[quote author=Maximus69 post=88252826]

Listen to learn, your Pastors are only after your money, they don't care a bit about salvation because they don't believe in it neither will they allow you to be saved!

If you think you know the real meaning of BORN AGAIN

Answer these questions!

Jesus said one must be born of water and spirit to be become a born again.

So

(1)What's the meaning of being born of water and spirit?

(2)Were pre-christians servants of God before John (the baptist) born again?

(3)Who initiated the idea of born again?

(4)When did the idea began? Who is the first to be born again?

(5)Was Adam a born again?

(6)Why must people be born again?

Don't use the assumptions of those misinformed churchgoers you give titles "Pastors" in your religious gatherings, use the scriptures to address each question!



[4. Who is the first to be born again? Answer: Jesus Christ. He became born again when he rose from the dead. This is why Romans 8:29 calls Him “first born among many brethren “. Also, Colossians 1:18 says He’s the first born from the dead.]

Xavfra:





You're just playing exactly as I said.......


You stated that its either one is serving the Christian God if not the person is serving the enemy........
Which implies that ATR is of the devil......
Also our forefathers would burn in your Christian hell....
That Africa was clouded from the sun (I don't mean the sun Asin the sun...)
That we Africa have no say in the world,
That Africa's life would be chosen and directed by foreigners.



You said Christianity offers the ability for a sinner to become a saint..

I'm Igbo and by our culture, if there's a crime in a community, the Dibia (chief priest) helps to reconcile the community or the person who commits the crime with the gods....if any case it isn't possible, an Nri man is sent to that community to help cleanse the sin.


Yes I mean we should hold ourselves in high self esteem....
.....

I must let you know that you cannot use the standard of your religion or culture to judge mine.

I'm not saying people should create a Frankenstein religion.



I might not be able to address all your points due to laz ;Diness and I'm quite busy....


I hope I've helped solve the issue of Christianity being able to give sainthood to a sinner.......



There's no justification for us to leave ATR and embrace any foreign religion.

Is that right? You're Igbo you say? Ok...I'm gonna check/verify that bolded part out, because (dare I say) that 99 percent of Igbos are Christians.
Igbos don't speak against Christianity this way...hmmmm.



Sorry, but nothing was solved.
Blessings to you anyway....

madegreatbygrace:
Are there scriptures that support predestination in the Bible ?I’m a little confused here.

I think this Op's statement (which was wrongly interpreted) was based on the following scripture verses:


Romans 8:29-30 (KJV)


29 For whom he did foreknow, he also did predestinate to be conformed to the image of his Son, that he might be the firstborn among many brethren.

30 Moreover whom he did predestinate, them he also called: and whom he called, them he also justified: and whom he justified, them he also glorified.

Eviana:


The "elect" mean those that have chosen to surrender their lives to God.
He says, "chosen", because HE knows who those people are who have chosen Him. God has called or say "chosen" ALL to repentance, however many will not receive His call or choose Him.
Pre-destination is a false doctrine AND would label the God of Abraham, Isaac, and Israel a liar...which He is not, can not, nor will ever be.

The Bible gives countless scripture verses clearly stating that ALL have a choice: serve the Lord or serve the enemy.
That's it...there is no straddling the fence.
The God of the Old Testament is the same God of the New Testament.
There is still an opportunity to surrender to Christ while one us still alive and hasn't silenced the Holy Spirit's voice.


Joshua 24:15 (KJV)

15 And if it seem evil unto you to serve the Lord, choose you this day whom ye will serve; whether the gods which your fathers served that were on the other side of the flood, or the gods of the Amorites, in whose land ye dwell: but as for me and my house, we will serve the Lord.


1 Kings 18:21 (KJV)

21 And Elijah came unto all the people, and said, How long halt ye between two opinions? if the Lord be God, follow him: but if Baal, then follow him. And the people answered him not a word.


Hebrews 12:1-2 (KJV)

12 Wherefore seeing we also are compassed about with so great a cloud of witnesses, let us lay aside every weight, and the sin which doth so easily beset us, and let us run with patience the race that is set before us,

2 Looking unto Jesus the author and finisher of our faith; who for the joy that was set before him endured the cross, despising the shame, and is set down at the right hand of the throne of God.


