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Does MMR Cause Autism? by benjibabs(m): 6:25pm On Dec 16, 2016
Below is a publication by Dr. Natasha Campbell-McBride MD. With the rise in autism and all the unknowns that surround it, I believe her perspective is worth taking note of. She is the creator of the GAPS diet, a Natural Digestive Healing. And before you dismiss this as another money-making diet program, just read the piece below. Gut and Psychology Syndrome (GAP Syndrome or GAPS) is a condition, which establishes a connection between the functions of the digestive system and the brain. This term was created by Dr Natasha Campbell-McBride, MD, MMedSci (neurology), MMedSci (human nutrition) in 2004 after working with hundreds of children and adults with neurological and psychiatric conditions, such as autistic spectrum disorders, attention deficit hyperactivity disorder (ADHD/ADD), schizophrenia, dyslexia, dyspraxia, depression, obsessive –compulsive disorder, bi-polar disorder and other neuro-psychological and psychiatric problems.


Does MMR cause autism?

Talking about autism it is impossible to avoid the issue of the MMR vaccine and vaccination in general. I my practice I see some parents of autistic children who would link their child's disorder with MMR vaccine where many can not make this connection. Following research by Dr. Wakefield there has been a lot of publicity on this subject. The government has put a lot of effort and money into convincing the public that MMR vaccine is safe. While the MMR vaccine was in the lime light, other vaccines got questioned as well, due to the fact that many of them contain Thimerosal, a Mercury compound. Others are new and have not been tested long enough, yet apparently the number of unreported complications from these vaccines is much higher than anybody would expect. On top of all this we have to remember that vaccines are commercial products made with profit in mind. Is it true that the 3 million pounds which the government recently spent on MMR promotion were paid for by the companies who have a commercial interest in this vaccine?

So, does MMR cause autism?

I do not believe that things are so simple. Here we have to look at autism as a whole picture and vaccination as a whole.

Let us have a look at what is happening to children in our modern society. If you look around, how many healthy children would you see? Childhood asthma, eczema, diabetes, allergies, hay fever, digestive disorders, ADHD and autistic spectrum disorders have all gained epidemic proportions! The majority of siblings of autistic children have eczema, asthma or another one of those disorders. And though all these health problems appear to be different, they have one thing in common. A very big thing - a compromised immune system with suppressed Th1 and overactive Th2 parts of the immunity. These two opposing arms of the immune system normally should be in balance. But in these children they are out of balance reducing the body's ability to fight infections and predisposing the child to allergies and autoimmune reactions. A
compromised immune system is not going to react to environmental insults in the normal way! Vaccination is a huge insult for the immune system. The manufacturers of vaccines produce them for children with normal immune systems which will react to these vaccines in a normal way. And perhaps 50 or even less years ago the majority of children had normal immune systems, so vaccination was producing the expected
results of protection against infections without any harm for the body. However, in our modern society with our modern way of life we are rapidly moving to a situation where a growing proportion of children do not have a normal immune system and will not produce an expected reaction to the vaccine. In some of these children vaccination, putting an enormous strain on an already compromised immune system,
becomes that "last straw which breaks the camel's back" and brings on the beginning of autism, asthma, eczema, diabetes, etc.. In other children, whose immune system is compromised to a lesser degree, vaccination will not start the disorder, but it will deepen the damage and move the child closer to it.

But what makes the immune system compromised? What is it in our modern life styles that does this damage?

There are a number of factors which play their part in damaging the delicate balance of the immune system, but some major factors deserve particular attention:

1. Gut Dysbiosis.
2. Use of antibiotics, steroids and other drugs.
3. Consumption of sugar and processed foods.
4. Consumption of trans-fatty acids.
5. Food additives.

Let's look at some of these factors in detail.

1. Gut Dysbiosis.

Not everybody is aware that our bodies are a home to huge numbers of bacteria, viruses, fungi and other microbes. In a healthy body this micro-world is properly balanced and fulfils a whole host of beneficial functions, without which we would not be healthy. The largest population of microbes, called gut flora, live in our digestive systems. The gut wall with its microbial flora has been described as "the right hand" of the immune system. If the bacterial layer is damaged or worse than that, abnormal, then your immune system is trying to function with its right hand chopped off.

Let us have a look at some details.

