the ground.

diordaves:


Omo, ALL column settings need basket wether soakaway or upstairs. The basket is to spread the load. Placing columns without basket is like placing a pin on the ground, apply pressure and the pin will sink into the ground.

Given that so you introduce baskets as base supports for columns when used for bungalows?
Any ways let anyone come up with a pix ?

bixton:


Given that so you introduce baskets as base supports for columns when used for bungalows?
Any ways let anyone come up with a pix ?

The fact that you have done soakaway columns without basket doesn't mean it's right. Mind you, basket and columns are not two separate things. They go together. Columns without basket is cutting corners. It's not best practice.

diordaves:


The fact that you have done soakaway columns without basket doesn't mean it's right. Mind you, basket and columns are not two separate things. They go together. Columns without basket is cutting corners. It's not best practice.

I will take it that you do that for bungalows thereby not cutting corners.
Thanks.
It's a learning process.

diordaves:


The fact that you have done soakaway columns without basket doesn't mean it's right. Mind you, basket and columns are not two separate things. They go together. Columns without basket is cutting corners. It's not best practice.

We need pictures of these baskets o. Abeg. make we learn.

folmus:


We need pictures of these baskets o. Abeg. make we learn.

Take note of the "mat" on the floor; that's the basket. So the basket is a part of the column. You don't stick s column without the mat: basket.

diordaves:


Take note of the "mat" on the floor; that's the basket. So the basket is a part of the column. You don't stick s column without the mat: basket.

is this building a bungalow?

Mup4life:
is this building a bungalow?

It may not be a bungalow. What has bungalow to do?

diordaves:


It may not be a bungalow. What has bungalow to do?

The arguement up there was about the exclusion of baskets from the septic tank, if you can build bungalows without baskets you can definitely build septic tanks without it also.

I have not seen foundation of bungalows on a solid ground employ baskets for columns unless you have pics to prove otherwise.

Mup4life:
is this building a bungalow?

It doesn’t matter.

The only difference is that the size of steel used, the number of steel used and the size of the basket changes with the size of the building.

EgunMogaji:


It doesn’t matter.

The only difference is that the size of steel used, the number of steel used and the size of the basket changes with the size of the building.

I didn't use basket for my own build.. they only blind the floor and use block straight up.. maybe because it's a solid groubd. It's for 3 bedroom flat though

Mup4life:
The arguement up there was about the exclusion of baskets from the septic tank, if you can build bungalows without baskets you can definitely build septic tanks without it also.

I have not seen foundation of bungalows on a solid ground employ baskets for columns unless you have pics to prove otherwise.

All the columns on my bungalow have baskets.

My septic tank has baskets.

twinskenny:


I didn't use basket for my own build.. they only blind the floor and use block straight up.. maybe because it's a solid groubd. It's for 3 bedroom flat though

This is always the disclaimer from at least Spyder880, each build is different and a professional should be involved in deciding the type of foundation to be used.

All of those ile alamo that are still standing were built without steel columns/baskets.

This is also the reason why I built a bungalow.

The system I’m used to will have the government ensuring that building codes are met at each step of the way.

The city will not issue a building permit until the arch drawings are approved which will include structural engineering, etc this will take weeks to months.

Then at various stages their will be mandatory site inspections to ensure code.

Before you pour concrete they’ll come and inspect your rebar work, if you pour concrete before inspection by mistake then you’ll have to take it apart and do it all over.

We need to try to do things properly. I don’t know your site or the decision not to do columns, maybe your specific condition as you said, but we should encourage each other to do the right things.

One of my most memorable reads on here was one that Skimanski wrote. He said he was called to do some work in one of those Lekki luxury slums (my word) and he couldn’t wait to run out of the building because it was so unsafe.

EgunMogaji:


I’ll look up my receipt when I get out of bed.

I used Nigerian tile throughout my project.

Thanks... I'm expecting

Any one with pictures kindly post them: building basket /columns for soakaway.

It would be easier if anyone can upload the design plan for the soakaway he did for those who have detailed designs.

On a thread on someone's build I did not see columns used on your soakaway since your people refused to put them but instead used concrete to fill up block holes.

Mup4life:
The arguement up there was about the exclusion of baskets from the septic tank, if you can build bungalows without baskets you can definitely build septic tanks without it also.

I have not seen foundation of bungalows on a solid ground employ baskets for columns unless you have pics to prove otherwise.

You can build cars without tyres, you can build soakaway without columns. In fact, you can do anything in anyway you like. But the question remains: Is that the proper and best way? Cutting corners in the Nigerian building sector has so eaten deep into the system that an abnormality like columns without square footing (basket) is now viewed by folks like you as normal. It's sad though.

Look, all columns should have a square footing which we call basket in Nigeria. As Egunmogaji has said, the expected load should determine the size of the square footing. See pix attached, that's for a small project for signpost with basket.