dalaman:


You can not deny that these are the realitiesof life. You chose to say that they are hopeless, bleak etc but that doesn't change them from being the reality of life. I just stated the reality of life and it has nothing to do with atheism. Unless if you are trying to lie as usual and claim that the reality of life as i stated is atheism which will then show that you are a liar as always.

So lies and false hope means well for humanity abi? It's not suprising, since its coming from a person that dwells on lies daily.

butterflylion:
[s]

Unnecessarily rigmarole.

So long story short. Atheism has nothing to offer

dalaman:


There is more truth and reality in what I've written than in all the books of the bible put together. Jesus can NOT help you. If you are involved in an accident and you break your limbs, it is your follow humans beings that will have to come to your aid, pull you out of the car, take you to the hospital where your fellow humans will have to treat you and give you medical attention. Jesus will not come and pull you out of the wreckage and heal your broken limbs. No matter how you hope and believe that he will do it he can't and won't ever. That is my point.

It does. Just that it doesn't have false hope and lies to sell.

butterflylion:


I repeat, the fact that you are an atheist and voicing this OPINION out simply means this is your atheistic worldview so cannot be said to be the reality of those who are not atheists.

Thanks for again affirming the bleakness and hopelessness of atheism

I also repeat, when an atheist calls religious motives targeting the well-being, hope, comfort, motivation and encouragement of humanity a lie, then we know who is actually lying

You are doing a great job affirming religion.

dalaman:


Lie all you want but that remains the reality of life for.most people including you. You live in a country called Nigeria where the average life expectancy is 47 years, which means that majority of the people will not get to see their grand children(short life), the country is a total mess, over 70 percent of the people are poor, have no access to basic amenitiesof life, like good shelter, clothing, stable electricity, good food, good roads, good health care delivery services, social safety net, good security services and justice. The life out there is hard and difficult for most of the people that live there and is filled with ups and downs. The only people that are supposed to make things easy for the people which are the leaders and fellow citizens have failed to do that. These are the realities of life in Nigeria for most people and NOT my opinion. It is also the reality of your life as a Nigerian, unless if you are part of the elites which I doubt you are. So that is also your own reality and not my opinion and that has nothing to do with atheism but the reality life in the place where you live.

I have already told you that it is false. No.matter what if you are infected with blood cancer today in Nigeria , Jesus will never help you. It is your fellow humans that will have to help yoy. When your president fell ill, he did not rely on the hope that islam offers, he ran to England
The land of the infidels, spent money to get the best medical help money can buy in the hands of his fellow humans in an advance society. That is the reality and truth, it is your fellow humans that will have to help you when you need help and assistance in this life and not some external force that remains a lie.

No matter the hope and comfort that religions teach, when it comes down to reality their lies and nonsense they teach always gets exposed as the lies that it is.

butterflylion:
Much as I hate doing this I just need to for the sake of the problematic atheist community here on nairaland. I like them though but they never seem to reason so let me help them reason properly.

The world as we know it is slowly degenerating into a chaotic place and isn't wholesome anymore for so many and in times like these people seek for hope, motivation, encouragement, direction, comfort.

This is so for a vast majority of people world wide so they are constantly on the look out for anyone who can offer them these. So here come the nairaland atheists or even the atheists worldwide to help them as best they can.

From my observations atheism is simply a rejection mixed with a sceptical approach with a dice of mockery all added together. We all know that scepticism is a common phenomenon everywhere in the world.

We are sceptical in our offices, market places, schools, and even the area boys and girls are sceptical so this makes scepticism, common place and so irrelevant. However people are always on the look out for anyone with any form of answers and tend to avoid sceptics because as I said, it is so common place. But answer providers are not common place.

We also know that mockery can get boring and tiresome a lot as we cannot keep it up because after a while the fans of the one mocking would begin to get tired and walking away one by one because it is becoming ridiculous and repetitive. Eventually they will turn on the one mocking.

A thread was put up by winner01 (a Christian) which got me thinking about putting up this thread as well. This is the thread

Among the list of the atheist leaders who were to speak in the convention is Richard Dawkins . Richard, the once applauded, atheist and with throngs of followers could not pull his usual attention to this convention so they had to cancel it due to dismal ticket sales.

This was actually the 3rd GLOBAL convention and at just the 3rd convention things are already falling apart.

