Avenir:


I quite agree with your point of view. However, I have to point to the fact that in the UK legal redress is not only available to the most financially comfortable. Even if you don’t have a penny, no win no pay lawyers abound that will be begging you to take up your brief if you have a good case against medical negligence. There are other options for getting lawyers to take your brief even when you are not financially okay. The converse is the case in Nigeria. No lawyer, not even the charge and bail ones, will take your brief without some pricey upfront payment. The topic refers to public health workers in Nigeria. Most of the users of public health services patronise it because it is the cheaper option and because they can’t afford a private hospital with similar facilities. How will such users be able to afford a lawyer to sue for clinical negligence? They will do the most sensible thing and move on with their lives.

In the UK, a health worker will even be investigated if the aggrieved complains to the appropriate body. Every public hospital has a clinical audit unit which performs quality assurance on the services. Each hospital unit have appropriate supervisory body to whom clinical data (including fatalities) has to be reported. Deaths are taken seriously and are investigated if there is a pattern even without anybody complaining.

In Nigeria, even when you sue, what relief can you get? If you get awarded compensation, are the public health workers insured? Do they have the ability to pay the compensation? If they get struck of a register (if any exists) can they practice again? Of course they can practice in some quack private hospital. So what is the use of suing?

I have lost two close relatives due to cases of clinical negligence at Nigerian public hospitals. This is not to say that there are no good nurses and doctors in Nigeria. There are many of them. The good ones are in private hospitals. The good ones are very few in public hospitals! I sincerely believe that if the government cannot run public hospitals (the bulk stops with the hospital owners) they should close them down and replace them with comparable and more practical alternatives where human life is accorded the respect it deserves and were the health workers are held accountable by their employers for the service they were paid (irrespective of how meagre the pay is) to render. They are not paid to be merchants of death. They are paid to be caregivers!

nice observations, but i beg to differ with the italicized part.
There are good ones everywhere and infact im sure there are more good ones in public hospitals than in private ones at least in lagos.i have worked in both and i can tell you that most private hospitals have no proper audit systems,even the very expensive ones,yes.I worked in a highbrow hospital in VI before and i know how many things happen or are swept under the carpet, fact is most clients are highly placed and they surprisingly dont ask too many questions cos they just believe that the doctors there have done their best.
More so, the doctors there were the same ones from the Teaching hospital many people have attacked on this thread, but i guess once people enter this classy hospital,they drop all bias against the doctors and are more receptive to treatment.
I have lost a dear one to treatment at a 'high class' hospital in ikeja during childbirth many years ago,i approached the MDCN for redress on the issue but the hospital management and the patient's husband pleaded to drop/withdraw the case.
So you see my dear, it will be wrong to say the good ones are in private practice(most of which depend on doctors especially consultants from government owned hospitals)
The problem like i outlined earlier is multifaceted and only concerted effort by everyone and i mean everyone can save the sector.

The issue we have as a country and as individual[b] simplicity[/b]
we complicate things alots in such way we make things difficult
for ourselves and for others. take for example a child don't know
maths why beating him or her. some will take after shool teacher still
the child don't know maths. The parent will think the child is not
ready to learn and they continue beating him. in nigeria there's
nothing like he or she is have learning difficulties instead of that the
punishment continue. despite all the money we have as a county we are not doing anything for
our citizen basic care needs, support for people with learning difficulties

i know am driving away from the main topic this things are just
bothering me. look at 7 points agenda is just a waste of time and
not worth the paper written on.  The day we start putting nigeria
mentality behind and treat people equally and maybe start adopting
some western ways of treating people then you"ll start seing a better
nigerian. when i was in body school back then 16 yrs prior to coming to
england I was in JSS 3 and my seniors always send me to fetch waters
do this do that. when you report a member of staff will tell u i too we become senior
one day and i can also do the same. Those are example of mentality we need to
work hard and leave behind.

