Myer:
But even the Hebrew language and Greek also have multiple interpretations of the same words/sentences.

Why do you think there's a myriad of bible translations?

brother, you and I, aren't spring chicken nah. You and I know that translations are God inspired, which is why when studying, we lay out as many translations we manage to get our hands on, then with 2 Timothy 2:15 imprinted in back of our minds, using all means necessary (i.e. interlinears, concordance et cetera) to rightly dividing the word of truth, so be able to correctly handle the word of truth. When done that way, what earlier and on the surface, that seemed to be inconsistencies and contradictions would just get filtered away and everything the whole text becomes clear.

If it happens that you do understand Ancient Hebrew or Paleo-Hebrew, then you wouldn't have the need of translations, you'll just read exactly what it says on the tin, without any risk of inconsistencies and contradictions, lmao.

hoopernikao:


It seems you put the bold as to be a future events even from context of 1 Cor 13, I hope tongues and revelation are also seen as same by you since they were used in the same explanation as prophecy. We can conclude there is still TONGUES AND REVELATION, but not of speaking or revealing new things. Just thinking!!

All the gifts have met their purpose Sir!

So they're gone and gone for good!

Maximus69:


Naaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa!

Jesus, Pharisees, Saddusees, Scribes and the rest are Jews Sir!

So they all had the same attitude claiming they know better than everyone else when talking about their God!

The only difference is while Jesus' disciples have love amongst themselves, all other Jewish religious groups never had PEACE amongst themselves!

That's exactly what's happening today Sir!

Your lack of understanding grows deeper with every post.

Good to know that you have no problem being identified as Pharisees or Saducees. That explains a lot.

You clearly didn't see that Jesus was never in agreement with Pharisees and Saduccees but in fact cursed them all the time for their self-righteousness.
Luke 11:37–54 and Matthew 23:1–39. Mark 12:35–40 and Luke 20:45–47

Atleast now we finally know that your role model is not Christ but self-righteous Pharisees and Saducees.

Maximus69:


There is no spiritual missile Satan can infuse your brain that God's word {Hebrew 4:12} will not render harmless {Isaiah 54:17} followers of this thread may not identify you as a seed of the Serpent {Genesis 3:15} but Jehovah has given us that discerning spirit to fish you out speedily!

Once you condemned God's word (whether subtly or harshly) you have nothing to say that's of any use to one of Jehovah's Witnesses!

You believe in satanic missiles but don't believe in spiritual gifts?

Making any intelligent conversation with you is an effort to futility. I'm done.

Myer:


Your lack of understanding grows deeper with every post.

Good to know that you have no problem being identified as Pharisees or Saducees. That explains a lot.

You clearly didn't see that Jesus was never in agreement with Pharisees and Saduccees but in fact cursed them all the time for their self-righteousness.
Luke 11:37–54 and Matthew 23:1–39. Mark 12:35–40 and Luke 20:45–47

Atleast now we finally know that your role model is not Christ but self-righteous Pharisees and Saducees.

Sorry Sir it was exchange of curses back then, while Jesus cursed those brood of vipers they also cursed Jesus and his followers!

So it's their heritage to lay curses on those contradicting the words of their God because their ancestors vowed to remain loyal to the covenant! Deuteronomy 27:1-26

But to his own followers Jesus gave the command NEVER to curse anyone because there was no concrete agreement (covenant) binding the people of the nations to worship their God! Matthew 5:44

All these are meaningless to anyone who strongly believe that the document contradicts itself Sir!

Myer:


You believe in satanic missiles but don't believe in spiritual gifts?

Making any intelligent conversation with you is an effort to futility. I'm done.

The document is contradictory nah, have you forgotten?

The book only said gifts are done away with but Satan capitalizes on the showy display of falsehood to continue deceiving people whereas there is no benefits!

The book also said Satan is still very much around and he is still deceiving people Sir!

But all part of the contradictions!

Maximus69:


All the gifts have met their purpose Sir!

So they're gone and gone for good!

I thought you just subtlety exempted Prophecies now using future tense.
I asked again, are their prophecies JW still carries today that doesnt fit 1 Cor 13 context.

Well, like i said, i am just thinking look at JW history and methods as aligning to 1 Cor 13.