Revelation 3:21 (KJV)

21 To him that overcometh will I grant to sit with me in my throne, even as I also overcame, and am set down with my Father in his throne.

you have said nothing!

Jokerman:


Bro I believe as children of God, as advised by St Paul, we shouldn't be arguing about God's word but rather we should make people come to the knowledge of truth, and also not the make the dumb atheists mock our Lord...

I rather argue and destroy the lies of Messi fans against Ronaldo.. however to answer your questions...

Firstly, being born again means being a NEW CREATURE- which means the person is dead to sin, self and unrighteousness- 1 Cor 5:17

1. Being born of water and the spirit of God- water here means the word of God (Ephesians 5:26 :"that he might sanctify and cleanse it with the washing of water by the word". The spirit here means holy Spirit.

2. There was nothing like prechristians.. Christian means a follower of Christ, hence they were called servants of God. In those days they offered sacrifices, and use blood of clean animals (dove, sheep etc) to sanctify themselves- (a sign of being renewed-born again)..buh when Jesus came he abolished all those at the cross of Calvary in John 19:30- it is finished.

3. Born again started with Jesus Christ. John the Baptist was just the forerunner of what Jesus would do. No wonder in John 1:28... " John said, behold the son of God that takes away the sin of the whole world. Only Jesus can make a person born again when the person decides (Rev 3:20- behold I stand at the door and knock, IF (decision) any man opens the door, I would come in to dine with him and him with Me)- hallelujah

4. Jesus Christ is the author and finisher if our faith. He's the first born of creation. Jesus Christ is our chief high priest. He reconciled us back to God. Hence he's the first, then the apostles as seen when the holy spirit came into them on the day of Pentecost. They now became born again (New beings) as they did good as the Lord and our master Jesus Christ.

5. Adam was not a born again. Jesus wasn't manifested then. Infact it was sin that made Adam lose the glory of God. Adam was the creature God wanted before the fall of man. Jesus is the author of being born again( being a new CREATURE- free from the manacles of sin, self and the devil)

6. People must be born again because the Lord Jesus Christ said so in John 3:3- "except a man be born again he can't see the kingdom of God", and St Paul said in 1 Cor 6:9-10, "know ye know that the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom of God.......... 11. And such were some of you: but ye are washed, but ye are sanctified, but ye are justified in the name of the Lord Jesus, and by the Spirit of our God".

I hope I have made a good explanation. You made me cry now typing this, as if I was running away from preaching...

May God bless pastor Lazarus Muoka for making me know the word of God.

So why did you jump into the lagoon if you don't know how to swim?

If born again started with Jesus, then what happens to all the faithful servants of God before Jesus?

Since they are NOT born again, can they SEE the Kingdom of God?

Born again simply means Christians God chose with the spirit to become corulers with Jesus in heaven.

They must be born of water, baptized in water as Christians and baptized in the spirit just as the 120 at Pentecost.

Faithful servants of God and the remaining Christians will live on earth forever while those born of the spirit (born again) will be transformed into their spirit body with which they can get access to heaven!

That's all!

[quote author=Eviana post=88273120]

I think this Op's statement (which was wrongly interpreted) was based on the following scripture verses:


Romans 8:29-30 (KJV)


29 For whom he did foreknow, he also did predestinate to be conformed to the image of his Son, that he might be the firstborn among many brethren.

30 Moreover whom he did predestinate, them he also called: and whom he called, them he also justified: and whom he justified, them he also glorified.
[Oh, I thought as much. That is a lazy and noncontexual reading of the Bible. To have a better understanding of the meaning of the verses, everything must be taken in context. God fore knowing the weakness of man, predestined man to be saved in Christ Jesus even before the foundation of the world. In other words, God foreknew that man was going to mess up in the garden of Eden have predestinated all men to be saved in Christ Jesus and Him alone .It’s not saying that some men are predestined to be saved while some are not predestined to be saved. This wrong interpretation of these verses makes mockery of verses like John 3:16. For God so loved the world that He gave His only begotten son, that WHOSOEVER believeth in Him should not perish but have everlasting life. The emphasized word here which is “whosoever “means the responsibility to be saved now lies with men and not God. ]

Eviana:


The "elect" mean those that have chosen to surrender their lives to God.
He says, "chosen", because HE knows who those people are who have chosen Him. God has called or say "chosen" ALL to repentance, however many will not receive His call or choose Him.
Pre-destination is a false doctrine AND would label the God of Abraham, Isaac, and Israel a liar...which He is not, can not, nor will ever be.

