Excerpt from memoirs of Hugh Crow (1765 – 1829), an English sea captain.

It is probable (and this opinion is entertained by Captain Adam and others) that Bonny, and the towns on the low line of the coast on either side of it were originally peopled from the Eboe country, and that before the commencement of the slave trade, if it then existed; the inhabitants employed themselves in the making of salt, by evaporation from the sea water. (This is not what the Ijaws do, do they?)

The King of New Calabar, in the neighbourhood, and Pepple, king of Bonny, were both of Eboe descent, of which also are the mass of the native; and the number of the slaves from the Eboe country, which, throughout the existence of the British trade were taken from Bonny, amounted to perhaps three-fourth of the whole export.

Apparently Ijaws do produce salt:


http://books.google.com/books?id=MdaAdBC-_S4C&pg=PA236&lpg=PA236&dq=ijaw+making+salt&source=bl&ots=dN4NlGvf8V&sig=1j5rJxdrPddethBwTcUdHMFZtEc&hl=en&ei=LpKsTergA8Xi0gG3r7T5CA&sa=X&oi=book_result&ct=result&resnum=6&ved=0CDUQ6AEwBQ#v=onepage&q&f=false

http://books.google.com/books?id=fFdeYB1lIPwC&pg=PA249&lpg=PA249&dq=ijaw+making+salt&source=bl&ots=L5NvFbZSRM&sig=QOMGR5MHKGOaB4Exc3tk3CeUy5U&hl=en&ei=LpKsTergA8Xi0gG3r7T5CA&sa=X&oi=book_result&ct=result&resnum=2&ved=0CB4Q6AEwAQ#v=onepage&q=ijaw%20making%20salt&f=false

Reviewing the link above, you'll see that Bonny was included as Ijaw so that doesn't work.

I have my facts right

King Pepple = Grandson of the great king Opubo/Obullo (An Igbo man)

The names of the 4 regents appointed in Bonny are:
Anna Pepple = Iloli
Ada Allison
Captain Hart = Affo Dappa
Manilla Pepple = Ncheke or Erinashaboo


Anna Pepple house was headed/founded by Madu (Maduka) and succeeded by his sons Alali and Iloli
Manilla Pepple house was headed/founded by Ntshaka or Ncheke (an ex-slave). Ncheke is also said to be known as Erinashaboo/Erinashabu. Ncheke was succeeded by another slave Oko Jumbo.

Jumbo Manilla is Sinaminabofori Okponkata, I couldn't find his other names but Okponkata is Igbo.

From all these, who is not Igbo among them?

[url=http://books.google.ca/books?id=8drXpCGaT-UC&pg=PA45&lpg=PA45&dq=manilla+pepple+ncheke&source=bl&ots=8HdqJALQiQ&sig=hHEKINur92BG8N96CyROPKmfy9w&hl=en&ei=2YasTY7mLMatgQf10_nzBQ&sa=X&oi=book_result&ct=result&resnum=1&ved=0CBYQ6AEwAA#v=onepage&q=manilla%20pepple%20ncheke&f=false]Link1[/url]
Link2
[url=http://books.google.ca/books?id=QMwNAAAAQAAJ&pg=PA271&lpg=PA271&dq=this+Opubo,+or+Obullo&source=bl&ots=ZkAtKWDvsQ&sig=6YwFsK-3E3U_EKdE0mDKbroH8Ow&hl=en&ei=i5qsTZLyJIv2gAexpOTzBQ&sa=X&oi=book_result&ct=result&resnum=3&ved=0CCYQ6AEwAg#v=onepage&q=this%20Opubo%2C%20or%20Obullo&f=false]Link3[/url]
[url=http://books.google.ca/books?id=3ACKrcIEAl4C&pg=PA199&lpg=PA199&dq=inhabitants+of+Bonny,+when+our+author+last+visited+that+port,+amounted+to+about+3,000.+They+are+chiefly+a+mixture+of+the&source=bl&ots=AslKhv-KMu&sig=Q7fuaMKPFsfFRILsNRfRJddsK_4&hl=en&ei=L3ysTdWuNo7pgQffwJD0BQ&sa=X&oi=book_result&ct=result&resnum=1&ved=0CBQQ6AEwAA#v=onepage&q=inhabitants%20of%20Bonny%2C%20when%20our%20author%20last%20visited%20that%20port%2C%20amounted%20to%20about%203%2C000.%20They%20are%20chiefly%20a%20mixture%20of%20the&f=false]Link4[/url]

