Reyginus:
Valid? What exactly did the bible say on this? I think that's what matters.Do you think the bible's command on this is the best? If yes, do we apply it here?

wiegraf:


Have to go.

But simple question: is abortion infanticide?

PastorAIO:


Does anybody in the bible have an abortion?

If not then how are we going to know the bible's command for those that do abortions?

But that is the least of my problems, My own is that I want to know what the bible has to say about Eating Amala because this is a very major issue for me in my life. Maybe I should stop because the bible doesn't even mention it.

Reyginus:
I don't think the bible spoke of things like Yahoo-Yahoo like some of our people do but then we know it's evil. You see, it is simply a subject of what is morally good or evil.

Why do we do abortion? Is it not for the sole purpose of terminating existence? Ectopic pregnancy is a different case because the mother is threatened and the fetus often die. Does the Bible talk about good and evil or not? Then is abortion good in any wa? The simple fact that taking the innocent fetus's life is wrong settles it.

PastorAIO:


I will not say that Yahoo yahoo is evil. Or even use the term evil the way you do. But that is not what I was concerned with. My concern is Amala. If you can help it will be appreciated.

Are you saying that the act of terminating existence is evil? Is this what the bible teaches you? Where does the bible say that?

Reyginus:
Yeah. Terminating the creation of God for the glorification of self and not Gos is evil. That's according to the Christian bible. Try Lev 24:17

PastorAIO:


I see that you are now further qualifying it. So it is not just the Terminating of Existence now abi? It is okay to terminate existence if it is for the glory of God.

How did the fellow in the OP glorify himself by murdering people? Did he not do it to glorify God?

I don't think people having abortions feel glorified either. That is not their intention.

I also wonder if you consider the killing of cows for food to be 'evil'. Even if eating food is not glorification what about the use of their hides to make designer shoe. That is glorification abi? Is killing cows evil?

Reyginus:
So you think I'm arguing to validate Christianity's tenets or God's? No. With Wiegraf, I'm arguing within in. I'm interested in how his behaviour, I mean the man, is Christian according to the Christian holy book.

PastorAIO:


you just said it is okay for a christian to terminate existence for the glory of God. Are you retracting this statement?

If not, then obviously the Man in the OP is very christianly in his murderous activities.

Reyginus:
I just said what? Please show me where then we talk about a retraction.

Reyginus:
Yeah. Terminating the creation of God for the glorification of self and not Gos is evil. That's according to the Christian bible. Try Lev 24:17

PastorAIO:


You said it right here. If you mean something different please explain it to me. The fellow in the OP terminated people's existence for the glory of God, not for his own personal glory.


And if his genocidal rampage wasn't done for the glory of God can you give me an example of a genocide that is done for the glory of God.

Reyginus:
Lol. I think it's rather you who need to give an explanation. Let me help still. In ectopic pregnancy, where there are inflammatory reactions on the fallopian tube, the pregnant woman is at risk of death and often times the fetus is unable to survive, excision is usually done to save mother rather than losing both doing nothing.

By Christian standards that event gives glory to God. Now I'd like to know how my statement translates to genocide, ordered by God, is the morally good thing to do. Mind you I'm neither for or against God here but simply how I inferred this. If you mean something different please explain to me.

PastorAIO:


It wasn't an inference it was a literal understanding. You said it. If that was not what you meant then what did you mean.

Ectopic abortion does not give any god any glory, by any standards. Did God invent the procedure? Anyway sha that's not what we're talking about now. You've just denied that you said that terminating existence can be for the glory of God. I showed you where you said it. Are you now agreeing that you said it? I presume so because your post above seems like a feeble attempt to justify it.

I suspect that you are now just throwing words about without any cogency. What a pathetic god you serve who kills a baby to save the mother and claims it is a glorious act. (feeling repulsed)

Reyginus:
Lololol. Do you read my comments at all? Or because you already have a bias for the errors of Christians you then categorize all statements under this bias? Lol. So explaining the contradiction between how we react to what we believe and how we ought react to what we believe is now making an argument as a Christian? Lo

Even though I made it known to you that I am not making a case for God but simply making a case from the ignorance of the man about his faith you still don't get it. Is this wisdom or deliberate ignorance? From this perspective, I showed you how the Christian will view the ectopic pregnancy but you still attack me like I'm making a case for absolute truth. So what do you want me to do now? To argue on the morality of the Christain God's actions and will or to argue on the man's understanding of his faith like I've been doing with wiegraf? Tell me.

PastorAIO:


you're spouting nonsense menh, abeg forget it.