· The epithelial surface of the colon is inhabited by huge numbers of bacteria, and can be truly described as a "cradle" of the immune system, both systemic and mucosal. The beneficial bacteria in the colon, engage lymphoid tissue of the gut wall and take part in the production of huge numbers of immunoglobulins. For example, in the cell wall of Bifidobacteria, one of the major inhabitant groups of a healthy gut flora, there is a substance called Muramil Dipeptide, which activates synthesis of B and T-Lymphocytes. As a result, a healthy gut wall is literally infiltrated, jam packed with B and T Lymphocytes, ready to protect the body from any invader. Your digestive system is a major gate into the body and needs good guarding.

· The beneficial flora of the gut has got a pronounced anti-viral activity. They take part in the synthesis of such anti-viral substances as interferon, lizocym and surfactins, which dissolve the membranes of lipid envelope viruses. The food and drink which we consume are full of disease causing viruses, but the healthy gut flora would not allow them to take hold in your body.

· Immunoglobulin A is a substance which is secreted by the gut wall into the gut lumen in response to new food arriving from the stomach. It is the immune system's way of dealing with the unwelcome invaders coming with food and drink. Fairly soon after being excreted the Immunoglobulin A naturally degrades. The beneficial bacteria in the gut slow down this degradation, allowing the Immunoglobulin A more time to do its work.

· Healthy gut flora absorb considerable amounts of heavy metals, phenols, formaldehyde and other toxic substances, acting as natural chelators and protecting the immune system from them. It is known that the immune system is particularly vulnerable to these substances. As a result of all this activity your healthy gut flora keeps the two major arms of the immune system, the Th1 and Th2 immunity, in proper balance. The condition, when the gut flora is not healthy, is called - Gut Dysbiosis. In this condition the beneficial bacteria in the gut are damaged or eradicated.

As a result the gut wall gets taken over by a large number of pathogenic and opportunistic bacteria, viruses, fungi and parasites, all producing very toxic substances. The digestion and absorption of food becomes abnormal, the gut wall becomes damaged and "leaky". But most importantly, as we are concentrating on the immune system here, the person with gut Dysbiosis becomes immune-compromised.

A number of factors in our modern life styles can damage the delicate balance of the gut flora. Antibiotics and steroids are major contributors, consumption of processed foods, a toxic environment, prolonged stress, etc.

Here we are talking about vaccination, so we need to look at babies' and children's gut flora. Babies get their gut flora from the mother. So, if the mother does not have healthy bodily flora, then the baby will not have it either. Widespread use of the contraceptive pill (steroids) in young girls damages the gut flora. When it is combined with regular consumption of processed sugary foods and antibiotics, then the damage gets deeper. The majority of mothers of immune-compromised children with eczema, asthma, learning disabilities, etc. show symptoms of Gut Dysbiosis, such as digestive problems, allergies, skin problems, PMS, migraines, thrush, or simply chronic lack of energy. After the baby is born the breast milk promotes the process of populating the gut wall with appropriate bacteria. Formula milk does not fulfil this function. So, breast again is the best. However, in cases when the mother has a considerable Gut Dysbiosis with an overgrowth of abnormal bacteria, fungi, viruses and parasites in her gut, she will be excreting their toxins in her milk. A lot of these toxins have an opioid structure and act on the brain as real opioids would do. In these cases the mothers report that their baby would fall asleep on the breast after a couple of mouthfuls of this opioid rich milk. In other cases the baby refuses the breast or develops an allergic reaction. The recent research shows that the toxins, produced by abnormal gut flora, play a major role in development of autism.

The population of the gut wall with normal gut flora plays a major part in the appropriate development of the baby's immature immune system. If the gut flora is not normal then we can not expect a normal immune system. The breast milk provides a ready immune protection for the baby. So, while exclusively breast fed our babies can do quite well without properly developing gut flora, but when the breast feeding stops, it takes a few months for pathological symptoms to start appearing. This is exactly when the vaccination, and I mean any vaccination, may prove to be too much of an attack on an already compromised immune system.

2. Antibiotics and steroids, including contraceptive pills, and many other drugs apart from damaging the gut flora have a direct immune suppressing effect. Their wide spread use in mothers before and during pregnancy have a damaging effect on the immune system of the future baby. Antibiotics, taken by the mother during breast feeding, will pass to the baby through the milk and add to the damage of it's gut flora
and developing immune system.