Acehart:


Does this thread or writeup rather contradict spiritual gifts? Spiritual gifts wasn’t the focus of the writeup. The focus was the type of “tongues” practiced in the Corinthian church as it is done in many churches today. Did Augustine, Martin Luther, Charles Spurgeon, D.L. Moody, William Booth, Charles Wesley, John Wesley, speak in “tongues” as it is done today in Pentecostal Churches, C&S, and CCC? The writing was to serve as a stumbling block and if you stumbled, the Lord knows why.

I can confidently tell you for free, that theology of cessationism is just an Hyphoria of self denial.

Keep this somewhere:
THERE IS NO SINGLE CHILD OF GOD THAT HAVE NOT AND STILL DOES NOT EXERCISE THE GIFT OF THE SPIRIT ONE WAY OR THE OTHER. It is not a discussion of whether it is exhibited, it is a discussion of whether those who speak of gifts ceasing truly understand what gifts are. If they do, they will know that the indwelling of the Spirit alone, created an habitation, an enablement to function, receive and exercise the spirit gifts.

Leaving present day usage and application apart, which we can all argue based on opinion, But see, the reality is, as a child of God, a trace of these gifts are at work in you and through you even if you dont agree with it. Indoctrination, manipulation and over stretch of spirit gifts is not enough reason to condemn them and birth a doctrine of cessationism. This is not an argument at all.

And i say again. NO CHILD of God that havent experienced or functioned or received expression of the spirit gifts in their daily work but whether they know it or what it means or agree with it is a different context.

@Goshen360, Myer, Maximus69, MuttleyLaff

hoopernikao:


I thought you just subtlety exempted Prophecies now using future tense.
I asked again, are their prophecies JW still carries today that doesnt fit 1 Cor 13 context.

Well, like i said, i am just thinking look at JW history and methods as aligning to 1 Cor 13.

All the prophecies are WRITTEN in the scriptures Sir, and it's unfolding one by one!
What Jehovah's Witnesses are doing now is the job of the WATCHMAN focused on the fulfilment of Bible prophecies, NOT prophesying anything NEW!

hoopernikao:


I can confidently tell you for free, that theology of cessationism is just an Hyphoria of self denial.

Keep this somewhere:
THERE IS NO SINGLE CHILD OF GOD THAT HAVE NOT AND STILL DOES NOT EXERCISE THE GIFT OF THE SPIRIT ONE WAY OR THE OTHER. It is not a discussion of whether it is exhibited, it is a discussion of whether those who speak of gifts ceasing truly understand what gifts are. If they do, they will know that the indwelling of the Spirit alone, created an habitation, an enablement to function, receive and exercise the spirit gifts.

Leaving present day usage and application apart, which we can all argue based on opinion, But see, the reality is, as a child of God, a trace of these gifts are at work in you and through you even if you dont agree with it. Indoctrination, manipulation and over stretch of spirit gifts is not enough reason to condemn them and birth a doctrine of cessationism. This is not an argument at all.

And i say again. NO CHILD of God that havent experienced or functioned or received expression of the spirit gifts in their daily work but whether they know it or what it means or agree with it is a different context.

@Goshen360, Myer, Maximus69, MuttleyLaff

Of course all creatures made in God's image has special gifts, and it differs from one person to another.
You may have the gift of grasping road links when going to a place you've never been before, another the gift to sight things from afar, yet another person motivational speaker, another a charming look and smile, another the gift to locate scriptures easily.

All these are gifts from God and Jehovah's Witnesses acknowledge as well as appreciate them all, but that is not a criteria to feel special thinking it's time to open your own Church and start gathering people!

Goshen360:


I like that choice of word - not intelligible to all men.

So let's have you practically interpret these verses I mentioned with the non intelligible in replacement for language or languages and we see the outcome.


These verses are 2 to 6 of 1 Corinthians 14. Verses 13 - 14 and 23 - 36.

So, explain it in ABC format and practical format inserting this non intelligible language in those verses where necessary.

I am trying to fully understand your question as i read again and again those verses i only see reasons how perfect tongues are for believers and why i should speak in tongues the more.

But let me approach your question this way because i feel its not a 1 Cor 14 issue you raised based on my understanding, as 1 Cor 14 is clear but i will try again.


