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What Is Your Opinion On Capitalism? - Politics (7) - Nairaland

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Re: What Is Your Opinion On Capitalism? by dayokanu(m): 7:34am On Nov 07, 2010
OYINDAMOLAAAAAAaa
Re: What Is Your Opinion On Capitalism? by oyinda3(f): 7:41am On Nov 07, 2010
what is your opinion on capitalism? undecided
Re: What Is Your Opinion On Capitalism? by dayokanu(m): 7:42am On Nov 07, 2010
I can share that with you in private.
Re: What Is Your Opinion On Capitalism? by Katsumoto: 11:59am On Nov 07, 2010
dayokanu:

I can share that with you in private.

My friend, stop disturbing the poor girl. You either contribute to the subject or gerrouttt. grin grin grin

O se ya ashewo bayi?
Re: What Is Your Opinion On Capitalism? by olaolabiy: 3:31pm On Nov 07, 2010
Katsumoto:

O se ya ashewo bayi?

  smileygrin grin

The girl sef tooo fine now.

She's a friend on FB. wink wink wink
Re: What Is Your Opinion On Capitalism? by yeswecan(m): 4:29pm On Nov 07, 2010
My opinion on capitalism?

I would like to take it back and make a judgment on whole ideal of liberalism which opens the room for capitalism or any economic configuration  based on private ownership of capital.  This system is fine except its demerits are never headlined but concealed. The truth is that someone has to fall for another to stand, this defines capitalism- historically and realistically.  This goes for both individual capitalistic system and more so with International system -  we just don't know it yet. The rise of Europe marked the fall of Africa - raw material and labor which are 2 of the three factors of wealth creation were extracted from Africa for almost free, the scramble for Africa led to the rise of Europe - and this is capitalism. The media won't say.  If we Africans aspire to get developed as Europe we have to look for someplace to milk - this is the fact. I got your question, what about the Asian giants like Japan and China? Well, Japan is the biggest "freeriders" in the world hegemonic structure- they attained that position during cold war - were allowed to trade on unrealistically favorable terms. This was a war tool more like the Marshall plan was a way of buying over the western Europe.

No Asian tiger followed the Rostovian take-off model/ or the so called modernization theory. China's development is still a mystery to economist - though it is safe to say they exploited free Chinese prison labor to take over markets through dumping.

I cannot believe how far from the question i have strayed -  well, my point is that capitalism is synonymous with exploitation - show me any developed economy, I will tell you who they exploited to make it there. The worst part is that Africa continent is been exploited today that it ever has been in the 17th century. The sudden interest of Chinese in Africa seems to question a lot . . .  and yes you heard me Africans are going through the biggest expliotation ever in history - through the configuration of International trade, unequal exchange and price control. Any credible political economist would help explain why labor is expensive in Europe. . if i can produce a tip- it is because labor is cheap in the so called third world. Technically, we are working to pay the labor of the so called first Nations,  . It could be through Education - which is now the obsession of Africans to study Abroad with unreasonable fees-  buying cheap raw materials and exporting the finish goods for profits. . Also Multinationals are imperialistic mechanism who milk locals and export the profit to their host countries- we have to understand this structures and how they make Africa RELATIVELY poor. There won't be rich or poor if its not in a  relative manner .

Eurocentric capitalism is the worst economic system on record - just it is the only reasonable one because our "masters" said so. Media made socialist bad in my opinion- Any credible economist would tell that the capitalism is not sustainable, hence the world must slide into socialism and then Communism. This is the truth, evident ion Europe and now America - - that's the case because capitalism is not sustainable. It could take 500 more yrs but the world must slide to communism.
Re: What Is Your Opinion On Capitalism? by olaolabiy: 4:54pm On Nov 07, 2010
^^^

No capitalist country without some form of intervention from the State.

You would rather live in Ireland and not Cuba, isn't it?
Re: What Is Your Opinion On Capitalism? by yeswecan(m): 7:34pm On Nov 07, 2010
ola olabiy:

^^^

No capitalist country without some form of intervention from the State.

You would rather live in Ireland and not Cuba, isn't it?

In reality no country practices full capitalism with no govt. intervention - where govt are only concerned with public goods. There is no such place on this planet . .

Also i think you read my post in reverse. I am not criticizing capitalism my friend- i just reported its historic/ tacit characteristics. This is not a matter of where i would rather live , this talk about capitalism been the only way to prosperity is a socially constructed one. The inequalities that capitalism creates is more than you we can imagine - The greatest crimes of humanity were instigated by selfishness which is the core value of capitalism . .

I am not a Marxist my friend, i never had been.
Re: What Is Your Opinion On Capitalism? by Kay17: 1:26pm On Nov 10, 2010
A true Marxist communist system not Leninist! I'm strongly against the political monster in Leninist Communism.