3. 4. 5. Consumption of sugar and processed foods have a direct damaging effect on the immune system. On top of that these foods feed abnormal flora in the gut contributing to Gut Dysbiosis and hence to immune imbalance. Processed foods are a very poor source of nutrition and a very rich source of various toxic substances, like preservatives, colours, flavouring, aspartame, MSG, and all those E-numbers. Food
additives have been shown in a vast number of studies to have a detrimental effect on the immune system, brain chemistry, liver function, etc.. On top of that processed foods are a rich source of very harmful trans-fatty acids. Trans-fatty acids are unsaturated fatty acids with changed chemical structure. They have been shown to have a direct damaging effect on immune system. Children who are routinely fed on
crisps, sugary foods, soft drinks and meals out of tins and packets run a great risk of being immune-compromised.

Consumption of processed convenience foods, antibiotics, steroids, and the toxic environment are all features of our modern life style. Our children are paying the price for it. It is a fact that we can not afford to ignore!

So, my conclusion is that while MMR and other vaccines may not be the cause of autism, in immune compromised children they can do a lot of harm and in some children may well provide the trigger which starts the disorder.

Vaccination, which saved the lives of millions of children world-wide in the last century, is becoming dangerous thanks to changes in our lifestyles. The number of immune compromised children in developed countries is enormous and growing every day. It is time for the medical profession to review its attitude to vaccination. The cry "Vaccinate everybody!" has to change. Here is what I propose: a comprehensive immunological test has to be done with every baby before a decision about vaccination would be made. There are a number of very good tests already in existence to assess the state of one's immune system. These tests have to be put into an appropriate pre-vaccination panel for all babies and results of these tests have to be an essential part in the process for deciding which of the following steps to take:

· The standard vaccination protocol.
· Single vaccines only.
· Delayed vaccination until the results of the tests are better.
· No vaccination at all. A child presenting with eczema, asthma, digestive problems or any other disorder, which would indicate compromised immunity, should be a red flag not to vaccinate!

Those 3 million pounds which the government spent on promoting MMR might have been just enough to develop such a test panel, and in my opinion, a much more worthwhile investment in the future health of our nation.

Published in Issue 9 of The Autism File. February 2002

source: http://nebula.wsimg.com/d292bbf591c44d7fb1e660d5d4832a1e?AccessKeyId=2FD8067D3CA481BB9119&disposition=0&alloworigin=1
http://www.gapsdiet.com/resources.html


====
For those who do not know Dr. Natasha Campbell-McBride MD, you can read about her and her work on her website:

http://www.gapsdiet.com/about.html
Re: Does MMR Cause Autism? by Onegai(f): 8:05pm On Dec 16, 2016
Well, a lot of this is a localised issue in my opinion. Where are the worldwide studies showing corresponding rise in cases in Africa, Asia and Europe? Thats how you know MMR vaccine causes Autism. And I'm speaking from a place where I know a lot of anti-vaccers (who did their best to convince me) versus well-educated, practised medical siblings (who questioned my sanity if I refused our vaccines. One is on the forefront of Paediatric care in several African countries).

Nigeria is beginning to switch to a more processed, less organic lifestyle (how many of us have eaten Fresh fish this year or fresh chicken? How many of us will choose a leafy salad over rice and stew? How many of us exercise?). These are not Western ideas given to us, this is how our grandparents lived. Barring diseases from hygiene and poor cultural practises and other inherited illnesses, an average farmer in the 1940s had a high chance of living till 80 than a banker of today: he ate well, exercised well and had never tasted processed foods. So if you could survive Childhood, Malaria and Typhoid, your chances of growing old was high. And Agbo was effective (not whatever we drink now, the old school remedy).

Nowadays, the average Nigerian abuses Antibacterial meds. Drinking it like Tom-Tom. Any small illness a baby has, it's "break out the Augmentin!". If that doesn't work, "time to prescribe another antibiotic!". I constantly forward mums cases to my siblings and irritated, they ask them to ask their Drs to check for allergies instead. Same with Malaria meds and Painkillers: "I feel feverish, so heading to the Pharmacy to buy Coartem and Diclofenac". With all this, I expect more issues to rise in Nigeria.

As for the US, never have I seen a country which loves its medications like those guys. They have adverts for heavy medications running side-by-side with their most popular tv shows. Seriously, half way through "Jane the Virgin" will pop an Ad for medications for Asperger's, heart disease, frequent urination and more. The Pharma industry there has made a fortune off their For-Profit Healthcare. The nurses will stare at you and make snide comments when you refuse an epidural during labour (as you get wheeled in at 4cm dilation, they offer you that needle. Compare that to Naija). Because of all this, a huge distrust has grown in the mind of the public against Vaccines and meds, especially when the whole country seems to be diagnosing all sorts (I had a friend who had ADHD, a painkiller addiction due to an accident and I was forced to tell him that in Naija they would have recommended more Discipline as a child rather than meds to his parents). So there is a backlash against chemicals in everything and anti-vaccinations. And states are having to pass legislation forcing schoolkids to vaccinate.

