solite3:
headship does not denote superiority of nature

Solite3 , am surprised u are still dragging matters on this thread, you who could not Identify the fact that man and animals are same spirit .

You posted a matt Slick Post saying Jesus is still a man in heaven , which means u agree with him Only for you to come here and say Jesus and his Father are equal by nature , what !


to understand if they are equal or not , I have this two questions for u .

To establish equality of nature

- how many nature does Jesus have ?

- How many natures did his father have?

waiting

solite3:
breath may or may not mean Spirit depending on the context it is used.

Solite3

Lack of understanding is what u are showing here

What is the Hebrew word for Spirit ?

does it appear in Eccl 3:19 ?


do justice to those two questions ... and let's expose the naked truth of this matter .

"And The Word, which was Him was made Flesh". We need The Inspiration of The Holy Spirit to understand The Bible.

How about John 20:17 when Jesus himself says that he has a God? Would you call Jesus a liar?
You quoted my comment, the emboldened above. Is headship found in John 20:17? When you call someone your God, does it sound like a co-equalling? Did Jesus sound that way in that verse? Can you show me any Bible where Jesus plainly said that He is 3 in one God? Any verse where Jesus referred to himself as God?

solite3:
headship does not denote superiority of nature

achorladey:

Na Swahili be the post you read and respond to?

Not Swahili, More like Mpulumazanga

harbjar Luke 23:46-47 "Then He said to them "Thus it is written and thus it was necessary for the Christ to suffer and to rise from the dead the third day, and that repentance and remissions of sins should be preached in His name to all nations, beginning at Jerusalem."" Matthew 26:28 "For this is My blood of the new covenant, which is shed for many for the remission of sins." THESE ARE ALL JESUS WORDS SIR, NO PAUL HERE, STRICTLY JESUS.

salvation101:
In Genesis 1:2, it was mentioned that the Spirit of God (or Holy Spirit) was moving on the face of the waters before God then said "let there be light" in d next verse..

As an experienced contextualizer, do you know the purpose of a preposition? In context, explain its function in these sentences: the wisdom OF Solomon was at work; the strength OF a woman can carry the weight of the world; the voice OF the President strengthens our faith in this country; the power OF gun can kill; the faith OF a righteous man can move mountains.
Verse 2 says "And God said..." Do not sin by literally saying that the holy spirit said using the pronoun, HE to prove a non-existent point. Verse one said that it was the spirit OF who?

salvation101:

To understand john 20:17, u av to read philipians 2 where it was clearly spelled out that Jesus left his glory above to put on the flesh of man. He had an equal glory with God wch he willingly left for the purpose to die for humanity. His glory was restored after he Resurrected and ascended.. He took back his Godship..

In context, When he said I and the father are one, what glory did he have on? Was he in the flesh or in the spirit when he said that, in context? When Stephen saw him in heaven in Acts 7:55, who did he say that he was with? Did he resurrect or was he resurrected as the Bible says in Romans 8:11; 1 Corinthians 15:4; 2 Corinthians 4:14; Romans 4:25. Or will you also put these verses in context?

salvation101:
He is God that became man for just about 33 years cos he has been from the beginning.

Beginning of what? The Bible says that he is God but not the ALmighty God because he himself has a God and he has a Head and he also has a beginning and he is a creation Colossians 1:15.

salvation101:

1cor 8:6 here Paul put God and Jesus on the same level by saying all things came from God the Father through Jesus. That is just the order within the Godhead,

No disrespect but do you know the purpose of the prepositions used in that verse? Where does FROM and THROUGH form a line? Do you care to look the meaning of words up? The source is the FROM and ultimately every good thing comes from the father, Jehovah James 1:17; John 6:44.

salvation101:
Jesus also referred to himself as the door and no one can come to the father except through him. It in no way reduces his Godship, simply shows that there is order within the God head.

I will ask you a question 'if one passes through Jesus who is the door to get to God, what physical object would you use to classify the Holy spirit whom you claim is part of the Godhead?'
Can a door and a destination be co-equal? John 5:30 "I can do nothing on My own initiative..." John 6:38; You are trying too hard to fuse them together, but the word of God is just simple and plain.

salvation101:
1tim2:5 is saying exactly the same thing 1cor 8:6..Jesus is from everlasting.. Paul here referred to him as a man dis buttresses the fact that he had to become a man to mediate between God and man. He wasn't a man at the beginning, He is usually referred to as the Son of God but eventually gave up his glory to become the Son of man. God in this context as used by paul referred to the father.

Ludicrous! You sounded very tired and out of context. So what then was Jesus Buttressing in John 20:17? And what did Stephen see in Acts 7:55?

salvation101:
1peter 1:2 shows the crystal clear relationship between the God head in the work of man's redemption.. It was the father that chose, the spirit sanctified and Jesus qualifies through his blood

Wow! So these are the roles of the your godheads. Father=CHOOSE; spirit=SANCTIFY; Jesus=QUALIFIES.
In what context is Jesus a qualifier? Keeping in mind John 17:17, in what context is the holy spirit a sanctifier?

PrecisionFx:



Not Swahili, More like Mpulumazanga

thumbs up to you

1 Corinthians 8:6 to us (the first century Christians, Jesus in John 20:17; John 17:3, and to Jehovah's witnesses) there is ONLY ONE TRUE GOD.

solite3:
So how many 'mighty God' do you have

lovingJehovah:
As an experienced contextualizer, do you know the purpose of a preposition? In context, explain its function in these sentences: the wisdom OF Solomon was at work; the strength OF a woman can carry the weight of the world; the voice OF the President strengthens our faith in this country; the power OF gun can kill; the faith OF a righteous man can move mountains.
Verse 2 says "And God said..." Do not sin by literally saying that the holy spirit said using the pronoun, HE to prove a non-existent point. Verse one said that it was the spirit OF who?
In context, When he said I and the father are one, what glory did he have on? Was he in the flesh or in the spirit when he said that, in context? When Stephen saw him in heaven in Acts 7:55, who did he say that he was with? Did he resurrect or was he resurrected as the Bible says in Romans 8:11; 1 Corinthians 15:4; 2 Corinthians 4:14; Romans 4:25. Or will you also put these verses in context? Beginning of what? The Bible says that he is God but not the ALmighty God because he himself has a God and he has a Head and he also has a beginning and he is a creation Colossians 1:15. No disrespect but do you know the purpose of the prepositions used in that verse? Where does FROM and THROUGH form a line? Do you care to look the meaning of words up? The source is the FROM and ultimately every good thing comes from the father, Jehovah James 1:17; John 6:44. I will ask you a question 'if one passes through Jesus who is the door to get to God, what physical object would you use to classify the Holy spirit whom you claim is part of the Godhead?'
Can a door and a destination be co-equal? John 5:30 "I can do nothing on My own initiative..." John 6:38; You are trying too hard to fuse them together, but the word of God is just simple and plain.
Ludicrous! You sounded very tired and out of context. So what then was Jesus Buttressing in John 20:17? And what did Stephen see in Acts 7:55?
Wow! So these are the roles of the your godheads. Father=CHOOSE; spirit=SANCTIFY; Jesus=QUALIFIES.
In what context is Jesus a qualifier? Keeping in mind John 17:17, in what context is the holy spirit a sanctifier?

Lol. Now its about preposition and conjunction? Sir u can't find out God by grammar or from dictionary. The jew seek a sign, the greek seek knowledge but at d end dey both cant find God..

