femi4:
You are not talking to baby Christian. FYI, this is what the scripture said about Adam and Eve

Gen 2:25

Adam and his wife were both naked, and they felt no shame

Gen 3:7
Then the eyes of both of them were opened, and they realized they were naked; so they sewed fig leaves together and made coverings for themselves

Choose what you wish to believe, but I've told you what I now know.
Little children are notorious for trying to shed their clothes and run around naked. This is done with total innocence; the two-year-old does not see any difference between his face, his knees, and the parts of his body which we adults insist that he cover. Only adults feel that certain parts of the body must be covered. Why? Because those are connected with physical lust and passions, and should not be exposed.
Prior to their sin, Adam and Eve knew good from bad, right from wrong, but they had not internalized an evil inclination. So they could choose to do right and wrong, and were held responsible for their choices, but the urge to do evil did not come from within. This urge was represented by the serpent—the external tempter. Since the evil did not reside within them, they were "naturally" good, and their unclothedness was innocent and in no way sinful. They saw no difference between a hand, whose purpose was to give charity and to do good deeds, a mouth with which one praises GOD and says kind words to others, and the parts of the body which are used to "be fruitful and multiply." With every organ they could fulfill the will of GOD or vice versa, so no organ was shameful, nor did anything need to be covered.
When they ate of the Tree of Knowledge, the evil inclination became a part of them. No longer did they need an external tempter to incite them to sin—now, that tempter resided within their psyches. And specifically, sexual passion – a passion which is much stronger than the desire to give charity or praise G‑d, a passion which is much more encompassing and has the potential to be seriously misused – became a part of them as well.
Hence the abovementioned verse. "The eyes of both of them were opened" – they became aware of physical lust "and they realized that they were naked" – and only now it was inappropriate for them to be unclothed.

femi4:
Sorry, I didn't see that in my Bible

YAHWEH The Creator of the universe, created and covered birds with feathers, goats and lions with furs, will HE create Man in HIS Image Naked, NO. Read Psalm 8, He created Man a little lowered than the Angels and clad him with Glory.

frosbel2:


You cannot say you have given your children the freewill to choose when they know you will beat them with a whip if they step out of line. Many kids stay in line with their parents authority because of the fear of whipping or financial sanctions. Without any of these punishments, kids will in most cases choose their own way. Same thing with Christians, you cannot say we have freewill when one of the options involves spending an eternity in a place of endless torments , only a FOOL will do choose hell if it exists.

I have been a christian for over 30 years and most of what we learnt in so called church where simply rehashed roman myths and fables, it mostly bull sh.it.

Right from the get go, God has given us only two choices - LIFE or DEATH , anything else is a LIE.

Life or death, they are still choices. The freedom to choice either of the two is freewill. But think about this, love is what drives God to give us freewill. Freedom and liberty to choose when we can be coerced is the hallmark of love.
God is like a king, absolutely powerful, he gets his will done as he wishes. No one can resist him. Now he falls in love with a very beautiful lady, an epitome of beauty. A lady everyman desires to have. He showers great and wonderful gift on the woman, pick her from gutter, sent her to ivy league school without asking for anything in return, not even an ordinary kiss!.
When it was time for the woman to repay the man with allegiance and marry him, she claims to love another. And who is this other one? One of the subjects of the king. What makes it so painful was that the man the woman chose over the king is ragtag, mean and deceitful. The loving king out of love didn't stand on the way of the lady knowing the man in question can't care for her and would even demean her. He painfully and tearfully let her go to marry HIS SUBJECT. However, he always leave the door open, hoping and praying that before the marriage is consumated,the lady in question will see through the lies and return in time before it is too late. Once the marriage is consumated, it is final.
Is the king wicked in giving the woman freedom to choose despite his power to compel?
The king is God, man the beautiful lady, the wicked subject is the devil.