The Bible gives countless scripture verses clearly stating that ALL have a choice: serve the Lord or serve the enemy.
That's it...there is no straddling the fence.
The God of the Old Testament is the same God of the New Testament.
There is still an opportunity to surrender to Christ while one us still alive and hasn't silenced the Holy Spirit's voice.


Joshua 24:15 (KJV)

15 And if it seem evil unto you to serve the Lord, choose you this day whom ye will serve; whether the gods which your fathers served that were on the other side of the flood, or the gods of the Amorites, in whose land ye dwell: but as for me and my house, we will serve the Lord.


1 Kings 18:21 (KJV)

21 And Elijah came unto all the people, and said, How long halt ye between two opinions? if the Lord be God, follow him: but if Baal, then follow him. And the people answered him not a word.


Hebrews 12:1-2 (KJV)

12 Wherefore seeing we also are compassed about with so great a cloud of witnesses, let us lay aside every weight, and the sin which doth so easily beset us, and let us run with patience the race that is set before us,

2 Looking unto Jesus the author and finisher of our faith; who for the joy that was set before him endured the cross, despising the shame, and is set down at the right hand of the throne of God.


Revelation 3:21 (KJV)

21 To him that overcometh will I grant to sit with me in my throne, even as I also overcame, and am set down with my Father in his throne.

But it is in the bible. What are you saying?
Are you hôrny or just mad ?

Romans 8 vs 29_30
Daniel 4 vs 35
Proverbs 16 vs 9

Ephesians 1 vs 4

[quote author=Maximus69 post=88274254]

So why did you jump into the lagoon if you don't know how to swim?

If born again started with Jesus, then what happens to all the faithful servants of God before Jesus?

Since they are NOT born again, can they SEE the Kingdom of God?

[What happens to all the faithful servants of God before Jesus? That’s an interesting question. Notice that Abraham believed and it was counted to him for righteousness. This is imputed righteousness and this righteousness was inputed to him because he believed the gospel in Genesis 12: 3.

“And I will bless them that bless thee, and curse him that curseth thee: and in thee shall all families of the earth be blessed.”
‭‭
By believing the gospel he received the forgiveness of sins and inputed righteousness. However, he couldn’t become a new creature because the Holy Spirit hadn’t yet been given then.The same is applicable to all the believers before Christ . They couldn’t also go to heaven immediately they died because the work of salvation in then was not yet complete . Hence, they were kept temporarily in Abraham’s bosom pending the death of Christ.When he died, he went to the place of the dead where Abraham’s bosom was, set free all the believing captives, and gave them eternal life.


“Wherefore he saith, When he ascended up on high, he led captivity captive, and gave gifts unto men.”
~‭‭Ephesians‬ ‭4:8‬ ‭ .


“And, behold, the veil of the temple was rent in twain from the top to the bottom; and the earth did quake, and the rocks rent; And the graves were opened; and many bodies of the saints which slept arose, And came out of the graves after his resurrection, and went into the holy city, and appeared unto many.”
‭‭~Matthew‬ ‭27:51-53


Since they now bore the image of Christ, they became qualified to ascend to heaven with Christ in a cloud. ]

Maximus69:


So why did you jump into the lagoon if you don't know how to swim?

If born again started with Jesus, then what happens to all the faithful servants of God before Jesus?

Since they are NOT born again, can they SEE the Kingdom of God?

Of cos. They worked by faith. Look at what St Write in the book of Hebrews 11... The elders obtained a good report..... Especially read verse 13-16.......