Now, if sincerely you want to know the truth about the Holy Trinity, drop those ur jw materials u run to for consultation and read ur Bible with an open mind.. Firstly, the first mention of the word God in the Bible according to the original Hebrew text is the word Elohim..this same word is used more than 2000 time to refer to God in the old testament.. The word Elohim is the plural for El, it means the strong ones(notice the plurality).. God said let US make man... God said let US go down to confuse their language(Gen 11:7 tower of babel).. All through the Bible we see God working together to achieve every purpose right from creation down to redemption. It shouldn't be strange except you want to argue. The father is God (1cor 8:6, psalm 89:26, 1chr 29:10) the Holy Spirit is God (Act 5:3,4, 1cor 3:16,17, 1cor 6:19,20, heb 3:7-9, heb 10:15,16), Jesus is God (isa 9:6,7, john 20:28, john 1:1-3).

Before the ministry of Jesus kicked off we see the three of them coming together at his baptism, God (the Father) spoke from heaven dat this is my beloved son...., the Holy Spirit descended taking the form of a dove and rested on Jesus.. Except you just want to argue over semantics, the scripture has always been clear about the plurality within the Godhead.. Except you want to give me another meaning of the word Elohim.

salvation101:

Lol. Now its about preposition and conjunction? Sir u can't find out God by grammar or from dictionary. The jew seek a sign, the greek seek knowledge but at d end dey both cant find God..

Now, if sincerely you want to know the truth about the Holy Trinity, drop those ur jw materials u run to for consultation and read ur Bible with an open mind.. Firstly, the first mention of the word God in the Bible according to the original Hebrew text is the word Elohim..this same word is used more than 2000 time to refer to God in the old testament.. The word Elohim is the plural for El, it means the strong ones(notice the plurality).. God said let US make man... God said let US go down to confuse their language(Gen 11:7 tower of babel).. All through the Bible we see God working together to achieve every purpose right from creation down to redemption. It shouldn't be strange except you want to argue. The father is God (1cor 8:6, psalm 89:26, 1chr 29:10) the Holy Spirit is God (Act 5:3,4, 1cor 3:16,17, 1cor 6:19,20, heb 3:7-9, heb 10:15,16), Jesus is God (isa 9:6,7, john 20:28, john 1:1-3).

Before the ministry of Jesus kicked off we see the three of them coming together at his baptism, God (the Father) spoke from heaven dat this is my beloved son...., the Holy Spirit descended taking the form of a dove and rested on Jesus.. Except you just want to argue over semantics, the scripture has always been clear about the plurality within the Godhead.. Except you want to give me another meaning of the word Elohim.

The scripture has always been clear about the singular God (Jehovah) Even Jesus quote the Hebrew scriptures to support that Deuteronomy 6:4 Hear, O Israel: The LORD our God is one LORD: Mark 12:29 And Jesus answered him, The first of all the commandments is, Hear, O Israel; The Lord our God is one Lord: Jesus not only stated it as a word of fact but as as a commandment but you are not ready to follow.
. Finally a sure finality from horse's mouth John 20:17 Jesus saith unto her, Touch me not; for I am not yet ascended to my Father: but go to my brethren, and say unto them, I ascend unto my Father, and your Father; and to my God, and your God. Jesus should have stated my 'Gods'. The God we serve is singular not plural. Jesus you cherish so much never pluralised him. If they are co-equal then Jesus must be the father of the liar that has ever liveth by saying John 17:3 And this is life eternal, that they might know thee the only true God(singular again), and Jesus Christ, whom thou hast sent.

achorladey:

The scripture has always been clear about the singular God (Jehovah) Even Jesus quote the Hebrew scriptures to support that Deuteronomy 6:4 Hear, O Israel: The LORD our God is one LORD: Mark 12:29 And Jesus answered him, The first of all the commandments is, Hear, O Israel; The Lord our God is one Lord: Jesus not only stated it as a word of fact but as as a commandment but you are not ready to follow.
. Finally a sure finality from horse's mouth John 20:17 Jesus saith unto her, Touch me not; for I am not yet ascended to my Father: but go to my brethren, and say unto them, I ascend unto my Father, and your Father; and to my God, and your God. Jesus should have stated my 'Gods'. The God we serve is singular not plural. Jesus you cherish so much never pluralised him. If they are co-equal then Jesus must be the father of the liar that has ever liveth by saying John 17:3 And this is life eternal, that they might know thee the only true God(singular again), and Jesus Christ, whom thou hast sent.

well the word u refer to as jehovah is actually YHWH or Yahweh... The word Elohim is used to refer to God 2700 times in the old testament i would love to hear ur explanation of that...

achorladey:

The devine light that Jesus is not the son of God? Do you think calling Jesus son of God constitute part of the corruption contained in the Bible. I am tempted to ask who is Adam in relation to God? Is it right to view individuals and those that have worked and walked with God the way God sees them? Do you feel Christians demean God by saying he has a son? Response please?

You see i dont have an objection if you call humans children of God or sons of God because according to the bible both new and old..good people were being referred to as sons of God
Romans 8:14
For all who are led by the Spirit of God are sons of God. ...
Its the genius of the jewish language, but you see christains say jesus is a different kind of son.. That he is "begotten" and not like created like adam and all of us but "begotten" by God....
So now i am asking you.. What does begotten mean??

salvation101:
well the word u refer to as jehovah is actually YHWH or Yahweh... The word Elohim is used to refer to God 2700 times in the old testament i would love to hear ur explanation of that...

Well this is actually not my fight because it seems its a trinitarian xtain and monotheistic xtain at war.. But let me just help clear it air..
The word "Elohim".....
You see in Hebrew and also in Arabic (sister language and brethen) they have two types of plurals known as plural of numbers and respect (duel) the word IM is a plural of respect and God uses it to glorify himself and not to say he is two or three or thousand in one...
The jews are monotheistic in nature and like the Muslims are totally against the trinity doctrine and for once they never questioned that word Elohim cause they understand the deeper meaning of their literature....

joshnes:
harbjar Luke 23:46-47 "Then He said to them "Thus it is written and thus it was necessary for the Christ to suffer and to rise from the dead the third day, and that repentance and remissions of sins should be preached in His name to all nations, beginning at Jerusalem."" Matthew 26:28 "For this is My blood of the new covenant, which is shed for many for the remission of sins." THESE ARE ALL JESUS WORDS SIR, NO PAUL HERE, STRICTLY JESUS.

Check your reference for luke again.. It seems wrong

salvation101:
Lol. Now its about preposition and conjunction? Sir u can't find out God by grammar or from dictionary. The jew seek a sign, the greek seek knowledge but at d end dey both cant find God..

No! It is not, rather since you have decided to contextualize the entire Bible, I am asking for clarification to be able to understand your exegesis in context. As for the Bible's message, I read and understand it perfectly.

salvation101:
Now, if sincerely you want to know the truth about the Holy Trinity, drop those ur jw materials u run to for consultation and read ur Bible with an open mind..

I have never quoted any JW materials or made any references to it. I have been quoting the scriptures so far. Why are you attacking the JW? Is it proper for a Christian to attack a religion rather than its doctrine? If you are a sincere reader and firm believer in the Bible, can you show me in the Bible where the phrase "Holy Trinity" is written just as you mentioned?
Meanwhile, run to who for consultation?

salvation101:
Firstly, the first mention of the word God in the Bible according to the original Hebrew text is the word Elohim..this same word is used more than 2000 time to refer to God in the old testament..