Freedom to allow others be themselves after we have given them what is within our capacity is the ultimate test of LOVE

Knowledge is freedom.. Freedom is freewill where did we come across knowledge... The apple Eve ate... Were we given free will No... But we took it for ourselves anyway...
The question is why God didn't take it back from us

CuteEmma:
There's free will... Buh it's less significant since both the beginning and ending have been fixed... So it's limited

Talking about hell, I really dunno if it actually exist, buh I'm stiff-necked sure that its no fiery furnace.... 'Cause it just doesn't make any sense that God created people just to burn 'em later,, as He knew right from the start, all those who wouldn't be able to hold strong...

For instance, If yhu know that 60 out of the 100 toys yhu want to create would malfunction, and still go ahead to create them, only with the intention of destroying 'em when they finally malfunction, kinda seems like a very insane plan..... I believe our conscience would be the judge and our hell too...

If yhu read the book of Jeremiah, you'd agree with me that we don't choose our destinies.. Perhaps Kidnapper Evans was fixed to distract Nigerians from the actual problem...

are you fix to click on this topic ? were do the thought of clicking on this topic come from ? if God fix you to worship Him, how do you get pleasures from this kind of worship ?

VargasVee:
We were all created with free will, now what good is it for us to have it if the intention was not for us to use it cause we'd go to hell if we stray?


I'm confused here.

Bros there is no hell

Or in other word hell is grave
Dead person don feel a dam pain,
Is not conscious.
Bros just think
How then will someone that is not conscoius and does not feel pain be roasting in fire and be crying. Use your brain

There is free will! definitely! thats why there is karma!!!
Good deeds atimes is equal to good things coming your way.

We always pay somehow for our deeds. Even when the person is dead. The children might still suffer or enjoy.

Use your free will well. Believe in God's existence.

[color=#006600][/color]

Proudlyngwa:

Freewill entails making decisions, with out making the right decisions, you can't overcome.

Now could you please answer the Op's question?

Iamthoney:
Now could you please answer the Op's question?

It has been answered by my first comment on this thread, if you need more explanation kindly say so.

What's up with the stupid memes

coolesmile:

That's an inaccurate viewpoint. Religion is a human conception. Man will hv to deal with his demagogue

joinnow:


Bros there is no hell

Or in other word hell is grave
Dead person don feel a dam pain,
Is not conscious.
Bros just think
How then will someone that is not conscoius and does not feel pain be roasting in fire and be crying. Use your brain

Which ideology tells you hell is not real?

This has really made a good read for me. Have learnt alot from both sides of the dabate. And in my own final analysis, I can only say that perhaps we have free will but we are not free to use it freely.

*drops mic*

malvisguy212:
are you fix to click on this topic ? were do the thought of clicking on this topic come from ? if God fix you to worship Him, how do you get pleasures from this kind of worship ?

I never said freewill doesn't exist,, it does.... Buh it's so so limited

So that we will not all be lying on the devil.


Mr. Devil: Give me a break!!!! You all have free will.

SHALOM!

VargasVee:
We were all created with free will, now what good is it for us to have it if the intention was not for us to use it cause we'd go to hell if we stray?

I'm confused here.

You are confused, only because you are Wicked and Stupid.

. JOB 28:28.

28. "And unto Man He Said,

'BEHOLD, THE FEAR OF THE LORD,
THAT IS WISDOM;
AND TO DEPART FROM EVIL,
IS UNDERSTANDING.' "

IF YOU DO NOT FEAR GOD, YOU ARE NOT WISE.

IF YOU DO NOT DEPART FROM EVIL, YOU WILL NOT BE ABLE TO UNDERSTAND.

. DEUTERONOMY 30:19-20.

19. I call Heaven and Earth to record
this day against you,
that I have set before you
Life and Death,
Blessing and Cursing:
therefore Choose Life,
that both thou
and thy seed may live:
20. That thou mayest love
The LORD thy God,
and that thou mayest obey His Voice,
and that thou mayest cleave unto Him:
for He is thy Life,
and the Length of thy days:
that thou mayest dwell in the land
which The LORD sware unto thy fathers,
to Abraham, to Isaac, and to Jacob,
to give them.