Also read Matthew 27:51-53... When Jesus arise on the 3rd day, many saints who couldn't enter into the kingdom all arose with the Lord Jesus Christ.... Read below....
"Matthew 27:50-53 Jesus, when he had cried again with a loud voice, yielded up the ghost.
And, behold, the veil of the temple was rent in twain from the top to the bottom; and the earth did quake, and the rocks rent;
And the graves were opened; and many bodies of the saints which slept arose,
And came out of the graves after his resurrection, and went into the holy city, and appeared unto many."

[quote author=madegreatbygrace post=88277672][/quote]

The only hope God is giving all faithful people is EVERLASTING LIFE! John 3:16; Romans 6:23

Those who will rule with Jesus must have been trained by Jesus himself, that's why none of those who died before pentecost can become a born again or have spirit to go to heaven! Matthew 11:11

Heaven is not God's plan for humans but Earth! Psalms 115:16

The only reason why few Christians will go to heaven is because Jerusalem the proposed seat of God's Kingdom on earth has been profaned! Matthew 23:37-38

Even when Jesus was telling his followers this new arrangement of another place where they're going to stay with him to reign, they were confused because there was no such promises before then! John 14:1-4

Take note of Jesus' statement at John 14:2-4, he specifically mentioned that he is "going to prepare a place", this means there was no such plan from the beginning!

Maximus69:
Born again simply means Christians God chose with the spirit to become corulers with Jesus in heaven.

They must be born of water, baptized in water as Christians and baptized in the spirit just as the 120 at Pentecost.

Faithful servants of God and the remaining Christians will live on earth forever while those born of the spirit (born again) will be transformed into their spirit body with which they can get access to heaven!

That's all!

Wrong.

Being born again means being a NEW CREATURE in Christ Jesus.

Read 1 Cor 5:17..." If any man be in Christ, he's a new creature, old things are passed away and behold all things are become new"

John 3:3... " Except a man be born again, he can't see the kingdom of God"

John 3:16.... "For God so loved the world that he gave his only begotten son that whosoever believeth in Him, should not perish but have eternal life"

Born of water means...cleansed and sanctified by the word of God.
Also you are write about baptism and the holy spirit

Finally, do not be deceived, this Earth will pass away as it will be melted by a fiery fire, and God will create a new Earth... See what St Peter said in his book...
"

2 Peter 3:10-13 But the day of the Lord will come as a thief in the night; in the which the heavens shall pass away with a great noise, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat, the earth also and the works that are therein shall be burned up.
Seeing then that all these things shall be dissolved, what manner of persons ought ye to be in all holy conversation and godliness,
Looking for and hasting unto the coming of the day of God, wherein the heavens being on fire shall be dissolved, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat?
Nevertheless we, according to his promise, look for new heavens and a new earth, wherein dwelleth righteousness"...

See what was revealed to apostle John the beloved in the book of Revelation...
"Revelation 21:1-5: And I saw a new HEAVEN and a new Earth: for the first heaven and the first earth were passed away; and there was no more sea.
And I John saw the holy city, new Jerusalem, coming down from God out of heaven, prepared as a bride adorned for her husband.
And I heard a great voice out of heaven saying, Behold, the tabernacle of God is with men, and he will dwell with them, and they shall be his people, and God himself shall be with them, and be their God.
And God shall wipe away all tears from their eyes; and there shall be no more death, neither sorrow, nor crying, neither shall there be any more pain: for the former things are passed away.
And he that sat upon the throne said, Behold, I make all things new. And he said unto me, Write: for these words are true and faithful"

The only time Christians (born again) will dominate the Earth is during the 1000 years of Jesus's reign when the devil would be bound.

Do not be deceived bro. Study God's word

Jokerman:


Of cos. They worked by faith. Look at what St Write in the book of Hebrews 11... The elders obtained a good report..... Especially read verse 13-16.......

What they saw wasn't about going to heaven as born again, Apostle Paul was referring to them as people who believe in the hope of coming back to enjoy life as youths forever on planet earth just as God planned from the beginning for Adam!