Reyginus:
Lol@mehn. Superior logic should have substituted ad hominems.

ad hominem
ad ˈhɒmɪnɛm/
adverb & adjective
1.
(of an argument or reaction) directed against a person rather than the position they are maintaining.
"an ad hominem response"
2.
relating to or associated with a particular person.
"the office was created ad hominem for Fenton"

PastorAIO:



- Google.


We're all learning

Reyginus:
You are spouting nonsense mehn, abeg forget it.

PastorAIO:


Thank you for addressing the content of my post (however erroneously) and not my person or my character. I couldn't possibly accuse you of Ad hominems on the basis of that cos I actually know the meaning of the term.

wiegraf:


It's framed as a question, but I mean the usual; selfish, self-serving, hypocritical etc

Most religious people seem to think the universe literally revolves around them. they're the stars in a cosmic version of big brother and their actions are good. Only their right is right, and god has ordained them to enforce this right. god perhaps may have mercy on anyone who stands in their way, or exact "fair" judgment by roasting them forever.

With the judeoxtians in particular, the above view is very justifiable. Supremacist ideologies with a god to back you up? Well, that's the end result.

And no, "turn the other cheek" and the likes mitigate nothing. the core itself is rotten once it allows for concepts like hell fire, original sin and, of course, the aforementioned supremacy and selfishness. Let's not even get into the OT.

There are more benign religions than the abrahamics, but you find quite a lot of them have its adherents as the stars of the universe.

Btw, can you unequivocally state that the man wasn't being a true xtian?

PastorAIO:
Thank you. Your points are well taken.

There is a slight difference between your cases and mine. The muslims in your example and the christian in the OP believe themselves to be doing good when they kill. They even broadcast the deeds.

The issue of an absolute Good and Evil, Morality palava, is another whole can of worms that I might get into when I fancy giving myself a headache.

In the case I was discussing though the subject already believes an action to be evil and denounces such action when he sees others doing it, yet he does the same.

If muslims fought against slavery too then they would fit in the case I'm talking about. If they were against war in their rhetoric (maybe they are, I don't know) then they would fit.

PastorAIO:
I don't think that religion in and of itself is a cause of many human evils.

oga steve:

With or without religion, you would have good people doing good things and evil people doing evil things. But for good people to do evil things, that takes religion.

PastorAIO:

What other traits of the religious mind might you say you've missed out? I think a couple more have been quite salient over the course of this thread.

Reyginus:
Infanticide? No. It is simply killing of a fetus. Now telling me, is killing of a fetus good or bad?

Reyginus:

Yeah. Terminating the creation of God for the glorification of self and not Gos is evil. That's according to the Christian bible. Try Lev 24:17

wiegraf:


If the mother doesn't want it in her: YES



You said you wouldn't do my work for me, yet you did it for the pastor??

I'm hurt

Reyginus:
Lol. I was simply trying to correct his idea on where I'm standing. So tell me, in what way is the man right according to the Christian bible?

wiegraf:

Btw. When I say yes, I mean she is morally justified in terminating the pregnancy. Hurriedly typed that without editing.

In other words, NO, it is not evil



You've already shown how.....

Reyginus:
Don't tell me you are clutching at Ectopic Pregnancy. Show me where I did.

Reyginus:

Yeah. Terminating the creation of God for the glorification of self and not Gos is evil. That's according to the Christian bible. Try Lev 24:17

Reyginus:

The simple fact that taking the innocent fetus's life is wrong settles it.

wiegraf:


Ectopic pregnancy is an excellent example as well, a great one that highlights quite a lot of hypocrisy in your case, especially when used in tandem with other stuff you've said. However, I used something else. Didn't you see it??



Even lines like this don't help your case



You say it isn't infanticide and just a fetus. If so, exactly what's evil about terminating it?

I mean, if you consider that termination of life (for glorification of self?), then do you cry every time you ma@turbate?

Reyginus:
You speak like a fetus itself is not a life. Infancy is simply another stage in the life of a human. So your question is like asking what's wrong with the termination of life. Do you agree? Yes or No.

wiegraf:


termination of what kind of life? Be clear....

Again, is abortion infanticide? You now seem to be equating fetal development stages to infancy, or as a part of it. Make up your mind abeg....

Btw, as far as abortion is concerned, the simple fact that it's the woman's body settles it. But I'll play along with your trying to paint it as some sort of murder.

Reyginus:
Lol. You seem not to understand. Get this clear now.

Infancy is not the same thing as fetal life. Life doesn't begin at infancy. Infanticide is the killing of infants. Mind you an infant is not in the womb. So you infanticide cannot be abortion but murder of an infant.
Before I continue, do you have any objection to the above?

wiegraf:

When does life begin?

Reyginus:
At the point of fertilization to form a zygote.