So, will I trust the data from US Doctors? Not until I see corresponding data from other continents who have different lifestyles but show the same results. I live in Nigeria and we took all our vaccines but I try not to create a too-sterile environment around my kid. She plays outside, eats off the floor of the house, eats a lots of fruits and home-cooked meals as much as we can (but we aren't perfect), stays away from powder and we don't use Dettol. So far, she has had one cold once in her life and only got a skin reaction to sandflies.

Sensible decisions, side-by-side with Science. That's how we roll.

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Re: Does MMR Cause Autism? by Gerrard59(m): 11:01pm On Dec 16, 2016
Onegai:


Nowadays, the average Nigerian abuses Antibacterial meds. Drinking it like Tom-Tom. Any small illness a baby has, it's "break out the Augmentin!". If that doesn't work, "time to prescribe another antibiotic!". I constantly forward mums cases to my siblings and irritated, they ask them to ask their Drs to check for allergies instead. Same with Malaria meds and Painkillers: "I feel feverish, so heading to the Pharmacy to buy Coartem and Diclofenac". With all this, I expect more issues to rise in Nigeria.

As for the US, never have I seen a country which loves its medications like those guys. They have adverts for heavy medications running side-by-side with their most popular tv shows. Seriously, half way through "Jane the Virgin" will pop an Ad for medications for Asperger's, heart disease, frequent urination and more. The Pharma industry there has made a fortune off their For-Profit Healthcare. The nurses will stare at you and make snide comments when you refuse an epidural during labour (as you get wheeled in at 4cm dilation, they offer you that needle. Compare that to Naija). Because of all this, a huge distrust has grown in the mind of the public against Vaccines and meds, especially when the whole country seems to be diagnosing all sorts (I had a friend who had ADHD, a painkiller addiction due to an accident and I was forced to tell him that in Naija they would have recommended more Discipline as a child rather than meds to his parents). So there is a backlash against chemicals in everything and anti-vaccinations. And states are having to pass legislation forcing schoolkids to vaccinate.

[/b]So, will I trust the data from US Doctors? Not until I see corresponding data from other continents who have different lifestyles but show the same results[b]. I live in Nigeria and we took all our vaccines but I try not to create a too-sterile environment around my kid. She plays outside, eats off the floor of the house, eats a lots of fruits and home-cooked meals as much as we can (but we aren't perfect), stays away from powder and we don't use Dettol. So far, she has had one cold once in her life and only got a skin reaction to sandflies.

Sensible decisions, side-by-side with Science. That's how we roll.

Same thing I discussed with a Nairalander about the preponderance of Alzheimer's sufferers in the West compared to say Japan.
https://www.nairaland.com/3465690/world-health-organisation-trainee-programme/1#51118894

Talking about antibiotics, majority of Nigerians abuse it and it certainly has its effects - in the future. For instance, I once abused NSAIDS and it resulted in Peptic-ulcer - stopped taking antibiotics altogether.

About eating from the floor, reminds me of the topic "Hygiene Hypothesis"
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1838109/?page=2

However, permit me to ask: Any problem using powder, Dettol? I'm ignorant here.

Additionally, with the lifestyles my fellow Nigerians are living nowadays. Making a profit out of it seems the best thing to do. That's one of the reasons I like the pharma industry - make profits of people's lifestyle. Might seem unethical, but....

Your posts are educative. Greetings cool


Thanks OP, it's good reading something from a different perspective. Albeit, cure for autism has been intensified. Wonder when Africa will have something similar. Our mental health sector needs intensive research.

https://www.nibr.com/our-research/disease-areas/neuroscience
Re: Does MMR Cause Autism? by shaybebaby(f): 11:50pm On Dec 16, 2016
Gerrard59:


Same thing I discussed with a Nairalander about the preponderance of Alzheimer's sufferers in the West compared to say Japan.
https://www.nairaland.com/3465690/world-health-organisation-trainee-programme/1#51118894

Talking about antibiotics, majority of Nigerians abuse it and it certainly has its effects - in the future. For instance, I once abused NSAIDS and it resulted in Peptic-ulcer - stopped taking antibiotics altogether.