reindeer:


nice observations, but i beg to differ with the italicized part.
There are good ones everywhere and infact im sure there are more good ones in public hospitals than in private ones at least in lagos.i have worked in both and i can tell you that most private hospitals have no proper audit systems,even the very expensive ones,yes.I worked in a highbrow hospital in VI before and i know how many things happen or are swept under the carpet, fact is most clients are highly placed and they surprisingly dont ask too many questions cos they just believe that the doctors there have done their best.
More so, the doctors there were the same ones from the Teaching hospital many people have attacked on this thread, but i guess once people enter this classy hospital,they drop all bias against the doctors and are more receptive to treatment.
I have lost a dear one to treatment at a 'high class' hospital in ikeja during childbirth many years ago,i approached the MDCN for redress on the issue but the hospital management and the patient's husband pleaded to drop/withdraw the case.
So you see my dear, it will be wrong to say the good ones are in private practice(most of which depend on doctors especially consultants from government owned hospitals)
The problem like i outlined earlier is multifaceted and only concerted effort by everyone and i mean everyone can save the sector.

I didn’t know they have audit systems in Nigerian public hospitals. I guess we learn everyday. Probably the audit system doesn’t work well. My post is based on my personal experience at Gbagada General Hospital and Ikeja General Hospital. While it is true that the private hospitals rely on the consultants and doctors from the public hospitals, I have to point out that the attitude of these health workers changes depending on whether they are in a public hospital or a private one. I have to agree with you that we can all improve the service delivery in the sector by holding the health workers more accountable for their actions.

Ok you guys keep talking abt evil Drs. Wat abt evil patients. Hear this story, one day back in '99 i was a houseofficer @ LUTH paediatric ward there was this child in a very bad state. I cnt remember but it was a fatal neurological condition.
I and my SR (specialist reg.) worked day and nite to save this child but alas the child gave up. It wasn't a shock to us cos we knew how grave its condition was. But it so happened that the time the child gave up was the ExaCt time the father came to visit.
A huge Igbo man, he walked in and saw the nurses preparing his child for the morgue. He took one look @ me and my SR and said ''Dr, so my child is finally dead.''
We both stood silent trying to hide the fact that we were trembling.
''OK, that's alright'' he said in low and calm voice. ''I'm coming.''
He walked out of the ward slowly, me and my oga breathed a sigh of relief, thinking the man hadtaken the loss of his child with philosophical calm. We resumed our wardround, attending to the living.
After abt two minutes we heard the nurses scream ''Dr, Dr !,  He's coming, he's coming ! ''
Next thing I saw was a Car Jack flying at the speed of sound, narrowly missing my oga's small head. The man suddenly transformed into carl lewis and jumped out of the nearest window. The nurses simply disappeared, as for my self I hid under the nurses counter while the father rained all manner of expletives on the staff. Of course all those kids were in tears.
A similar incident happend in IB last yr when a MOPOL gassed some kids to death. Thank god no one was hurt in my ward.

i think the docs and nurses have seen so much sickness and they're kind of used to it, so ur case is no different, they've seen worse.
they tend to give less care than they ought to give.
they should be sued! but unfortunately litigation doesnt favour the consumer in our system.

i think pple should take thier loved ones to private hospitals if u can afford it.

With the advent of private Health Maintenance Organisations (HMOs) in Nigeria this sort of shabby treatment should become a thing of the past.

Lot of people are frustrated. If you work in those environment and you earn maybe 18k you will be an angry b*tch too.