Even Moses, the writer of that word in the Book knew that God was not a name. That was why he asked God his name. God then gave him his name. That name is YHWH which is translated Jehovah in English and it appears over 7000 times in the HOLY scriptures. If you search your Bible, you will discover that the name that Moses asked for and was Given by God, is missing in your Bible. If you were Moses-like, you would have asked why that name is missing in your Bible. Are you serving the God of Moses? That name was removed by Trinitarians to give the doctrine of the Trinity a threshold. That name identifies one unique person, Jehovah. It discredits the heretic Trinity doctrine incorporated into Christianity by Constantine in 325 CE. None of the apostles taught that doctrine about 200 years before its incorporation by a pagan emperor, Constantine.
You put all verses of the scriptures that exposes the Trinity into context, yet you never let go of "I and the father are one". That verse, you will never be put into context, yet the same Jesus that you claim to be CO-EQUAL with Jehovah said that the father is GREATER than him. Jesus said that he is by Jehovah's side and Stephen confirms that in Acts 7:55

salvation101:
The word Elohim is the plural for El, it means the strong ones(notice the plurality)..

Languages have rules and if you consult with any Jew who speaks Hebrew, he will break it down for you. Let me analyse it locally for better comprehension. Yoruba uses EYIN (as singular), French also uses Vous (as singular), and so it goes in many other languages. Ask a Jew who speaks Hebrew for reference if he will corroborate your metaphorical definition of the word El.
If your point is genuine, why not refer to him as GodS (as your El)? Have you also checked the reflection of the plurality in the Greek translation?

salvation101:
God said let US make man... God said let US go down to confuse their language(Gen 11:7 tower of babel)..

That is what Jesus said in Proverbs 8:30. He was a master worker [b]beside [/b]God. And according to the Bible that you read in 1 Corinthians 8:6, God did (and keeps doing) things THROUGH Jesus. If you read the book of Revelation 1:1 you will also see the relationship that Jesus and Jehovah have. Jehovah includes everyone he loves in his activities. He is a God of love and he is not selfish at all. Even the angels and men are involved in his activities. Moses stretched out his rod to divide the red sea. God could have just done it and asked them to walk through, but Moses was involved. David killed Goliath. He could have just said the word and that would be the end of Goliath, but David was involved. So, when he says US it means exactly what Jesus said in John 6:38 that he came to do (not our will, but) the WILL of Jehovah.

salvation101:
through the Bible we see God working together to achieve every purpose right from creation down to redemption. God working together with his son to It shouldn't be strange except you want to argue. The father is God (1c or 8:6, psalm 89:26, 1chr 29:10) the Holy Spirit is God (Act 5:3,4, 1cor 3:16,17, 1cor 6:19,20, heb 3:7-9, heb 10:15,16), Jesus is God (isa 9:6,7, john 20:28, john 1:1-3).

I am not here for the sake of argument but to converse. Here is what Jesus said in Hebrews 10:7 Then I said: ‘Look! I have come (in the scroll* it is written about me) to do your will, O God.
You see how he referred to God and coming to do the will of his God? He did not say our will. Again, Jesus reiterated in John 5:30 I cannot do a single thing of my own initiative. Just as I hear, I judge, and my judgment is righteous+ because I seek, not my own will, but the will of him who sent me.
Let us see again how distinct Jesus and Jehovah are in person in Luke 22:42 “Father, if you want to, remove this cup from me (not us). Nevertheless, let, not my will, but yours take place.
Reading these books of the Bible, you can see that it wasn't co-equals working together, but a God and a son in Jesus and his father's words. Matthew 3:17 the father said "this is my son". But here you are calling God a liar by instructing him that it could have been "this is my mate or co-equal". Where in the bible did Jesus literally call himself God? Show me! I don't want a context, I want plain simple sentence uttered by Jesus just the way he referred to his father as God.

salvation101:
Before the ministry of Jesus kicked off we see the three of them coming together at his baptism, God (the Father) spoke from heaven dat this is my beloved son...., the Holy Spirit descended taking the form of a dove and rested on Jesus.. Except you just want to argue over semantics, the scripture has always been clear about the plurality within the Godhead.. Except you want to give me another meaning of the word Elohim.

Oh! How you contradict your own self. You said that Jesus left his Godship in heaven and took the form of a man. Now, the three of the Gods came together at his baptism... How can you compute this discombobulation?
The deeper you go into this doctrine of the Trinity, the more mystifying it becomes. Kindly straighten up your teaching in your next reply.

lovingJehovah:
No! It is not, rather since you have decided to contextualize the entire Bible, I am asking for clarification to be able to understand your exegesis in context. As for the Bible's message, I read and understand it perfectly.
I have never quoted any JW materials or made any references to it. I have been quoting the scriptures so far. Why are you attacking the JW? Is it proper for a Christian to attack a religion rather than its doctrine? If you are a sincere reader and firm believer in the Bible, can you show me in the Bible where the phrase "Holy Trinity" is written just as you mentioned?
Meanwhile, run to who for consultation? Even Moses, the writer of that word in the Book knew that God was not a name. That was why he asked God his name. God then gave him his name. That name is YHWH which is translated Jehovah in English and it appears over 7000 times in the HOLY scriptures. If you search your Bible, you will discover that the name that Moses asked for and was Given by God, is missing in your Bible. If you were Moses-like, you would have asked why that name is missing in your Bible. Are you serving the God of Moses? That name was removed by Trinitarians to give the doctrine of the Trinity a threshold. That name identifies one unique person, Jehovah. It discredits the heretic Trinity doctrine incorporated into Christianity by Constantine in 325 CE. None of the apostles taught that doctrine about 200 years before its incorporation by a pagan emperor, Constantine.
You put all verses of the scriptures that exposes the Trinity into context, yet you never let go of "I and the father are one". That verse, you will never be put into context, yet the same Jesus that you claim to be CO-EQUAL with Jehovah said that the father is GREATER than him. Jesus said that he is by Jehovah's side and Stephen confirms that in Acts 7:55 Languages have rules and if you consult with any Jew who speaks Hebrew, he will break it down for you. Let me analyse it locally for better comprehension. Yoruba uses EYIN (as singular), French also uses Vous (as singular), and so it goes in many other languages. Ask a Jew who speaks Hebrew for reference if he will corroborate your metaphorical definition of the word El.
If your point is genuine, why not refer to him as GodS (as your El)? Have you also checked the reflection of the plurality in the Greek translation? That is what Jesus said in Proverbs 8:30. He was a master worker [b]beside [/b]God. And according to the Bible that you read in 1 Corinthians 8:6, God did (and keeps doing) things THROUGH Jesus. If you read the book of Revelation 1:1 you will also see the relationship that Jesus and Jehovah have. Jehovah includes everyone he loves in his activities. He is a God of love and he is not selfish at all. Even the angels and men are involved in his activities. Moses stretched out his rod to divide the red sea. God could have just done it and asked them to walk through, but Moses was involved. David killed Goliath. He could have just said the word and that would be the end of Goliath, but David was involved. So, when he says US it means exactly what Jesus said in John 6:38 that he came to do (not our will, but) the WILL of Jehovah. I am not here for the sake of argument but to converse. Here is what Jesus said in Hebrews 10:7 Then I said: ‘Look! I have come (in the scroll* it is written about me) to do your will, O God.
You see how he referred to God and coming to do the will of his God? He did not say our will. Again, Jesus reiterated in John 5:30 I cannot do a single thing of my own initiative. Just as I hear, I judge, and my judgment is righteous+ because I seek, not my own will, but the will of him who sent me.
Let us see again how distinct Jesus and Jehovah are in person in Luke 22:42 “Father, if you want to, remove this cup from me (not us). Nevertheless, let, not my will, but yours take place.
Reading these books of the Bible, you can see that it wasn't co-equals working together, but a God and a son in Jesus and his father's words. Matthew 3:17 the father said "this is my son". But here you are calling God a liar by instructing him that it could have been "this is my mate or co-equal". Where in the bible did Jesus literally call himself God? Show me! I don't want a context, I want plain simple sentence uttered by Jesus just the way he referred to his father as God.
Oh! How you contradict your own self. You said that Jesus left his Godship in heaven and took the form of a man. Now, the three of the Gods came together at his baptism... How can you compute this discombobulation?
The deeper you go into this doctrine of the Trinity, the more mystifying it becomes. Kindly straighten up your teaching in your next reply.