How is Erinashaboo Igbo? (On another note, the Ijaw seem to be really water down with the Igbo, up to Nembe )

ezeagu:

How is Erinashaboo Igbo? (On another note, the Ijaw seem to be really water down with the Igbo, up to Nembe )

His other name was Ncheke and he was an Igbo slave.

I'm not even understanding you people, who was the actual first person who was said to have founded Bonny, is it not Alagbrie, or whatever the spelling is, where was he from, or, where does his name come from and what does it mean?

ezeagu:

I'm not even understanding you people, who was the actual first person who was said to have founded Bonny, is it not Alagbrie, or whatever the spelling is, where was he from, or, where does his name come from and what does it mean?

According to Ngwa traditions, an Ngwa man remembered as Okobo had two sons, recollected as Agba (said to be short for Agbayiegbe) and Okwuleze. Agba was a known hunter, and it is said that one day he headed toward the coast, on a hunting expedition. He returned days later to report that he came across a place with lots of birds, most notably curlew (Igoro-omirima, Igoloma, Ugoloma, depending on where in Ngwa/Ndoki one is from). Agba and some members of his family and some of his kinsmen later on then decided to migrate over and settle there. Some of Agba's family members though (being some sons, his brother [Okwuleze] and his [Okwuleze's] family), and other kinsmen didn't migrate, and instead remained where they were, at what is now known as Umuagbayi (Umu Abayi in Rivers State). Ijo people though, say Alagbariye was from Central Delta and that his name is Ijo. *shrug*

Now, here are some interesting things to note (and also infer)

#1. Umuagbayi traditions are silent about Ijo contact. They don't speak of any Ijo migration.

#2. G.I. Jones, the European man who did the most thorough work on the various groups/clans in the area, also notes similar, by stating: Both Ijo and Ibo traditions are silent about any contact between the two groups, apart from the Azuogo Ndokki, and Kalabari legends. - [url=http://books.google.com/books?id=G_Q0IBdHSP8C&pg=PA32&dq=ijo+igbo+silent+traditions&hl=en&ei=rCitTY3zLM_PgAfH1N2PDA&sa=X&oi=book_result&ct=result&resnum=1&ved=0CDEQ6AEwAA#v=snippet&q=ijo%20ibo%20traditions%20silent&f=false]Trading States of the Oil Rivers[/url]

#3. Bonny traditions on migration route admit to Ijo coming in contact with already established Ngwa (Igbo) in what is now Ndoki, some of whom they then traveled with to Bonny.

#4. Referencing #'s 2 & 3 above, and in correlating Ijo and Ngwa accounts, we can see that Ijo migrants likely came in contact with Agba [Agbayiegbe] and co. (who were likely already en route toward the place with lots of curlew [Igoro-omirima] birds) and likewise joined them.

#5. No one seems to know the meaning of Alagbariye (or if they know, they aren't saying), but one thing that's interesting to note is that in Bonny/Ijo traditions, Alagbariye is said to be a prominent hunter (confirmation to Umuagbayi-Ngwa traditions) and a chief, and interestingly enough, "chief" in Ijo is ala (chief/leader).

#6. Seeing as to how the meaning or history behind Alagbariye's name is more or less unknown to the Ijo, and noting that the Ijo expression for "chief/leader" is ala, we can likely infer that the Ijo, in coming into contact with Agbayiegbe and co., must have referred to Agbayiegbe as Ala Agbayiegbe (chief/leader Agbayiegbe), as he is indeed the one who was leading the migration toward Bonny (as oral traditions recount), and as Bonny and Ngwa oral traditions further state, he became the chief/clan-head once the migrants settled at Bonny; the founder.

