And the woman already named her child "Angela". Yet there are hindus in Pakistan. They were not killed. There are hindus in Bangladesh. They are not killed. Or why would one be killed and the others are not, if killing apostate is the rule in Islam?

A woman named her child Angela, and yet so many left Islam and still gling to their Muslim names. I wonder why? $Osisi, if I were to list all "supposed" atrocities of Christian Igbos or Amharri of Ethiopia against Muslims, would I be correct? At least it was a known fact that during Haile Sallaisse rules, the Christian authorities used to wager between themselves with whatever was in the belly of the pregnant Muslim woman! One will say its a boy. The other will say its a girl. And they will without any warning slash her belly open! And out comes the baby. Mother and baby losing their lives.

That happened in the 80s, still you know. It ended with the overthrow of the tyrannical monarch. This is Christianity for you, since it was under reported in the west, it was not an issue.

Afrikaan Dutch of South African used the Bible to oppress the total citizenry of South Africa. The last I check, there were Muslims among them. Just because Muslims did not cry foul shows the great convictions and the steadiness of their faith. Hootsie and Tootsie killed each other as Christians. While the big white Pastors and reverends were escaping the carnage leaving their worshippers to fend for themselves, without any quams about this callous behavior for a godly man, the Muslims were the far flung oasis of rescue that many Christians had! Go read about it or ask somebody who know better, without your biased underlinings.


People leave Noetic alone. His condition is so chaotic.

oyb:

see this olodo

your matriach is talking about apostates
are you really too stupid to comprehend what she is posting?

if you want to get into slaying unbelievers - theres plenty in your bible that endorses it abi you've forgotten Leviticus and how your hero dawoda nackson was defending the rape of women captured in war 

the christian way - throw all the mud you can - some may stick 

whats the difference? an apostates becomes an islamic "unbeliever", are u so dumb?

allah has repeatedly asked u to kill . , . .so whats the difference?

oyb:

see this olodo

your matriach is talking about apostates
are you really too stupid to comprehend what she is posting?

if you want to get into slaying unbelievers - theres plenty in your bible that endorses it abi you've forgotten Leviticus and how your hero dawoda nackson was defending the rape of women captured in war  

the christian way - throw all the mud you can - some may stick  

You are the olodo
Noetic never told you he was a Christian,did he?
are those not killings nevertheless.
Get ready to be embarrased

eh noetic of the why i am not a muslim, why i am not an atheist, why i am a christian threads

abi you spend so much time on islam for muslims that you are confusing him with tudor ?

are those not killings nevertheless.

if you want to go by that, theres plenty in leviticus that sanctions killing of unbelievers - yeah i know - old testament /for jews ( until its time for an eye for an eye, spare the rod, sodom and gomorah. . . )

let's start with the hadiths first of all,let me pre empt the apologists here.
The hadith is not authentic
The hadith is not the Koran
blah bla blah.
Every good Muslim knows that the hadiths which are recordings and actions of Mohammed are the second most important Muslim writings besides the Koran and they are of importance.

see this from an Islamic website
The Importance of Hadith in Islam

By  Prof. Shahul Hameed

Consultant to IslamOnline.net — India


The two fundamental sources of Islam are the Qur'an (the word of God) and the Sunnah (the example) of the Prophet (peace and blessings be upon him). By Sunnah, we mean the actions, sayings and silent permissions (or disapprovals) of the Prophet.
The word "Sunnah" is also used to refer to religious duties that are optional. Here, we are concerned with Sunnah in the sense of the recorded sayings (Hadiths) of Prophet Muhammad (peace and blessings be upon him). In this sense, Hadith is considered to be second to the Qur'an. It is impossible to understand the Qur'an without reference to the Hadith; and it is impossible to explain a hadith without relating it to the Qur'an.

The Qur'an is the message, while the Hadith is the verbal translation of the message into pragmatic terms, as exemplified by the Prophet. While the Qur'an is the metaphysical basis of the Sunnah, the Sunnah is the practical demonstration of the precepts laid down in the Qur'an.

So now that we got that message out of the way,let us proceed,shall we?

First.