Lol.. You don't believe in three in one God
You dont believe Jesus is God
You believe God is one and created jesus and did work through him
You believe Jesus submitted his will to God
Welcome to islam bro... That's exactly our view about jesus too

harbjar:

Check your reference for luke again.. It seems wrong

Yeah; Luke 24:46-47. Sorry.

lovingJehovah:
No! It is not, rather since you have decided to contextualize the entire Bible, I am asking for clarification to be able to understand your exegesis in context. As for the Bible's message, I read and understand it perfectly.
I have never quoted any JW materials or made any references to it. I have been quoting the scriptures so far. Why are you attacking the JW? Is it proper for a Christian to attack a religion rather than its doctrine? If you are a sincere reader and firm believer in the Bible, can you show me in the Bible where the phrase "Holy Trinity" is written just as you mentioned?
Meanwhile, run to who for consultation? Even Moses, the writer of that word in the Book knew that God was not a name. That was why he asked God his name. God then gave him his name. That name is YHWH which is translated Jehovah in English and it appears over 7000 times in the HOLY scriptures. If you search your Bible, you will discover that the name that Moses asked for and was Given by God, is missing in your Bible. If you were Moses-like, you would have asked why that name is missing in your Bible. Are you serving the God of Moses? That name was removed by Trinitarians to give the doctrine of the Trinity a threshold. That name identifies one unique person, Jehovah. It discredits the heretic Trinity doctrine incorporated into Christianity by Constantine in 325 CE. None of the apostles taught that doctrine about 200 years before its incorporation by a pagan emperor, Constantine.
You put all verses of the scriptures that exposes the Trinity into context, yet you never let go of "I and the father are one". That verse, you will never be put into context, yet the same Jesus that you claim to be CO-EQUAL with Jehovah said that the father is GREATER than him. Jesus said that he is by Jehovah's side and Stephen confirms that in Acts 7:55 Languages have rules and if you consult with any Jew who speaks Hebrew, he will break it down for you. Let me analyse it locally for better comprehension. Yoruba uses EYIN (as singular), French also uses Vous (as singular), and so it goes in many other languages. Ask a Jew who speaks Hebrew for reference if he will corroborate your metaphorical definition of the word El.
If your point is genuine, why not refer to him as GodS (as your El)? Have you also checked the reflection of the plurality in the Greek translation? That is what Jesus said in Proverbs 8:30. He was a master worker [b]beside [/b]God. And according to the Bible that you read in 1 Corinthians 8:6, God did (and keeps doing) things THROUGH Jesus. If you read the book of Revelation 1:1 you will also see the relationship that Jesus and Jehovah have. Jehovah includes everyone he loves in his activities. He is a God of love and he is not selfish at all. Even the angels and men are involved in his activities. Moses stretched out his rod to divide the red sea. God could have just done it and asked them to walk through, but Moses was involved. David killed Goliath. He could have just said the word and that would be the end of Goliath, but David was involved. So, when he says US it means exactly what Jesus said in John 6:38 that he came to do (not our will, but) the WILL of Jehovah. I am not here for the sake of argument but to converse. Here is what Jesus said in Hebrews 10:7 Then I said: ‘Look! I have come (in the scroll* it is written about me) to do your will, O God.
You see how he referred to God and coming to do the will of his God? He did not say our will. Again, Jesus reiterated in John 5:30 I cannot do a single thing of my own initiative. Just as I hear, I judge, and my judgment is righteous+ because I seek, not my own will, but the will of him who sent me.
Let us see again how distinct Jesus and Jehovah are in person in Luke 22:42 “Father, if you want to, remove this cup from me (not us). Nevertheless, let, not my will, but yours take place.
Reading these books of the Bible, you can see that it wasn't co-equals working together, but a God and a son in Jesus and his father's words. Matthew 3:17 the father said "this is my son". But here you are calling God a liar by instructing him that it could have been "this is my mate or co-equal". Where in the bible did Jesus literally call himself God? Show me! I don't want a context, I want plain simple sentence uttered by Jesus just the way he referred to his father as God.
Oh! How you contradict your own self. You said that Jesus left his Godship in heaven and took the form of a man. Now, the three of the Gods came together at his baptism... How can you compute this discombobulation?
The deeper you go into this doctrine of the Trinity, the more mystifying it becomes. Kindly straighten up your teaching in your next reply.

If u say the plurality in Elohim is actually singularity, then how do u reconcile the "us" as used repeatedly in the scripture?
Now u make it seem like moses wrote the book of Genesis before the exodus from Egypt wch is actually false. Moses knowledge of God was deeper at the time he wrote Genesis than at the time he had his first encounter with God cos the books were written in hindsight... The knowledge of God wen Moses had worked with God for several years is definitely more than the knowledge he had d very first time he met God

Eloha is singular, Elohim is plural..

Now u coming to tell me a story about Constantine is simply fallacious cos thr jews have their Torah wch they av kept for ages Infact dey train their children to memorize it.. Constantine got nothing to do with anything here Infact its ur new world translation dat was doctored to suit wat u preach that is why you keep in re editing it at intervals. How come 4 of the 5 men who translated the NWT had no knowledge of greek or Hebrew?

Yhwh(the God of Israel) or Adonai was used by jews who feared to call God name so as not to take it in vain but it's not the name of God. Forcing it into the Bible 7000 times is an error that should be repented of.

salvation101:

If u say the plurality in Elohim is actually singularity, then how do u reconcile the "us" as used repeatedly in the scripture?
Now u make it seem like moses wrote the book of Genesis before the exodus from Egypt wch is actually false. Moses knowledge of God was deeper at the time he wrote Genesis than at the time he had his first encounter with God cos the books were written in hindsight... The knowledge of God wen Moses had worked with God for several years is definitely more than the knowledge he had d very first time he met God

The Bible says "God said, let us...", if the three were one, wouldn't they have the same thought and the same mouth? Should the creativity or thought have come from one? For the thought to have come from one, it means 'that one' has the right to it and it is his WILL for that action to be carried out. According to the Bible, it says that it all came FROM Jehovah (the only SOURCE), THROUGH Jesus to come to fulfilment. Using biblical references, mention three scenarios in which Jesus and the holy spirit came up with their own thoughts as your acclaimed co-equals? Apart from the mention of Jesus PLEADING with his father on behalf of his followers.
In the case of Moses, If his knowledge of God became deeper before writing Genesis, was the book of Exodus written before the whole miracles and deliverance of Egypt or after? If it was after, how shallow was Moses' knowledge during the entire process of his first encounter with God and post deliverance from Egypt? Using Bible verses, can you explain that depth of his knowledge between the writing period of Exodus to Genesis?

salvation101:
Eloha is singular, Elohim is plural..