About eating from the floor, reminds me of the topic "Hygiene Hypothesis"
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1838109/?page=2

However, permit me to ask: Any problem using powder, Dettol? I'm ignorant here.

Additionally, with the lifestyles my fellow Nigerians are living nowadays. Making a profit out of it seems the best thing to do. That's one of the reasons I like the pharma industry - make profits of people's lifestyle. Might seem unethical, but....

Your posts are educative. Greetings cool



Thanks OP, it's good reading something from a different perspective. Albeit, cure for autism has been intensified. Wonder when Africa will have something similar. Our mental health sector needs intensive research.

https://www.nibr.com/our-research/disease-areas/neuroscience
There is no cure for autism. It is a lifelong neurodisability which can be managed.
Re: Does MMR Cause Autism? by Onegai(f): 7:01am On Dec 17, 2016
shaybebaby:

There is no cure for autism. It is a lifelong neurodisability which can be managed.

Do you think you are seeing or hearing of higher cases of a diagnosis of Autism where you are?
Re: Does MMR Cause Autism? by Gerrard59(m): 8:18am On Dec 17, 2016
shaybebaby:

There is no cure for autism. It is a lifelong neurodisability which can be managed.

I actually meant research for the cure has been intensified. The neuroscientist in the link wants to find a cure.
Re: Does MMR Cause Autism? by shaybebaby(f): 10:10am On Dec 17, 2016
Onegai:


Do you think you are seeing or hearing of higher cases of a diagnosis of Autism where you are?
Hiya Hun, merry Christmas to you and family.

To answer your question, there are more diagnosis definitely but I think it's because it is actually recognised now as a disability and not just children being naughty or difficult.

The problem is that it is a hidden disability, no visual clues like Down's syndrome where it reflects in the appearance. So it was harder to diagnose. But there is help out there and where people were left without proper help because it wasn't recognised, now it is easier to support people living with it because there is greater awareness even if the condition is not fully understood as yet.

My son has a diagnosis so I live with it everyday. But it has been interesting to note that a lot of the behaviours he displays, I displayed them too as a child and to an extent as an adult, for instance toe-walking. I did that till my teens.
Re: Does MMR Cause Autism? by Onegai(f): 11:12am On Dec 17, 2016
Gerrard59, Powder and Dettol are not as safe as we think, especially for babies.

Powder particles are known to cause Respiratory issues in babies. Most paediatricians will recommend your baby goes powder-free. Cases are springing up that constant use of powder in the genital area leads to certain cancers (and that was so-called safe brands like Johnson's talcum). In my mum's era, you had Asthma and breathing issues because it was harmattan or it was inherited. Now, people with no history of that are having kids developing Asthma.

There are several studies that show that there is no evidence to prove Antibacterial soaps are better than regular soaps. Worse, Triclosan and Triclocarban and other chemicals in these soaps are being studied and early tests show that those things are hormone-disrupting. That's why the US FDA is banning those ingredients from soaps from 2017.
But take a look at the ingredients of Delta soap, Dettol soap and some other antibacterial soaps. And that is the first thing Mummy and Daddy will use for their kids once they start attending school. When regular soap works just fine and I say that as someone who cloth diapers.
And no-one on any Nigerian Regulatory Body is saying anything. Do they even do studies? Really, shouldn't they scrap almost all Science courses in Nigerian universities since they barely do any reseach or carry out studies?

I should have done a thread on this since but meh...
Re: Does MMR Cause Autism? by Onegai(f): 11:19am On Dec 17, 2016
Shaybebaby, Merry Christmas to you guys! smiley

It's interesting that you say a lot of his behaviours, you had them too with no diagnosis. BTW, I'm sure your little man is going to grow up wonderfully too smiley

My friend with ADHD, once he was given that diagnosis, it became a crutch for his parents: "he's like that because he's suffering, hormonal imbalance, he can't help himself" became their song. It helped them live with any guilt that arose from wondering if they were parenting properly. But I have nephews like him and 3 are currently adults and are doing fine, because no-one gave them that diagnosis and wrote any any prescription other than "cane, apply liberally" grin
Re: Does MMR Cause Autism? by shaybebaby(f): 11:44am On Dec 17, 2016
Onegai:
Shaybebaby, Merry Christmas to you guys! smiley

It's interesting that you say a lot of his behaviours, you had them too with no diagnosis. BTW, I'm sure your little man is going to grow up wonderfully too smiley

My friend with ADHD, once he was given that diagnosis, it became a crutch for his parents: "he's like that because he's suffering, hormonal imbalance, he can't help himself" became their song. It helped them live with any guilt that arose from wondering if they were parenting properly. But I have nephews like him and 3 are currently adults and are doing fine, because no-one gave them that diagnosis and wrote any any prescription other than "cane, apply liberally" grin
Lol@ cane being applied liberally. However in my opinion, making excuses based on a diagnosis and caning are two polar opposites. The former being inaction in the face of a problem and the latter being taking action albeit incorrectly.