Ali burnt some people and this news reached Ibn ‘Abbas, who said, “Had I been in his place I would not have burnt them, as the Prophet said, ‘Don’t punish (anybody) with Allah’s Punishment.’ [i.e., only God can burn someone with fire in hell.] No doubt, I would have killed them, for the Prophet [Mohammed] said, ‘If somebody (a Muslim) discards his religion, kill him.’” Volume 4, Book 52, Number 260


are you also calling the prophet a liar since the schools of thought are all lying through their teeth
oyb and mukina please respond
Is mohammed making a cultural or an Islamic statement?

Qur'an (4:89) - "They but wish that ye should reject Faith, as they do, and thus be on the same footing (as they): But take not friends from their ranks until they flee in the way of Allah (From what is forbidden). But if they turn renegades, seize them and slay them wherever ye find them"

The following are from the hadith:

Bukhari (52:260) - ", The Prophet said, 'If somebody (a Muslim) discards his religion, kill him.' "

Bukhari (83:37) - "Allah's Apostle never killed anyone except in one of the following three situations: (1) A person who killed somebody unjustly, was killed (in Qisas,) (2) a married person who committed illegal sexual intercourse and (3) a man who fought against Allah and His Apostle and deserted Islam and became an apostate."



Bukhari (84:57) - "[In the words of] Allah's Apostle, 'Whoever changed his Islamic religion, then kill him.'"

[b]Bukhari (89:271) - A man who embraces Islam, then reverts to Judaism is to be killed according to "the verdict of Allah and his apostle."

Bukhari (84:58) - "There was a fettered man beside Abu Muisa. Mu'adh asked, 'Who is this (man)?'  Abu Muisa said, 'He was a Jew and became a Muslim and then reverted back to Judaism.'  Then Abu Muisa requested Mu'adh to sit down but Mu'adh said, 'I will not sit down till he has been killed. This is the judgment of Allah and His Apostle (for such cases) and repeated it thrice.'  Then Abu Musa ordered that the man be killed, and he was killed. Abu Musa added, 'Then we discussed the night prayers'"

Bukhari (84:64-65) - "Allah's Apostle: 'During the last days there will appear some young foolish people who will say the best words but their faith will not go beyond their throats (i.e. they will have no faith) and will go out from (leave) their religion as an arrow goes out of the game. So, wherever you find them, kill them, for whoever kills them shall have reward on the Day of Resurrection.'"

[/b]

do u want more?

Bomb #1 by Osisi.

OH my dear noetic,why did you release all our arsenal at once
why not give it to them one by one
and give them a chance to respond?

I am sorry about that . . . . .I just dont want them to continue deceiving themselves

but dont be surprised if olabowale comes out with a long sermon now

noetic2:

I am sorry about that . . . . .I just dont want them to continue deceiving themselves

but dont be surprised if olabowale comes out with a long sermon now

We shall call it the sermon on the Kabba

I would have left this thread if they admitted to the fact that Islam says to kill apostates but when they denied it and even went as far as calling the killings cultural and saying that Mohammed would never have killed apostates,I decided to tell the readers the truth about Islam and it's prophet.

Osisi dem send you?

Allah's Apostle sent us in a mission (i.e. am army-unit) and said, "If you find so-and-so and so-and-so, burn both of them with fire." When we intended to depart, Allah's Apostle said, "I have ordered you to burn so-and-so and so-and-so, and it is none but Allah Who punishes with fire, so, if you find them, kill them."


Narrated Ikrima


Ali burnt some people and this news reached Ibn Abbas, who said, "Had I been in his place I would not have burnt them, as the Prophet said, 'Don't punish (anybody) with Allah's Punishment.' No doubt, I would have killed them, for the Prophet said, 'If somebody (a Muslim) discards his religion, kill him.' "

this is the hadith and the one preceding it . obviously this was during war. a muslim who turned apostate at this time would have sold the muslims out to the Quraiysh . end of story. or perhaps traitors are treated mercifully in wartime?

you do realise that until the return to Mecca, Muslims were basically at war with the quraish, and that anyone who was a muslim and who reconverted would have sold them out?

noetic, i have an electronic hadith here. i found osisis hadith, but i can't find your own.  

get back to your website and get the proper refernces , if you can

bukari 4.83 - The Prophet said, "Plague is the cause of martyrdom of every Muslim (who dies because of it)."