That's what faithful man Job and all others before Jesus believe! Job 14:13-15, Psalms 37:7-11, 29

So going to heaven is completely a new development not the former plan. That's why those who will be part of that new arrangement must be transformed into spirits, they don't need physical bodies in heaven so they can't be male or female when they get their meaning they will not marry or have children {Luke 20:34-36} but the former arrangement before then was the same as God planned for Adam, he will have a wife (female partner), they will have sex and bear children on planet earth! Isaiah 65:23

So the born again arrangement is not for all faithful Christians, God select those who will be part of this new plan, nobody can decide to be part of it by himself, God chooses the partakers! Matthew 20:20-23

Go and tell Mr Lazarus Moaka the TRUTH!

Jokerman:


Wrong.

Being born again means being a NEW CREATURE in Christ Jesus.

Read 1 Cor 5:17..." If any man be in Christ, he's a new creature, old things are passed away and behold all things are become new"

John 3:3... " Except a man be born again, he can't see the kingdom of God"

John 3:16.... "For God so loved the world that he gave his only begotten son that whosoever believeth in Him, should not perish but have eternal life"

Born of water means...cleansed and sanctified by the word of God.
Also you are write about baptism and the holy spirit

Finally, do not be deceived, this Earth will pass away as it will be melted by a fiery fire, and God will create a new Earth... See what St Peter said in his book...
"

2 Peter 3:10-13 But the day of the Lord will come as a thief in the night; in the which the heavens shall pass away with a great noise, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat, the earth also and the works that are therein shall be burned up.
Seeing then that all these things shall be dissolved, what manner of persons ought ye to be in all holy conversation and godliness,
Looking for and hasting unto the coming of the day of God, wherein the heavens being on fire shall be dissolved, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat?
Nevertheless we, according to his promise, look for new heavens and a new earth, wherein dwelleth righteousness"...

See what was revealed to apostle John the beloved in the book of Revelation...
"Revelation 21:1-5: And I saw a new HEAVEN and a new Earth: for the first heaven and the first earth were passed away; and there was no more sea.
And I John saw the holy city, new Jerusalem, coming down from God out of heaven, prepared as a bride adorned for her husband.
And I heard a great voice out of heaven saying, Behold, the tabernacle of God is with men, and he will dwell with them, and they shall be his people, and God himself shall be with them, and be their God.
And God shall wipe away all tears from their eyes; and there shall be no more death, neither sorrow, nor crying, neither shall there be any more pain: for the former things are passed away.
And he that sat upon the throne said, Behold, I make all things new. And he said unto me, Write: for these words are true and faithful"

The only time Christians (born again) will dominate the Earth is during the 1000 years of Jesus's reign when the devil would be bound.

Do not be deceived bro. Study God's word

All those who will live forever must put on the new character {Ephesians 4:24} so all those dead before Jesus are still coming back to learn this new personality trait from Christians who aren't part of the new heavenly plan when they're resurrected, at that time there will be no distractions like all these false religions claiming Christians that are deceiving people around because Satan who initiated falsehood must have been kept in a place of inactivity, so those who accepted the new character will be granted everlasting life while those who refuses will be destroyed! Revelations 20:11-15

Preciousgirl:

Mark 13:20 King James Version (KJV)
20 And except that the Lord had shortened those days, no flesh should be saved: but for the elect's sake, whom he hath chosen, he hath shortened the days.

Sister, Matthew, Mark, Luke and John were written by 4 Different writers. They are Summaruly saying the same thing but from Perspectives.

What I am saying is that Every man on Earth has a Choice and Opportunity to be Saved..

JESUS Christ has paid it all! All you need is to Believe and Accept HIM. That Automatically grants you Access to JESUS. By Accepting JESUS CHRIST we automatically become a part of the Chosen Ones

Also , The Literal Elect on Earth Today are the Isrealites! They are the ones GOD Almighty Personally Made A Covenant with.

We who are Gentiles who have Accepted JESUS CHRIST are Spirtual Isrealites by Adoption!

So read your bible with Understanding

[s]

Maximus69:


What they saw wasn't about going to heaven as born again, Apostle Paul was referring to them as people who believe in the hope of coming back to enjoy life as youths forever on planet earth just as God planned from the beginning for Adam!