This is long but I hope you will read this careful over all.

verse 2: no man understand, he speaks to God, this speaks of realities of tongues. (i take God's word for what it is). So, it is unintelligible to anyman.

verse 3/4, So, when i speak this, i will be helping myself, tongues edify me, prophecies edify others (church). Keywords here, is that there is edification. One to me the other to church.
Is it important that a believer should consistently edify himself? YES. Edify, builds you up. So, i can take advantage of tongues and edify myself. But to edify others i must go beyond tongues and prophesy. Paul explain this in next verse

verse 5: Because i prophesy, many are blessed, so i contribute more to the spiritual development of the church/others. When i speak tongues i will always edify myself, but it is me only. So, a man who prophesy profit others (1 Cor 12:7) more than a man who speaks in tongues (but note: he never say dont speak, he speaks of application). So, what should i do.

Paul said, if i can interpret my tongues to others, it will come to human mind and all will understand and be blessed. It means when i interpret my tongues, i will achieve the same contribution as that of prophecy. So tongues and interpretation will mean prophecy in application. How? Paul said he should pray, desire it. Interpretation brings to mind what tongues expressed in the spirit.

---

Interpretation is not simply translation, the word used is (diermēneuō) the word for expound.

In Luke 24:27, Jesus expounded (diermēneuō) the scriptures to them. This doesnt mean Jesus translated the scriptures to them as they were all Jews.
Expound is deeper than translation. Diermēneuō in old Greek culture is the word used for interpreting signs, events, circumstances.

You could see a closer to it in OT, Daniel took 4 words and then interprets in more than 20 verses. (this is not translation). What he did is to expound. Diermēneuō will mean to put side by side, go over and explain properly, go across, and bring what is not clear or hidden to light. The word is from root word "Hermes". Hermes was the messenger and interpreter of the gods in Greek.


Also note, this is where the word "Hermeneutics" comes from, which is the branch of knowledge that deals with interpretation You will agree with me that Hermeneutics is not a direct translation but and expounding of text and writings to bring its true meaning out.

When Jesus used diermēneuō in[b] Luke 24:27[/b], He was explaining Books of Moses, side by side with Psalms, with all the Prophets writings to show things they spoke about him. This is proper interpretation, going over scriptures, putting things side by side, unraveling the mysteries so that we can get the meaning.[/b]

It simply means to unfold. If you are a computing person, it is from this word we have what we call "interpreter" in programming language. It is different from a compiler (translator). Origen (ancient writer) used it to describe the sublimity of Christian doctrine.

---

Hence, in interpreting tongues, you are unfolding spiritual information to the human mind. you will be expounding spiritual realities to the mind of others. Tongues can be a 2 minutes activities and the interpretation takes 2 hours. That is expounding. It is not a word for word translation.
You should also know that tongues will unfold God's mind to us concerning situation, events and plans. A man who speaks in tongues regularly will always be at the center of God's will.

I give you a case study (i hardly do this in my writings but will do in this case)

Have you ever being woken up in the midnight before with a urge to pray? You dont know why, or what to pray for, infact you just finished praying an hour ago before sleeping, yet there is a urge to pray and you know it as it is fully impressed on your heart? Your mind searched thoroughly what could be the issue but found non (mind is limited/cant understand things of the spirit).
Most times, a man who refused tongues will want to search by his understanding what the spirit is saying. Will have questions on his mind what should i pray for? Most times you will miss those opportunities. For example, is it possible for God to choose you as the vessel to pray for a missionary in trouble in Syria? Yes it is. God's always use an available vessel. How your will comprehend this overnight is another thing.

A man who appreciate tongues has come to know that when i pray in tongues i communicate God's will in prayers. He will stand and pray in tongues, believing God will direct its prayer. Most times when done seriously, you will surely receive an impressed understanding on why and what you should direct the prayers on. Usually, they are things that would never have crossed your mind to pray for if you have done it in understanding. Here you arent far from interpretation.

I have seen, heard cases where circumstances were averted, changed and corrected via a yielding heart who chose just to obey to pray without knowing what or why, but prayed in tongues.

---

So, edifying self is a central these to tongue but know that it is also a vehicle to interpretation and edifying others.

