LightningLord:


http://gifsec.com/wp-content/uploads/GIF/2014/03/Bring-it-gif.gif

Lol.

Reyginus:
Lol.

Still don't have too much time, but let's begin.

How exactly is he being un-xtianlike?

He believes he's a sinner that can be redeemed by accepting xrist, yes? Is that not an xtian?

wiegraf:


Still don't have too much time, but let's begin.

How exactly is he being un-xtianlike?

He believes he's a sinner that can be redeemed by accepting xrist, yes? Is that not an xtian?

But I thought he's already done that? I mean he's already accepted Christ. Is the question still necessary?

Reyginus:
But I thought he's already done that? I mean he's already accepted Christ. Is the question still necessary?

Yes

So, you accept he's an xtian?

Do you doubt his honesty?

wiegraf:

Yes
So, you accept he's an xtian?
Do you doubt his honesty?

No, I don't. I only doubt his understanding.

Reyginus:
No, I don't. I only doubt his understanding.

No vex...time.....

Why do you think his understanding is not valid and yours is??

Btw, do you think he does not consider himself a sinner? His understanding may be more in line with yours than you think. He may be simply looking for redemption, and what better way to please god than to bring his benign justice to those "baby-killers"?

malvisguy212:
Jesus in His days denounced religious hypocrites, confront the teachers of the law to removed the beem in their eyes to see clearly to remove other.

So if christianity is so damn wonderful how come it foster the most hypocrites of any religion in this world?

sonOfLucifer:

You see, this is the point. Is there any difference between a true Christian and a Christian? Does 'true Christian' really mean anything?

Obviously, everyone understands who a Christian is or should be. One who believes in the Quran can't logically claim to be Christian. A Christian, by definition, believes in your Bible and Christ. Differences in theology, doctrines etc do not matter.

What makes anyone a damned christian. The posts are always shifting. Christian is the most meaningless term that we have in existence today. Calling yourself a christian does not tell us anything about your core beliefs or our character. it only tells us that whatever your beliefs are, you claim that it is backed up by a character called Jesus Christ.

I don't think that religion in and of itself is a cause of many human evils.

However I do believe that religion facilitates many evils that lie within man.

The greatest facilitator of all is christianity.

That is why when asked I say that I do practise tenets of christianity but I am not a christian.

PastorAIO:


So if christianity is so damn wonderful how come it foster the most hypocrites of any religion in this world?

were did you keep your thinking cap? Christianity is the Largest religion so you will find large amount of such people. One thing for sure Jesus denounce religious hypocrites.

The reason you reject Christianity is because of nowadays 'Churchianity' which Jesus would denounce.

Matthew 23-23-26
23 “Woe to you, scribes and Pharisees,
hypocrites! For you tithe mint and dill
and cumin, and have neglected the
weightier matters of the law: justice and
mercy and faithfulness. These you ought to have done, without neglecting the others. 24 You blind guides, straining out a gnat and swallowing a camel! 25 “Woe to you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! For you clean the outside of the cup and the plate, but inside they are full of greed and self-indulgence. 26 You blind Pharisee! First clean the inside of the cup and the plate, that the outside also may be clean.

PastorAIO:

That is why when asked I say that I do practise tenets of christianity but I am not a christian.

PASTORAIO ? More like PastorFAS ?

Why can't you just change your username since you are not a christian . Maybe to AIO or FAS

KingEbukasBlog:


PASTORAIO ? More like PastorFAS ?

Why can't you just change your username since you are not a christian . Maybe to AIO or FAS

Is it by force?

malvisguy212:
were did you keep your thinking cap? Christianity is the Largest religion so you will find large amount of such people. One thing for sure Jesus denounce religious hypocrites.

Jesus also said 'wide is the way and many are those who find it ...'


... just to buttress your point, and mine.

PastorAIO:


Jesus also said 'wide is the way and many are those who find it ...'