That's what faithful man Job and all others before Jesus believe! Job 14:13-15, Psalms 37:7-11, 29

So going to heaven is completely a new development not the former plan. That's why those who will be part of that new arrangement must be transformed into spirits, they don't need physical bodies in heaven so they can't be male or female when they get their meaning they will not marry or have children {Luke 20:34-36} but the former arrangement before then was the same as God planned for Adam, he will have a wife (female partner), they will have sex and bear children on planet earth! Isaiah 65:23

So the born again arrangement is not for all faithful Christians, God select those who will be part of this new plan, nobody can decide to be part of it by himself, God chooses the partakers! Matthew 20:20-23

Go and tell Mr Lazarus Moaka the TRUTH!

[/s]

Chosen1984:


Sister, Matthew, Mark, Luke and John were written by 4 Different writers. They are Summaruly saying the same thing but from Perspectives.

What I am saying is that Every man on Earth has a Choice and Opportunity to be Saved..

JESUS Christ has paid it all! All you need is to Believe and Accept HIM. That Automatically grants you Access to JESUS.

Also , The Literal Elect on Earth Today are the Isrealites! They are the ones GOD Almighty Personally Made A Covenant with.

We who are Gentiles who have Accepted JESUS CHRIST are Spirtual Isrealites by Adoption!

So read your bible with Understanding

Confused Dullard!

So you understand the whole thing much more than Jesus (God's son) who taught his followers face to face and send them to go and meet their own people (Jews who had God's word with them) face to face shey? Matthew 28:19-20

How come you people are so stupid like this?

If each person is to read and understand on his own then why must someone go out and teach others! Act 18:24-26

Eviana:


Is that right? You're Igbo you say? Ok...I'm gonna check/verify that bolded part out, because (dare I say) that 99 percent of Igbos are Christians.
Igbos don't speak against Christianity this way...hmmmm.



Sorry, but nothing was solved.
Blessings to you anyway....

Good morning
It's your choice to get the solution to what I said earlier........
I don't expect you to accept easily

You're trying to play something I cannot describe but I know.....

99 percent of Ndi Igbo are Christians....yes you're right..

But not 99 percent of them understand what they're doing in Christianity so as to other Africans......

If you see this as speaking against Christianity-..fine .... No wahala.....

Most of us have refused to tell ourselves the truth......and fear wouldn't allow us say the truth...

I see Christianity as a FRANKENSTEIN RELIGION

ATR was a more sincere Religion Christianity is awash ........

Another issue with not only Christianity but other things that were broth by the white man is that they threw all they brought on us without allowing us scrutinize and understand it......


I wish it was physically I was telling you ....I would have said more.......
I cannot say more about ATR for a certain reason.

Maximus69:


Confused Dullard!

So you understand the whole thing much more than Jesus (God's son) who taught his followers face to face and send them to go and meet their own people (Jews who had God's word with them) face to face shey? Matthew 28:19-20

How come you people are so stupid like this?

If each person is to read and understand on his own then why must someone go out and teach others! Act 18:24-26

No Man can Understand the things of GOD except GOD Be with HIM...

To Understand the things of GOD you first have to Surrender and Accept HIM..

The Bible is not the literal novel or book you read! That's why no matter how long and well U have Read, you never get tired! And u always get a New Revelation ..

Until you Accept JESUS CHRIST you will keep on Misquoting the Scriptures

Chosen1984:


No Man can Understand the things of GOD except GOD Be with HIM...

To Understand the things of GOD you first have to Surrender and Accept HIM..

The Bible is not the literal novel or book you read! That's why no matter how long and well U have Read, you never get tired! And u always get a New Revelation ..

Until you Accept JESUS CHRIST you will keep on Misquoting the Scriptures

You that you've accepted him why can't you explain or tell us the reason why people must teach people face to face?

Keep deceiving yourself, nobody can know anything inside the Bible unless you identify Jesus' brothers, they're the ones God baptized with his spirit to teach every other person, if you're not ready to acknowledge them the spirit of God will not rest on you.

Do you think my efficacy in quoting and explaining the scriptures is just by reading all by myself?

Well i've identified Jesus' spiritual brothers (born again), they are the ones who taught me and it's because i believe his word through their teaching {John 17:20} that's why the spirit of God is reminding me all what i've learnt! John 14:26

Try to do the same by connecting scriptures with articulation if truly you're a Christian with God's spirit in you!