#7. Overtime, there maybe could have been either a corruption in speech (as there typically tends to be in things like this) and/or some error in transcription when Europeans recorded the oral accounts of the natives (as we are all familiar with, i.e. Sirie [Siriye], Onitsha [Onicha], Okrika [Wakrike], Bonny [Ubani/Ibani], etc.), which is likely responsible for Ala Agbayiegbe (chief/leader Agbayiegbe) being either eventually spoken as Ala-Agbariye and/or eventually recorded variously by Europeans as Alagbariye, Alagbara, Alagba-n-ye. Both [the speech corruption and the European transcriptions] seem equally likely.

Lastly -- [url=http://www.google.com/search?tbm=bks&tbo=1&q=ngwa+ibani&btnG=Search+Books#sclient=psy&hl=en&tbo=1&tbm=bks&source=hp&q=ngwa+bonny+alagbara&aq=f&aqi=&aql=&oq=&pbx=1&bav=on.2,or.r_gc.r_pw.&fp=efa74fedee4c96d0]GoogleBooks Search: ngwa bonny alagbara[/url] :: [url=http://www.google.com/search?sclient=psy&hl=en&tbo=1&tbm=bks&source=hp&q=ngwa+14th+century&aq=f&aqi=&aql=&oq=&pbx=1&bav=on.2,or.r_gc.r_pw.&ech=1&psi=-I-tTcWfBInqgAeLnOmFDA130323113637019&emsg=NCSR&noj=1&ei=w5GtTZLPN8GM0QHCofCuCw]GoogleBooks Search: ngwa 14th century[/url]

So, basically, attempts to match Bonny/Ijo and Ngwa oral traditions seems to indicate that Alagbariye (Ala-Agbayiegbe) was an Ngwa man, as Bonny oral tradition says.

That was a good post. I now have a better understanding. Thanks.

No problem. I tried to make it as thorough as I could.

ChinenyeN:

According to Ngwa traditions, an Ngwa man remembered as Okobo had two sons, recollected as Agba (said to be short for Agbayiegbe) and Okwuleze. Agba was a known hunter, and it is said that one day he headed toward the coast, on a hunting expedition. He returned days later to report that he came across a place with lots of birds, most notably curlew (Igoro-omirima, Igoloma, Ugoloma, depending on where in Ngwa/Ndoki one is from). Agba and some members of his family and some of his kinsmen later on then decided to migrate over and settle there. Some of Agba's family members though (being some sons, his brother [Okwuleze] and his [Okwuleze's] family), and other kinsmen didn't migrate, and instead remained where they were, at what is now known as Umuagbayi (Umu Abayi in Rivers State). Ijo people though, say Alagbariye was from Central Delta and that his name is Ijo. *shrug*

Now, here are some interesting things to note (and also infer)

#1. Umuagbayi traditions are silent about Ijo contact. They don't speak of any Ijo migration.

#2. G.I. Jones, the European man who did the most thorough work on the various groups/clans in the area, also notes similar, by stating: Both Ijo and Ibo traditions are silent about any contact between the two groups, apart from the Azuogo Ndokki, and Kalabari legends. - [url=http://books.google.com/books?id=G_Q0IBdHSP8C&pg=PA32&dq=ijo+igbo+silent+traditions&hl=en&ei=rCitTY3zLM_PgAfH1N2PDA&sa=X&oi=book_result&ct=result&resnum=1&ved=0CDEQ6AEwAA#v=snippet&q=ijo%20ibo%20traditions%20silent&f=false]Trading States of the Oil Rivers[/url]

#3. Bonny traditions on migration route admit to Ijo coming in contact with already established Ngwa (Igbo) in what is now Ndoki, some of whom they then traveled with to Bonny.

#4. Referencing #'s 2 & 3 above, and in correlating Ijo and Ngwa accounts, we can see that Ijo migrants likely came in contact with Agba [Agbayiegbe] and co. (who were likely already en route toward the place with lots of curlew [Igoro-omirima] birds) and likewise joined them.

#5. No one seems to know the meaning of Alagbariye (or if they know, they aren't saying), but one thing that's interesting to note is that in Bonny/Ijo traditions, Alagbariye is said to be a prominent hunter (confirmation to Umuagbayi-Ngwa traditions) and a chief, and interestingly enough, "chief" in Ijo is ala (chief/leader).