... just to buttress your point, and mine.

agreed. However most of your post seems to condemned All christians.
If you are well versed in scripture, you will realized Christianity is by heart and not by word, the substance Is not in the word but the HEART. Authentic
Christians claim to be so bad that they deserve no forgiveness from God (making themselves dependable to God alone )Hypocrites are people who claims to be better than what they really Are.

malvisguy212:
agreed. However most of your post seems to condemned All christians.
If you are well versed in scripture, you will realized Christianity is by heart and not by word, the substance Is not in the word but the HEART. Authentic
Christians claim to be so bad that they deserve no forgiveness from God (making themselves dependable to God alone )Hypocrites are people who claims to be better than what they really Are.

I wouldn't say that I condemn christians. I condemn Christianity as a cult. The dynamics within the cult of Christianity are most injurious to the spiritual development of any human being.


People who claim to be better than they actually are are just deluded people. For example those who steal and injure others and then continue to feel saintly because they claim that the are covered by the blood of the lamb. Our actions are a product of our nature. If we do evil that is because that evil comes from an evil source. Apple tree cannot bear Orange fruits. If any transformation has occurred as christians claim then patapata the extent of their wickedness should be reduced, but rather it is amplified.

Hypocrite can be due to delusion or it can be intentional, to deceive. Both ways are applicable to christians. Furthermore it does not limit itself to ethical behaviour but it extends to claims of knowledge. Christians make so many claims and fill their minds with so much mendacity and they go about spreading such mendacity. The perfect example of this can be found in many of Olaadegbu's threads. They make historical claims that are false and buttress their mendacity with arrogance. They practice double standards left right and centre. They are so quick to point the finger at others, whether the others are atheists, pagans, muslims, or even other christians that happen to think differently from them. Naturally the premise of this finger pointing is that they have some degree of righteousness that the others do not possess, in other words they're hypocritical.

PASTORAIO GUESS U ARE AWARE THE WORD CULT HAS A PRETTY WIDE APPLICATION. UNLESS YOUR POST ABOVE IS AGAINST ALL FORMS OF ORGANISED CHRISTIANITY, CHRISTIANITY IS A CULT BY NATURE.

PastorAIO:


I wouldn't say that I condemn christians. I condemn Christianity as a cult. The dynamics within the cult of Christianity are most injurious to the spiritual development of any human being.


People who claim to be better than they actually are are just deluded people. For example those who steal and injure others and then continue to feel saintly because they claim that the are covered by the blood of the lamb. Our actions are a product of our nature. If we do evil that is because that evil comes from an evil source. Apple tree cannot bear Orange fruits. If any transformation has occurred as christians claim then patapata the extent of their wickedness should be reduced, but rather it is amplified.

Hypocrite can be due to delusion or it can be intentional, to deceive. Both ways are applicable to christians. Furthermore it does not limit itself to ethical behaviour but it extends to claims of knowledge. Christians make so many claims and fill their minds with so much mendacity and they go about spreading such mendacity. The perfect example of this can be found in many of Olaadegbu's threads. They make historical claims that are false and buttress their mendacity with arrogance. They practice double standards left right and centre. They are so quick to point the finger at others, whether the others are atheists, pagans, muslims, or even other christians that happen to think differently from them. Naturally the premise of this finger pointing is that they have some degree of righteousness that the others do not possess, in other words they're hypocritical.

your problem is the word "Christianity" and not 'christians'. You are being bias. The pagans in anthioch were the first to call the apostles 'christians' why ?because the apostles did not follow the commercial world of the pagans. "Christian" is an adjective, not a noun.

The term "Christian" was IMPOSED upon
the servants of Christ by Christ’s enemies living outside the Kingdom of God,to label those living in the Kingdom of God.

I think you are trying to say that you are better than christians since you can discern hypocrite, well, Good for you, keep it up. Thank you for your time.