I meet them at Local Post Office, Police Stations, government revenue offices/minitries, teachers, its just all around

face969:

Ok you guys keep talking abt evil Drs. Wat abt evil patients. Hear this story, one day back in '99 i was a houseofficer @ LUTH paediatric ward there was this child in a very bad state. I cnt remember but it was a fatal neurological condition.
I and my SR (specialist reg.) worked day and nite to save this child but alas the child gave up. It wasn't a shock to us cos we knew how grave its condition was. But it so happened that the time the child gave up was the ExaCt time the father came to visit.
A huge Igbo man, he walked in and saw the nurses preparing his child for the morgue. He took one look @ me and my SR and said ''Dr, so my child is finally dead.''
We both stood silent trying to hide the fact that we were trembling.
''OK, that's alright'' he said in low and calm voice. ''I'm coming.''
He walked out of the ward slowly, me and my oga breathed a sigh of relief, thinking the man hadtaken the loss of his child with philosophical calm. We resumed our wardround, attending to the living.
After abt two minutes we heard the nurses scream ''Dr, Dr !, He's coming, he's coming ! ''
Next thing I saw was a Car Jack flying at the speed of sound, narrowly missing my oga's small head. The man suddenly transformed into carl lewis and jumped out of the nearest window. The nurses simply disappeared, as for my self I hid under the nurses counter while the father rained all manner of expletives on the staff. Of course all those kids were in tears.
A similar incident happend in IB last yr when a MOPOL gassed some kids to death. Thank god no one was hurt in my ward.

That is a very pathetic story! I guess the father should have tried his best to control his emotional outburst.

These are just a few instances of patient's outburst, nothing compared to the ones meted out on the patients by these nurses & doctors, if you ask me!

my mum is a retired nurse >>> as far as i know she was unlike the nurses of nowadays who 'misbehave'
nurses weren't like this in Nigeria's good times >>> few months she died she was trying to help the wife of a doctor friend deliver
the nurses abandoned the woman just before she delivered my mom who was just outside the labor room insisted that she
(a retired nurse & a former midwife) be allowed to help her deliver_she was refused access_despite the fact that the woman in
question was in serious labour pains. She called this woman's husband_incidentally a doctor_from duty to help out.The man stormed in visibly angry that nothing was being done to assist his wife in labor & made sure she was attended to under his watch. Shamelessly the nurses complained that the woman was 'forcing them ' to 'help her' because "her husband is a doctor". Few days after the delivery the woman's husband after observing his wife personally gave his wife a check-up & discovered that the nurses carelessly left this woman's placenta in her womb. If you ask me_NOTHING SHORT OF WICKEDNESS !!!

MCLOVIN:

With the advent of private Health Maintenance Organisations (HMOs) in Nigeria this sort of shabby treatment should become a thing of the past.

perish the thought man!
Most of thos just grab money from the patients and their companies and refuse to pay the hospitals and when they do,its late(up to 3 months).
And in fact most of em refure to pay up if you give their patients 'expensive' drugs, begging you to use cheaper alternates.
If there is any threat to the NHIS, its the HMO's, im sure you heard the news of the ones sanctioned lately by the health ministry, thats just a tip of whats going on.The hope for the sector lies in government sincerity to develop and eqip the hospitals and motivate staff and then you can come hard on the erring officers.

^^
Sure ! HMOs will always rip patients off. But they will do it POLITELY and with special CARE .

had a bad experience once, a nurse asked me to clean up my vomit, had to cause she threatened to beat me up and mummy dearest was nowhere to be found. it happened a really long time ago anyways, but from what i'm reading in other people's posts things haven't change much, tragic!!!!!

Only in your backside country.

ok

Whenever you complain about any Nigerian medical personnel, look at yourself and make sure you are doing the right thing wherever you are. The Nigerian Medic of which I am one, comes from the same society as you.
So why do you expect him to be different. Why should you be allowed to be rude to your clients, demand bribes before doing your paid job, sneak out of your office to go to market, hold prayer meetings instead of attending to official visitors, close early on Friday to go to the mosque even if you are a christian- but then expect thenurse or doctor or lab person to behave differently when you go to his or her office or sell yur customer fake brake pads.
You forget he may have been the customer you saw yesterday in the bank whom you shouted at or the man whose electricity you disconnected even after he paid his bill. Or he may be the person whose car brakes you replaced with fake brake pads or sold bad fuel to or the parent of that child you are failing if he doesn't pay for some extra lessons.
So instead of thinking of you the patient he is thinking of how to do the transaction in the bank before the close of day, or how to get to PHCN to reconnect her light or how he or she will get home because the brakes that you just repaired are feeling funny and making noise or about his or her child who claims to be victimized by a teacher.
Think well before you point those accusing fingers. You may just be the reason the medical personnel is behaving badly today.