Fantastic! I see that you have a very robust knowledge of Hebrew.
Now, since Elohim which is translated God means God+Jesus+holy spirit (according to you), who was Jesus crying out to in Matthew 27:46? "About three in the afternoon Jesus cried out in a loud voice, "Eli, Eli, lema sabachthani?" (which means "My God, my God, why have you forsaken me?"."
Was Jesus crying out to the Trinity (Elohim)?
Can you provide the translation of Jesus' words at John 17:3 in the Hebrew language? Wouldn't it be beautiful seeing the introduction of EL or ELOHIM in that verse?
I will also want to see the Hebrew Translation of John 20:17.

salvation101:

Now u coming to tell me a story about Constantine is simply fallacious cos thr jews have their Torah wch they av kept for ages Infact dey train their children to memorize it.. Constantine got nothing to do with anything here Infact its ur new world translation dat was doctored to suit wat u preach that is why you keep in re editing it at intervals. How come 4 of the 5 men who translated the NWT had no knowledge of greek or Hebrew?

I know about your smear campaign against the JW but that will not bother us yet. You have been well fed with indecorous rhetorics by some anti-JW bloggers and I pray that your heart is blessed. You should be grateful to have learned the history of the incorporation of the Trinity by Constantine in 325 CE because people pay fees to learn it in classrooms. It is a recorded history, so even if you refute it today, it will count as ignorance in the future. That history has been for thousands of years.
The inclusion of the Jews makes it even more expository because you seem to be unaware that Jerusalem was decimated in 70 CE by the Romans and the survivors were taken as captives and then afterwards, seized again by the Caliph. This part of history is not documented in our NWT but this is HISTORY, my friend.

salvation101:

Yhwh(the God of Israel) or Adonai was used by jews who feared to call God name so as not to take it in vain but it's not the name of God. Forcing it into the Bible 7000 times is an error that should be repented of.

In the future you would wish for an online eraser to erase this benighted comment. No shade intended though.
Firstly, you said that YHWH means The God of Israel.
Secondly, you said that The Jews incorporated YHWH into the Torah for fear of saying the name of God.
Thirdly, It was erroneously inserted into the Bible 7000 times.
What then is the name of God?
Let me ask you and do not shrivel. I am a JW, what church do you represent?
By refuting YHWH, you are declaring yourself a heretic by Trinitarians or the mainstream. You should have done a little research before posting this. You just called the entire mainstream churches heretics indirectly. This includes Orthodox, Catholics, the Pope, Jews as well as so many religions in Nigeria. You might be standing alone.

lovingJehovah:
The Bible says "God said, let us...", if the three were one, wouldn't they have the same thought and the same mouth? Should the creativity or thought have come from one? For the thought to have come from one, it means 'that one' has the right to it and it is his WILL for that action to be carried out. According to the Bible, it says that it all came FROM Jehovah (the only SOURCE), THROUGH Jesus to come to fulfilment. Using biblical references, mention three scenarios in which Jesus and the holy spirit came up with their own thoughts as your acclaimed co-equals? Apart from the mention of Jesus PLEADING with his father on behalf of his followers.
In the case of Moses, If his knowledge of God became deeper before writing Genesis, was the book of Exodus written before the whole miracles and deliverance of Egypt or after? If it was after, how shallow was Moses' knowledge during the entire process of his first encounter with God and post deliverance from Egypt? Using Bible verses, can you explain that depth of his knowledge between the writing period of Exodus to Genesis?
Fantastic! I see that you have a very robust knowledge of Hebrew.
Now, since Elohim which is translated God means God+Jesus+holy spirit (according to you), who was Jesus crying out to in Matthew 27:46? "About three in the afternoon Jesus cried out in a loud voice, "Eli, Eli, lema sabachthani?" (which means "My God, my God, why have you forsaken me?"."
Was Jesus crying out to the Trinity (Elohim)?
Can you provide the translation of Jesus' words at John 17:3 in the Hebrew language? Wouldn't it be beautiful seeing the introduction of EL or ELOHIM in that verse?
I will also want to see the Hebrew Translation of John 20:17.
I know about your smear campaign against the JW but that will not bother us yet. You have been well fed with indecorous rhetorics by some anti-JW bloggers and I pray that your heart is blessed. You should be grateful to have learned the history of the incorporation of the Trinity by Constantine in 325 CE because people pay fees to learn it in classrooms. It is a recorded history, so even if you refute it today, it will count as ignorance in the future. That history has been for thousands of years.
The inclusion of the Jews makes it even more expository because you seem to be unaware that Jerusalem was decimated in 70 CE by the Romans and the survivors were taken as captives and then afterwards, seized again by the Caliph. This part of history is not documented in our NWT but this is HISTORY, my friend.
In the future you would wish for an online eraser to erase this benighted comment. No shade intended though.
Firstly, you said that YHWH means The God of Israel.
Secondly, you said that The Jews incorporated YHWH into the Torah for fear of saying the name of God.
Thirdly, It was erroneously inserted into the Bible 7000 times.
What then is the name of God?
Let me ask you and do not shrivel. I am a JW, what church do you represent?
By refuting that, you are declaring yourself a heretic by so many Trinitarian standard. You should have done a little research before posting this. You just called the entire mainstream churches heretics indirectly. This includes Orthodox, Catholics, the Pope, Jews as well as so many religions in Nigeria. You might be standing alone.

Really wished i was as good in text formatting so dat i could be tackling ur questions one at a time like u do but u will av to bear with me.

Now for the first part, it was Elohim (the strong ones) said. Elohim is the word translated as God hence is plural.
Asking where Jesus and the Holy Spirit came up with their own thought is fallacious cos according to the gospels the Holy Spirit came on Jesus at his baptism hence all he did in his earthly ministry was done in unism with the Holy Spirit.
In the case of Moses, he couldn't av written genesis before the exodus from Egypt. It was most probably during his encounter with God at mount sinai that he got the knowledge. Now the book of exodus was a written account of israel slavery and deliverance as penned down by moses. His deeper revelation of who God is is evident by comparing his response God. At d burning bush he was full of doubt, he was reluctant. But in the wilderness, after over 40yrs of walking with God, his attitude towards the words of God clearly improved.

Now dis is where u r mistaken again. Eloi is difficult from elohim, Eloi means my God. On the cross the Holy Spirit left him cos he was sin.

Wat has the jews going into captivity got to do with the scripture? Dat should be d fourth empire if am not mistaken? So how were dey able to preserve the word under babylonia, medo-persian and greek empire wch happened before roman? Any student who finished d second school of the jews (bet talmund) could recite the entire old testament off hand.

Talking about smear campaign, are you denying to fact that those 5 guys dat translated ur Bible aren't qualified to? Do u want verifiable links?

How can u say 7000 times wen there is no mention of Yhwh in the entire new testament? The new testament was written in greek, non of the disciples referred to God as Jehovah. The greek word for God (Theos) and Lord (krios) were manipulated by watchtower to mean Jehovah.

Yeah i did a little research about the meaning of Yhwh and the meaning i found is "The Holy one" so saying the God of Israel was wrong wch i readily admit. Still u can see plainly that it was just used to describe His attributes, not particularly His name.. Wen the scribes were referring to God they call Him "the Holy one" or as u like, Yahweh... His name is ELOHIM.

salvation101:

Really wished i was as good in text formatting so dat i could be tackling ur questions one at a time like u do but u will av to bear with me.

No problems at all.

salvation101:

Now for the first part, it was Elohim (the strong ones) said. Elohim is the word translated as God hence is plural.

