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An Expatriate’s Email From Nigeria - Politics (3) - Nairaland

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Re: An Expatriate’s Email From Nigeria by ThiefOfHearts(f): 6:36pm On May 04, 2009
[QUOTE]I was talking to one of our Project Managers (an American) the other day. Irritating man to say the least.
He has two official cars - A Prado and an Avensis, gets paid almost $20,000 after tax every month and everything down to his laundry detergent is bought for him and his family and yet he claims he feels "unwelcome here". In fact, just last week, he still said he should be more welcome and exonerated here because he protested African liberty and freedom on the streets on New York in his hay days[/QUOTE]

Lmao. You actually let this person talk? too funny. The fact that he's from NY where "we're" known for spitting on people yet he still complains about feeling "unwelcomed" in Naija seriously cracks me up
Re: An Expatriate’s Email From Nigeria by AjanleKoko: 6:38pm On May 04, 2009
No need to get all het up about our German friend's email.
I'm curious though. Don't our diasporean friends want us to debate the email?  Let's see if there are any truths we can garner about ourselves? You know, it may just be possible, maybe the guy is making a lot of good points about us, that we can learn from? angry You know, like we build our houses with sand and all that? Maybe we can start using wood like the rest of the developed world?
I mean, we can forget who made the comment, let's look at the content of what he's saying, etc, etc. . .? Diasporeans, help!
Re: An Expatriate’s Email From Nigeria by ThiefOfHearts(f): 6:39pm On May 04, 2009
Again one can argue that this is due to "fear of johnny foreigner" approach that have become synonymous with certain aspect of their culture here. How many food of international origin have cross appeal in the British menu? You can count everyone of em on one hand - Chinese and Indian.

Add Ethopian.
Re: An Expatriate’s Email From Nigeria by ElRazur: 6:40pm On May 04, 2009
4 Play:

It then appeals to which people: The Asian community, the Eastern Europeans, Caribbeans?

My observation is that a cross-cultural appeal is non-existent. Yours is that a cross-cultural appeal exists and you think a ''fair way'' to exchange ideas is for me to establish non-existence as much as you establish existence. Bizarre.

Look, I really cannot be drawn into a lengthy debate here. The Nigerian food have cross appeal, whether you take it or not. The hundreds of Nigerian eateries around here in London alone highlights that. Or are these restaurants serve Nigerians and just Nigerian only.

Several food that is common with the Yoruba culture is common in Cameroon too. A good examples of these are Fufu, Garri and boiled cassava. All of these foods are eaten on a regular basis in neighbouring Cameroon. [under a different name] That alone defeats your point of non-cultural appeal blah blah blah.

As for your last paragraph, you seem to have been dismissal of everyone who have come in here to tell you one way or the other that our food do have cross-appeal. Yet, it is obvious for everyone to see that your point are not in anyway a fact, but the same "anecdotal" you are labelling the view of others. Hence why I asked you if that is a fair way of debating.
Re: An Expatriate’s Email From Nigeria by Akpangbon: 9:50am On May 05, 2009
the same stupid people everywhere.
Re: An Expatriate’s Email From Nigeria by spikedcylinder: 9:57am On May 05, 2009
ThiefOfHearts:

Lmao. You actually let this person talk? too funny. The fact that he's from NY where "we're" known for spitting on people yet he still complains about feeling "unwelcomed" in Naija seriously cracks me up

Dude actually reels people into convos with his loud voice. His comments were so ridiculous, I cannot count how many "you don't says" I interjected with.
Re: An Expatriate’s Email From Nigeria by agabaI23(m): 10:23am On May 05, 2009
AjanleKoko:

No need to get all het up about our German friend's email.
I'm curious though. Don't our diasporean friends want us to debate the email? Let's see if there are any truths we can garner about ourselves? You know, it may just be possible, maybe the guy is making a lot of good points about us, that we can learn from? angry You know, like we build our houses with sand and all that? Maybe we can start using wood like the rest of the developed world?
I mean, we can forget who made the comment, let's look at the content of what he's saying, etc, etc. . .? Diasporeans, help!