Thing is there is no " one size-fits-all" approach. Just as we are individuals, same with neurodisability, same diagnosis but different personalities and responses to input. The key is to keep evolving to meet the child's needs.

My son is a very literal thinker, so in the summer, when he was naughty, I started smacking him. It worked for a while and then, he got to school and started clumping other kids... And me too.

I had to think, " how can I convey that hitting is bad, if I do the same to him?". I needed a rethink.
My solution: I had to understand the why, which was him craving attention from me, so being naughty was a way to get. The more attention he gets, the better his behaviour.

In all, it's not all doom and gloom, a reorientation of expectations and tons of patience is what is needed. And plenty of support, for them and for oneself.

Thank you for your wishes, I know he will grow up to be a fine young man.
Re: Does MMR Cause Autism? by Onegai(f): 12:04pm On Dec 17, 2016
shaybebaby:

Lol@ cane being applied liberally. However in my opinion, making excuses based on a diagnosis and caning are two polar opposites. The former being inaction in the face of a problem and the latter being taking action albeit incorrectly.

Thing is there is no " one size-fits-all" approach. Just as we are individuals, same with neurodisability, same diagnosis but different personalities and responses to input. The key is to keep evolving to meet the child's needs.

My son is a very literal thinker, so in the summer, when he was naughty, I started smacking him. It worked for a while and then, he got to school and started clumping other kids... And me too.

I had to think, " how can I convey that hitting is bad, if I do the same to him?". I needed a rethink.
My solution: I had to understand the why, which was him craving attention from me, so being naughty was a way to get. The more attention he gets, the better his behaviour.

In all, it's not all doom and gloom, a reorientation of expectations and tons of patience is what is needed. And plenty of support, for them and for oneself.

Thank you for your wishes, I know he will grow up to be a fine young man.


Ouch at him hitting back.

You are very correct, there is no "One-size fits all" method. I and Himself are not people who responded to caning or typical Nigerian parenting tactics (my favourite family member is the one who constantly talked to me in a calm, understanding voice. She ranks higher than my mum). On the other hand, I have a brother that Boarding School was the making of him. Baby E is the same: I think she's beginning to hit and it's not just naughtiness. I don't smack her that much (she knows her warning smacks and will even administer it to her hand when I ask her "are you being naughty?"wink. And she has a tendency to throw my phone away a lot. So 2017 will be the year of "Mummy not being glued to her handset all the time". I think she wants my full attention so I can applaud when she's using white crayon to complete her design masterpiece on the tv stand smiley.

That's why I query some of the diagnosis of mental issues I hear of in the US: what is normal? Your definition of "this is an abnormal child who has a mental issue" may be a Russian's definition of normal. Every child is different and requires different ways to handle their issues. Lord knows, I wasn't on the normal scale of the Nigerian child. But I think I'm normal...or am I...(duh duh duhhhhhh!!! grin)

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Re: Does MMR Cause Autism? by shaybebaby(f): 1:50pm On Dec 17, 2016
Onegai:



Ouch at him hitting back.

You are very correct, there is no "One-size fits all" method. I and Himself are not people who responded to caning or typical Nigerian parenting tactics (my favourite family member is the one who constantly talked to me in a calm, understanding voice. She ranks higher than my mum). On the other hand, I have a brother that Boarding School was the making of him. Baby E is the same: I think she's beginning to hit and it's not just naughtiness. I don't smack her that much (she knows her warning smacks and will even administer it to her hand when I ask her "are you being naughty?"wink. And she has a tendency to throw my phone away a lot. So 2017 will be the year of "Mummy not being glued to her handset all the time". I think she wants my full attention so I can applaud when she's using white crayon to complete her design masterpiece on the tv stand smiley.

That's why I query some of the diagnosis of mental issues I hear of in the US: what is normal? Your definition of "this is an abnormal child who has a mental issue" may be a Russian's definition of normal. Every child is different and requires different ways to handle their issues. Lord knows, I wasn't on the normal scale of the Nigerian child. But I think I'm normal...or am I...(duh duh duhhhhhh!!! grin)
Ofcourse she does, everything she does is fabulous and she doesn't want you to miss a moment of it. How old is the little diva? grin

The American way is very different to the English way of handling these issues. Americans medicate the children easily and ABA( applied behavioural analysis) is used widely.