#6. Seeing as to how the meaning or history behind Alagbariye's name is more or less unknown to the Ijo, and noting that the Ijo expression for "chief/leader" is ala, we can likely infer that the Ijo, in coming into contact with Agbayiegbe and co., must have referred to Agbayiegbe as Ala Agbayiegbe (chief/leader Agbayiegbe), as he is indeed the one who was leading the migration toward Bonny (as oral traditions recount), and as Bonny and Ngwa oral traditions further state, he became the chief/clan-head once the migrants settled at Bonny; the founder.

#7. Overtime, there maybe could have been either a corruption in speech (as there typically tends to be in things like this) and/or some error in transcription when Europeans recorded the oral accounts of the natives (as we are all familiar with, i.e. Sirie [Siriye], Onitsha [Onicha], Okrika [Wakrike], Bonny [Ubani/Ibani], etc.), which is likely responsible for Ala Agbayiegbe (chief/leader Agbayiegbe) being either eventually spoken as Ala-Agbariye and/or eventually recorded variously by Europeans as Alagbariye, Alagbara, Alagba-n-ye. Both [the speech corruption and the European transcriptions] seem equally likely.

Lastly -- [url=http://www.google.com/search?tbm=bks&tbo=1&q=ngwa+ibani&btnG=Search+Books#sclient=psy&hl=en&tbo=1&tbm=bks&source=hp&q=ngwa+bonny+alagbara&aq=f&aqi=&aql=&oq=&pbx=1&bav=on.2,or.r_gc.r_pw.&fp=efa74fedee4c96d0]GoogleBooks Search: ngwa bonny alagbara[/url] :: [url=http://www.google.com/search?sclient=psy&hl=en&tbo=1&tbm=bks&source=hp&q=ngwa+14th+century&aq=f&aqi=&aql=&oq=&pbx=1&bav=on.2,or.r_gc.r_pw.&ech=1&psi=-I-tTcWfBInqgAeLnOmFDA130323113637019&emsg=NCSR&noj=1&ei=w5GtTZLPN8GM0QHCofCuCw]GoogleBooks Search: ngwa 14th century[/url]

So, basically, attempts to match Bonny/Ijo and Ngwa oral traditions seems to indicate that Alagbariye (Ala-Agbayiegbe) was an Ngwa man, as Bonny oral tradition says.

Very good explanation.

I also saw this:

"Alagoa and Fombo have postulated that Hgwa-lgbo immigrants who settled in Bonny probably in the 14th century, were amongst the founders of the earliest dynasties which ruled that town (4). The fact that the Ngwa are associated with the , " in one of the little Google Books snippet previews that your second link showed (obviously "Hgwa" is supposed to be Ngwa here). So that was why you were referring people to those authors in your earlier posts. Really clears the whole thing up.


I have to ask though, what are you going to do about the fact that the people of Bonny are widely regarded and described as a sub-group of the Ijaw rather than acknowledged as a mix? Or are you fine with that? (from this thread, it's clear that some other people aren't)

uhm. . . sorry for the interruption. . . but does it really take 63 pages for this topic alone?
I guess Igbos really are confused. haha

PhysicsMHD:
I have to ask though, what are you going to do about the fact that the people of Bonny are widely regarded and described as a sub-group of the Ijaw rather than acknowledged as a mix? Or are you fine with that? (from this thread, it's clear that some other people aren't)

The Bonny people are seen as an Ijaw group that have Igbo influence, especially when the language of the island is Igbo, and 'Bonny' is even the name of an Igbo dialect. What people were trying to do here is uncover who is the diala (son of the soil, aborigine) of Bonny, as in who founded it (maybe because of the unstable time).

THE AMAKA:

uhm. . . sorry for the interruption. . . but does it really take 63 pages for this topic alone? 
I guess Igbos really are confused. haha

The Amaka feels left out.

PhysicsMHD:

Very good explanation.