I am not an engineer, using wood and sand in a tropical climate, which one is more beneficial considering the seating heat we find ourselves in?
Re: An Expatriate’s Email From Nigeria by Hauwa1: 10:47am On May 05, 2009
if a foreigner is intro to our stockfish and dried fish the very first time, that's the end of trying our food grin yet the puzzling thing is the stockfish is from somewhere in europe (norway right).

they will be willing to try frog and octopus than our snail stew, their killing burgers to our eba and okra soup etc. oh well undecided
Re: An Expatriate’s Email From Nigeria by AjanleKoko: 11:12am On May 05, 2009
agabaI23:

I am not an engineer, using wood and sand in a tropical climate, which one is more beneficial considering the seating heat we find ourselves in?

bros, I was just being sarcastic. We don't actually use sand alone to build our houses, we use concrete abi.
The guy is just an illiterate German talking total nonsense. I'm surprised a lot of our patriots have not picked any 'useful' advice to suggest to Nigerians, so we can change our bad ways and be more likeable to this German idiot.
Re: An Expatriate’s Email From Nigeria by agabaI23(m): 11:14am On May 05, 2009
AjanleKoko:

bros, I was just being sarcastic. We don't actually use sand alone to build our houses, we use concrete abi.
The guy is just an illiterate German talking total nonsense. I'm surprised a lot of our patriots have not picked any 'useful' advice to suggest to Nigerians, so we can change our bad ways and be more likeable to this German idiot.
my bad. I felt the sarcasm but I was not too sure lol
Re: An Expatriate’s Email From Nigeria by Lagosboy: 12:00pm On May 05, 2009
The idiotic thing about this german slowpoke is “Nigerians are dirty and the food is poison” how can any intelligent person generalise a people in such a demeaning manner. Why hasn’t the food kill the 150 million people in the country.

I care less abt his comments about Nigerian women because even Nigerians here that go back say the same things like the naija girls are now as cheap as pure water.

His comments about politicians is also true as some of these thieving politicians travel abroad but lack the necessary exposure and still suffer from complex and dats is why they wud pay to get these guys to their party. I don’t think this german guy worked in Lagos though as I don’t think any lagos politician will pay the dirty german to attend his party.
Re: An Expatriate’s Email From Nigeria by grafikdon: 12:07pm On May 05, 2009
Kobojunkie:

I am not too sure of that. I have yet to meet any non-nigerian, even non-Nigerian africans, who swears by/loves Nigerian food. I never really gave much thought to it until now. I know ghanians and some camerounians who love our movies but I can't say they love our food. lol



I have a Trini friend who swears by Okra soup (without the akpu and fufu  grin), she just eats with spoon. here is a Jamaican friend who swears by moi moi. However. . .(yeah u didn't see that coming  grin) There is a Jewish dude who thinks breadfruit stinks like a dead horse  shocked shocked and a Japanese-American dude who thinks breadfruit tastes like, well. . . a ''freaking Nigerian food'' (not a compliment) cry

I think we may need to ''love-vendor'' our food to attain the so-called cross-cultural appeal. I went to a friend's house and saw what I thought was raw akpu in the fridge, considering that the putrid stench threw me off balance and temporarily shut down my system  as I opened the lid of the plastic container. I was shocked to learn it was fermented corn. . . Jeezuz wept shocked shocked shocked I know that once you dip akpu in boiling water, about 90% of the putrid stench disappears but this thing remained the same after boiling water was poured into it. It was so bad that not even a combination of Jesus and Amadioha  could convince me to shovel that disgusting food down my throat.

Now, if I who have been exposed to all manners of WMD masquerading as Nigerian food felt this way about this particular WMD. . .errr. . . Nigerian food, I leave to your imagination the reaction of non-Nigerians  lipsrsealed lipsrsealed
Re: An Expatriate’s Email From Nigeria by Ilelobola: 12:34pm On May 05, 2009
I remember a former manager in the UK moving to a CFO (I wouldn’t make him CFO in my business but just my opinion) job in Nigeria for a Nigerian firm and him recommending me for a role with his new company. He was told that they would prefer a non-Nigerian and actually a white person as it’s better for their image. I wasn’t shocked. He was …

So few years on he moves to another job in Nig with another Nig firm still and recommends 2 of us for another job, 1 White Briton and moi. All 3 of us agree that I am a better candidate than my white colleague (well I’ve had more excellent performance ratings than him) but alas, the firm offers me the role but at a lower pay than was initially advertised. Ok, perhaps they’ve decided I won’t be an expat but I am moving from London to do the role and it is only a year long contract with the possibility of extension but they refused to provide accommodation, allowance and transport saying I could source it myself … well, I’m still in the UK; my former colleague got the job, don’t know what the package is though.