YOU HAVE A CHOICE BETWEEN LIFE AND DEATH.

God ABUNDANTLY Respects the Choice we make.

If we Choose LIFE, He will give It to us Abundantly.

If we choose Death, Abundance of THAT can be given to us, too.

. DEUTERONOMY 28:1-20.

AND it shall come to pass,
if thou shalt hearken diligently
unto The Voice of The LORD thy God,
to observe and to do
all His Commandments
Which I Command thee this day,
that the LORD thy God
will set thee on high
above all nations of the Earth.
2. And all these Blessings shall come on thee,
and overtake thee,
if thou shalt hearken unto
The Voice of The LORD thy God.
3. Blessed shalt thou be in the city,
and blessed shalt thou be in the field.
4. Blessed shall be the fruit of thy body,
and the fruit of thy ground,
and the fruit of thy cattle,
the increase of thy kine,
and the flocks of thy sheep.
5. Blessed shall be thy basket and thy store.
6. Blessed shalt thou be when thou comest in,
and blessed shalt thou be when thou goest out.
7. The LORD shall cause thine enemies
that rise up against thee to be smitten before thy face:
they shall come out against thee one way,
and flee before thee seven ways.
8. The LORD shall Command the Blessing
upon thee in thy storehouses,
and in all that thou settest thine hand unto;
and He shall Bless the
in the land which The LORD thy God giveth thee.
9. The LORD shall establish thee an Holy people unto Himself,
as he hath sworn unto thee,
if thou shalt keep The Commandments of The LORD thy God,
and walk in His Ways.
10. And all people of the Earth shall see
that thou art called by The Name of the LORD;
and they shall be afraid of thee.
11. And The LORD shall make thee
plenteous in goods,
in the fruit of thy body,
and in the fruit of thy cattle,
and in the fruit of thy ground,
in the land which The LORD sware unto thy fathers to give thee.
12. The LORD shall open unto thee
His Good Treasure,
the Heaven to give the rain
unto thy land in his season,
and to Bless all the Work of thine hand:
and thou shalt lend unto many nations,
and thou shalt not borrow.
13. And The LORD shall make thee the head,
and not the tail;
and thou shalt be above only,
and thou shalt not be beneath;
if that thou hearken unto The Commandments of The LORD thy God,
Which I Command thee this day,
to observe and to do them:
14. And thou shalt not go aside
from any of the Words
Which I Command thee this Day,
to the right hand,
or to the left,
to go after other gods to serve them.

15. But it shall come to pass,
if thou wilt not hearken unto The Voice of The LORD thy God,
to observe to do all His Commandments and His Statutes
Which I Command thee this Day;
That all these Curses shall come upon thee,
and overtake thee:

16. Cursed shalt thou be in the city,
and cursed shalt thou be in the field.
17. Cursed shall be thy basket and thy store.
18. Cursed shall be the fruit of thy body,
and the fruit of thy land,
the increase of thy kine,
and the flocks of thy sheep.
19. Cursed shalt thou be
when thou comest in,
and cursed shalt thou be
when thou goest out.

20. The LORD shall send upon thee
cursing, vexation, and rebuke,
in all that thou settest thine hand unto
for to do,
until thou be destroyed,
and until thou perish quickly;
because of the wickedness of thy doings,
whereby thou hast forsaken Me.

. PSALMS 34:15-22.

15. The Eyes of The LORD
are upon the Righteous,
and His ears are open unto their Cry.
16. The Face of The LORD is against them that do Evil,
to cut off the Remembrance of them from the Earth.
17. The Righteous Cry,
and the LORD Heareth,
and delivereth them
out of all their troubles.
18. The LORD is nigh unto them
that are of a broken heart;
and saveth such as be of a contrite spirit.
19. Many are the afflictions of the Righteous:
but The LORD delivereth him out of them all.
20. He keepeth all his bones:
not one of them is broken.
21. Evil shall slay the Wicked:
and they that hate the Righteous shall be desolate.
22. The LORD Redeemeth the soul of His Servants:
and none of them that trust in Him shall be desolate.