I also saw this:

"Alagoa and Fombo have postulated that Hgwa-lgbo immigrants who settled in Bonny probably in the 14th century, were amongst the founders of the earliest dynasties which ruled that town (4). The fact that the Ngwa are associated with the , " in one of the little Google Books snippet previews that your second link showed (obviously "Hgwa" is supposed to be Ngwa here). So that was why you were referring people to those authors in your earlier posts. Really clears the whole thing up.

Thanks, and yeah, that's mostly why I was referring to those authors, particularly because though, I didn't feel like making all that effort explaining this to some who seem to want to debate every little thing I say; not taking my contributions, as an informed Ngwa, seriously, but I didn't mind responding to posts that seemed genuine, to me.

PhysicsMHD:

I have to ask though, what are you going to do about the fact that the people of Bonny are widely regarded and described as a sub-group of the Ijaw rather than acknowledged as a mix? Or are you fine with that? (from this thread, it's clear that some other people aren't)

I'm not really bothered with it the way some people are (not concerned with the whole "Igbo"/"Ijo" tug-of-war some engage in). Yeah, it's true that there is the movement to challenge and downplay the Igbo/Ngwa origin of Bonny, but regardless, many Bonny still rightly and unashamedly acknowledge a relationship between themselves and Ngwa/Ndoki. They're not denying that fact. That aside, as far as reality is concerned, there now exists a clear and virtually indisputable boundary between "Ijo" and "Igbo" lands, and there's no helping that (at least, so long as people continue with the "Igbo"/"Ijo" dynamics). So I'm fine with it all. We know ourselves, and that's actually the only thing that really counts.

ezeagu:

The Bonny people are seen as an Ijaw group that have Igbo influence, especially when the language of the island is Igbo, and 'Bonny' is even the name of an Igbo dialect. What people were trying to do here is uncover who is the diala (son of the soil, aborigine) of Bonny, as in who founded it (maybe because of the unstable time).

Wait, what do you mean by the bolded, if you don't mind me asking?

ezeagu:

The Amaka feels left out.

PhysicsMHD:


Very good explanation.

I also saw this:

"Alagoa and Fombo have postulated that Hgwa-lgbo immigrants who settled in Bonny probably in the 14th century, were amongst the founders of the earliest dynasties which ruled that town (4). The fact that the Ngwa are associated with the , " in one of the little Google Books snippet previews that your second link showed (obviously "Hgwa" is supposed to be Ngwa here). So that was why you were referring people to those authors in your earlier posts. Really clears the whole thing up.


I have to ask though, what are you going to do about the fact that the people of Bonny are widely regarded and described as a sub-group of the Ijaw rather than acknowledged as a mix? Or are you fine with that? (from this thread, it's clear that some other people aren't)

I once stated that the Federal Government under Obasanjo tried to Ibanize Bonny and force them to stop speaking Igbo but they refused.
Some of them know who they are; it's this same Ijaw propaganda that makes it seem Bonny is Ijaw just like they claimed to be 8 million in population and the BBC believed them whereas they couldn't get more than 500,000 Ijaws to register in Bayelsa State.

Bonny has always been Igbo, spoke Igbo and will remain Igbo. That notwithstanding, there are a few Ijaws among them.

ChinenyeN:

Wait, what do you mean by the bolded, if you don't mind me asking?

Everybody rushing for states and finding out where their influence reaches.

ezeagu:

Everybody rushing for states and finding out where their influence reaches.

Oh okay. I think I get it.

I love you guys.

Interesting read about Bonny history. . .

@Obiagu1

I wrote insinuate and now quote verbatim. . .Your assertions insinuates such and besides making sweeping statements like majorly Igbo is wrong until you have genetically tested all Kalabari people.

Now even in cultural terms, I wonder which Kalabari tradition (food, clothing, marriage, funeral, worship etc) is exclusively done in Igboland. I can go on but I'd leave you to your opinions here with the same advice I have given earlier. If you really want to Know more about this, You can take this offline and actually travel to Abonnema, Buguma, Bonny, Okrika, Akassa or Ekeremor to see if you're assertions are true.

With an open mind, I am very certain that some of your statements would be rescinded. Who knows you might even write a better history than the white people. Also, try to learn some Ijaw (Pick one dialect and learn a few words. . . )


@PhysicsMHD, Obiagu1 and ezeagu

Very nice history here and I have learnt a lot (especially about things I didn't know).