The German email in the first post seems to be telling it as it is, as far as I am concerned.
Re: An Expatriate’s Email From Nigeria by Lagosboy: 12:48pm On May 05, 2009
Ilelobola:

I remember a former manager in the UK moving to a CFO (I wouldn’t make him CFO in my business but just my opinion) job in Nigeria for a Nigerian firm and him recommending me for a role with his new company. He was told that they would prefer a non-Nigerian and actually a white person as it’s better for their image. I wasn’t shocked. He was …

So few years on he moves to another job in Nig with another Nig firm still and recommends 2 of us for another job, 1 White Briton and moi. All 3 of us agree that I am a better candidate than my white colleague (well I’ve had more excellent performance ratings than him) but alas, the firm offers me the role but at a lower pay than was initially advertised. Ok, perhaps they’ve decided I won’t be an expat but I am moving from London to do the role and it is only a year long contract with the possibility of extension but they refused to provide accommodation, allowance and transport saying I could source it myself … well, I’m still in the UK; my former colleague got the job, don’t know what the package is though.

The German email in the first post seems to be telling it as it is, as far as I am concerned.


I feel u bro, this is quite unfortunate but it is not exclusive to Nigeria. The middle eastern countries have a different pay package based on nationalty. I work in the oil and gas industry and it is shameful what happens to people without US,canada or EU passports in those countries as welll. The indians dont have much of a choice so they grab it wholeheartedly .

Equality in this terms i one of the good things i appreciate and respect in western countries.
Re: An Expatriate’s Email From Nigeria by ikeyman00(m): 5:18pm On May 05, 2009
@@@

just readin this thread

anyway 4play u are not making any sense!!! period , now forget them big grammar!!

who told u that nigerian food doesnt appeal to wide audience people like u probably have live in overseas for far too long, na naoooo

chinese food ki?? yes everybody like chinese food but like what and what, i remember people complaining during the olympics in china that the chinese food u buy in the west is completely different from the one u see in china!! abi na cockroaches and snake they de chop for china,

therefore in other words the fact that people loves chinese fried rice or noddles does not implies that people love all the chinese food!! period

Right, as for naija food, the carriebean loves our jellof with plaintain?, mio mio, u name it

so like some nigerians back home said, if all ur losers in the making cannot contribute to move nigeria forward, yall should just shut up!! period

if u like die whereever u want, no body cares!

i blame the FG, that suffer from inferior complex, they also embraces it in nigeria, every governor wana shake chinese or oyibo hand for 2009 shocked shocked shocked shocked

and u best beleive it , when i was in abuja 2007, the naijaman was walking along side oyibo, i think the oyiboman was hungry, then they both walked in to the hotel resturant where i was sharkin some star, the oyibo look on the table where this dude was yamin some pounded yam and egwusi, and he went like, oh what that wiith some nasty expression on his face!! i was damn angry that i was gona blast him, but i back off, but the home dude which suffers from inferiority couldnt get what  happen as he carry on eating
Re: An Expatriate’s Email From Nigeria by Hauwa1: 5:24pm On May 05, 2009
ROFL grin grin grin
Re: An Expatriate’s Email From Nigeria by ThiefOfHearts(f): 5:25pm On May 05, 2009
Other than Carribs, you people cant name anyone else.
Re: An Expatriate’s Email From Nigeria by ikeyman00(m): 5:29pm On May 05, 2009
english

scotish

india

was it not in nl that those a-america sista talk about our soup and pounded yam hmmm

abi na scrabble eggs una want now

anway these are the ones i can mention now
Re: An Expatriate’s Email From Nigeria by AjanleKoko: 11:02am On May 06, 2009
I did my NYSC in one airline like that. Operating locally, but almost wholly-owned foreign airline (Dutch in fact).
We had one cleaner lady who used to clean around our hangar and the workshop. This old lady would go on and on about how these 'Oyinbos' were so much better than black people. She would say 'In fact when you clean toilet for black man, e go so dirty so tay black man to stand on top toilet bowl, but the white man own, always clean!' I would always respond 'Mama, like your people o, no prefer oyinbo to your people!'.