Maximus69:


You that you've accepted him why can't you explain or tell us the reason why people must teach people face to face?

Keep deceiving yourself, nobody can know anything inside the Bible unless you identify Jesus' brothers, they're the ones God baptized with his spirit to teach every other person, if you're not ready to acknowledge them the spirit of God will not rest on you.

Do you think my efficacy in quoting and explaining the scriptures is just by reading all by myself?

Well i've identified Jesus' spiritual brothers (born again), they are the ones who taught me and it's because i believe his word through their teaching {John 17:20} that's why the spirit of God is reminding me all what i've learnt! John 14:26

Try to do the same by connecting scriptures with articulation if truly you're a Christian with God's spirit in you!

The Truth is I don't understand your point..

Are u asking the Reason people preach?

Chosen1984:
The Truth is I don't understand your point..

Are u asking the Reason people preach?

I just figured the guy is a Jehovah witness....

Jokerman:


I just figured the guy is a Jehovah witness....

Yeah bro! It's possible!

Chosen1984:
The Truth is I don't understand your point..

Are u asking the Reason people preach?

My guy go and sit down!

You know nothing inside the Bible!

Maximus69:


My guy go and sit down!

You know nothing inside the Bible!

I know u know bro! But u are Confused!

Chosen1984:


I know u know bro! But u are Confused!

It's obvious jare!

[quote author=Maximus69 post=88278645]

The only hope God is giving all faithful people is EVERLASTING LIFE! John 3:16; Romans 6:23

Those who will rule with Jesus must have been trained by Jesus himself, that's why none of those who died before pentecost can become a born again or have spirit to go to heaven! Matthew 11:11

Heaven is not God's plan for humans but Earth! Psalms 115:16

The only reason why few Christians will go to heaven is because Jerusalem the proposed seat of God's Kingdom on earth has been profaned! Matthew 23:37-38

Even when Jesus was telling his followers this new arrangement of another place where they're going to stay with him to reign, they were confused because there was no such promises before then! John 14:1-4

Take note of Jesus' statement at John 14:2-4, he specifically mentioned that he is "going to prepare a place", this means there was no such plan from the beginning!



[So many times in the Bible, Jesus taught figuratively and so His teachings must not be taken literally. Thus, if the readers is not careful, he’ll completely misunderstand His message.



“Let not your heart be troubled: ye believe in God, believe also in me. In my Father's house are many mansions: if it were not so, I would have told you. I go to prepare a place for you. And if I go and prepare a place for you, I will come again, and receive you unto myself; that where I am, there ye may be also. And whither I go ye know, and the way ye know.”
‭‭John‬ ‭14:1-4


To start with, mansion doesn’t mean your earthly building with expensive furniture, modern devices, lighting and every bling bling you can ever imagine. Here, Jesus used the Greek word “mone “ which means dwelling. Likewise, house is not the regular house you live in. The Greek word is ”oikia “ which means family or household . If you ever think Jesus is referring to a mansion here then you are under a great delusion.


So what is He talking about? He’s going to prepare a place. This place is not actually a “ place “. This place is a person. This place is His body- the body of Christ, where all believers are right now. That is why He said in verse 3 :

“ ..........I will come again, and receive you unto myself; that where I am, there ye may be also. “

So, where are you now? You are in Him, He is in you . Have you not read it somewhere in the scripture?

“And hath raised us up together, and made us sit together in heavenly places in Christ Jesus:”
‭‭~Ephesians‬ ‭2:6‬ ‭KJV‬‬

You are where He is. We are now together with Him.Therefore we can rewrite verse 2:


“ In my father’s family, there are many dwellings/room/accommodation : If it were not so, I would have told you. I go to prepare a body for you that will accommodate all believers. This body/ place is the body of Christ. The mansion and house are not physical my brother. Glory!
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[quote author=madegreatbygrace post=88274861][/quote]

For some reason, I couldn't quote your reply to my post, but I agree with you.
Well-written...

[quote author=madegreatbygrace post=88292994][/quote]

Where exactly was God's plan for humans to live from the beginning, heaven or earth?

That will solve your problem!