How can a GLOBAL atheist convention experience dismal ticket sales? Why aren't the global atheists interested?

There are religious conventions which have been held yearly for upwards of 50 years or even 20 years now and still pull crowds because of the hope, comfort, direction, motivation, encouragement, they offer which everyone seeks after. Yet at just the 3rd convention atheists are already losing interest.

If atheists can offer hope they will grow
If they can offer motivation they will grow
If they can offer encouragement they will grow
If they can offer direction they will grow
If they can offer comfort they will grow

But can they offer any of these? No they cannot

Do they make any attempts at working on these? No they do not.

wirinet:


Atheism cannot and had never pretended to offer those things you listed above. Anyone that need hope, motivation, direction and comfort, better try pentecostal Christianity, they offer tithe, offerings and complete submission to the pastor in exchange for those things.

wirinet:

For your information there is no atheist community here on nairaland or elsewhere in Nigeria.

dalaman:


Life has been difficult and is difficult for most people hence they need by various people to find ways to lie to people and explain them in the name of religion to accept what ever they imagine and think for them that they feel will give them hope or make them live according to the way they want. Christ telling his followers that things won't be easy means nothing because things have been hard for many people since before any story about Jesus was written. But then there are many christians that will disagree with you about the claim that Jesus said things will be heard for people. All these prosperity word of faith preachers and christians will totally disagree with you.

dalaman:


No help will come from any where apart from your fellow human beings. Jesus does NOT help christians, there is no evidence to show that christians are having it better than non christians at all or that they are getting any help from any where better than non christians . If you fall sick with a terminal illness you will have to go to the hospital the way anybody else does and seek proper medical attention, if you are involved in an accidentand you break a limb you'll have to go and follow the normal process every body follow to get healing. You'll go to the hospital and a POP will be used or any other method will be used and you'll wait for weeks before your bones will come back to the way they were. Jesus will NOT help you or heal you in a day or two once you have a fractured bone in any of your limbs. You have to work to earn a living either legitimately or illegitimately like every other person. Jesus will not and can not give you anything you want without you working for it. You will have to get an education, move around and travel wide to gain knowledge and awareness like every other person. Jesus can never give you any type of education or professional knowledge or any thing without you going out to seek for it like any other person.

dalaman:


At the end of it all. You get no help from any external source. The only help you'll get when you are in trouble or in Nedd has to be from your fellow humans. Jesus can never help you. Jesus can never feed you when you are hungry. You have to vigorouslyhustle or if you are lucky get help from someone. Jesus can never come and give you food even if you are straving..

dalaman:

Human beings can be made to change their out look towards life and help each other more so that their stay on earth will be easier for them all instead of lying to themselves that some external force will help them when they are in bed or in trouble. How does the hope for tomorrow or a better world negates the atheistic worldview? Atheism is the disbelief in God's and not a world view that is negates the hope of a better tomorrow. That remains your own making and it is a lie.

winner01:
Yawns!!!

Who said hardship began with the era of Jesus?

Also many Christians will disagree with that doctrine the same way several atheists will disagree with all the trash you're saying. A belief in Jesus Christ as the son of God is what binds us regardless of doctrinal differences.

Doctrinal differences can be argued within Christians not by atheists who believe everyone else is deluded.




You too talk. I've had this same argument with you. Of course Christians don't have it better than non Christians and no Christian was promised a rosy life either. Jesus Christ and his disciples did not live long, they were not the wealthiest of humans (materially). The help we speak of is spiritual. Uplifting the spirit and helping us to maintain a healthy christian life in the race for eternal glory.

Everything else you've said is trash


We all get help from external sources. When God wants to send help, he uses man. Jesus has helped me in many ways. That you hold the belief that yourself and about 3% of the world are the only custodians of truth is okay of it will make you sleep well.


Why should your stay on earth be easier? Is that what your delusion teaches?

Atheism is an hopeless and empty worldview that negates the very essence of humanity.
Quit shifting the goal post and explain what atheism can do for humanity.