So, my spirit prays (verse 14/15), my understanding is foolish, yet i will pray with my spirit. Note he didnt condemned doing so, he advocate to do both. They all have their places.

So, (verse 25) when i am equipped with such gifts, i will help the church to grow, i will help the unbeliever via interpretation which will come as revelation to him, i can receive things pertaining to his life, situation and circumstances that God wants to use. I have seen this happened over and over again in soul winning outreaches.
Even the most ardent hardened personalities on the other side, when the secrets of their life/heart are lay bare by someone they never met before, they will immediately have listening ears and open hearts to receive salvation.

So, how can i do this. Will i stay praying in tongues in from of the person i want to preach to?
No, i could have received this message when praying before departing, also since i have edified myself before leaving, i have aligned my wondering mind to the spiritual activities so as to hear accurately, and understand easily. Getting to an unbeliever, it will then be evident. Also, sometimes, tongues can be done quietly as your fellow preaches, from which something can be revealed and impart the unbeliever to yield. All these are potent tools for outreaches and ministry and usually a killer of arguments on the field. Hence, sometimes i tell people, it is not enough to sit behind computer and question spiritual gifts just because you have access to microphone to speak to some. On the field there, you will understand how the Holy Ghost uses those gifts for the furtherance of the gospel.

---

Dont forget, i said tongues is a vehicle for interpretation. There is nothing to interpret without tongues, so i must first start from tongues, and them move to be able to bless others. Also note that interpretation will now be a vehicle for revelation or prophecy. An interpretation can reveal something to us (revelation) and can provide comfort and exhortation to us (prophecy). Which ever way, i will be blessing others via my utterance. Yet my starting point is tongues.

So, in Christian gathering (verse 26), Paul admonished that tongues must be present, same as interpretation, revelation, prophecy.
Each one of you hath...

It simply mean, firstly, Paul encouraged all members to partake in spirit giftings, This means the responsibility of blessing others in church does not only lie on the Pastor or coordinator but all. You can be a blessing, i also can. So, let me ask. How many times have you left your house going to church hoping to bless others spiritually and contribute to the spiritual benefit of the church.
This is where many who practice tongues deviates. In practice, we must be taught how to use thing giftings to bless others regularly in church gathering. But dont forget again, the vehicle most times is tongues.

See, it as this below.

Speaking in tongues ------> to myself ------> i am blessed and edified.
Speak in tongues ----> Interpret it -------> something is revealed (revelation)------> exhortation/comfort is received (prophecy) -----> miracles/healing (via praying for circumstances revealed) ----> everyone is blessed (edification).
This is how spirit gifts function together.

Note that most people who speaks in tongues today stay at tongues because they were not taught what interpretation or how it comes or received. Some have many times but still continue praying for it. Ignorance is a Slave master.

---

So, what should i do?

I will firstly seek to edify myself, as this is important step to be able to edify others. That is i should seek to contribute to my edification and that of others. I will thereby grow in the application and usage of the things of the spirit and get better by use.


But what if i neglect speaking in tongues?

Such fellow, will soon start questioning prophecy too. The target is not always tongues but spiritual gift. They usually start with tongues due to what they called popular misuse. But the truth is, i havent seen a man who despite tongues but appreciate revelation and prophecy.


But i still find it difficult to take or believe

If you do, mostly it is due to some unexplained but wrong doctrine that you have been exposed to. many at times this happens to those who get born again but werent ministered or taught the things of the spirit as for believers. From experience, i have seen persons with non religion background function fast and adequately without having to even to mention it but just preaching to them, received the gift of tongues. Why? Their minds have not been polluted with wrong information. They dont have to reason it out what is happening to them, they are only focused on the joy of salvation.

So, for you, i believer you belief that Jesus saved you, and the only source you have of that information is the scriptures, you belief the scriptures that Jesus died for you, that your sins are forgiven, that you have been given the spirit of God which dwells in you. All these are actions of faith to receive. I am sure you never question if Jesus died for you or your salvation. Same way for tongues. If the scriptures says believers are/will speak in tongues, all i will do is to receive such by faith.
The same faith of salvation, is the same way i will believe the scriptures on tongues. And as i trust in God's word, i will desire and ask the Holy Spirit to help me, as i receive and function in His utterance which he gives me. In this i will speak.