PhysicsMHD:

I have to ask though, what are you going to do about the fact that the people of Bonny are widely regarded and described as a sub-group of the Ijaw rather than acknowledged as a mix? Or are you fine with that? (from this thread, it's clear that some other people aren't)

Although, (I know I said I'm okay with it all, which I am, but. . .) I do feel that I must say a statement before people become overly accustomed to my post on Alagbariye. That statement is this, the Ijo origin of Bonny is entirely challenge-able. Meaning that, a real case can actually be put forth that Bonny was originally Ngwa (Igbo), before the Brass (Ijo) arrived. Problem is though, that people (not just Ijo, but people in general) have grown so accustomed to and have generally accepted the Ijo disinformation (in my honest opinion) of Bonny's origin that an actual argument to the contrary may indeed look very strange (or to be frank, look completely wrong), or threatening or possibly even insulting to some. So, I went with a "joint establishment, at best" explanation, in my discussion of Alagbariye, as an attempt to satisfy both the Bonny/Ijo and Ngwa accounts (at least give both sides some credit), but even in the attempt to satisfy both sides, we see evidence that points to Alagbariye not being an Ijo man, as is so propagated by the Ijo, but rather an Ngwa man, as Bonny traditions rightly attest.

chinenye rather than talk about oral traditions that will forevever be disputed ask yourself  this very simple question.
were the igbos the first humans to walk on what is now igboland

now replace igbos/igboland with binis,yorubas,hausas,french etc.

what is important is who occupies it NOW and what do they call themselves
the people of bonny today do not identify themselves as igbo
the people of america do not identify themselves as english
the people of warri do not identify themselves as yoruba etc

i don't know why you must claim everyone is igbo.

even if all those dubious tales are true they are irrelevant.
barak obama is american NOT KENYAN

in

in talking about land.land does not have origin in people.a good example is palestine/israel.
talking about igbo origin of bonny is an exercise in illogicality.

Here it comes. The "Igbo"/"Ijo" tug-of-war. Well, see here. You're approaching the wrong person with all that. I don't do this whole tug-of-war thing. In fact, if you read through my posts, you'll see that I've maintained the use of names like Ngwa, Brass, Ndoki, and Bonny/Ijo. If you choose to view that as me differentiating "Igbo" or "Ijo", that's your business, but I don't play that game.

Note the Below:

ChinenyeN:

I'm not really bothered with it the way some people are (not concerned with the whole "Igbo"/"Ijo" tug-of-war some engage in). [/b]Yeah, it's true that there is the movement to challenge and downplay the Igbo/Ngwa origin of Bonny, but regardless, many Bonny still rightly and unashamedly acknowledge a relationship between themselves and Ngwa/Ndoki. They're not denying that fact. That aside, [b]as far as reality is concerned, there now exists a clear and virtually indisputable boundary between "Ijo" and "Igbo" lands, and there's no helping that (at least, so long as people continue with the "Igbo"/"Ijo" dynamics). So I'm fine with it all. We know ourselves, and that's actually the only thing that really counts.

ChinenyeN:

Oh please. "Igbo" and "Ijo" lines have long since been drawn and they clearly indicate that anything south of Ikwere-Echee-Ndoki is not "Igbo".

So if anyone here has just engaged in 'illogicality', it would be you, coming behind to say what you just said, even after I've long-since acknowledged the fact. That is illogical.

By the way, iwanbaoko, where are you from, if you don't mind me asking? I'd really like to know & I really do expect an honest answer.

i wish i knew .

iwonbaoko:

i wish i knew  .

You don't know who your people are? Seriously? hmm. .

iwonbaoko:

in

Castrated Pig, common get out of here, you are not intelligent enough for this sort of thread. Get Out, Ediott.

andrew,clearly a man of profound intellect.a credit to your forebears .

iwonbaoko:

in talking about land.land does not have origin in people.a good example is palestine/israel.
talking about igbo origin of bonny is an exercise in illogicality.

That's the worst example you could give.

according to your taste buds??
your saying so does not make it so.
if we are going to avoid circularity say something original