At least we will all agree that capitalism is a step towards the future.
Re: What Is Your Opinion On Capitalism? by AjanleKoko: 1:34pm On Nov 10, 2010
yeswecan:

  If we Africans aspire to get developed as Europe we have to look for someplace to milk - this is the fact.

No, no. We have enough natural resources, and we have the capital, human and intellectual. The social system is the key. Would you say that the UAE and Saudi, Oman and Qatar are not developed, simply because they are not massively exporting finished goods, or invading their neighbours?

The Europeans suffered from natural deprivations, which is why the story of riches in the West has been a story of expansion.
Re: What Is Your Opinion On Capitalism? by yeswecan(m): 2:32pm On Nov 10, 2010
AjanleKoko:

No, no. We have enough natural resources, and we have the capital, human and intellectual. The social system is the key. Would you say that the UAE and Saudi, Oman and Qatar are not developed, simply because they are not massively exporting finished goods, or invading their neighbours?

The Europeans suffered from natural deprivations, which is why the story of riches in the West has been a story of expansion. 

Well it is best that you understand my post word-by-word before you punch it. I will reproduce my line below

"If we Africans aspire to get developed as Europe we have to look for someplace to milk - this is the fact."

Now to your question on  UAE and Saudi, Oman and Qatar - they are relatively developed and developing countries it depends on who's talking and  who listens - my post touched on European type of development.  Why i said that in essence was not for us to think of how to develop the European way rather for us to define development wholly on our terms not on western terms. The western type of development cannot be possible without expliotation - thats my point.
Re: What Is Your Opinion On Capitalism? by yeswecan(m): 2:35pm On Nov 10, 2010
Kay 17:

A true Marxist communist system not Leninist! I'm strongly against the political monster in Leninist Communism.

At least we will all agree that capitalism is a step towards the future.

Tell me whats so wrong with Leninist Communism? If you are a true theorist you would understand that the world is sliding to socialism and then communism- this is unavoidable. It could take 1000 years but a classless world would come into view.
Re: What Is Your Opinion On Capitalism? by yeswecan(m): 2:57pm On Nov 10, 2010
Let me give you guys a tip on how capitalism is the hegemony's way to control the economy/ exploit smaller countries.  Lets take the Multinational debate. multinational corporation (MNC) comes into a small country like - let's say Ghana and drives local competitors underground through artificial dumping (selling goods  a price below that charged in the domestic market ) just to secure the market from competitors- they have the financial strength and might to do that. The Multinational takes over the market in Ghana with time and control the pricing - this is bad because the multinational takes all profit to its headquarter usually in a developed economy to invest there. We have seen this in Nigeria's MNC like Shell cooperation that literally has no petrol-station in a country where they get raw material from - most of their properties are on lease. I  cannot think of the number of Shell stations i have seen in the UK alone.

Now America and friends tells you to open your economy so that such companies can come in and lift resources and profit back to them - criminals- the world bank and IMF uses this as loan terms and Africa leaders are too dumb to think it through.  This is what capitalism and liberalizing the economy means. . They know the exchange is not equal - they fix prices of our products and they want this to go on forever. . .  We need an little bit of an isolationist ideology
Re: What Is Your Opinion On Capitalism? by Jbenue: 3:49pm On Nov 10, 2010
Social Capitalism is the way forward. Countries like Japan and Germany have pioneered this system to an extent. Where it failed for countries like Japan was their pension system which became a combersome, over bloated burden, that drained the state coffers. In my opinion the state should have nothing to do with pension, every working person should have their own private pension that in later life they can draw upon, the status quo now is that the younger generation are paying for the pension of the now retired because living + pay standards since the 70's have greatly increased.
there is a way to augment this quagmire, if the state was to ensure not only a minimum wage(already in place in 1st world) but also a maximum wage, even the poorest worker would get a bigger slice of the pie, hence he or she may invest more in their pension schemes. Due to thoroughly greedy capitalist lords sadly i doubt this will ever happen. In England the government has been trying to cap the wages of their highest earners but one nation cannot implement this. As courageous as it may be it would also be economical suicide as there would be an Exodus of the most brilliant minds that drive the economy to other countries willing to indulge their greed. It has to be a consensus agreement between all the countries especially the economic powers. I hope one day man will wake up from the capitalist hypnosis it seems to be dancing to at the moment, I mean the worlds largest communist state China practises one of the most vitriolic brands of capitalism, a slight juxtaposition no? Sad really.
Re: What Is Your Opinion On Capitalism? by yeswecan(m): 4:19pm On Nov 10, 2010
Jbenue:

Social Capitalism is the way forward. Countries like Japan and Germany have pioneered this system to an extent. Where it failed for countries like Japan was their pension system which became a combersome, over bloated burden, that drained the state coffers. In my opinion the state should have nothing to do with pension, every working person should have their own private pension that in later life they can draw upon, the status quo now is that the younger generation are paying for the pension of the now retired because living + pay standards since the 70's have greatly increased.
there is a way to augment this quagmire, if the state was to ensure not only a minimum wage(already in place in 1st world) but also a maximum wage, even the poorest worker would get a bigger slice of the pie, hence he or she may invest more in their pension schemes. Due to thoroughly greedy capitalist lords  sadly i doubt this will ever happen. In England the government has been trying to  cap the wages of their highest earners but one nation cannot implement this. As courageous as it may be  it would also be economical suicide as there would be an Exodus of the most brilliant minds that drive the economy to other countries willing to indulge their greed. It has to be a consensus  agreement between all the countries especially the economic powers. I hope one day man will wake up from the capitalist  hypnosis it seems to be dancing to at the moment, I mean the worlds largest communist state China practises one of the most vitriolic brands of capitalism, a slight juxtaposition no? Sad really.

There is no reflection of independent thinking in your post.
Re: What Is Your Opinion On Capitalism? by Jbenue: 5:55pm On Nov 10, 2010
yeswecan:

There is no reflection of independent thinking in your post.

What do you mean sir??
Re: What Is Your Opinion On Capitalism? by ochocinco1(m): 7:01pm On Nov 10, 2010
I think Oyinda. said it best.

Unbridled capitalism is as bad as Unbridled socialism.

There is no arbitrary ideal level of government that is needed
or suitable for all epochs, but it is healthy if the ballot box sorts
out the various alternatives on offer.
Re: What Is Your Opinion On Capitalism? by cap28: 1:47am On Nov 11, 2010
yeswecan:


"If we Africans aspire to get developed as Europe we have to look for someplace to milk - this is the fact."

Then we will have to change our mindset, as it is we are content to sit back and imitate europe and america, every nation with exploitative tendencies has also had expansionist tendencies, do we have this kind of outlook? our way of thinking has been destroyed by colonialism and western religion. It has made us weak and directionless, we are simply not yet mentally equipped to think in those terms yet.
Re: What Is Your Opinion On Capitalism? by Nobody: 2:11am On Nov 11, 2010
cap28:

Then we will have to change our mindset, as it is we are content to sit back and imitate europe and america, every nation with exploitative tendencies has also had expansionist tendencies, do we have this kind of outlook?  our way of thinking has been destroyed by colonialism and western religion. It has made us weak and directionless, we are simply not yet mentally equipped to think in those terms yet.

You make sense die !

Colonialism dragged us back because the colonialists were not here to develop or show us the way to meet up with them,rather their intentions was to exploit our resources,instil british hegemony and imperialism expanionist.Schools were built just to educate people for purpose of trade and clerks,infastuructures were built strcitly on necessities of trade such as railways and also the seaports.
It's going to be hard or take a long way before we can free ourselves from this kolomentality because we are at the receiving end of the injustice of colonization
Re: What Is Your Opinion On Capitalism? by Kay17: 9:47am On Nov 11, 2010
Tell me whats so wrong with Leninist Communism? If you are a true theorist you would understand that the world is sliding to socialism and then communism- this is unavoidable. It could take 1000 years but a classless world would come into view.
Communism failed!
Re: What Is Your Opinion On Capitalism? by yeswecan(m): 4:38pm On Nov 11, 2010
cap28:

Then we will have to change our mindset, as it is we are content to sit back and imitate europe and america, every nation with exploitative tendencies has also had expansionist tendencies, do we have this kind of outlook? our way of thinking has been destroyed by colonialism and western religion. It has made us weak and directionless, we are simply not yet mentally equipped to think in those terms yet.


Obviously
Re: What Is Your Opinion On Capitalism? by cbravo3: 3:07pm On Apr 26, 2017
Re: What Is Your Opinion On Capitalism? by hucienda: 3:10pm On Apr 26, 2017
Appears the days are long gone on intellectual discourse with threads such as this.
Re: What Is Your Opinion On Capitalism? by iseeicome: 9:05am On Sep 10, 2017
Re: What Is Your Opinion On Capitalism? by tck2000(m): 10:52am On Jan 18, 2020
EzeUche0:
Frankly, I feel that capitalism is the best economic system we have currently. No economic system has yet been discovered that is more effective in creating wealth as the free market system. After all, only capitalism has helped the world's downtrodden rise out of the of poverty and obscurity. Just look at the hundreds of millions who have risen out of poverty in the last few decades in India, Brazil and China by adopting free-market principles.

Capitalism requires cutthroat competition; therefore, the system awards winners and discards losers. Companies within this system are required to maximize profits and to grow. It is a dog eat dog world, and capitalism leads to INNOVATION.