But what if i just want to be praying in understanding? What if i dont want tongues?

It is not a question of whether you wants it, it is a question of whether you want to function in it as the gift is of the Holy Ghost who is in you and reside in you. So the gift in/of the holy ghost is in you. It is not coming from external party. So, if you chose not to function or desire to operate in it, it doesnt change the readiness of the spirit to express himself through you for the edification of yourself and other. Therefore, he will be at work in you (respecting your desire/refusal) waiting for the day you are ready for His full expressions.


I truly hope you will read this careful over all.

Maximus69:


Of course all creatures made in God's image has special gifts, and it differs from one person to another.
You may have the gift of grasping road links when going to a place you've never been before, another the gift to sight things from afar, yet another person motivational speaker, another a charming look and smile, another the gift to locate scriptures easily.

All these are gifts from God and Jehovah's Witnesses acknowledge as well as appreciate them all, but that is not a criteria to feel special thinking it's time to open your own Church and start gathering people!

Is the bold above part of the gift too? As i cant find it in this discussion.

And on the "all creatures gifts above" i hope you enjoyed the gifts demonstrated by superman, spider-man and hulk too. At least if they dont look charming, they entertain too. That is a gift from God. according to the bible. It is very clear now.

Maximus69:


All the prophecies are WRITTEN in the scriptures Sir, and it's unfolding one by one!
What Jehovah's Witnesses are doing now is the job of the WATCHMAN focused on the fulfilment of Bible prophecies, NOT prophesying anything NEW!

Oh oo.
Prophecy unfolding, Hmmm. Dont you think there can be some tongues and revelation WRITTEN and unfolding too. Since 1 Cor 13 have an exemption.

hoopernikao:


I can confidently tell you for free, that theology of cessationism is just an Hyphoria of self denial.

Keep this somewhere:
THERE IS NO SINGLE CHILD OF GOD THAT HAVE NOT AND STILL DOES NOT EXERCISE THE GIFT OF THE SPIRIT ONE WAY OR THE OTHER. It is not a discussion of whether it is exhibited, it is a discussion of whether those who speak of gifts ceasing truly understand what gifts are. If they do, they will know that the indwelling of the Spirit alone, created an habitation, an enablement to function, receive and exercise the spirit gifts.

Leaving present day usage and application apart, which we can all argue based on opinion, But see, the reality is, as a child of God, a trace of these gifts are at work in you and through you even if you dont agree with it. Indoctrination, manipulation and over stretch of spirit gifts is not enough reason to condemn them and birth a doctrine of cessationism. This is not an argument at all.

And i say again. NO CHILD of God that havent experienced or functioned or received expression of the spirit gifts in their daily work but whether they know it or what it means or agree with it is a different context.

@Goshen360, Myer, Maximus69, MuttleyLaff

I want to stand with Martin Luther King Jr who said: “let us keep the issues where they are”. The issue is the fading away of tongues. (You are the one bringing the issue of cessation and if I ever mentioned the word “cessation” for the “gifts of tongues”, I was drunk). Has this gift ceased? No. Is the gift fading away as Paul prophesied? Yes. There were conditions that existed and therefore necessitated the gift of tongues. Do those conditions exist today? Yes. And as long as those conditions exists, the gift still has a few gallons of fuel left in it.

However, if you speak in the tongues that is non-evangelistic in nature (the Shibaraba, yantelebo etc type), carry on. It doesn’t take away your status as a child of God; nevertheless, you ridicule the body of Christ like a black sheep of the family.

Let us keep the issues where they are.

Acehart:
I want to stand like Martin Luther King Jr who said: “let us keep the issues where they are”. The issue is the fading away of tongues. (You are the one bringing the issue of cessation and if I ever mentioned the word “cessation” for the “gifts of tongues”, I was drunk).

Has this gift ceased? No. Is the gift fading away as Paul prophesied? Yes. There were conditions that existed and therefore necessitated the gift of tongues. Do those conditions exist today? Yes. And as long as those conditions exists, the gift still has a few gallons of fuel left in it.

Gbam!