One afternoon like that, after another of such banters, we went off to lunch, and by the time we got back, I heard she was gone.
Apparently, the Dutch MD was strolling around the hangar and found the old lady asleep in one corner. He promptly fired her.

A while later, I saw her, she had joined one other airline. My only remark to her was 'Mama, shey you don see say na we fit like ourselves, and Oyinbo no fit like us?' She smiled.

Of course some people would say 'well, serve her right for sleeping on duty, that is why the white man is so productive, they don't tolerate any slacking!'. I expect such reponses in fact.

Peace.
Re: An Expatriate’s Email From Nigeria by Ilelobola: 11:14am On May 06, 2009
Depends on how many times she’s been caught sleeping on duty, the reason and the overall quality of her work.

The question for me though is how come Oyinbo and Nigs use different toilets in the same organisation? And Mama certainly hasn’t seen proper dirty Oyinbos.
Re: An Expatriate’s Email From Nigeria by blacksta(m): 11:17am On May 06, 2009
AjanleKoko:

I did my NYSC in one airline like that. Operating locally, but almost wholly-owned foreign airline (Dutch in fact).
We had one cleaner lady who used to clean around our hangar and the workshop. This old lady would go on and on about how these 'Oyinbos' were so much better than black people. She would say 'In fact when you clean toilet for black man, e go so dirty so tay black man to stand on top toilet bowl, but the white man own, always clean!' I would always respond 'Mama, like your people o, no prefer oyinbo to your people!'.

One afternoon like that, after another of such banters, we went off to lunch, and by the time we got back, I heard she was gone.
Apparently, the Dutch MD was strolling around the hangar and found the old lady asleep in one corner. He promptly fired her.

A while later, I saw her, she had joined one other airline. My only remark to her was 'Mama, shey you don see say na we fit like ourselves, and Oyinbo no fit like us?' She smiled.

Of course some people would say 'well, serve her right for sleeping on duty, that is why the white man is so productive, they don't tolerate any slacking!'. I expect such reponses in fact.


Peace.

That is why the level of decay in the fabrics of Nigeria is so rampant - it sounds like you agree to the fact " sleeping on duty " is o.k

Why the hell should i pay you to sleep on the job.  Oyinbo no get time for sentiment.   Would any of you ( u and the mama) be employed if things weren't done properly
Re: An Expatriate’s Email From Nigeria by spikedcylinder: 11:23am On May 06, 2009
Looks like the pleasant aromas from oyinbo's clean toilet sent mama straight to sleep! grin grin
Re: An Expatriate’s Email From Nigeria by Ilelobola: 11:32am On May 06, 2009
blacksta:

That is why the level of decay in the fabrics of Nigeria is so rampant - it sounds like you agree to the fact " sleeping on duty " is o.k

Why the hell should i pay you to sleep on the job. Oyinbo no get time for sentiment. Would any of you ( u and the mama) be employed if things weren't done properly

As you appear to be in the UK, let's assume mama was caught sleeping in the UK; would she be fired immediately (if it was the first time of course and with no formal warning)? I think not. And sleeping on duty does not mean she wasn't doing her job properly.
Re: An Expatriate’s Email From Nigeria by AjanleKoko: 1:33pm On May 06, 2009
Guys, you miss the point there. And I was expecting those responses.

First, it was lunchtime. I've never worked in the UK or US or wherever you guys are at, but really, do CEOs go around over there at lunchtime looking for people sleeping in odd corners? You guys tell me.