Wrinet(m): 7:38pm

Arguing with you is becoming an unproductive and irrational exercise, how does "we have atheist in every city" translate to atheism is a community? I took time to explain to you that atheists do not have the motivation for meetings and jamborees, and you are talking of atheist community. Most universities have a reasonable amount of atheists, but you will not see them forming a community of meeting. They only betray their beliefs when Christians intrude on their privacy and try to save their soul by force.
Atheism is a personal journey, it does not require evangelism or convincing others

wirinet:

I can compare you to a wailing wailer, the same way PDP and it's allies are still pained that their hero lost the last presidential elections and are extremely bitter and sometimes hateful towards the ruling party and their supporters, that is the way you guys are pained that some people left your religious party ( Christianity ) and have chosen to live happily as freethinkers or atheists.

wirinet:


For your information there is no atheist community here on nairaland or elsewhere in Nigeria.

wirinet:



The problem poverty, hopelessness and directionless is caused mainly by greed and materialism, which is being promoted by your religion Christianity. Buddhism, shintoism, Hinduism and even Judaism does not promote crass materialism and so do not suffer those issues of hopelessness and lack of meanings to their lives.
Atheism is just personal conviction of lack of any diety worthy of worship, so I do not understand how that can give any others hope.

wirinet:


Atheism is simply a rejection or a disbelief in any God. That is the only common denomination, after that there are a million and one shades of atheists, you have the materialistic atheist, you have the spiritual atheist, the militant atheist, the pacifist atheist, there is even the Christian atheist, (those atheists who believes in the teaching and ideas of Christ but do not believe in the diety of Jesus or in any other Gods.

wirinet:


Atheist conventions cannot work because there is nothing to discuss in such meetings. What else is there to discuss? Are atheists going to a convention to reinforce their beliefs that there is no God? Will there be music, drinks and motivational speeches at the convention?
The only people that would be interested in such conventions are undecided atheists.

wirinet:


Atheism cannot and had never pretended to offer those things you listed above. Anyone that need hope, motivation, direction and comfort, better try pentecostal Christianity, they offer tithe, offerings and complete submission to the pastor in exchange for those things.

butterflylion:





It seems you know the guy and his long unnecessary stories while shifting around to everything yet without saying what he was asked.

winner01:
Dalaman is a specialist in typing long sermons without meaning.

winner01:


Ad hominem


Local champions. Search Facebook for Nigerian atheist movements, I've seen about 2 Nigerian sponsored adverts on Facebook, promoting their arm of hopeless atheism


Greed and materialism is caused by those who have no regard for God or humanity regardless of whatever they claim to believe.

And don't lump other worldviews to atheism and claim they don't deal with issues of hopelessness. Atheism is secluded in its dreamland of a godless utopia. Christianity does not promote materialism either. Christ who all Christians strive to imitate did not preach materialism. And If you give me examples of those not following the teachings of Christ, then be prepared for examples of those who seem to be actingbout the real effects of atheism.

Atheism is a lack of belief that seeks to spread its foolishness to other scenes of humanity. This is why y'all spend your life on a religion section preaching atheism dishonestly and ridiculing religious people.
After hundreds of years of this act of foolishness, humanity still remains largely religious.



But do you agree when we say Christians are bound by a "belief in Jesus as the son of God", after that there are hundreds of denominations.
Do you call out dalaman and other atheists when they triy to lump together all religious attrocitoes commuted by Christians with christianity

That's where your bigotry comes in.


Foreign atheists are not toothless dogs like Nigerian atheists. They have organizations and have held international conventions which have all recorded ridiculously low turnouts.
Atheists organize and go to conventions for the same reason you are onna religion section trying to advocate for the superiority of atheism.

The prominent atheists whose quotes I gave on the first page seem to disagree with you.
I'm my opinion, they are smarter, more intelligent, have more depth in atheism and most importantly are much more honest than most Nigerian atheists. This is why they have honestly exposed the hopelessness of the atheistic worldview.

wirinet:


I now understand why my good friend Billyonaire is winding down his time on nairaland, debates have becomes childish, repetitive and unproductive.

I am also extremely tired of the merry go round, no matter how much you try to educate the fundamentalist Christian that the only thing binding atheist together is a lack of belief of God or gods, it looks like you are talking to a prerecorded voice message, they keep repeating their nonsense of atheist being a platform to offer anything like hope, motivation, etc.

It seems their grouse is with atheists in general and not any other theist. it is as if converting to any theist like Muslim, Hindu, Buddhist or even okija worshiper would douse their hatred of others holding different beliefs, and show love instead[/s].