Acehart:
If you speak in the tongues that is non-evangelistic in nature (the Shibaraba, yantelebo etc type), carry on. It doesn’t take away your status as a child of God; nevertheless, you ridicule the body of Christ like a black sheep of the family.

Let us keep the issues where they are

[img]https://s2/images/MuttleyHilarious.gif[/img]

hoopernikao:

Is the bold above part of the gift too? As i cant find it in this discussion.

And on the "all creatures gifts above" i hope you enjoyed the gifts demonstrated by superman, spider-man and hulk too. At least if they dont look charming, they entertain too. That is a gift from God. according to the bible. It is very clear now.

Gifts are appreciated when it's benefitial to one and all!

Superman
Spider-Man and
Hulk

Both sounds good to laymen because they're fabrications of human imagination.

God's gift totally differs Sir, note that those characters you mentioned are comic heroes but that's not the problem, Jesus taught us a totally different way of capturing our enemies.
Unlike coming heroes who goes about using FORCE and VIOLENCE to settle disputes, Jesus taught Jehovah's Witnesses (true Christians) how to disarm the opposing side without using FORCE!

Jesus helped us to recognize our real enemy as an unseen mighty spirit being called Satan, he is the one influencing the people who see around us, so instead of thinking of how to use force like your comic heroes, we talk and reason with them.
You'll notice that most followers feel uncomfortable with me in the thread, well it's because the spirit dwelling in them is finding it difficult to breathe, so it's either they purge out the evil spirit or think of how to attack me.

Now i know it's not them that's doing it but the spirit that's dwelling in them, so my heartfelt prayer to God for them is that the opportunity may come when their hearts will need healing after the spirit has thrown them into confused state of mind, that is the time most people do calm down to reason with us!

hoopernikao:


Oh oo.
Prophecy unfolding, Hmmm. Dont you think there can be some tongues and revelation WRITTEN and unfolding too. Since 1 Cor 13 have an exemption.

Of course the FULFILMENT of tongues and revelations are unfolding Sir!

Today Jehovah's Witnesses are speaking in over 1021 tongues globally and what is WRITTEN in the Bible in the book of revelations is undergoing fulfilment today.

Do you know that the Jews are still expecting Elijah to come in person till now as prophesied in the scriptures?

Well only a handful of first century followers of Jesus knew that Elijah has come in the person of John the baptist.

So if you're not one of Jehovah's Witnesses, there are many sacred secrets you can't grasp no matter what you do!

Acehart:


I want to stand with Martin Luther King Jr who said: “let us keep the issues where they are”. The issue is the fading away of tongues. (You are the one bringing the issue of cessation and if I ever mentioned the word “cessation” for the “gifts of tongues”, I was drunk). Has this gift ceased? No. Is the gift fading away as Paul prophesied? Yes. There were conditions that existed and therefore necessitated the gift of tongues. Do those conditions exist today? Yes. And as long as those conditions exists, the gift still has a few gallons of fuel left in it.

However, if you speak in the tongues that is non-evangelistic in nature (the Shibaraba, yantelebo etc type), carry on. It doesn’t take away your status as a child of God; nevertheless, you ridicule the body of Christ like a black sheep of the family.

Let us keep the issues where they are.

Brother White sheep.

You arent actually keeping the issue where they are with your utterances, you are actually dishonoring the gift of God thereby dishonoring God. And with such dishonoring heart, it wont be far fetched why you may not have seen such gift in operations hence your fading.

It is obvious your tolerance level is low on related issue. That exactly is what you get when you dont understand spiritual gifts, you will tend to openly dishonor even those who do or practice it. It is the same trauma of an atheist who cant sit for 1 minutes without having to shout "There is no God", "bible is fake". It is the same trauma only the source is different.

Maximus69:


Of course the FULFILMENT of tongues and revelations are unfolding Sir!

Today Jehovah's Witnesses are speaking in over 1021 tongues globally and what is WRITTEN in the Bible in the book of revelations is undergoing fulfilment today.

Do you know that the Jews are still expecting Elijah to come in person till now as prophesied in the scriptures?

Well only a handful of first century followers of Jesus knew that Elijah has come in the person of John the baptist.

So if you're not one of Jehovah's Witnesses, there are many sacred secrets you can't grasp no matter what you do!