Ubenedictus:
PASTORAIO GUESS U ARE AWARE THE WORD CULT HAS A PRETTY WIDE APPLICATION. UNLESS YOUR POST ABOVE IS AGAINST ALL FORMS OF ORGANISED CHRISTIANITY, CHRISTIANITY IS A CULT BY NATURE.

if he know what cult is , he wouldn't associate Christianity with it. Cult discourage its members from asking questions. The bible encourage christians to ask questions until we are convinced of what we believe. John the baptist who supposed to believe in jests hundreds percent still send his disciples to ask Jesus " are you the messia" did Jesus condemned him ? NO. Jesus even give the disciples of John enough proof.

Ubenedictus:
PASTORAIO GUESS U ARE AWARE THE WORD CULT HAS A PRETTY WIDE APPLICATION. UNLESS YOUR POST ABOVE IS AGAINST ALL FORMS OF ORGANISED CHRISTIANITY, CHRISTIANITY IS A CULT BY NATURE.

Thanks for your comment. What I meant to say was actually more nuanced than it came across. I used the word cult in the broadest sense applicable. So your post now prompts me to articulate the nuances as I understand them.

I make a distinction between A Communion on the one hand, and any ol' society or association on the other hand.

In society there is pressure to 'form' or present oneself in a respectable manner, and this has a tendency to lead to lead to hypocrisy whereby one 'forms' piety while remaining as rotten as sin itself in one's heart. This is an issue that is relevant to every social situation and it is an issue that Jesus himself addressed directly in the gospels. Such social pressures and succumbing to them are one of the major obstacles blocking anyone seeking spiritual growth. (Even just in friendships, there are certain codes that if a person fails to uphold the code he will lose his friends. Maybe he doesn't dress well and he's 'letting the team down' when they go out, etc etc etc....

The fact that this problem that Jesus himself addressed pertains pandemically in christian associations around the globe only buttresses Paul's statement that indeed Satan goes about disguised as an Angel of Light.

That is not the case with a Communion. The members of a communion are one being, in mind, and actions. For a christian to be at odds with another christian is like a person whose mouth has decided that it no longer wants to send food down to the stomach because it is vexed with the stomach. Far from 'forming' piety within a communion the members practise confession of their shortcomings.

Salvation does not come from membership of the cult, or in being identified as a card carrying member of the cult. Salvation comes from the practice of the tenets. There is an efficacy in communal prayer and actions that a lone ranger cannot achieve. This spiritual fact buttresses the importance of Communion. Communion is strengthened by confession of sin. Human Societies are strengthened by hypocrisy.

malvisguy212:
your problem is the word "Christianity" and not 'christians'. You are being bias. The pagans in anthioch were the first to call the apostles 'christians' why ?because the apostles did not follow the commercial world of the pagans. "Christian" is an adjective, not a noun.

The term "Christian" was IMPOSED upon
the servants of Christ by Christ’s enemies living outside the Kingdom of God,to label those living in the Kingdom of God.

I think you are trying to say that you are better than christians since you can discern hypocrite, well, Good for you, keep it up. Thank you for your time.

I'm not prepared to argue back and forth over the meaning of words. Whatever christian or christianity means to you, I'm fine with that. But when I say christianity I'm referring to what is widely recognised all around the world as the biggest, most populous religion.


Being able to discern hypocrite has nothing to do with whether one is better than a christian or not. In fact some of the best identifiers of hypocrites are hypocrites themselves. There's that saying: It takes one to know one.

Or to paraphrase Jesus himself: as big as the block in your eye is, you have no problem spotting the speck of dust in your brother's eye.

PastorAIO:

But when I say christianity I'm referring to what is widely recognised all around the world as the biggest, most populous religion.

so you judge christians based on the World point of view and NOT on the explanation the bible provide? If I should judge you based on what I heard people say about you, will you be happy? Jesus say Love your enemy and bless those who persecute you, any christian acting contrary to this and still call himself a better christian is a hypocrite.

malvisguy212:
so you judge christians based on the World point of view and NOT on the explanation the bible provide? If I should judge you based on what I heard people say about you, will you be happy? Jesus say Love your enemy and bless those who persecute you, any christian acting contrary to this and still call himself a better christian is a hypocrite.