Secondly. . . and this is the point, really . . . There is what is called 'cultural adaptation' in business. Even in business schools they teach about various cultures, and how this affects doing business in these cultures. One usual case study is the Middle East. Execs working in the Middle East are usually appraised about the culture of the Arabs, and how to factor this into the daily operational life. I've attended an AMP where we had this case study about a German chap who was a CEO in Syria, and he didn't particularly find exciting the Arab way of work (they generally spend the first hour of work socializing) and he instituted a no-frills, typically German policy of work, work and work. Surprisingly he ended up creating an atmosphere of general apathy and hostility among the Arab workers, the overall productivity declined, and he was eventually replaced by his parent company.

Now do not get me wrong, I am not condoning laziness. . . but do we not have a right to demand cultural adaptation from foreign execs working in Nigeria? Or is the Nigerian society so crass and stupid that we must always get the overseer-slave treatment in our country? If they have a particular work ethic in the UK, you are bound to adapt to it. You can't transplant the UK corporate environment tradition and impose it upon Nigerians. That they have a stronger work ethic in the developed societies is moot in my view. My visits to Europe (the UK in particular) and the US have me stumped, seeing crowds in the mall at 10 O clock in the morning, generally shopping, strolling around, etc etc, all year round. We actually don't see that in Nigeria. Also, if I use the general work attitude of Oyinbos in Nigeria to gauge their race, I might want to say they seem lazier, and even a lot less intelligent (the German chap even affirmed that in his email!) except we have some 'lazy gas' in the atmosphere that affects them once they step off the plane.

All in, I felt it was unnecessary to fire the old lady, it was culturally insensitive and smacks of the disdain white people hold for blacks. I've worked in an Middle East organization with a lot of European and American execs, and you could see the deference they had for Arabs who were even their subordinates, some sort of ridiculous ass-kissing just cos they never were sure which sheik the employee was related to! These same guys are always taking some silly moral high ground when they are in African nations, while under the table you would collapse in shock when you find out the inordinate levels of profligiacy and naked corruption these Oyinbos engage in, corruption usually engineered and executed by them. When they want to execute their dirty contracts, they either railroad all Nigerian execs to comply, or shut them out entirely. And we believe these guys are saints? Please.

It's the general hypocrisy of our situation that has made me take this view: I as a person, do not consider myself morally, intellectually, or physiologically inferior to any other race just because I am African, and I won't jettison who I am, where I came from, and the ways and manners of my people just because some lighter-skinned person said something to that effect. In all the races, it's always the Africa who's the idiot, the one the others must treat with disdain, the one people like Lugard, Hitler, and even Osama has some disgusting classification for. I wonder how we can ever believe in ourselves and rise to the occasion when we are reminded everyday about how we should be classified as animals, such that 98% of us have full buy in to that thinking.

Apologies for the long post.
Peace.
Re: An Expatriate’s Email From Nigeria by blacksta(m): 1:38pm On May 06, 2009
Ilelobola:

As you appear to be in the UK, let's assume mama was caught sleeping in the UK; would she be fired immediately (if it was the first time of course and with no formal warning)? I think not. And sleeping on duty does not mean she wasn't doing her job properly.

Yes - i have heard of people who were fired but in most cases a warning is given which is a route to employment termination. but in fairness a company can opt to fire if you are not able provide sustainable evidence on why you are sleeping at work . What if mama was a pilot?
Re: An Expatriate’s Email From Nigeria by mrsb(f): 4:51pm On May 13, 2009
ThiefOfHearts:

Quote
I was talking to one of our Project Managers (an American) the other day. Irritating man to say the least.
He has two official cars - A Prado and an Avensis, gets paid almost $20,000 after tax every month and everything down to his laundry detergent is bought for him and his family and yet he claims he feels "unwelcome here". In fact, just last week, he still said he should be more welcome and exonerated here because he protested African liberty and freedom on the streets on New York in his hay days

I work with a bunch of expats - American, Brits, French and Italian mostly. The Americans are terrible. They are so patronising to the Nigerian staff, bloody rude about the country and their wives are the worst!!! Sit around in eachother's luxury apartments complaining about the food, weather, domestic staff, armed robbers etc. They don't venture outside, they don't do work for NGO's, charities etc. they just complain for a living.