bukari 4.84 - When the Divine Inspiration: "Those of the believers who sit (at home)," was revealed the Prophet sent for Zaid (bin Thabit) who came with a shoulder-blade and wrote on it. Ibn Um-Maktum complained about his blindness and on that the following revelation
came: "Not equal are those believers who sit (at home) except those who are disabled (by injury, or are blind or lame etc.) and those who strive hard and fight in the Way of Allah with their wealth and lives)." (4.95)

bukari 4.89 The Prophet went on carrying (i.e. the earth) and saying, "Without You (O Allah!) we would have got no guidance."

noetic, maybe your matriach needs teach you how to proprly peruse Islam bashing websites

these are the hadiths in bukari you refernced . . .unless there's something i'm doing wrong before you come out with your taqiyya etal

oyb:



this is the hadith and the one preceding it . obviously this was during war. a muslim who turned apostate at this time would have sold the muslims out to the Quraiysh . end of story. or perhaps traitors are treated mercifully in wartime?

you do realise that until the return to Mecca, Muslims were basically at war with the quraish, and that anyone who was a muslim and who reconverted would have sold them out?

noetic, i have an electronic hadith here. i found osisis hadith, but i can't find your own.  

get back to your website and get the proper refernces , if you can

when is islam never in war? allah and mohammedans are always fighting. My only problem is that their victims are defenceless people.

oyb:




noetic, maybe your matriach needs teach you how to proprly peruse Islam bashing websites

these are the hadiths in bukari you refernced . . .unless there's something i'm doing wrong before you come out with your taqiyya etal

what are thou talking about?

debosky:

Osisi dem send you?

I hate when Muslims parade the "there's no compulsion",Islam,Islam is a peaceful religion nonsense.
People need to know the truth and relate the current happening with the teachings and lifestyles of mohammed and stop calling Muslim killers extremists.
They are just Muslims
They are doing what Mohammed taught them to do.

oyb:



this is the hadith and the one preceding it . obviously this was during war. a muslim who turned apostate at this time would have sold the muslims out to the Quraiysh . end of story. or perhaps traitors are treated mercifully in wartime?

you do realise that until the return to Mecca, Muslims were basically at war with the quraish, and that anyone who was a muslim and who reconverted would have sold them out?

noetic, i have an electronic hadith here. i found osisis hadith, but i can't find your own.

get back to your website and get the proper refernces , if you can

Your explanation is pediatric at best.
so in a war anyone who leaves Islam should be killed?
I thought you said apostate killing was Unislamic?
so in wars,it's allowed?
You folks are hilarious
Now give me proof that the killing is only allowed in war times since you want your readers to believe that apostates are never killed in Islam except in war situations.

when is islam never at war? Read the quran . . . the answer is there.

oyb's quote.

Allah's Apostle sent us in a mission (i.e. am army-unit) and said, "If you find so-and-so and so-and-so, burn both of them with fire." When we intended to depart, Allah's Apostle said, "I have ordered you to burn so-and-so and so-and-so, and it is none but Allah Who punishes with fire, so, if you find them, kill them."

Narrated Ikrima


Ali burnt some people and this news reached Ibn Abbas, who said, "Had I been in his place I would not have burnt them, as the Prophet said, 'Don't punish (anybody) with Allah's Punishment.' No doubt, I would have killed them, for the Prophet said, 'If somebody (a Muslim) discards his religion, kill him.' "


First of all the passage says Mohammed sent them on a mission.
and specifically tells them the target of his so called mission
He was the aggressor.
He sent foot soldiers with specific instruction to hunt down and burn apostates.
so that is the war eh kwa?
His men went on a mission to kill people and you call it war?
Thank God the people reading these things have a brain

davidylan:

when is islam never at war? Read the quran . . . the answer is there.

Don't mind them.
Some of them may be sharpening their machetes as we type.
They are in an everlasting war until everyone bows to allah
Isn't that their mission.
If pleading doesn't do it, they bring out a sword.