Okay o, I'm an hypocrite, o tan. Let's leave it there.

malvisguy212:
if he know what cult is , he wouldn't associate Christianity with it. Cult discourage its members from asking questions. The bible encourage christians to ask questions until we are convinced of what we believe. John the baptist who supposed to believe in jests hundreds percent still send his disciples to ask Jesus " are you the messia" did Jesus condemned him ? NO. Jesus even give the disciples of John enough proof.

DAT DEPENDS ON HOW U DEFINE CULT

ok, pastoraio today i am persuaded to pinch your thoughts a little. xtianity provides an ideal that most times we fail to live up to due to human weakness and stupidity. the ideal on which the church was built is similar to what u describe of a communion. a close nit family where there is no need for pretense, a path for true spiritual growth. d church is an assembly of those called who share the 'life' of Christ amid falls and rising(dis doesnt scratch d surface bt it will do). do we lose d title "christian" each time we fall short of dis ideal. sometimes we turn the communion into association other times we mix them all up. does this make everything useless and the community unnecessary? i wonder if it is possible to see a communion where everyone lives up to the ideal and human weakness don't come in. does the church cease when the ideal isn't followed by all?

i'm not sure my thoughts come out clearly so i'll let u respond.

wiegraf:


No vex...time.....

Why do you think his understanding is not valid and yours is??

Btw, do you think he does not consider himself a sinner? His understanding may be more in line with yours than you think. He may be simply looking for redemption, and what better way to please god than to bring his benign justice to those "baby-killers"?

Valid? What exactly did the bible say on this? I think that's what matters.Do you think the bible's command on this is the best? If yes, do we apply it here?

Ubenedictus:
do we lose d title "christian" each time we fall short of dis ideal. sometimes we turn the communion into association other times we mix them all up. does this make everything useless and the community unnecessary?

Like I said previously 'christianity' has become possibly the most meaningless term in existence. It tells me nothing about any ideals one may hold, it tells me nothing except perhaps that whatever the adherent claims is supposedly backed up a character called Jesus Christ. I can invent anything today and call myself a christian because of a claim that my invention was revealed to me in a dream by Jesus.

As you've said above it's a title and I don't care much for titles. A person who's fallen short of ideals is just that: short of ideal.

An athlete that falls short of adequate fitness may still go around calling himself an athlete but he will face disgrace on the track.

Jesus tells a parable about many people with the right title being shocked when they were considered unfit for the kingdom. Yet in the same parable many who did not even know him, simply by acting right and being orientated right, were welcomed into the kingdom.

I don't know any walk of life where somebody is successful just by making the right claim. If the claim is not an actual fact then events will expose this .. err.. eventually.

Communities are subject to process and evolution/revolution as with everything else in temporal existence. A little leaven leaveneth the whole lump. It is important to always be aware of this in associations of all sorts. It applies not only in religion but every sort of association. As yoruba says: The goat that associates with dog will eat poo. Yoruba also says: The leaf that mixes with soap will become soap.
These are observable facts in every walk of life and not only spiritual science.

LORD HAVE MERCY FOR WE HAVE SINNED.

Reyginus:
Valid? What exactly did the bible say on this? I think that's what matters.Do you think the bible's command on this is the best? If yes, do we apply it here?

Of course, pick any of his many 'sins' and show me what the Bible has to say on it.

Almost surely a waste of time tho. Very few things are as contradictory as the Bible, and we also have to look at the larger scope of things, not just immediate edicts from the book. In other words, it's not the only thing that matters, albeit it being one of the cardinal. But go ahead, I'll (at least try to) keep an open mind.

wiegraf:


Of course, pick any of his many 'sins' and show me what the Bible has to say on it.