Unfortunately that is not for me. I use positive reinforcement, modelling and intensive interaction coupled with lots of visual aids. The key thing is early intervention in all aspects and not burying one's head in the sand.

Enjoy your little madam, pay attention to everything( even when you need to borrow patience). Having my son has made me appreciate lots of things that other parents take for granted.

Regarding normal, normal is boring and overrated. Besides, generally, it's what is considered socially acceptable but then we know that changes with time. In the face of the ever changing definition of normal, nothing is really normal. tongue

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Re: Does MMR Cause Autism? by benjibabs(m): 8:28pm On Dec 19, 2016
Onegai:
Well, a lot of this is a localised issue in my opinion. Where are the worldwide studies showing corresponding rise in cases in Africa, Asia and Europe? Thats how you know MMR vaccine causes Autism. And I'm speaking from a place where I know a lot of anti-vaccers (who did their best to convince me) versus well-educated, practised medical siblings (who questioned my sanity if I refused our vaccines. One is on the forefront of Paediatric care in several African countries).


@ the bold portion, if you believe MMR causes autism, how would you explain a situation where a child who took MMR did not become autistic? And mind you, the children who did not become autistic after taking MMR far out number those who did. This is the reason Dr. Natasha's perspective got me. While I was a big fat OLODO in biology, I can relate perfectly well to the dr's logical explanation being an excellent IT guy who engages in troubleshooting on daily basis. I knew all along that there must be another factor since the result is not consistent in all cases.

It will make a whole lot of sense if they can come up with a way to confirm the strength of the kids immune system before giving vaccine. It is sad that the vaccine that is expected to protect is now causing even greater damage in certain situation.
Re: Does MMR Cause Autism? by benjibabs(m): 8:46pm On Dec 19, 2016
shaybebaby:

There is no cure for autism. It is a lifelong neurodisability which can be managed.

Dr Natasha's son was diagnosed autistic at three; today, he is a teenager without any symptoms of autism. She has also helped lots of family.

Read her story here: http://nebula.wsimg.com/4301052663bad7dc46768012684c001e?AccessKeyId=2FD8067D3CA481BB9119&disposition=0&alloworigin=1

I got that from "My son" article on the resource page on her website here - http://www.gapsdiet.com/resources.html

What do you think?
Re: Does MMR Cause Autism? by shaybebaby(f): 9:08pm On Dec 19, 2016
benjibabs:


Dr Natasha's son was diagnosed autistic at three; today, he is a teenager without any symptoms of autism. She has also helped lots of family.

Read her story here: http://nebula.wsimg.com/4301052663bad7dc46768012684c001e?AccessKeyId=2FD8067D3CA481BB9119&disposition=0&alloworigin=1

I got that from "My son" article on the resource page on her website here - http://www.gapsdiet.com/resources.html

What do you think?

I'll be reading that a bit later when my son goes to bed and will try to keep an open mind. I'll give my opinion afterwards.
Re: Does MMR Cause Autism? by Onegai(f): 9:28pm On Dec 19, 2016
shaybebaby:

I'll be reading that a bit later when my son goes to bed and will try to keep an open mind. I'll give my opinion afterwards.

You're a good person.

1 Like

Re: Does MMR Cause Autism? by shaybebaby(f): 10:45pm On Dec 19, 2016
benjibabs:


Dr Natasha's son was diagnosed autistic at three; today, he is a teenager without any symptoms of autism. She has also helped lots of family.

Read her story here: http://nebula.wsimg.com/4301052663bad7dc46768012684c001e?AccessKeyId=2FD8067D3CA481BB9119&disposition=0&alloworigin=1

I got that from "My son" article on the resource page on her website here - http://www.gapsdiet.com/resources.html

What do you think?

First, I will say from the little I have read that her son seems to have made tremendous strides and that is very encouraging.
However I will note that from her write up-he still displays autistic traits i.e still socially awkward, hyperactive etc.

There is one saying. "once you meet a person with autism, you have met just ONE". It's a very curious disability or should I say differently able in that yes there is the triad of impairment -speech, communication and social interaction but how it presents differs greatly: just like how we are all human beings, have the same biological make-up but yet very different as individuals.