Signorina:

@Reindeer, I was almost tinkn dat u were making sense. You must be so daft 2 think dat we got in2 nursing schools wit 3 credits, or we culdnt make JAMB or get in2 university. How many uni in naija offer nursing degree? It's doctors lyk u who frustrate nd luk down on nurses. I got admission in UNIPORT 2 study medicine, i changd my mind cos i luv Nursing. As 4 d topic, nurses r luvly ppl bt wen u come 2 d hospital expectn 2 c a wicked nurse due 2 d stories u've heard, evry action of d nurse wil luk bad 2 u, in d ward with 20-30 difficult patients wit just 3-4 nurses nd ungrateful relatives. Evil ppl who go into any profesion wil make odas luk evil, nt just nurses.

hmm, the stuff some nurses are made of

My point exaclty!
And some sister up there picked on a line ,improperly distilled it and came up with ''personal'' attack.
when i say some, it means not all, and fact is i never blamed nurses, i only refered to some of them with improper training.
And for someone who got admission to study medicine and loved nursing, goodluck to you, though it is queer the same person didnt go for degree nursing

no big deal, there are bad eggs everywhere in every field and concerted efforts from all will change the situation.

I work in a health facility. In this in which I work, the doctors n nurses are awesome. I repeat awesome. But ofcourse, a few, esp d nurses could be wild n rude. Very annoying, Yes. I guess its attributed to fustration n inability to accept adequate training, because they actually send them for training. Fortunately, now, the institution has been admitting nurses in the past 5yrs to undergo university training. We hope for the best. Finally, to the critics, how good a service provider are you?

Is there a way to complain about doctors or hospitals in Nigeria?

they don't take criticism well, in fact they will first ask you to check yourself, some will even go ahead to quote the bible for you 

and some of the hospitals are filthy as in you really wonder how medical doctors could work in such environment, they will blame the government officials for it even though they are in charge daily


and I just hate when they use this line for excuse

Let's Face it, Nigerian Nurses aren't paid a lot of money. . .

like duuuh didn't they know that before going into the profession? the same excuse the police use to shoot people randomly on the streets

My contribution. Majority of the doctors and nurses are not well trained, nor do they respect the code of coduct.
The universites produce half baked doctors and nurses, and most of the hospitals are not well built. majority are
filthy. There is no good regulation bodies for the hospital and also medical profession. Though l pratice in the united states. some time ago . l visited a family friend, at isolo hospital , their were 12 pt in the room ,6 on each side. l sat beside my friend and we were chatting, the nurse came over to give him is meds, and l ask the nurse what meds. digoxin. she said oga here is your meds. hmm and l ask for the head nurse. she came over. and l ask her why the pt should be given digoxin, without the apical pulse been taking. (info digoxin is used to stabilize irregularHR, slow fast HR and treat congestive failure.the heart must be above 60 before taking these meds. ) the nurse ,then took the pusle and it was 56, so the meds was not given. my advice to pt is , it is your right to ask the doctors or nurses info before taking any drug or meds. question like side effect , purpose. drug interaction etc. it is always good for pt to look up info about there illness and any meds they are taking. Most of these illness can be prevented. but due to like of info. what you eat is very important and regular check up , are vital to your health.

In response to JUMIE , sorry about what you went through, but firstly when a pt is admitted and after all assesment, \
history . the family should be brief and about the intervention and be updated about the progress of their loves ones whether positive or negative. there are few good doctors and nurses in nigeria. hope to set up a wellness center soon.