Almost surely a waste of time tho. Very few things are as contradictory as the Bible, and we also have to look at the larger scope of things, not just immediate edicts from the book. In other words, it's not the only thing that matters, albeit it being one of the cardinal. But go ahead, I'll (at least try to) keep an open mind.

Lol. Now you are asking me to do your work for you. I think you should be showing me how his actions are in tandem with that of a Christian according to the bible. Pick any of his many sins and show me.

PastorAIO:
I don't think that religion in and of itself is a cause of many human evils.

However I do believe that religion facilitates many evils that lie within man.

The greatest facilitator of all is christianity.

That is why when asked I say that I do practise tenets of christianity but I am not a christian.

I agree about facilitating those with already questionable character, but I would argue the religions themselves also ingrain hypocrisy (among many other ills) into many of their unsuspecting adherents. For instance, many of their tenets, doctrine and what not, are hypocritical, so they're bound to produce adherents that are hypocrites.

consider the average muslim, I'm quite sure, would never accept it just to slave or kill apostates where it not for the fact that he's been conditioned into thinking it's fine by his religion.

they would all concede, at some level, that slavery is fine because uncle mo engaged in it. No exceptions. Not just the ones that are rotten already.

they would all find jihad acceptable as well, of course.

then they'll turn around and tell you they're peaceful. even claim that islam means "peace".....

Note that sure, I can't tell you slavery or jihad is absolutely unacceptable, that would make me just as dogmatic as those I criticize. But they're certainly not acceptable at the low threshold muslims set. Not in most of today's world.

Also, religions like the abrahamics are not the only tool that can program social norms, for sure, but with them we are dealing with what their adherents consider are absolutes.

On another note, I think perhaps historically xtianity takes the cake with regards to facilitating and/or creating folly, but I think Islam is by far the bigger cancer in almost every way in today's world. But that could be just me....of course....

Reyginus:
Lol. Now you are asking me to do your work for you. I think you should be showing me how his actions are in tandem with that of a Christian according to the bible. Pick any of his many sins and show me.

Have to go.

But simple question: is abortion infanticide?

Thank you. Your points are well taken.

There is a slight difference between your cases and mine. The muslims in your example and the christian in the OP believe themselves to be doing good when they kill. They even broadcast the deeds.

The issue of an absolute Good and Evil, Morality palava, is another whole can of worms that I might get into when I fancy giving myself a headache.

In the case I was discussing though the subject already believes an action to be evil and denounces such action when he sees others doing it, yet he does the same.

If muslims fought against slavery too then they would fit in the case I'm talking about. If they were against war in their rhetoric (maybe they are, I don't know) then they would fit.

wiegraf:


I agree about facilitating those with already questionable character, but I would argue the religions themselves also ingrain hypocrisy (among many other ills) into many of their unsuspecting adherents. For instance, many of their tenets, doctrine and what not, are hypocritical, so they're bound to produce adherents that are hypocrites.

consider the average muslim, I'm quite sure, would never accept it just to slave or kill apostates where it not for the fact that he's been conditioned into thinking it's fine by his religion.

they would all concede, at some level, that slavery is fine because uncle mo engaged in it. No exceptions. Not just the ones that are rotten already.

they would all find jihad acceptable as well, of course.

then they'll turn around and tell you they're peaceful. even claim that islam means "peace".....

Note that sure, I can't tell you slavery or jihad is absolutely unacceptable, that would make me just as dogmatic as those I criticize. But they're certainly not acceptable at the low threshold muslims set. Not in most of today's world.

Also, religions like the abrahamics are not the only tool that can program social norms, for sure, but with them we are dealing with what their adherents consider are absolutes.

On another note, I think perhaps historically xtianity takes the cake with regards to facilitating and/or creating folly, but I think Islam is by far the bigger cancer in almost every way in today's world. But that could be just me....of course....