Bukhari (84:58) - "There was a fettered man beside Abu Muisa. Mu'adh asked, 'Who is this (man)?'  Abu Muisa said, 'He was a Jew and became a Muslim and then reverted back to Judaism.'  Then Abu Muisa requested Mu'adh to sit down but Mu'adh said, 'I will not sit down till he has been killed. This is the judgment of Allah and His Apostle (for such cases) and repeated it thrice.'  Then Abu Musa ordered that the man be killed, and he was killed. Abu Musa added, 'Then we discussed the night prayers'"


so what war was going on in the above?
The man was chained
and his crime was leaving Islam and going back to his Judaism faith and someone swore that the man must be punished with allah's punishment.
Allahs' punishment of killing apostates?
where is Mukina
Is she reading along?
These animals killed a man and then discussed prayers?
Prayers to allah
where all of una dey?
una don run comot?

$osisi:

Don't mind them.
Some of them may be sharpening their machetes as we type.
They are in an everlasting war until everyone bows to allah
Isn't that their mission.
If pleading doesn't do it, they bring out a sword.

I wonder why they cant just pray to allah to help convert people?

does allah take pleasure in spilling blood always?

noetic2:

I wonder why they cant just pray to allah to help convert people?

does allah take pleasure in spilling blood always?

perhaps they also know allah isnt listening?

@$Osisi: David, if you wish you can participate. You too, Noetic. I expect chaotic answer from you.

My question to you is this; what condition will make Christianity kill anyone? see. I di not give you a long sermon. I need direct answer, please. Be generous in your entry. We want to know if there is any or no condition that will warrant any one losing his/her life as a Christian or not! Thanks.

olabowale:

@$Osisi: David, if you wish you can participate. You too, Noetic. I expect chaotic answer from you.

My question to you is this; what condition will make Christianity kill anyone? see. I di not give you a long sermon. I need direct answer, please. Be generous in your entry. We want to know if there is any or no condition that will warrant any one losing his/her life as a Christian or not! Thanks.

There is NO condition for a christian to kill another:

Matthew 5:44 But I say unto you, Love your enemies, bless them that curse you, do good to them that hate you, and pray for them which despitefully use you, and persecute you;

olabowale:

@$Osisi: David, if you wish you can participate. You too, Noetic. I expect chaotic answer from you.

My question to you is this; what condition will make Christianity kill anyone? see. I di not give you a long sermon. I need direct answer, please. Be generous in your entry. We want to know if there is any or no condition that will warrant any one losing his/her life as a Christian or not! Thanks.

havent u heard, Jesus said, love ur enemies, pray for them.

mohammed and allah said, chase them and kill them.

So what you are saying is that in the history of Christianit, no one has been killed for any reason. Correct?


If I can provide from the Bible, the injuction to kill by Jesus, then you are a liar. Right?

If I can provide from the History of mankind, since there is something known as Christianity, that a Christian have killed anyone, then you are a liar?

Do you agree, or is this one of your deny it and stick to denial whatever the case may be? I want you to set your own noose. Its very easy.

olabowale:

@$Osisi: David, if you wish you can participate. You too, Noetic. I expect chaotic answer from you.

My question to you is this; what condition will make Christianity kill anyone? see. I di not give you a long sermon. I need direct answer, please. Be generous in your entry. We want to know if there is any or no condition that will warrant any one losing his/her life as a Christian or not! Thanks.

Have we concluded the topic at hand?
Remember you folks denied my initial posts until the truth stared you in the face
start a topic on Christianity ,Christ and killings and I promise to answer you.
Don't derail this one

$osisi:


Have we concluded the topic at hand?
Remember you folks denied my initial posts until the truth stared you in the face
start a topic on Christianity ,Christ and killings and I promise to answer you.
Don't derail this one

Osisi dont mind them, the only answer they have is this - If I can provide from the Bible, the injuction to kill by Jesus

olabowale:

So what you are saying is that in the history of Christianit, no one has been killed for any reason. Correct?


If I can provide from the Bible, the injuction to kill by Jesus, then you are a liar. Right?

If I can provide from the History of mankind, since there is something known as Christianity, that a Christian have killed anyone, then you are a liar?

Do you agree, or is this one of your deny it and stick to denial whatever the case may be? I want you to set your own noose. Its very easy.

Go ahead olabowale . . . i'm waiting to read from you.

As if your bible is true- go get me ur original bible and i will prove it to u, d bible of paul is compiled to suit man

Jesus said luke 19:27 As for these enemies of mine who did not want me to reign over them, bring them here & slay them

This same verse was d one d xtrians justify by persecuting and torturing those who reject xtrianity in d middle ages