She mentioned that ABA was used in conjunction with dietary approach. I do not subscribe to ABA, when i researched t, it reminded me Pavlov's theory and my son is NOT a dog to be trained to respond appropriately. I have always wanted to understand why things were required of me, if I had that understanding, it was easier for me to do as expected because it made sense.

Using that logic, I would rather not enforce conformity to socially accepted norms, but rather encourage creativity to help my son make sense of the world in a way that HE understands and not the way societal norms dictate.

She rightly mentioned that there is a link with the gut and that has been my experience too, my son is severely constipated but there is no firm link that has been proven to verify this. Probably because not all children with autism present this. Out of all the parents i have met, my son is the only one with chronic constipation and food sensory issues. The other kids eat like hoovers grin.

All children with autism make progress with the right intervention but no-one can say really what the outlook is in the longer term. For one, it is a neuro-developmental condition, we still understand very little of the human brain so it is hard to predict. In all, I could tell that even though she is highly qualified, we are two very different people when it comes to parenting our autistic children.

Her son goes to a mainstream school, I fought to get my son into a special school, never mind the stigma because I accept him, I want him to know he is different but be proud of his difference...and boy is he excelling. Yes he speech is delayed but we are getting there, but he reads, writes, spells brilliantly, is funny, has a great sense of humor, very loving and he's just 5..most of all..he very confident. That boy don't give a toss, he marches to his own rhythm and you know what? He gets the world much better than even I, his mummy.

In all, we all bring our personalities into parenting and that includes those of us with additional needs, i might not agree with her methods but I know she is doing what she feels is best for her child. But to free from autism? Nahhhh. People just develop better coping strategies.

4 Likes

Re: Does MMR Cause Autism? by shaybebaby(f): 10:46pm On Dec 19, 2016
Onegai:


You're a good person.
E-hugs honey. Thank you. kiss kiss

1 Like

Re: Does MMR Cause Autism? by benjibabs(m): 10:31pm On Dec 20, 2016
shaybebaby:

First, I will say from the little I have read that her son seems to have made tremendous strides and that is very encouraging.
However I will note that from her write up-he still displays autistic traits i.e still socially awkward, hyperactive etc.

There is one saying. "once you meet a person with autism, you have met just ONE". It's a very curious disability or should I say differently able in that yes there is the triad of impairment -speech, communication and social interaction but how it presents differs greatly: just like how we are all human beings, have the same biological make-up but yet very different as individuals.

She mentioned that ABA was used in conjunction with dietary approach. I do not subscribe to ABA, when i researched t, it reminded me Pavlov's theory and my son is NOT a dog to be trained to respond appropriately. I have always wanted to understand why things were required of me, if I had that understanding, it was easier for me to do as expected because it made sense.

Using that logic, I would rather not enforce conformity to socially accepted norms, but rather encourage creativity to help my son make sense of the world in a way that HE understands and not the way societal norms dictate.

She rightly mentioned that there is a link with the gut and that has been my experience too, my son is severely constipated but there is no firm link that has been proven to verify this. Probably because not all children with autism present this. Out of all the parents i have met, my son is the only one with chronic constipation and food sensory issues. The other kids eat like hoovers grin.

All children with autism make progress with the right intervention but no-one can say really what the outlook is in the longer term. For one, it is a neuro-developmental condition, we still understand very little of the human brain so it is hard to predict. In all, I could tell that even though she is highly qualified, we are two very different people when it comes to parenting our autistic children.

Her son goes to a mainstream school, I fought to get my son into a special school, never mind the stigma because I accept him, I want him to know he is different but be proud of his difference...and boy is he excelling. Yes he speech is delayed but we are getting there, but he reads, writes, spells brilliantly, is funny, has a great sense of humor, very loving and he's just 5..most of all..he very confident. That boy don't give a toss, he marches to his own rhythm and you know what? He gets the world much better than even I, his mummy.

In all, we all bring our personalities into parenting and that includes those of us with additional needs, i might not agree with her methods but I know she is doing what she feels is best for her child. But to free from autism? Nahhhh. People just develop better coping strategies.


You are right - every child is different, even those without autism. It seems you have a good grip on what to do to help your son. As long as you are getting the desired results, keep doing what you are doing. I pray for more grace and wisdom for you to continue to help him.

Thank you for sharing your opinion.
Re: Does MMR Cause Autism? by ba7man(m): 5:45am On Jan 27, 2017
shaybebaby:

E-hugs honey. Thank you. kiss kiss
You're welcome. smiley


You've abandoned your bro. cry

1 Like

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