I am also considering leaving like billyonaire, so Christians can have free reign on this section. I think I have outlive my usefulness

dalaman:


There is more truth and reality in what I've written than in all the books of the bible put together. Jesus can NOT help you. If you are involved in an accident and you break your limbs, it is your follow humans beings that will have to come to your aid, pull you out of the car, take you to the hospital where your fellow humans will have to treat you and give you medical attention. Jesus will not come and pull you out of the wreckage and heal your broken limbs. No matter how you hope and believe that he will do it he can't and won't ever. That is my point.




It does. Just that it doesn't have false hope and lies to sell.

darkchild64:
dalaman and wrinet you need not waste your time here let butterflylion and the rest think whatever they like. With all the so called hope and motivation that religion provides Christians don't live a better quality life than non Christians so cut the chase,if you like say to yourself that atheism is hopelessness and emptiness keep reciting it until it sticks to your head THAT IS YOUR BUSINESS

winner01:
Yawns!!!

Who said hardship began with the era of Jesus?

Also many Christians will disagree with that doctrine the same way several atheists will disagree with all the trash you're saying. A belief in Jesus Christ as the son of God is what binds us regardless of doctrinal differences.

Doctrinal differences can be argued within Christians not by atheists who believe everyone else is deluded.

You too talk. I've had this same argument with you. Of course Christians don't have it better than non Christians and no Christian was promised a rosy life either. Jesus Christ and his disciples did not live long, they were not the wealthiest of humans (materially). The help we speak of is spiritual. Uplifting the spirit and helping us to maintain a healthy christian life in the race for eternal glory.

Everything else you've said is trash

We all get help from external sources. When God wants to send help, he uses man. Jesus has helped me in many ways. That you hold the belief that yourself and about 3% of the world are the only custodians of truth is okay of it will make you sleep well.

Why should your stay on earth be easier? Is that what your delusion teaches?

Atheism is an hopeless and empty worldview that negates the very essence of humanity.
Quit shifting the goal post and explain what atheism can do for humanity.

dalaman:


Jesus christ as the son of God? That has not even been established, many christians are yet to tell us if Jesus is God himself or the son of God separately. These issues are yet to be resloved even among christians but that is a topic for another day.





So the help you speak is mythical and fictional since it has no direct bearing on your life and can not be seen or observed by any body outside your body of delusion.
Ive said it before that you guys always make empty claims. You claim Christianity offers hope and comfort , when asked to measure up you are now saying that it is spiritual. The spiritual is meaningless and always a copout because it means nothing in reality. When you want to run away you just jump to the spiritual realm because at that realm anything can be asserted because nobody expects any accountability, proof or evidence qhen it come to that.




No we don't. You are making empty claims. Only humans help each other Gods do not help anybody in reality. In fictional and alternate realities like the bible and Koran for example you see God helping people directly but in the reality we know that remains a lie.
It is humans that must help you always. Gods do not help people, there is absolutelyno evidence for that.



What is the very essence of humanity and how does atheism negate it?

darkchild64:
butterflylion keeps talking about the "hope" and "fulfilment" that religion offers and the "emptiness" and "hopelessness" atheism offers
Bro if a man is facing challenges and he chooses to drink alcohol,he would forget the problem for a while but does that mean the problem is not there no,another man in his position may choose to accept his situation and make efforts to change it rather than try to forget it like the former

Religion is like alcohol,it tells you that everything is going to be alright,while we welcome the hope we are all about the result,imagine a woman with cancer,religion tells the kids to pray and have faith and "God" would surely hear their prayers and heal her[/s]

On the other hand an atheist or any objective person recognizes that her chances of survival is quite low so s/he makes the woman and her children recognize that ,however she is subjected to every possible medication available to help resolve her situation

Atheism is simply the lack of belief in any deity,it is not something instituted to bring people hope and motivation,

there are millions of ways one can find hope and motivation in life,what atheism simply does is give one courage to solve ones problems and also show people the reality of life and not give them empty promises no super daddy is coming from the skies to help you so you must work hard,this might seem negligible to you but it is not my business to make you understand, think whatever you like

butterflylion:


For the 6th time, you said categorically that atheism has a lot to offer humanity and so I ask again, what are the lots of things atheism has got to offer?

Don't shift this to a question such as you are not trying to do by asking "how atheism negates the essence of humanity ". That was not your earlier position.

What are the lots of things atheism has got to offer humanity?