Re: What Is Your Opinion On Capitalism? by Konquest: 7:06pm On Nov 13, 2021
oyinda3:
I just read randomly that hedge fund managers are sometimes making upwards of 3 BILLION DOLLARS a year!!!!
India and China are also producing increasing numbers of millionaires lately.

I mean, according to the law of thermodynamics, energy is neither created nor destroyed. it can only be transferred (sometimes very inefficiently).
so while all this wealth is being accumulated by a very small group of financial leaders that are basically ruling the world, some others (poor people both in the US and especially in 3rd world countries, and future generations) are suffering for it.
the wealth gap is growing at a rapid rate.
all these is SO obvious but it seems like a crime to say anything against capitalism. why? 
why is it that people are stigmatized in society for criticizing some sometimes messed up American ideologies ex. capitalism, romantic love etc saying anything against these things no matter how constructive your intentions are will land you in a hot pot of . . .

. . .anyways, what do u guys think of capitalism? The reason we have allowed it to stay is because of the whole question of "what is the alternative to capitalism" I don't know the answer to this question but capitalism is so messed up. at least i'm sure of that.  sad

Capitalism is the way to go as it encourages creativity and wealth creation.

Those who have learned the
power of disruptive innovation
are leveraging on capitalism. grin

There must be capitalism with a
human face to prevent rampant
profiteering and monopoly.


*Signing out*
Re: What Is Your Opinion On Capitalism? by Konquest: 7:18pm On Nov 13, 2021
Katsumoto:
Capitalism is required in all societies for wealth creation and innovation. It can be the antithesis of socialism and communism which sometimes encourage laziness. To see how important capitalism is, we just have to look at Russia and China. The USSR collapsed while China, which practises state capitalism, progressed after it inculcated capitalist policies promulgated by Deng Xiaoping in 1978.

Capitalism creates wealth which in turn gives rise to political power. I have to keep using China as an example because politically, it is still very much a communist country. Who would have guessed that China would have been able to outmuscle Japan in a diplomatic impasse? Two weeks ago, the Japanese released the Chinese crew that ran into Japanese vessels only because China threatened not to sell Rare Earth raw materials, which is required for Japanese industry, to Japan. A few years ago, China might have resorted to military arm twisting. A look at the G8 countries will reveal that they all practice capitalism.

Having said all that, not all societies can practice capitalism. First, they must inculcate certain policies and principles which are necessary for capitalism to thrive. Also, the government on any nation that practices capitalism must use a combination of monetary and fiscal policy to achieve wealth distribution. The government must use a combination of tax and welfare programs to attempt to strike a balance. However, this should not be too extreme, otherwise wealth creators and capitalists would simply relocate to more conducive business environments. This is all the more pertinent due to the globalisation which is very evident these days.



You will find that the tide is turning gradually. The US and most western nations, bar Germany, are in for a few years of austerity while some former third world nations such as Singapore, China, India, Vietnam,Brazil, etc are growing. This is due to the balance of trade between nations. The West had been consuming at an alarming rate before the economic crisis in 2008 while the developing nations were saving. Now the US together with other Western nations are crying out loudly. They scream about the manner in which manipulates its currency and that its citizens save too much and should start consuming so that Western economies can import less from China and export more to China, India, Brazil.
Word!
Re: What Is Your Opinion On Capitalism? by Konquest: 7:28pm On Nov 13, 2021
Katsumoto:


Consumption is not the main driver of capitalism; wealth creation is the main driver of Capitalism. Germany is one of the largest economies in the world but its strength comes not from consuming itself but from others consuming its goods. While the rest of Europe that had been consuming for years started to scream about lack of funds, the Germans were safe because Germans are a saving people just like the Chinese.

The countries that will suffer the most are those without any kind of resources and those that fail to manage their resources. The issue that the US is facing is that it has always relied on internal consumption to overcome recessions in the past. But the problem with that this time is that it has outsourced most of its manufacturing and services to China and India. This is set to get worse with increased globalisation. Each corporation will pay an additional $11,000 per worker per year due to the Healthcare bill when the cost to a US corporation outsourcing to China, India, Malaysia is nil. Consequently, there are less people paying taxes, more people receiving welfare, and those with jobs worried about those jobs. Now add to the fact that the US debt is approximately $13 trillion ($54 trillion if you include debt not following due in the short term), deflationary concerns, immobility of workers due to negative equity, congress that is unlikely to agree on anything for the foreseeable future, other problems and them you start to the enormity of the problem facing the US.

The US must consume less, export more, and try to achieve a balance of trade with China to survive. Judging by the tone of your post, I can tell you that what you would like is beginning to happen. US citizens will get poorer while citizens of developing countries such as Brazil, China, Malaysia, Singapore, South Korea that have invested in education, infrastructure, solid monetary and fiscal policy, are getting richer.

Well said! grin
Last paragraph... Topnotch.

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