Okay Sir. I will hold the bold for future discussion as this thread is not an adequate covering.
And also let me stay with the bible than poke-nosed into the "sacred secrets" you mentioned.
Thanks.

hoopernikao:


Brother White sheep.

You arent actually keeping the issue where they are with your utterances, you are actually dishonoring the gift of God thereby dishonoring God. And with such dishonoring heart, it wont be far fetched why you may not have seen such gift in operations hence your fading.

It is obvious your tolerance level is low on related issue. That exactly is what you get when you dont understand spiritual gifts, you will tend to openly dishonor even those who do or practice it. It is the same trauma of an atheist who cant sit for 1 minutes without having to shout "There is no God", "bible is fake". It is the same trauma only the source is different.

I’m sorry for dishonoring you and your spiritual lingo gift.

hoopernikao:


Brother White sheep.

You arent actually keeping the issue where they are with your utterances, you are actually dishonoring the gift of God thereby dishonoring God. And with such dishonoring heart, it wont be far fetched why you may not have seen such gift in operations hence your fading.

It is obvious your tolerance level is low on related issue. That exactly is what you get when you dont understand spiritual gifts, you will tend to openly dishonor even those who do or practice it. It is the same trauma of an atheist who cant sit for 1 minutes without having to shout "There is no God", "bible is fake". It is the same trauma only the source is different.

Dishonouring God?

Naaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa!

The same book that says the gifts will COME {Joel 2:28} says it will CEASE {1Corinthians 13:8} so the questions we need to ask are~

Why is it that such gift must come after the Messiah?

Why wasn't such gifts spoken of before then?

What is the purpose of such gifts and what are we to benefit from it?

These questions will surely help any sincere Bible scholar know whether it has ceased now or it should continue!

Maximus69:


Dishonouring God?

Naaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa!

The same book that says the gifts will COME {Joel 2:28} says it will CEASE {1Corinthians 13:8} so the questions we need to ask are~

Why is it that such gift must come after the Messiah?

Why wasn't such gifts spoken of before then?

What is the purpose of such gifts and what are we to benefit from it?

These questions will surely help any sincere Bible scholar know whether it has ceased now or it should continue!

You may need to take a walk from the beginning of this thread and read properly/comment on each post there so that i am sure you are ready for discussion. Before you are done, i am sure you will have more questions and explanations. Late coming to bible study isnt good. And i am not trained on how to reward lateness.

hoopernikao:


Okay Sir. I will hold the bold for future discussion as this thread is not an adequate covering.
And also let me stay with the bible than poke-nosed into the "sacred secrets" you mentioned.
Thanks.

Hmmmmmmmm,

Well the phrase SACRED SECRETS is how the New Word Translation Of Holy Scriptures (JWs version of the Bible) used instead of the word MYSTERY by the KJV!

The reason is that MYSTERY means things that's incomprehensible, so Christendom Churches often talks about the MYSTERY when referring to God's word. That's why they must continue to accommodate all winds of teachings and doctrines as long as the bearer carries the Bible and prays or foresee good things at them.

On the contrary SACRED SECRETS means hidden things of God that anyone can grasp if your motive is pure and the one teaching you truly love you!

@ Matthew 13:11Jesus was teaching people but his closest confidants asked him for explanation, of course if it's mystery they can never understand it, but because it's sacred secrets their teacher (Jesus) could help them to grasp it! Luke 24:45

That's why Jehovah's Witnesses who calls it SACRED SECRETS could speak with one voice globally and continue producing the FRUITS befitting FAITH!

hoopernikao:


You may need to take a walk from the beginning of this thread and read properly/comment on each post there so that i am sure you are ready for discussion. Before you are done, i am sure you will have more questions and explanations. Late coming to bible study isnt good. And i am not trained on how to reward lateness.

Don't forget that i am one of Jehovah's Witnesses, the one and only group that will never take anything from you regarding spiritual food if you're not one of us!

I've come to enlighten all of you regarding what you're debating about our book (Bible), prove you understand the book by presenting just one single religious group that's practicing what you think you know!

Or do you think God is not capable of organizing his faithful worshipers as one family of peace lovers?

Please point, present, show, name, direct as in mentioned that group you can boast of where their FAITH is WORKING what is benefitial.