Very good! But answer my questions. Since Elohim which is translated God means God+Jesus+holy spirit (according to you), who was Jesus crying out to in Matthew 27:46? "About three in the afternoon Jesus cried out in a loud voice, "Eli, Eli, lema sabachthani?" (which means "My God, my God, why have you forsaken me?"wink."
Was Jesus crying out to the Trinity (Elohim)?
Can you provide the translation of Jesus' words at John 17:3 in the Hebrew language? Wouldn't it be beautiful seeing the introduction of EL or ELOHIM in that verse?
I will also want to see the Hebrew Translation of John 20:17.

salvation101:
Asking where Jesus and the Holy Spirit came up with their own thought is fallacious cos according to the gospels the Holy Spirit came on Jesus at his baptism hence all he did in his earthly ministry was done in unism with the Holy Spirit.

You said earlier that Jesus gave up his Godship and took a form of man, and then you said at his baptism, the three united to form a Godhead. This is perplexing and I need you to clarify it. How is it possible for God to unite at Jesus baptism when Jesus left his Godship in heaven? And if he left his Godship in heaven, how could he and his father be 1? And if he can take up his Godship at some point, why then could he not tell the day and hour? Please answer these questions.

salvation101:
In the case of Moses, he couldn't av written genesis before the exodus from Egypt. It was most probably during his encounter with God at mount sinai that he got the knowledge. Now the book of exodus was a written account of israel slavery and deliverance as penned down by moses. His deeper revelation of who God is is evident by comparing his response God. At d burning bush he was full of doubt, he was reluctant. But in the wilderness, after over 40yrs of walking with God, his attitude towards the words of God clearly improved.

Have you ever read the Bible enough to know that the scriptures were INSPIRED by God? Would Moses need deeper knowledge to pen down events that happened long before his birth? Are you probably thinking that he did a research before writing the book of Genesis?

salvation101:
Now dis is where u r mistaken again. Eloi is difficult from elohim, Eloi means my God. On the cross the Holy Spirit left him cos he was sin.

It is easier for you to spot my mistakes than for you to answer my questions. Do not skip my questions. If Elohim/EL/ELI means the 3-in-1 God. who then was Jesus crying to in Matthew 27:46? About three in the afternoon Jesus cried out in a loud voice, "Eli, Eli, lema sabachthani?" (which means "My God, my God, why have you forsaken me?".

salvation101:
Wat has the jews going into captivity got to do with the scripture? Dat should be d fourth empire if am not mistaken? So how were dey able to preserve the word under babylonia, medo-persian and greek empire wch happened before roman? Any student who finished d second school of the jews (bet talmund) could recite the entire old testament off hand.

Ok, I will drop this topic. Let us focus on my questions above.

salvation101:
Talking about smear campaign, are you denying to fact that those 5 guys dat translated ur Bible aren't qualified to? Do u want verifiable links?

Provide answers to the above first. We will eventually visit every links.

salvation101:
How can u say 7000 times wen there is no mention of Yhwh in the entire new testament? The new testament was written in greek, non of the disciples referred to God as Jehovah. The greek word for God (Theos) and Lord (krios) were manipulated by watchtower to mean Jehovah.

I hear you. let us focus on issues one after the other. My questions are above.

salvation101:
Yeah i did a little research about the meaning of Yhwh and the meaning i found is "The Holy one" so saying the God of Israel was wrong wch i readily admit.

It is alright! Do not feel bad. We all live and learn. Moreover, there is more to correct about that name because YHWH does not mean "the holy one". It means "he causes to become".

salvation101:
Still u can see plainly that it was just used to describe His attributes, not particularly His name..

If you call YHWH a title, then why was Moses satisfied when God told him? Moses was not satisfied with the word ELOHIM because he knew that it wasn't a name, hence he asked for a NAME and God gave him the name YHWH Matthew 7:11.

salvation101:
who cannot give something Wen the scribes were referring to God they call Him "the Holy one" or as u like, Yahweh... His name is ELOHIM.

That is not true. if I ask you the name of God(Elohim), will your response be God(Elohim)? How then is it that the scribes forbade people from using the name of God when the word 'Elohim' was used frequently in the New Testament? Or are you unaware that the Jews were forbidden from pronuncing the name of God?

lovingJehovah:
No problems at all.
Very good! But answer my questions. Since Elohim which is translated God means God+Jesus+holy spirit (according to you), who was Jesus crying out to in Matthew 27:46? "About three in the afternoon Jesus cried out in a loud voice, "Eli, Eli, lema sabachthani?" (which means "My God, my God, why have you forsaken me?"wink."
Was Jesus crying out to the Trinity (Elohim)?
Can you provide the translation of Jesus' words at John 17:3 in the Hebrew language? Wouldn't it be beautiful seeing the introduction of EL or ELOHIM in that verse?
I will also want to see the Hebrew Translation of John 20:17.
You said earlier that Jesus gave up his Godship and took a form of man, and then you said at his baptism, the three united to form a Godhead. This is perplexing and I need you to clarify it. How is it possible for God to unite at Jesus baptism when Jesus left his Godship in heaven? And if he left his Godship in heaven, how could he and his father be 1? And if he can take up his Godship at some point, why then could he not tell the day and hour? Please answer these questions.
Have you ever read the Bible enough to know that the scriptures were INSPIRED by God? Would Moses need deeper knowledge to pen down events that happened long before his birth? Are you probably thinking that he did a research before writing the book of Genesis?
It is easier for you to spot my mistakes than for you to answer my questions. Do not skip my questions. If Elohim/EL/ELI means the 3-in-1 God. who then was Jesus crying to in Matthew 27:46? About three in the afternoon Jesus cried out in a loud voice, "Eli, Eli, lema sabachthani?" (which means "My God, my God, why have you forsaken me?".
Ok, I will drop this topic. Let us focus on my questions above.
Provide answers to the above first. We will eventually visit every links.
I hear you. let us focus on issues one after the other. My questions are above. It is alright! Do not feel bad. We all live and learn. Moreover, there is more to correct about that name because YHWH does not mean "the holy one". It means "he causes to become". If you call YHWH a title, then why was Moses satisfied when God told him? Moses was not satisfied with the word ELOHIM because he knew that it wasn't a name, hence he asked for a NAME and God gave him the name YHWH Matthew 7:11. That is not true. if I ask you the name of God(Elohim), will your response be God(Elohim)? How then is it that the scribes forbade people from using the name of God when the word 'Elohim' was used frequently in the New Testament? Or are you unaware that the Jews were forbidden from pronuncing the name of God?

On the cross Jesus cried out to God. He left His glory above like i said. On dat cross, God the Father and the Spirit left him. I showed you where the Bible referred to the father as God and tge Holy Spirit as well. Asking me to quote the original Hebrew is wrong, u should be asking for the original greek cos the new testament were written in greek. The word Elohim means tge strong ones, Eloi means my God.

Now about wat happened on the day of Jesus baptism, i didn't say dey came back to form the Godhead again but to show u d same unism u find in other places of the scripture how they worked in synergy so don't misquote me. Till Jesus ascended he didn't have that glory cos the Bible testified dat he was fully man, faced with similar temptations like all men.. The Bible in philipians 2 tells us how Jesus left his glory above to come into the world.