. LUKE 13:1-9.

THERE were present
at that season some that told him
of the Galilaeans,
whose blood Pilate had mingled
with their sacrifices.
2. and Jesus answering said unto them,
"Suppose ye that these Galilaeans
were Sinners above all the Galilaeans,
because they suffered such things?
3. "I tell you,

'NAY: BUT,
EXCEPT YE REPENT,
YE SHALL ALL
LIKEWISE PERISH.'

4. "Or those eighteen,
upon whom the tower in Siloam fell,
and slew them,
think ye that they
were Sinners above all men
that dwelt in Jerusalem?
5. "I tell you,

'NAY: BUT,
EXCEPT YE REPENT,
YE SHALL ALL
LIKEWISE PERISH.'

6. he spake also this Parable;

"A certain man had a fig tree
planted in his vineyard ;
and he came
and sought fruit thereon,
and found none.
7 . Then said he unto the dresser
of his vineyard ,

'BEHOLD, THESE THREE YEARS
I COME SEEKING FRUIT
ON THIS FIG TREE,
AND FIND NONE:
CUT IT DOWN;
WHY CUMBERETH IT
THE GROUND?'

8. "and he answering said unto him,

'LORD, LET IT ALONE THIS YEAR ALSO,
TILL I SHALL DIG ABOUT IT,
AND DUNG IT:
9. 'AND IF IT BEAR FRUIT,
WELL: IF NOT,
then AFTER THAT THOU
SHALT CUT IT DOWN.' "

CuteEmma:
I never said freewill doesn't exist,, it does.... Buh it's so so limited

Jesus say " my sheep here my voice and followed me" but there are some who CHOOSE not to follow, there choice wasn't remove, they still have to chose to follow or stay.

scripture point out that most of us are stiff kneck and stubborn and we have gone astray, doesn't this imply that we have freewill to be righteous ? my lady, Partial freewill does not exist. thank you.

hopefulLandlord:
Another thing I never got about Free Will is whether it exists in the afterlife. Either option presents problems.

1.) We have free will in Heaven. This implies that Yahweh is capable of creating an absolute eternal paradise completely free of evil AND has constructed a means by which beings maintain free will in that state of being. Thus the argument that we have free will in our lives on Earth so that we can choose between good and evil falls flat, as God is capable of allowing free will without evil.

2.) We have no free will in Heaven. This implies that Yahweh cared so much about people's free will that he created our short temporary lives so that we would have the chance to excercise it, but then opted that we should spend eternity after without free will, which makes the time we spent excercising it seem rather pointless. If he valued it so highly in humans, why is it not a part of human paradise?

This shid is deeeep!

God doesn't want Robots, He wants Children! otherwise we wouldn't be different from Animals. You wouldn't know if your child will obey you if you haven't test such child by giving a particular instruction to see if he/she obeys or not, the same way God does with us. Adam and Eve also had freewill that was sadly misused.

[b][/b]TEMPTATION IS NECESSARY FOR MAN TO PROOF HIS OBEDIENCE! and it's mainly to make us grow, to be matured spiritually.

Try and Listen to a message 'the power of choice' and you can listen to rest of the series on www.cfcindia.com under the 'Basic Christian Teachings' series by Bro Zac Poonen. I think this should answer most, if not all of your questions.

aydes:


Why would you boubt the existence of free will when God gave us the ability to choose between right and wrong, good or bad, heaven or hell?

Can I chose neither heaven nor hell and not be punished/penalized ??...... if its not possible, then i believe u understand it now when i doubt the existence of free will

elderhimself:



Can I chose neither heaven nor hell and not be punished/penalized ??...... if its not possible, then i believe u understand it now when i doubt the existence of free will

You cant sit on the fence