And the expat staff all get atleast a 40% uplift on their basic salary (!!!) as Nigeria is considered a "hardship" location. They live in VI/Ikoyi in amazing apartments, have all bills paid etc and fly in and out to the US at will (return flight is about $8k). Whilst the Nigerian staff are given the junior and supporting roles on crap wages and no additional allowances. It's quite sickening.
Re: An Expatriate’s Email From Nigeria by Kobojunkie: 5:13pm On May 13, 2009
blacksta:

Yes - i have heard of people who were fired but in most cases a warning is given which is a route to employment termination. but in fairness a company can opt to fire if you are not able provide sustainable evidence on why you are sleeping at work . What if mama was a pilot?
Oludumare gba wa oo!!!  shocked
Re: An Expatriate’s Email From Nigeria by sartorius(m): 5:26pm On May 13, 2009
sorry story sad
Re: An Expatriate’s Email From Nigeria by biina: 6:20pm On May 13, 2009
All this stems from our over valuation of imported goods. We always seem to feel something from another continent is superior to ours , a  facility we have extended to the Caucasians from SA,   Nigerians with foreign qualification are often over rated, with little to no consideration given to the actual competence of the individual. It is only in Africa that I know of, where  foreigners are given preferential treatment at the expense of the citizens. Elsewhere the situation is reversed.

I remembered an incidence  of a few years back. Some colleagues were discussing the plight of the African continent. One of the GMs, a South African of Caucasian descent, used the phrase 'We Africans' (making reference to himself) to which another colleague, of similar Caucasian heritage, cautioned him that his use of the phrase to include himself was insulting to him (i.e. the GM) and his family. I really felt like beating some respect into his blonde head for uttering such crap angry . The whole crop of them were technicians who were brought in as management staff simply to appease the goons in the oil sector.
Re: An Expatriate’s Email From Nigeria by nich(m): 7:35pm On May 13, 2009
it's so amazing how educated some of our fellas are, but then 'almost' no room/breathing space to manifest what's cooking on the inside.

but there's hope sha!

@ topic,
no be their fault. na we allow them turn kings for our land when most of them are not even recognised in their countries.
Re: An Expatriate’s Email From Nigeria by Pillars: 9:25pm On May 13, 2009
@ Ajanlekoko: I feel greatly the truth behind your submissions, the issues are largely not what opinion an expatriate is going to have of us; in truth they have a right to hold any opinion, true or untrue. I learnt late in life not to really bother on fighting to protect my Reputation as much as working to build my character. My reputation is what people think of me whilst my character is what I really am. Do I have the power to control what you think about me? of course not! But do I have such power to work on my character? Sure I do.

What actually defines our community? What is our collective character? What are the values we hold dare? I have worked with people who will rather prefer to take a dumb "white face" to a meeting rather than a brilliant black skin - why? Because they believe their host will gladly accede to their business proposals because of the "white face." What stupidity?

Stupidity, Valuelessness, Corruption and all other vices are not native to any country or continent, it is a human thing, but apparently, so many of our people seem to possess this vices. What is hence the challenge? Simple: For those of us who have risen above these baseless prejudices to strive and enthrone Reason in this terrain of Ignorance we find ourselves.
Re: An Expatriate’s Email From Nigeria by Kobojunkie: 9:32pm On May 13, 2009
Pillars:

@ Ajanlekoko: I feel greatly the truth behind your submissions, the issues are largely not what opinion an expatriate is going to have of us; in truth they have a right to hold any opinion, true or untrue. I learnt late in life not to really bother on fighting to protect my Reputation as much as working to build my character. My reputation is what people think of me whilst my character is what I really am. Do I have the power to control what you think about me? of course not! But do I have such power to work on my character? Sure I do.

What actually defines our community? What is our collective character? What are the values we hold dare? I have worked with people who will rather prefer to take a dumb "white face" to a meeting rather than a brilliant black skin - why? Because they believe their host will gladly accede to their business proposals because of the "white face." What stupidity?

Stupidity, Valuelessness, Corruption and all other vices are not native to any country or continent, it is a human thing, but apparently, so many of our people seem to possess this vices. What is hence the challenge? Simple: For those of us who have risen above these baseless prejudices to strive and enthrone Reason in this terrain of Ignorance we find ourselves.



Straight on point and great questions asked!

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