Yeah i know the Bible was inspired word of God but Moses wasn't qualified to write a book that will be included in scripture before he met God in tge burning bush. Moses was 80 wen he met with God and he died at 120 so 40yrs was all he had in the ministry and bulk of that 40yrs was in the wilderness. This is the most likely time he penned down the scriptures.. He spent 40days twice at mouth sinai and it's most possible he got the inspiration about how the world began and everything about his ministry there..
The word Elohim is Hebrew so it couldn't be in scripture written in greek..

salvation101:
well the word u refer to as jehovah is actually YHWH or Yahweh... The word Elohim is used to refer to God 2700 times in the old testament i would love to hear ur explanation of that...

nothing is left to explain, Jesus your personal lord and saviour said in Mark 12:29 that the first commandment is Jehovah our God is one Jehovah. That is straight forward enough. The words of Jesus in Mark 12:29 is from part of what Moses recorded which Jesus christ while in heaven back then is fully aware. The same Jesus came from heaven to earth to attest to the same fact. Madam that is a commandment you either follow or set yours with ELOHIM.

harbjar:

You see i dont have an objection if you call humans children of God or sons of God because according to the bible both new and old..good people were being referred to as sons of God
Romans 8:14
For all who are led by the Spirit of God are sons of God. ...
Its the genius of the jewish language, but you see christains say jesus is a different kind of son.. That he is "begotten" and not like created like adam and all of us but "begotten" by God....
So now i am asking you.. What does begotten mean??

begotten: to cause, or produce as an effect. To cause something to happen or exist. What do you think?

salvation101:

On the cross Jesus cried out to God. He left His glory above like i said. On dat cross, God the Father and the Spirit left him. I showed you where the Bible referred to the father as God and tge Holy Spirit as well. Asking me to quote the original Hebrew is wrong, u should be asking for the original greek cos the new testament were written in greek. The word Elohim means tge strong ones, Eloi means my God.

So your rendition is that when Jesus cried the word ELI(my God), Jehovah and the holy spirit already left him? Beautiful! Does that now indicate that you agree that they are separable? Would you agree that using the word Elohim denotes an exclusion of Jesus? If the father left him, how was he able to entrust his spirit to him in Luke 23:46? Are you trying to negate Acts 2:27 "you will not leave me..."?
If you say that my God means Eloi, what should we do with the Bible-provided ELI in Matthew 27:46? Following your rendition, can we conclude that Jesus was not a native speaker of Hebrew hence his expression was wrong?
Please answer my questions.

salvation101:
Now about wat happened on the day of Jesus baptism, i didn't say dey came back to form the Godhead again but to show u d same unism u find in other places of the scripture how they worked in synergy so don't misquote me. Till Jesus ascended he didn't have that glory cos the Bible testified dat he was fully man, faced with similar temptations like all men.. The Bible in philipians 2 tells us how Jesus left his glory above to come into the world.

Before the ministry of Jesus kicked off we see the three of them coming together at his baptism, God (the Father) spoke from heaven dat this is my beloved son...., the Holy Spirit descended taking the form of a dove and rested on Jesus. The emboldened is your comment and if you scroll down you will see it for yourself.. The beauty of the internet is the perpetual receipt that it tenders. I do not have to worry about the rats in my house eating them up. Who are the three of them? Are you referring to God or flesh? kindly explain. If Jesus was "fully man", why, then, would you agree that a man and the father who is a spirit, not on earth but in heaven are one? The Bible did not say that the three of them came together.

salvation101:
Yeah i know the Bible was inspired word of God but Moses wasn't qualified to write a book that will be included in scripture before he met God in tge burning bush.

You said that his knowledge when writing Genesis grew fonder after writing Exodus because he came to LEARN MORE about 'God'(godhead). As a result, he understood better the use of the word GOD when writing Genesis.
However, I will reiterate my question. Did Moses write the book of Genesis out of his fonder knowledge of God or out of inspiration by God?

salvation101:
Moses was 80 wen he met with God and he died at 120 so 40yrs was all he had in the ministry and bulk of that 40yrs was in the wilderness. This is the most likely time he penned down the scriptures.. He spent 40days twice at mouth sinai and it's most possible he got the inspiration about how the world began and everything about his ministry there..

Okay

salvation101:
The word Elohim is Hebrew so it couldn't be in scripture written in greek..

Bravo! Can you explain what the word is doing here in the Greek scripture (and in English translation) in Matthew 27:46 About three in the afternoon Jesus cried out in a loud voice, "Eli, Eli, lema sabachthani?" (which means "My God, my God, why have you forsaken me?" )?

achorladey:

begotten: to cause, or produce as an effect. To cause something to happen or exist. What do you think?

You guys have a way of changing words to suit your definition....
Ask a kid what begotten means and immediately he would tell you to "procreate"..
The Bible says Deuteronomy 4:25
[25]When thou shalt beget children, and children's children, and ye shall have remained long in the land, and shall corrupt yourselves, and make a graven image, or the likeness of any thing, and shall do evil in the sight of the LORD thy God, to provoke him to anger:
What does that word imply there if not procreate
What john 16 means is that God procreated jesus and not made like Adam....
Do you believe God is the biological father of Jesus just as you are the biological son of your father??

lovingJehovah:
So your rendition is that when Jesus cried the word ELI(my God), Jehovah and the holy spirit already left him? Beautiful! Does that now indicate that you agree that they are separable? Would you agree that using the word Elohim denotes an exclusion of Jesus? If the father left him, how was he able to entrust his spirit to him in Luke 23:46? Are you trying to negate Acts 2:27 "you will not leave me..."?
If you say that my God means Eloi, what should we do with the Bible-provided ELI in Matthew 27:46? Following your rendition, can we conclude that Jesus was not a native speaker of Hebrew hence his expression was wrong?
Please answer my questions.
Before the ministry of Jesus kicked off we see the three of them coming together at his baptism, God (the Father) spoke from heaven dat this is my beloved son...., the Holy Spirit descended taking the form of a dove and rested on Jesus. The emboldened is your comment and if you scroll down you will see it for yourself.. The beauty of the internet is the perpetual receipt that it tenders. I do not have to worry about the rats in my house eating them up. Who are the three of them? Are you referring to God or flesh? kindly explain. If Jesus was "fully man", why, then, would you agree that a man and the father who is a spirit, not on earth but in heaven are one? The Bible did not say that the three of them came together.
You said that his knowledge when writing Genesis grew fonder after writing Exodus because he came to LEARN MORE about 'God'(godhead). As a result, he understood better the use of the word GOD when writing Genesis.
However, I will reiterate my question. Did Moses write the book of Genesis out of his fonder knowledge of God or out of inspiration by God? Okay
Bravo! Can you explain what the word is doing here in the Greek scripture (and in English translation) in Matthew 27:46 About three in the afternoon Jesus cried out in a loud voice, "Eli, Eli, lema sabachthani?" (which means "My God, my God, why have you forsaken me?" )?

Of course the Trinity is distinct. There is the father, son and holy spirit. They av their own personality and distinction. But they are still one in terms that they are always in agreement and never go against the will lf each other.. Why are u trying hard to twist the word Eli to mean elohim? Eli is the aramaic word for God and eloi is the aramaic word for my God.. Elohim is the Hebrew word for "the strong ones". During the time of Jesus on earth, the most common spoken language was Aramaic u can verify

U are actually seeing wat u want to see not wat i wrote up there. I told u moses knowledge as at d time of writing all the scriptures were already broader than wen dat event in exodus happened wch was wen he first met God... Its different from me saying he wrote exodus before genesis . I said he wrote those books in hindsight. The book of Exodus was an account of everything that happened and he had to put all the events there has dey occurred. When he first asked God for His name God said "i am that i am" but in Exodus6:2,3 he revealed himself to him as '' The Lord".. He said Abraham, Isaac and Jacob didn't know him as that name.. But we see moses using that word in Genesis wch shows he wrote in hindsight.

The word eli eli lama sabacthani is in greek scripture because the disciples who wrote it decided to quote it as he said it.. But u can verify, the new testament books were written in greek. Tell me if u av a contrary information.

achorladey:

nothing is left to explain, Jesus your personal lord and saviour said in Mark 12:29 that the first commandment is Jehovah our God is one Jehovah. That is straight forward enough. The words of Jesus in Mark 12:29 is from part of what Moses recorded which Jesus christ while in heaven back then is fully aware. The same Jesus came from heaven to earth to attest to the same fact. Madam that is a commandment you either follow or set yours with ELOHIM.

oh so u dismiss the plurality that occurs 2700 times over a verse u could as well not understand its meaning

salvation101:
Of course the Trinity is distinct.