And i will point to countless benefits that Jehovah's Witnesses are enjoying as God's people! James 2:18-26

Maximus69:


Hmmmmmmmm,

Well the phrase SACRED SECRETS is how the New Word Translation Of Holy Scriptures (JWs version of the Bible) used instead of the word MYSTERY by the KJV!

The reason is that MYSTERY means things that's incomprehensible, so Christendom Churches often talks about the MYSTERY when referring to God's word. That's why they must continue to accommodate all winds of teachings and doctrines as long as the bearer carries the Bible and prays or foresee for good things to them.

On the contrary SACRED SECRETS means hidden things of God that anyone can grasp if your motive is pure and the one teaching you truly love you!

@ Matthew 13:11Jesus was teaching people but his closest confidants asked him for explanation, of course if it's mystery they can never understand it, but because it's sacred secrets their teacher (Jesus) could help them to grasp it! Luke 24:45

That's why Jehovah's Witnesses who calls it SACRED SECRETS could speak with one voice globally and continue producing the FRUITS befitting FAITH!

Chairman, Oxford DIC is affecting you o.
Changing words, or using alternative words for bible grammar wont change the truth of the word. Either sacred secrets or mysteries, they both mean the same, it is you/your interpretation of mystery that takes it as something incomprehensible, bible used mystery, yes exactly that word and it never meant what you just said.

Maximus69:


Don't forget that i am one of Jehovah's Witnesses, the one and only group that will never take anything from you regarding spiritual food if you're not one of us!

I've come to enlighten all of you regarding what you're debating about our book (Bible), prove you understand the book by presenting just one single religious group that's practicing what you think you know!

Or do you think God is not capable of organizing his faithful worshipers as one family of peace lovers?

Please point, present, show, name, direct as in mentioned that group you can boast of where their FAITH is WORKING what is benefitial.

And i will point to countless benefits that Jehovah's Witnesses are enjoying as God's people! James 2:18-26

Seriously, you are just a glimpse of that guy called Amujal-e in writing. You make me laugh with the above.

hoopernikao:



Chairman, Oxford DIC is affecting you o.
Changing words, or using alternative words for bible grammar wont change the truth of the word. Either sacred secrets or mysteries, they both mean the same, it is you/your interpretation of mystery that takes it as something incomprehensible, bible used mystery, yes exactly that word and it never meant what you just said.

Guy, you really underestimated my thorough research!

I have asked many of your Pastors to define TRINITY, their response always

"It's a MYSTERY"

Thereby various definitions of the concept caused confusion amongst Trinitarians worldwide because they were taught that TRINITY is MYSTERY! Revelation 17:5

hoopernikao:


Seriously, you are just a glimpse of that guy called Amujal-e in writing. You make me laugh with the above.

James said

"you claim to be a believer but there is nothing to present for your FAITH, i will show you my FAITH through its achievements (WORKS)" James 2:18-26

Amujale and donnie are both angry that blacks won't stop worshiping the God introduced by the white, i've discussed with the both of them several times and now they're both frustrated whenever they sight my post because it's this same question i always ask them.

Jehovah's Witnesses Organization came from the white for sure, but their achievements is undeniable, show me the achievements of your black Gods so i can trash this white God!

For your information my friend,

Frustration comes in two forms!

(1) When you're battling bitterly to establish what is not true!

(2) When you're striving desperately to refute what all eyes can see!

So just refute what Jehovah's Witnesses have achieve by presenting a better performing group, that's all!

Acehart:


I’m sorry for dishonoring you and your spiritual lingo gift.

There is no other religious group that's speaking in tongues today for benefit except JEHOVAH'S WITNESSES!

Look at the people in the pictures below, they are from different races, languages and nations yet JW Organization have preached and taught each of them in the TONGUE that they fully understood to make them Jesus' disciples.

Even during the global lockdown and social distancing, they're getting baptized as Jesus commanded. Matthew 28:19-20

Because true FAITH is WORKING! James 2:18-26

REAL WORKS OF FAITH!

[img]https://s1/images/MuttAmin.gif[/img]

TATIME:
REAL WORKS OF FAITH!

Unlike dead faith of fruitless arguments!