I can easily show you how atheism negates the essence of humanity but I need you to first answer the question you claimed you had answers to from the start.

darkchild64:
butterflylion keeps talking about the "hope" and "fulfilment" that religion offers and the "emptiness" and "hopelessness" atheism offers
Bro if a man is facing challenges and he chooses to drink alcohol,he would forget the problem for a while but does that mean the problem is not there no,another man in his position may choose to accept his situation and make efforts to change it rather than try to forget it like the former

Religion is like alcohol,it tells you that everything is going to be alright,while we welcome the hope we are all about the result,imagine a woman with cancer,religion tells the kids to pray and have faith and "God" would surely hear their prayers and heal her
On the other hand an atheist or any objective person recognizes that her chances of survival is quite low so s/he makes the woman and her children recognize that ,however she is subjected to every possible medication available to help resolve her situation.

Atheism is simply the lack of belief in any deity,it is not something instituted to bring people hope and motivation,there are millions of ways one can find hope and motivation in life,what atheism simply does is give one courage to solve ones problems and also show people the reality of life and not give them empty promises no super daddy is coming from the skies to help you so you must work hard,this might seem negligible to you but it is not my business to make you understand, think whatever you like

dalaman:


Obgbeni will you keep quiet. Your friend like you claims religion offers message of hope, comfort and assistence only for him to run and claim it is spiritual help and spiritual mumbo jumbo he is talking about and race for eternal glory and other christian mythology and fiction. He can not point out to any message and comfort that his religion offers him that makes his life better here in the world more than that of others.

Despite your endless claims that your religion offers you hope and comfort (which is false hope and comfort ) your life is NOT better than mine as an atheist. You have no advantage over me, there is no special ability that you possess as a result of the hope and comfort you claim your religion offers you that gives you an advantage over me in anyway at all, you have no special knowledge or skill as a result as a result of the hope or comfort that your religion sells to you, you do not even have a more positive outlook towards life better than me despite all these empty claims of hope and confirt that you keep yapping about. You can only make EMPTY CLAIMS that when looked it always shows you completely have no idea of what you are talking about.

There is NOTHING that this empty and fake message of hope and comfort your religion sells to you that you can point to that makes you a better person than me or gives you any special advantage over me in anyway as long as reality is concerned. If there is name one, I INSIST that there is NONE.[/s]

I am not here to tell you what atheism offers but to show you that you believe in lies and false ideas of others. That's all there is to your false and empty beliefs.

dalaman:

It does. Just that it doesn't have false hope and lies to sell.

dalaman:

Atheism has a lot to offer. But it doesn't have lies and false hope to offer like religion does.

Butterflyleo:
[s]

So you are not here to tell me what atheism offers despite repeatedly saying the below





Save me the lengthy lecture and just list out what the "lots" of things are that atheism has to offer.
This surely should not be a difficult thing to list should it?

Telling me long stories I did not solicit for while ignoring the question I am now asking you FOR THE 7TH TIME is simply being silly even after you claimed atheism had a lot to offer.

Save your breath and energy and just cut to the chase by answering my simple and direct question. WETIN ATHEISM GET TO OFFER US FOR THIS HUMANITY WEY WE DEY SO?

dalaman:


You can not show me how the hope and comfort your religion sells to you gives you an advantage, a specual ability or makes your life better than that of others that do not subscribe to your religion but yet you want me to tell you what atheism offers humanity?

I am not here to tell you what atheism offers but to tell you that you believe in the lies and false messages of other men that has nothing to do with the reality we know and see around us.

Name one advantage or special ability the message of hope and comfort your religion offers you that puts your life above mine. Name just one.

Tonyosas101:
Let me get this straight
Religion is more of hope, comfort, promises
Atheism is more of reality and how to go about it

Reality is the state of things as they actually exist, as opposed to an idealistic or notional idea of them. Reality includes everything that is and has been, whether or not it is observable or comprehensible. A still broader definition includes that which has existed, exists, or will exist

Butterflyleo:




So with the above, the reality that religion offers is so on point because it is built on past, present and future which translates to HOPE and which further triggers ASSURANCE, COMFORT, ENCOURAGEMENT AND MOTIVATION.

a worldview that atheism does not hold so in a nutshell atheism has absolutely nothing to say beyond a bleak, empty past or present but can NEVER deal with the reality of A FUTURE.