Now, is each separate member referred to as Elohim distinctively?

salvation101:
There is the father, son and holy spirit. They av their own personality and distinction. But they are still one in terms that they are always in agreement and never go against the will lf each other..

Oh, here we go again! The oneness is now in agreement and not Godship? Give me an example of the WILL of the son or the WILL of the holy spirit in the Bible.

salvation101:
Why are u trying hard to twist the word Eli to mean elohim? Eli is the aramaic word for God

Can you match that belief with Matthew 27:46 About three in the afternoon Jesus cried out in a loud voice, "Eli, Eli, lema sabachthani?" (which means "My God, my God, why have you forsaken me?")? What Bible translation do you use?

salvation101:
and eloi is the aramaic word for my God..

Interesting! Initially, you said that the name of God was either Elohim or EL. Just to update you because we will get there soon.

salvation101:
Elohim is the Hebrew word for "the strong ones".

We will get there.

salvation101:
During the time of Jesus on earth, the most common spoken language was Aramaic u can verify

How do you know that? Give me a source to prove that.

salvation101:
U are actually seeing wat u want to see not wat i wrote up there.

I do not use glasses yet and I am pretty sure we both got great eyesight.

salvation101:
I told u moses knowledge as at d time of writing all the scriptures were already broader than wen dat event in exodus happened wch was wen he first met God...

What you said was that his knowledge was fonder when writing Genesis hence his understanding of the nature of God was prodigious. That was when I asked you if he wrote Genesis out of his fonder knowledge or by inspiration. It is easier to admit and move on than trying to coin a thought that is stored in a public forum. Do you realize that by saying that his knowledge grew fonder when writing Genesis, you are negating the veracity or the valuation of the book of Exodus?

salvation101:
Its different from me saying he wrote exodus before genesis . I said he wrote those books in hindsight.

This makes it even more impractical for a human. Have you read the book of Genesis at all? Without inspiration (or a vision) by God, no man can ever document that. Hindsight cannot fetch realities of pre-creation of the earth and man. How can hindsight beget the record of the communication of Spirits?

salvation101:
The book of Exodus was an account of everything that happened and he had to put all the events there has dey occurred. When he first asked God for His name God said "i am that i am" but in Exodus6:2,3 he revealed himself to him as '' The Lord".. He said Abraham, Isaac and Jacob didn't know him as that name.. But we see moses using that word in Genesis wch shows he wrote in hindsight.

How many books do you think Moses wrote? The Bible never told us that anyone wrote the Bible by hindsight. 2 Timothy 3:16 told us that ALL SCRIPTURE is inspired by God...

salvation101:
The word eli eli lama sabacthani is in greek scripture because the disciples who wrote it decided to quote it as he said it.. But u can verify, the new testament books were written in greek. Tell me if u av a contrary information.

Do you know who wrote those words in Greek? Do you know of an Apostle called Matthew? Did you know that the man was with Jesus for years, spoke the same language as Jesus and was a Jew by birth and down to his ancestors? Did you know that to hold an office of a tax collector one needs some level of education and writing skill? How would you think that such a man would write down Jesus' words literally as it sounded? The Bible as we know is inspired by God. He has seen than twisters might come in the last days to twist some words, and that could be one of the reasons why those words are preserved in its original language. Can you see how you just cannot get around the Bible? No matter how strong your point is, that Bible verse in its original language will always knock it out. As a firm believer in the Bible as the word of God, Eli means "My God" undoubtedly. Eloi can take a hike. It is only stressed to avoid questions like this which still stands: When Jesus cried out ELI(regardless of the language) was he referring to your Godhead which he is inclusive of or?

lovingJehovah:
Now, is each separate member referred to as Elohim distinctively? Oh, here we go again! The oneness is now in agreement and not Godship? Give me an example of the WILL of the son or the WILL of the holy spirit in the Bible. Can you match that belief with Matthew 27:46 About three in the afternoon Jesus cried out in a loud voice, "Eli, Eli, lema sabachthani?" (which means "My God, my God, why have you forsaken me?")? What Bible translation do you use? Interesting! Initially, you said that the name of God was either Elohim or EL. Just to update you because we will get there soon. We will get there. How do you know that? Give me a source to prove that.
I do not use glasses yet and I am pretty sure we both got great eyesight. What you said was that his knowledge was fonder when writing Genesis hence his understanding of the nature of God was prodigious. That was when I asked you if he wrote Genesis out of his fonder knowledge or by inspiration. It is easier to admit and move on than trying to coin a thought that is stored in a public forum. Do you realize that by saying that his knowledge grew fonder when writing Genesis, you are negating the veracity or the valuation of the book of Exodus? This makes it even more impractical for a human. Have you read the book of Genesis at all? Without inspiration (or a vision) by God, no man can ever document that. Hindsight cannot fetch realities of pre-creation of the earth and man. How can hindsight beget the record of the communication of Spirits? How many books do you think Moses wrote? The Bible never told us that anyone wrote the Bible by hindsight. 2 Timothy 3:16 told us that ALL SCRIPTURE is inspired by God...
Do you know who wrote those words in Greek? Do you know of an Apostle called Matthew? Did you know that the man was with Jesus for years, spoke the same language as Jesus and was a Jew by birth and down to his ancestors? Did you know that to hold an office of a tax collector one needs some level of education and writing skill? How would you think that such a man would write down Jesus' words literally as it sounded? The Bible as we know is inspired by God. He has seen than twisters might come in the last days to twist some words, and that could be one of the reasons why those words are preserved in its original language. Can you see how you just cannot get around the Bible? No matter how strong your point is, that Bible verse in its original language will always knock it out. As a firm believer in the Bible as the word of God, Eli means "My God" undoubtedly. Eloi can take a hike. It is only stressed to avoid questions like this which still stands: When Jesus cried out ELI(regardless of the language) was he referring to your Godhead which he is inclusive of or?

They are distinct in personality but they are one in purpose.

Asking to show where Jesus and the Holy Spirit exercised their will, luke5:12,13. Jesus christ expressed his willingness to heal the leprose man and in Ephesian 4:7-12 we receive grace and the gifts for ministry according to how Christ aportioned it. 1cor 11 :12 tells us about the gifts of the spirit and that it is abortioned according to the will of the Holy Spirit.


Now concerning 2tim 3:16, it says all of scriptures were inspired by God. Wat do you understand by that? For me, inspiration could be spiritual encounter (the prophets), physical (like dey r just doing their job like the scribes who wrote the historical books) It doesn't mean it was dictated to them by the God. An artist can be inspired by music, nature or an event. It doesn't mean it was dictated to him by this sources of inspiration. In d gospels we see the personalities of those who wrote the books (matt, mark, luke, john) reflected in their accounts. Jesus said, moses gave u a bill for divorcement because of ur hardeness of heart but in the beginning it was not so... Moses wrote more than the pentateuch, he wrote psalms, some jews believe he wrote the book of job as well.

The source to the language Jesus and his disciples spoke is here https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Language_of_Jesus

He would write Jesus word as it sounded just for record purpose and for the ridicle dat followed for tge ppl around said he was calling on elias(or elijah if u like).

The new testament was written in greek, this was d Roman empire but before then the greek empire (under Alexander the great) had reign so dis was their civilization. The entire new testament was written in greek.